Timing of the abomination of desolation

[Timtofly]

Dispensational futurism is all future.
Jesus isn't a dispensational futurist. That's why He warned the Judean Christians to flee.
The Holy Spirit isn't a dispensational futurist. That's why He inspired Matthew to record Jesus' warning to the Judean Christians to flee.
Matthew wasn't a dispensational futurist. That's why he obeyed the Holy Spirit's inspiration to record Jesus' warning to the Judean Christians to flee.
The Judean Christians weren't dispensational futurists. That's why they fled.
And survived.
And left dispensational futurism "hanging out to dry".

I am not a dispensational futurist either. So there is that. When one sees armies gathering, they do not have to be preterist or Amil to know they should flee. So if you like labels, good for you. Sounds to me you have no future, but it all hung out to dry for you in the first century. Good luck then, just to keep it all label friendly for you.

 

[covenantee]

Matthew is all future.

I am not a dispensational futurist either.

So what kind of futurist are you?

When one sees armies gathering, they do not have to be preterist or Amil to know they should flee.

The Jews saw armies gathering. So why didn't the Jews know that they should flee?

 

[Timtofly]

So what kind of futurist are you?

The Jews saw armies gathering. So why didn't the Jews know that they should flee?

The Jews chased the first army as it marched away, even killing some. Luke passed the word onto those living in Jerusalem sooner than Matthew's Gospel. Matthew did not need to write about fleeing from the armies, because it already happened. Matthew probably started to write his Gospel after fleeing from Jerusalem in 66AD. Now that they were in hiding, spreading the Gospel went from doing it person by person, to writing about the life of Christ.

I am a witness to the future. Every day is a new future.

 

[Davy]

So you then believe that Matthew 24:16 was intended for the Judean Christians.

You're right. It was.

No, you are not correct. The Matthew 24:16 verse (and Luke 21:21) is for the very END of this present world when the coming false-Messiah to JERUSALEM sets up the "abomination of desolation" idol of the Book of Daniel.

There was NO "abomination of desolation" event in 70 A.D. by the Romans. According to the Jewish historian Josephus (100 A.D.), the 2nd temple burned down while the Romans were trying to get possession of it, a fire having begun inside it.

Thus the Daniel 11 events that the coming Antichrist will do in Jerusalem at the end of this world, for the coming "great tribulation", in a new Jewish temple, will fulfill what that "vile person" is to do with placing the "abomination that maketh desolate" in the new temple, and proclaim himself as God.

Preterism is a false concoction by men. Even a 2nd grader can grasp that the time of the Signs Jesus was giving in Matthew 24, Mark 13, and Luke 21 involving the generation that will see His return is for the END of this world, and NOT back in 70 A.D.

 

[covenantee]

No, you are not correct. The Matthew 24:16 verse (and Luke 21:21) is for the very END of this present world when the coming false-Messiah to JERUSALEM sets up the "abomination of desolation" idol of the Book of Daniel.

There was NO "abomination of desolation" event in 70 A.D. by the Romans. According to the Jewish historian Josephus (100 A.D.), the 2nd temple burned down while the Romans were trying to get possession of it, a fire having begun inside it.

Thus the Daniel 11 events that the coming Antichrist will do in Jerusalem at the end of this world, for the coming "great tribulation", in a new Jewish temple, will fulfill what that "vile person" is to do with placing the "abomination that maketh desolate" in the new temple, and proclaim himself as God.

Preterism is a false concoction by men. Even a 2nd grader can grasp that the time of the Signs Jesus was giving in Matthew 24, Mark 13, and Luke 21 involving the generation that will see His return is for the END of this world, and NOT back in 70 A.D.

Whom to believe?

1. Jesus, His words, and His Judean followers who heeded Him and them.
or
2. Modern denialists.

I know Whom I believe.

 

[Davy]

You need to get your accusations straight. I never said they fled for 3.5 years as if a tribulation.

I said they fled in 66AD and it had Nothing to do with a tribulation nor 70AD. It had nothing to do with the OD as written in Matthew one iota. Matthew is all future. Israel becoming a nation, the Second Coming, the GT, and perhaps an AoD.

My facts are straight bud.

Your Post #137 You Said:
"Exactly. 70AD had nothing to do with the OD, except they fled 3.5 years prior to the destruction. So the closest we get to 70AD is the fleeing 3.5 years before 70AD. That was given in Luke, not Matthew. Matthew is still future."
___________________________________________

There is NO connection with the 3.5 years of the Book of Daniel and Book of Revelation to 70 A.D. fleeing. Your saying Jews fled Judea 3.5 years prior to 70 A.D. is a vain attempt to move that 3.5 years (or 1260 days, or time, times, and half a time) prophecy for the end back... to 70 A.D. Doing that represents A CHOPPING UP OF GOD'S WRITTEN WORD. It means you align with the charlatans who created the FALSE Preterist doctrines of men with trying to push those endtime events back in history.

