Why do so many Christains treat unbelievers as the enemy of God?

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BreadOfLife

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heaven is a place to you, that you might attain--after you physically die, of course--if you believe the right things, pick the right religion, and observe the right rituals. So we are just too far apart @ "people in heaven" for me to even give a meaningful reply there, sorry.

i believe "on earth, as it is in heaven," and i worship a Risen Christ, and (from my perspective) do not dwell on what to me are the foundational things, "laying them over and over." Hebrews? i think

so, John 3:13 is meaningful to me in a different way also, but it is tied in with an understanding of heaven as a spiritual state and not a place.

Christ's sacrifice opened the gates of heaven, sure--so heaven could come here, to our domain, where we are meant to be, and so that we might all have "Life, more abundantly," which when i read that, even with my mind as open as i can possibly make it, even on mushrooms, i just cannot envision meaning "after i am dead."

Mostly because after i am dead seems like the perfect time to realize that i have been robbed "like a thief in the night."
In other words - you've perverted Jesus's words in John 3 - just like you have everywhere else . . .
 

101G

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Sorry pal - but you're grasping at straws.
Neither Priscilla nor Pheobe were "Bishops".

First of all - I obliterated this argument by showing you the etymology of the word "Bishop" - and it goes back to the Greek word Epskipos.
I also gave you a Scriptural spanking by showing you the description of the qualifications for a Bishop in 1 Timothy 3. They refer to a MAN - not a woman.

Again - you need to admit that you're wrong and move on.

PS - You STILL haven't shown me an etymology of the word "Bishop" that goes back to "Sunergos" . . .
you're done talk to the HAND, good day
 

bbyrd009

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" John 3:13 is meaningful to me in a different way also, but it is tied in with an understanding of heaven as a spiritual state and not a place."

"you've perverted Jesus's words"

but i would be careful about making proclamations like this fwiw. you do not know, and i could stick you to the wall with passages that directly contradict heaven or the kingdom as physical places ok
 

101G

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I couldn't pass this up, you said, "qualifications for a Bishop in 1 Timothy 3. They refer to a MAN - not a woman".

let me ask you something is not an overseer, bishop, Elder, Pastor interchangeable? yes or no. please answer
 

BreadOfLife

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you're done talk to the HAND, good day
Translation:
"I cannot prove my point on a linguistic or etymological level - so I'll just bow out now."

That's what I thought . . .
 

101G

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No Translation:1 Timothy 4:7 "But refuse profane and old wives' fables, and exercise thyself rather unto godliness". and, 1 Timothy 6:20 "O Timothy, keep that which is committed to thy trust, avoiding profane and vain babblings, and oppositions of science falsely so called".

Now I will prove your male only for bishop a lie also.
well what about the overseer, pastor bishop, and elder are these the same? do they not feed the flock?, well
 

101G

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Since the cat got your tongue, or Satan, ... I’ll explain and answer AT THE SAME TIME. A bishop, is an, overseer, who is an elder who feed the flock of God which is the pastor. Now 1 Timothy 3:1 & 2 "This is a true saying, If a man desire the office of a bishop, he desireth a good work. 2 A bishop then must be blameless, the husband of one wife, vigilant, sober, of good behaviour, given to hospitality, apt to teach

Here are your problems, #1. Man here in verse 1 is not male, it’s G1536 εἰ τίς ei tis (ei tiys') cond.
1. if any. THAT'S MEAN Male or female.

#2. the bishop must be the husband of one wife. Problem, Paul was a bishop, and he was not married. Let me explain. Paul have always been known as the apostle. Well he’s also a prophet and a teacher, which in verse 2 of 1 Timothy 3 states “ apt to teach”. supportive scripture, 1 Corinthians 4:17 "For this cause have I sent unto you Timotheus, who is my beloved son, and faithful in the Lord, who shall bring you into remembrance of my ways which be in Christ, as I teach every where in every church”. now what about that Bishop position, a bishop is a feeder of sheep, but what do they feed with? Answer, Acts 20:28 "Take heed therefore unto yourselves, and to all the flock, over the which the Holy Ghost hath made you overseers, to feed the church of God, which he hath purchased with his own blood”. now the definition of this feeding, Jeremiah 3:15 "And I will give you pastors according to mine heart, which shall feed you with knowledge and understanding”. there's the food they feed with. let’s see the apostle Paul in his own words say this, 1 Corinthians 13:1 & 2 "Though I speak with the tongues of men and of angels, and have not charity, I am become as sounding brass, or a tinkling cymbal. 2 And though I have the gift of prophecy, and understand all mysteries, and all knowledge; and though I have all faith, so that I could remove mountains, and have not charity, I am nothing”.

