Who/What is Jesus if not God?

[Johann]

Therefore Jesus is not God...plain and simple

Incorrect, plain and simple
J.

 

[Behold]

The passage refers to the church that God purchased with His blood.

Each person is the "body of Christ".
The "body of Christ is the Bride and the Church".
The "church" is all the born again believers.

 

[Johann]

Each person is the "body of Christ".
The "body of Christ is the Bride and the Church".
The "church" is all the born again believers.

I think @marks is in full agreement with you.
J.

 

[MatthewG]

LOL

Gee @MatthewG .... How do you manage your daily life of thinking and believing on your own, “without some stranger” popping in to TELL YOU, what you think and believe.? LOL

Taken,
I have to realize this trinity stuff and Jesus is God will never cease so there isn’t no point in really talking about it… though if people desire to the know the truth they will seek for it.

Whom am I but a mere man. Fully capable of being fallible… only good that comes from me is by the Holy Spirit when abiding to Christ.

@Saint of God at 31 years old im old and tired and you can believe whatever you want (I’m not really responsible for you as your fully capable for yourself). One day me and you will pass away to be judged, so… hope that is a sobering thought for you.

(this is not saying I’m not my brothers keeper - as it is important to warn others if something will be coming be it someone abusing drugs, or whatever one can think of, trying to help lead them to the light sort of circumstances).

to others ; my encouragement is never believe me or others but study for yourself and have your faith before God…


Love you.

 

[Pearl]

It is impossible for God to lie...or to change...
Hebrews 6:18
That by two immutable things, in which it was impossible for God to lie, we might have a strong consolation, who have fled for refuge to lay hold upon the hope set before us:

If Jesus is not God how can he be in each of us who are born again. A man cannot be omnipresent - everywhere at once. But Jesus is in me and in all other true Christians by the poser of the His Holy Spirit.

I see you are still looking at this logically but I tell you it doesn't work like that, this isn't about logic or intellect it's spiritual, supernatural. My God is all powerful and can do anything.

 

[Saint of God]

You would have heard of this statement in Church that “Jesus was 100% man and 100% God while on earth.”

But what does this mean?

It means they lied to you and you fell for it.

In simple terms, it means that Jesus existed as God before He existed as a man. Many get this wrong by thinking that Jesus was first a man and then became God.

Jesus existed in God as all sons exists in their fathers before they are born.

The fact that Jesus was first God also ties into the Christian belief that God is Trinity which is that God is one in Being revealed in three distinct Persons the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit.

It is not a fact that Jesus was first God. If Jesus was first God, then Jesus would be his own Father before becoming his own son.

Jesus being part of the Trinity, has always existed as the second person of the Godhead.

So what happened?

What happened? What happened is you stated a lie and called it a fact, and now you are building on that lie. There is no mention of a trinity in the scripture.

In God’s appointed time, Jesus, who eternally existed as God, took on the role of a human in the incarnation and became flesh. Simply put, Jesus added the nature of humanity to His divinity. He did not cease to be God in the embodiment, but He did become a man.

So point us to where that is written. You are saying God became his own son...That would make God a liar when he said "this is my beloved son." He should have said. "I am my beloved son"...And it would make Jesus a liar because he said God was his father. He should have said I am my own father.

So when Jesus became a man, He did not become another ‘person’ but instead took on / added to Himself the human nature, which is how Jesus could be both God and Man.

You should have written, " God became a man"...because your claim is that Jesus existed as God before becoming a man (Jesus). But that does not say God became God and man does it? You slipped in an addition to your lies... If God became a God-man, then that must be written somewhere in the scripture... Please point us to the passage liar.

Jesus took on this role not for a mere display of His divinity but rather in humility to display His love for us on the cross and become the ultimate sacrifice for our sins.

JESUS TOOK ON THIS ROLE NOT FOR A MERE DISPLAY OF HIS DIVINITY BUT RATHER IN HUMILITY DISPLAYED FOR US ALL THE LOVE OF GOD ON THE CROSS.

Are you in agreement with this?
J.

I don't agree with lies. You are saying that God took on a role as his son and pretended to die on a cross because God cannot die. Point me to the passage of scripture that says what you wrote.

 

[Pearl]

It is impossible for God to lie...or to change...
Hebrews 6:18
That by two immutable things, in which it was impossible for God to lie, we might have a strong consolation, who have fled for refuge to lay hold upon the hope set before us:

God does not lie, so all the words in the bible that point to Jesus as being God are not lies. But perhaps you have a different bible that is used only by the group you belong to and says different things to by bible.

 

[Johann]

I have to realize this trinity stuff and Jesus is God will never cease so there isn’t no point in really talking about it… though if people desire to the know the truth they will seek for it.

Whom am I but a mere man. Fully capable of being fallible… only good that comes from me is by the Holy Spirit when abiding to Christ.