 

[Davy]

Whom to believe?

1. Jesus, His words, and His Judean followers who heeded Him and them.
or
2. Modern denialists.

I know Whom I believe.

I DEFINITELY believe my Lord Jesus' Words in His Olivet discourse, as He was pointing SPECIFICALLY to the Seals of Revelation 6 with those SIGNS He was giving in those Bible Chapters I quoted.

The fact that anyone... would claim to be heeding Jesus in those Chapters, but then go completely against the timing of the end of this world that He showed there, like you have done, is evidence of your heeding MAN's doctrines instead, and NOT heeding Jesus Christ. So let the chips fall where they may.

 

[covenantee]

I DEFINITELY believe my Lord Jesus' Words in His Olivet discourse, as He was pointing SPECIFICALLY to the Seals of Revelation 6 with those SIGNS He was giving in those Bible Chapters I quoted.

The fact that anyone... would claim to be heeding Jesus in those Chapters, but then go completely against the timing of the end of this world that He showed there, like you have done, is evidence of your heeding MAN's doctrines instead, and NOT heeding Jesus Christ. So let the chips fall where they may.

Tell the Judean Christians that they were "heeding MAN's doctrines instead, and NOT heeding Jesus Christ".

Let me know what they say.

 

[Davy]

Tell the Judean Christians that they were "heeding MAN's doctrines instead, and NOT heeding Jesus Christ".

Let me know what they say.

You've gone off topic with trying to present a silly argument. That's not how one shows good Bible scholarship with staying in God's Word.

 

[covenantee]

You've gone off topic with trying to present a silly argument. That's not how one shows good Bible scholarship with staying in God's Word.

Tell the Judean Christians that they'd gone off topic with trying to present a silly argument.

Let me know what they say.

 

[Davy]

Tell the Judean Christians that they'd gone off topic with trying to present a silly argument.

Let me know what they say.

Little Child.

 

[covenantee]

Little Child.

Yes, they were God's Children.

That's why they knew to heed the warnings of His Son.

 

[Timtofly]

My facts are straight bud.

Your Post #137 You Said:
"Exactly. 70AD had nothing to do with the OD, except they fled 3.5 years prior to the destruction. So the closest we get to 70AD is the fleeing 3.5 years before 70AD. That was given in Luke, not Matthew. Matthew is still future."
___________________________________________

There is NO connection with the 3.5 years of the Book of Daniel and Book of Revelation to 70 A.D. fleeing. Your saying Jews fled Judea 3.5 years prior to 70 A.D. is a vain attempt to move that 3.5 years (or 1260 days, or time, times, and half a time) prophecy for the end back... to 70 A.D. Doing that represents A CHOPPING UP OF GOD'S WRITTEN WORD. It means you align with the charlatans who created the FALSE Preterist doctrines of men with trying to push those endtime events back in history.

You are still as blind as a bat about my post.

You can argue with Josephus, because Josephus said they fled in 66AD when they saw the Roman army. Josephus said they remembered some warning about doing so. You can call Josephus the father of preterist eschatology.

Don't pin what Josephus said on me. I was not alive in the first century.

 

[Davy]

You are still as blind as a bat about my post.

You can argue with Josephus, because Josephus said they fled in 66AD when they saw the Roman army. Josephus said they remembered some warning about doing so. You can call Josephus the father of preterist eschatology.

Don't pin what Josephus said on me. I was not alive in the first century.

You're the one that doesn't 'get it', because the Olivet discourse where Jesus told those in Judea to flee is CONNECTED TO THE "ABOMINATION OF DESOLATION" IDOL event, in the Book of Daniel! And that event did NOT happen in 70 A.D. by the Romans! So you claiming the 3.5 years prophecy that is for the END that Jesus pointed to and in the Book of Daniel, shows YOUR CLAIM TO MEN'S LEAVEN DOCTRINES OF PRETERISM, A FALSE DOCTRINE.

 

[covenantee]

You're the one that doesn't 'get it', because the Olivet discourse where Jesus told those in Judea to flee is CONNECTED TO THE "ABOMINATION OF DESOLATION" IDOL event, in the Book of Daniel! And that event did NOT happen in 70 A.D. by the Romans! So you claiming the 3.5 years prophecy that is for the END that Jesus pointed to and in the Book of Daniel, shows YOUR CLAIM TO MEN'S LEAVEN DOCTRINES OF PRETERISM, A FALSE DOCTRINE.