There it is, all understanding, and all knowledge, just as Jeremiah 3:15 say what a pastor/overseer/bishop do. NOW WAS PAUL MARRIED?. NO, fist error on your part. now do man in verse 1 means only males?, no, so all your statements are false. it's a lie that women cannot be bishops. I already prove that with our sister Phebe in her role as succourer.
so breadof... you have been exposed. and proven false in all your statements. FALSE prophet = anti=Christ.
 

BreadOfLife

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Since the cat got your tongue, or Satan, ... I’ll explain and answer AT THE SAME TIME. A bishop, is an, overseer, who is an elder who feed the flock of God which is the pastor. Now 1 Timothy 3:1 & 2 "This is a true saying, If a man desire the office of a bishop, he desireth a good work. 2 A bishop then must be blameless, the husband of one wife, vigilant, sober, of good behaviour, given to hospitality, apt to teach

Here are your problems, #1. Man here in verse 1 is not male, it’s G1536 εἰ τίς ei tis (ei tiys') cond.
1. if any. THAT'S MEAN Male or female.

#2. the bishop must be the husband of one wife. Problem, Paul was a bishop, and he was not married. Let me explain. Paul have always been known as the apostle. Well he’s also a prophet and a teacher, which in verse 2 of 1 Timothy 3 states “ apt to teach”. supportive scripture, 1 Corinthians 4:17 "For this cause have I sent unto you Timotheus, who is my beloved son, and faithful in the Lord, who shall bring you into remembrance of my ways which be in Christ, as I teach every where in every church”. now what about that Bishop position, a bishop is a feeder of sheep, but what do they feed with? Answer, Acts 20:28 "Take heed therefore unto yourselves, and to all the flock, over the which the Holy Ghost hath made you overseers, to feed the church of God, which he hath purchased with his own blood”. now the definition of this feeding, Jeremiah 3:15 "And I will give you pastors according to mine heart, which shall feed you with knowledge and understanding”. there's the food they feed with. let’s see the apostle Paul in his own words say this, 1 Corinthians 13:1 & 2 "Though I speak with the tongues of men and of angels, and have not charity, I am become as sounding brass, or a tinkling cymbal. 2 And though I have the gift of prophecy, and understand all mysteries, and all knowledge; and though I have all faith, so that I could remove mountains, and have not charity, I am nothing”.

There it is, all understanding, and all knowledge, just as Jeremiah 3:15 say what a pastor/overseer/bishop do. NOW WAS PAUL MARRIED?. NO, fist error on your part. now do man in verse 1 means only males?, no, so all your statements are false. it's a lie that women cannot be bishops. I already prove that with our sister Phebe in her role as succourer.
so breadof... you have been exposed. and proven false in all your statements. FALSE prophet = anti=Christ.
Your Scriptural perversion never ends . . .

First of all - Paul NEVER said that a man MUST be married in order to be a Bishop.
In the 1st century - polygamy was rampant. Paul was simply stating that if a man wanted to be a Bishop - he could only be married to ONE woman. Anyway - this pertains to MEN - not women. Women were not allowed to be Bishops.

In fact – Paul says quite emphatically that that women should NOT teach or exercise authority over men (1 Tim 2:12) – so your rubbish about female Bishops is patently absurd.

Your problem - as with ALL anti-Catholics is that you are not educated in history, Scripture or linguistics.
 