@Saint of God at 31 years old im old and tired and you can believe whatever you want (I’m not really responsible for you as your fully capable for yourself). One day me and you will pass away to be judged, so… hope that is a sobering thought for you.

(this is not saying I’m not my brothers keeper - as it is important to warn others if something will be coming be it someone abusing drugs, or whatever one can think of, trying to help lead them to the light sort of circumstances).

to others ; my encouragement is never believe me or others but study for yourself and have your faith before God…


Love you.

Didn't you in one of your many topics posted about the Triune Godhead Matthew?
J.

 

[MatthewG]

Yes probably, I also have a video on the subject…

@Johann : I still do not believe people should believe what I present but consider it, and think about it, and study it out for themselves.

You can’t find treasure if you aren’t willingly to dig deep, and the Spirit searches the deep things of God if one allows it to be done.

 

[Saint of God]

@Saint of God at 31 years old im old and tired and you can believe whatever you want (I’m not really responsible for you as your fully capable for yourself). One day me and you will pass away to be judged, so… hope that is a sobering thought for you.

I can't help the way that you think... So unless you have scriptural proof that I wrote something contrary to the scripture my hands are clean.

 

[Johann]

So point us to where that is written. You are saying God became his own son...That would make God a liar when he said "this is my beloved son." He should have said. "I am my beloved son"...And it would make Jesus a liar because he said God was his father. He should have said I am my own father.

Don't put words in my mouth of which my posts never hinted at.
You wont last long in a Baptist Church.
J

 

[MatthewG]

Sometimes the best thing we can do is kick the dust of our feet after trying, everyone has their choices to make in this life.

less contention more love.

always aim for more love -> peace in the soul and rest setting one’s eyes on the heavenly looking towards the one we all so desperately need: the Lord Yeshua.

 

[MatthewG]

Have a good day saint, and everyone else.

 

[Pearl]

John 1

In the beginning was the Word(Jesus), and the Word was with God, and the Word (Jesus) was God.
3 Through him all things were made; without him nothing was made that has been made. 4 In him was life, and that life was the light of all mankind. 5 The light shines in the darkness, and the darkness has not overcome it.
9 The true light that gives light to everyone was coming into the world. 10 He was in the world, and though the world was made through him, the world did not recognize him. 11 He came to that which was his own, but his own did not receive him. 12 Yet to all who did receive him, to those who believed in his name, he gave the right to become children of God— 13 children born not of natural descent, nor of human decision or a husband’s will, but born of God.

14 The Word (Jesus) became flesh and made his dwelling among us. We have seen his glory, the glory of the one and only Son, who came from the Father, full of grace and truth.

Who is the Scripture talking about when it says the Word was with god and the Word was God and the Word became flesh? Who became flesh? Obviously somebody who had previously been spirit.

 

[MatthewG]

John 1

In the beginning was the Word(Jesus), and the Word was with God, and the Word (Jesus) was God.
3 Through him all things were made; without him nothing was made that has been made. 4 In him was life, and that life was the light of all mankind. 5 The light shines in the darkness, and the darkness has not overcome it.
9 The true light that gives light to everyone was coming into the world. 10 He was in the world, and though the world was made through him, the world did not recognize him. 11 He came to that which was his own, but his own did not receive him. 12 Yet to all who did receive him, to those who believed in his name, he gave the right to become children of God— 13 children born not of natural descent, nor of human decision or a husband’s will, but born of God.

14 The Word (Jesus) became flesh and made his dwelling among us. We have seen his glory, the glory of the one and only Son, who came from the Father, full of grace and truth.

Who is the Scripture talking about when it says the Word was with god and the Word was God and the Word became flesh? Who became flesh? Obviously somebody who had previously been spirit.

The very Word (Logos) of God.

And it is something we can’t fully understand but that is what John presents in his account of the Lord Jesus Christ.

 

[Johann]

Yes probably, I also have a video on the subject…

@Johann : I still do not believe people should believe what I present but consider it, and think about it, and study it out for themselves.

You can’t find treasure if you aren’t willingly to dig deep, and the Spirit searches the deep things of God if one allows it to be done.

Yes probably, I also have a video on the subject…

@Johann : I still do not believe people should believe what I present but consider it, and think about it, and study it out for themselves.

You can’t find treasure if you aren’t willingly to dig deep, and the Spirit searches the deep things of God if one allows it to be done.

I am more than willing to dig deep and not swim on the surface Matthew, one question.
you believe in the Triune Godhead?
2. What Bible version are you reading from?
3. What study sources are you using?
J.

 

[Saint of God]

If Jesus is not God how can he be in each of us who are born again. A man cannot be omnipresent - everywhere at once. But Jesus is in me and in all other true Christians by the poser of the His Holy Spirit.

You just proved your lack of understanding. Jesus is not saying he as a man is in you...
John 6:63
It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.

I see you are still looking at this logically but I tell you it doesn't work like that, this isn't about logic or intellect it's spiritual, supernatural. My God is all powerful and can do anything.