It happened in 66 AD, when the Judean Christians fled in recognition of Jesus' warnings in Matthew 24:15-16 and Luke 21:20-21.

Have you forgotten already?

 

[Waiting on him]

I don't believe in a 7 year tribulation. I only believe in the 42 month tribulation Daniel wrote about during the 42 months when the Gentiles occupy Jerusalem. It starts after the daily sacrifice is abolished and End with the abomination of desolation which is when the resurection takes place.

This happened in the first century after Jesus confirmed the covenant.


Matthew 26:28 KJV
[28] For this is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many for the remission of sins.

 

[Waiting on him]

Daniel 9:26-27 KJV
[26] And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off, but not for himself: and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined. [27] And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.
Need to stop denying Christ. He confirmed the covenant and due to the great act of love performed on Calvary no Orthodox Jew has atoned for his sin since.

 

[Davy]

It happened in 66 AD, when the Judean Christians fled in recognition of Jesus' warnings in Matthew 24:15-16 and Luke 21:20-21.

Have you forgotten already?

Nah, the "great tribulation" event Jesus warned about in His Olivet discourse DID NOT HAPPEN IN 66 A.D. You are being deceived by men's false leaven doctrine called Preterism.

Preterism wrongly believes that Christ's Olivet discourse was already history, and the same thing about most of Christ's Book of Revelation. The only part Partial Preterists hold to is Jesus' future 2nd coming.

But FULL Preterism, an even MORE CORRUPT leaven false doctrine of men, wrongly believes that Jesus' 2nd coming ALREADY HAPPENED in His Apostle's days, because they say it was to be a 'spiritual' coming, and not a literal bodily coming by Christ.

Those in Christ Jesus are NOT to run with those on those doctrines, because those ideas are against God's written Word. And if the Bible student doesn't know that, then they best get cracking in their Bible studies, because the times today are awfully short. Jesus' return is just around the corner.

 

[covenantee]

Nah, the "great tribulation" event Jesus warned about in His Olivet discourse DID NOT HAPPEN IN 66 A.D. You are being deceived by men's false leaven doctrine called Preterism.

Preterism wrongly believes that Christ's Olivet discourse was already history, and the same thing about most of Christ's Book of Revelation. The only part Partial Preterists hold to is Jesus' future 2nd coming.

But FULL Preterism, an even MORE CORRUPT leaven false doctrine of men, wrongly believes that Jesus' 2nd coming ALREADY HAPPENED in His Apostle's days, because they say it was to be a 'spiritual' coming, and not a literal bodily coming by Christ.

Those in Christ Jesus are NOT to run with those on those doctrines, because those ideas are against God's written Word. And if the Bible student doesn't know that, then they best get cracking in their Bible studies, because the times today are awfully short. Jesus' return is just around the corner.

The Judean Christians never knew of preterism, which first appeared in the 17th century, spawned in the counter-reformation of the apostasized papacy.

Nor did they ever know of futurism, which first appeared in the 16th century, also spawned in the counter-reformation of the apostasized papacy.

There wasn't a preterist or futurist in the bunch.

Thankfully, they did know the warnings of Jesus from His Olivet discourse.

And acted upon them.

And lived.

Exposing the fantasies, fallacies, and failures of modern armchair dispensational futurists.

 

[Davy]

The Judean Christians never knew of preterism, which first appeared in the 17th century, spawned in the counter-reformation of the apostasized papacy.

Nor did they ever know of futurism, which first appeared in the 16th century, also spawned in the counter-reformation of the apostasized papacy.

There wasn't a preterist or futurist in the bunch.

Thankfully, they did know the warnings of Jesus from His Olivet discourse.

And acted upon them.

And lived.

It's true that men's leaven doctrines of Preterism did not begin in the 1st century A.D. in Judea, nor in 70 A.D. The theory began much later when false prophets came up with such a blasphemous idea and began preaching it in certain Church denominations. I should know, as I was raised in one of those vain Church denominations, a beth-aven. They never taught Bible prophecy about the END of this world, but taught that Jesus' Olivet discourse was history, and likewise most of Christ's Book of Revelation. So their whole congregations... are sitting duped, not prepared one bit for what is coming in the future time of "great tribulation" just prior to Christ's return, even though Jesus Himself revealed to His faithful what to expect.