101G

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First of all - Paul NEVER said that a man MUST be married in order to be a Bishop.
Why do you have to lie?, 1 Timothy 3:2 "A bishop then must be blameless, the husband of one wife, vigilant, sober, of good behaviour, given to hospitality, apt to teach".

why do you lie so much?.
 

101G

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In fact – Paul says quite emphatically that that women should NOT teach or exercise authority over men (1 Tim 2:12) – so your rubbish about female Bishops is patently absurd.
another lie, the word woman here is
G1135 γυνή gune (ǰ ï-nee') n.
1. a woman.
2. (specially) a wife.
[probably from the base of G1096]
KJV: wife, woman

and how do we know that this speaking of a wife? verse 15 "Notwithstanding she shall be saved in childbearing, if they continue in faith and charity and holiness with sobriety". the only woman suppose to be having children is a married one.

again why do you lie so much.
 

101G

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See, now you’re stuck, I can read an injured dog quickly. When you said, “ Paul NEVER said that a man MUST be married in order to be a Bishop.” that was a dead give away of saying, I don’t know how to answer this. I’m not not about arguing, I give the answer. If you would have read chapter 2 the narrative would have told you who the apostle was addressing. Any married man who desire the work. He must be the husband of one wife, not two or three but one. How do we know this?, verse 4 “One that ruleth well his own house, having his children in subjection with all gravity”. are the lights coming on by now. his children, My God how long will one not understand.
 
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BreadOfLife

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Why do you have to lie?, 1 Timothy 3:2 "A bishop then must be blameless, the husband of one wife, vigilant, sober, of good behaviour, given to hospitality, apt to teach".

why do you lie so much?.
See, now you’re stuck, I can read an injured dog quickly. When you said, “ Paul NEVER said that a man MUST be married in order to be a Bishop.” that was a dead give away of saying, I don’t know how to answer this. I’m not not about arguing, I give the answer. If you would have read chapter 2 the narrative would have told you who the apostle was addressing. Any married man who desire the work. He must be the husband of one wife, not two or three but one. How do we know this?, verse 4 “One that ruleth well his own house, having his children in subjection with all gravity”. are the lights coming on by now. his children, My God how long will one not understand.
This is what happens when somebody approaches the Scriptures in total ignorance of the era that they were written. Paul is telling Timothy that polygamists could not be Bishops. He never said that an unmarried man couldn't be one.

Paul recommended the celibate life for those wishing to serve god more fully:
1 Cor. 7:32-34

I should like you to be free of anxieties. An unmarried man is anxious about the things of the Lord, how he may please the Lord.
But a married man is anxious about the things of the world, how he may please his wife, and he is divided.


Good grief - haven't you ever cracked open a Bible??
 

101G

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This is what happens when somebody approaches the Scriptures in total ignorance of the era that they were written. Paul is telling Timothy that polygamists could not be Bishops. He never said that an unmarried man couldn't be one.

Paul recommended the celibate life for those wishing to serve god more fully:
1 Cor. 7:32-34

I should like you to be free of anxieties. An unmarried man is anxious about the things of the Lord, how he may please the Lord.
But a married man is anxious about the things of the world, how he may please his wife, and he is divided.


Good grief - haven't you ever cracked open a Bible??
Understand breadof…. the flow of conservation. Thew apostle was talking with married men in chapter 2, and the conservation continue into chapter 3. how do we know this? answer notice the conjunction “THEN” in verse 2. 1 Timothy 3:1 "This is a true saying, If a man desire the office of a bishop, he desireth a good work. 2 A bishop then must be blameless, the husband of one wife, vigilant, sober, of good behaviour, given to hospitality, apt to teach;”. understand, “then” is the Greek word here, G3767 οὖν oun (oun') conj. 1. a conjunction indicating a responsive progression of actions or events, whether the response is direct, immediate or delayed.

2. (directly) accordingly.

3. (progressively) in due course.

4. (of continuation or question) so then (as used in the vernacular English).

5. (of a longer continuation) so (as used in the vernacular English).

6. (as a distinct or distant conjunction) now then.

7. (of a conclusive response) well then (as is obvious...).