You are the one assuming things. I showed you a passage saying that it is impossible for God to lie...Jesus is in believers by his words which you are yet to show that they abide in you. Jesus is not God because he is the son of God...God is not a race of beings. God is the title by which we address our eternal father...
We do not have many Gods we have one God, the father, and that God, the father, sent his son to be the saviour of the world.

 

[MatthewG]

I am more than willing to dig deep and not swim on the surface Matthew, one question.
you believe in the Triune Godhead?
2. What Bible version are you reading from?
3. What study sources are you using?
J.

Good keep digging deep.

www.cult.love
Thompson Chain Bible
Young’s literal translation, New International Version, King James, New King James, I also like New Living Translation.

Holman New King James Version study bible

If you watch the whole video you’ll know exactly everything i believe about God, Jesus, and the Holy Spirit (it is me in the video teaching from scriptures).

God bless.

 

[Saint of God]

Perhaps you will find this helpful on Acts 20:28.

"I have argued that the original text of Acts 20:28 read [THN EKKLHSIAN TOU THEOU HN PERIEPOIHSATO DIA TOU AIUATOS TOU IDIOU] and that the most appropriate translation of these words is "the church of God which he bought with the blood of his own one" or "the church of God which he bought with the blood of his own Son".
Murray J Harris - Jesus as Theos, The New Testament Use of Theos in Reference to Jesus

The Catholic Douay: "Take heed to yourselves, and to the whole flock, wherein the Holy Ghost hath placed you bishops, to rule the church of God, which he hath purchased with his own blood."

However, the Catholic New Jerusalem Bible reads: "Be on your guard for yourselves and for all the flock of which the Holy Spirit has made you the guardians, to feed the Church of God which he bought with the blood of his own Son."

Other translations agree with the New Jerusalem Bible.
CEB - "...which he obtained with the death of his own Son."
CJB - "...which he won for himself at the cost of his own Son’s blood."
CEV - "...he bought with the blood of his own Son."
GNT - "...which he made his own through the blood of his Son."
LEB - "...which he obtained through the blood of his own Son."
MOUNCE - "...which he purchased with the blood of his own Son."
NCV - "...which he bought with the death of his own son."
NET - “...that he obtained with the blood of his own Son.”
NRVS - “...that he obtained with the blood of his own Son.”
RSV - “...which he obtained with the blood of his own Son.”
NWT - "...which he purchased with the blood of his Son."

That was clearly established in my post... God does not have blood, neither can he die...

 

[Johann]

The very Word (Logos) of God.

And it is something we can’t fully understand but that is what John presents in his account of the Lord Jesus Christ.

Was with God (ἦν πὸς τὸν Θεὸν)
Anglo-Saxon vers., mid Gode. Wyc., at God. With (πρός) does not convey the full meaning, that there is no single English word which will give it better.

The preposition πρός, which, with the accusative case, denotes motion towards, or direction, is also often used in the New Testament in the sense of with; and that not merely as being near or beside, but as a living union and communion; implying the active notion of intercourse.

Thus: “Are not his sisters here with us” (πρὸς ἡμᾶς), i.e., in social relations with us (Mar_6:3; Mat_13:56). “How long shall I be with you” (πρὸς ὑμᾶς, Mar_9:16). “I sat daily with you” (Mat_26:55). “To be present with the Lord” (πρὸς τὸν Κύριον, 2Co_5:8). “Abide and winter with you” (1Co_16:6).

“The eternal life which was with the Father” (πρὸς τὸν πατέρα, 1Jn_1:2). Thus John's statement is that the divine Word not only abode with the Father from all eternity, but was in the living, active relation of communion with Him.

And the Word was God (καὶ Θεὸς ἦν ὁ λόγος)
In the Greek order, and God was the Word, which is followed by Anglo-Saxon, Wyc., and Tynd. But θεὸς, God, is the predicate and not the subject of the proposition. The subject must be the Word; for John is not trying to show who is God, but who is the Word.

Notice that Θεὸς is without the article, which could not have been omitted if he had meant to designate the word as God; because, in that event, Θεὸς would have been ambiguous; perhaps a God. Moreover, if he had said God was the Word, he would have contradicted his previous statement by which he had distinguished (hypostatically) God from the word, and λόγος (Logos) would, further, have signified only an attribute of God.

The predicate is emphatically placed in the proposition before the subject, because of the progress of the thought; this being the third and highest statement respecting the Word - the climax of the two preceding propositions. The word God, used attributively, maintains the personal distinction between God and the Word, but makes the unity of essence and nature to follow the distinction of person, and ascribes to the Word all the attributes of the divine essence.

“There is something majestic in the way in which the description of the Logos, in the three brief but great propositions of Joh_1:1, is unfolded with increasing fullness” (Meyer).

A problem if a person only believes in the echad/Oneness of Elohim and not seeing the Memra/Y'howshuwa/Jesus...God WITH God in a living, active, intimate fellowship One with the Other.

J.