[apparently a primary word]

KJV: and (so, truly), but, now (then), so (likewise then), then, therefore, verily, wherefore

Compare: G1352, G2596, G5106


See definition #1. the conservation was interrupted in verse 1, “This is a true saying, If a man desire the office of a bishop, he desireth a good work”. the true saying is for everyone, (THAT’S WHY IT’S A TRUE SAYING). verse 2 starts the conversation back with “THEN, listen, verse 2 “A bishop then” the THEN do just what it meant to do, G3767 οὖν oun (oun') conj. 1. a conjunction indicating a responsive progression of actions or events, whether the response is direct, immediate or delayed. The delay was in verse 1, with a true saying for all men.


My God how hard is it for one to learn.

I suggest you close your bible, because it's doing you no good.
 

101G

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Paul recommended the celibate life for those wishing to serve god more fully:
ANOTHER LIE, for the apostle said this, 1 Corinthians 7:35 "And this I speak for your own profit; not that I may cast a snare upon you, but for that which is comely, and that ye may attend upon the Lord without distraction".

beradof.... that's another lie. now I have prove to you without a doubt a women can be a bishop. two Paul was speaking to the married. and exposed the not married excuse.

now you see why I'm anti-catholic DOCTRINE. man made traditions. the scriptures are true, Mark 7:9 "And he said unto them, Full well ye reject the commandment of God, that ye may keep your own tradition".
 
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OzSpen

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Not all flavors are harmless. The rapture, tongues and the trinity are pretty harmless. I rarely see salvation issues in those topics. This is not true for all flavors.

Salvation issues are critical in our doctrine of the Trinity because the Trinity defines which God we worship. This is only a brief diagrammatic summary of the Trinity:

trinity-11.gif


(image courtesy Christianity 201)
 
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101G

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Salvation issues are critical in our doctrine of the Trinity because the Trinity defines which God we worship. This is only a brief diagrammatic summary of the Trinity:
a question, is not the conceiver the father of a child?, yes or no.
 

OzSpen

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I couldn't pass this up, you said, "qualifications for a Bishop in 1 Timothy 3. They refer to a MAN - not a woman".

let me ask you something is not an overseer, bishop, Elder, Pastor interchangeable? yes or no. please answer

That's an argument from silence, which is a logical fallacy.

Where do we find biblical explanations for the job description and character traits of a pastor (as compared with a bishop or elder)?

Notice that 1 Tim 3:12 (ESV) states that deacons should be 'the husband of one wife'. Yet Rom 16:1 states that 'our sister Phoebe' was 'a servant [deaconess] of the church at Cenchreae'.

Please explain how a female deaconess can be 'the husband of one wife'.

In regards to 'the husband of one wife' (ESV) translation, the latest edition of the NIV translates 1 Tim 3:12 as, 'A deacon must be faithful to his wife and must manage his children and his household well'. Why is that? Because the meaning of gune is wife or woman and it is talking about faithfulness in marital relationships, whether that be for a female deacon or a male deacon.

The latest NIV also translates 1 Tim 3:2 as, 'Now the overseer is to be above reproach, faithful to his wife, temperate, self-controlled, respectable, hospitable, able to teach'. So the overseer must not be a sleep around in a promiscuous society but needs to be faithful to his spouse. Even the ESV which translates this verse as 'husband of one wife' has the footnote, 'or, a man of one woman'.

Oz
 

101G

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Where do we find biblical explanations for the job description and character traits of a pastor (as compared with a bishop or elder)?
Jer 3:15

and I couldn't pass this up either,
So who is the Conceiver of the Holy Spirit and the Son?
Matthew 1:19 & 20 "Then Joseph her husband, being a just man, and not willing to make her a publick example, was minded to put her away privily. 20 "But while he thought on these things, behold, the angel of the Lord appeared unto him in a dream, saying, Joseph, thou son of David, fear not to take unto thee Mary thy wife: for that which is conceived in her is of the Holy Ghost".

if the Holy Ghost is the one who conceived the child, is he not the Father of the child?. I say yes. and if he's the Father who is this other person who you call Father? please answer.