Speaking in tongues is NOT a gift

[1stCenturyLady]

There are many blessings, promises, gifts ,& manifestations of God in his word. Some he offers to ppl bc he knows the simplicity of heart they believe with and the trust they follow him with.

Everybody does not have from him bc they have not made the commitment to be of a contrite heart and a broken spirit. Ppl hold tight to what they are comfortable with even RESISTING GOD to obedience.

If you lack wisdom, ask God [ Ja.1:3-6 ], ask and God will give it [ Mt.7:5-8 ] if anything you desire is lacking in your life,all that we must do in believing is ask,seek & knock. God does not withhold HIS good from HIS PPL.

Amen, sis!

 

[Rich R]

That's what I was afraid of. When you become born again you will know the difference. It is a supernatural experience that unmistakably removes your sin nature. Until then you will believe you are a sinner because you will be. When you're not, you'll know it, and it won't be a lie, because Jesus says so.

I appreciate your concern that I'm not born again. I could tell you it's an ill founded concern, but I don't suppose it'd change your mind, so I won't. Wait...I guess I just did. Ignore that part.

 

[1stCenturyLady]

I appreciate your concern that I'm not born again. I could tell you it's an ill founded concern, but I don't suppose it'd change your mind, so I won't. Wait...I guess I just did. Ignore that part.

I don't know if you are or not; I just know you are not willing to test yourself, if fact, you still believe to be partial to sin. I went to church for 30 years before becoming born again, so I know that not everyone who SAYS they are a Christian actually are. So if you don't care, then I'll let you work out your own salvation. Hope to see you there, but if not, I won't know about it, as we won't know anything but those in heaven with us. No tears for those who aren't.

 

[Rich R]

I don't know if you are or not; I just know you are not willing to test yourself, if fact, you still believe to be partial to sin. I went to church for 30 years before becoming born again, so I know that not everyone who SAYS they are a Christian actually are. So if you don't care, then I'll let you work out your own salvation. Hope to see you there, but if not, I won't know about it, as we won't know anything but those in heaven with us. No tears for those who aren't.

I think you are very wise in not worrying about it.

 

[1stCenturyLady]

I appreciate your concern that I'm not born again. I could tell you it's an ill founded concern, but I don't suppose it'd change your mind, so I won't. Wait...I guess I just did. Ignore that part.

Just curious, seeing as we are dead to sin, why would you argue that you sin if you indeed are born again. Do you know what born again means? Romans 6:6-7 shows you, so why is it a lie to say you are free from sin? Verse 1 John 1:9 goes WITH verse 8 in order to not be a liar. But you and Carl don't want to hear it. You would just rather take a verse out of context and run with it into false doctrine and right off the cliff.

Without holiness, no man shall see God. Good luck nursing your sin nature.

Do you speak in tongues? Also curious and just to get back to the OP. LOL

 

[Rich R]

Just curious, seeing as we are dead to sin, why would you argue that you sin if you indeed are born again. Do you know what born again means? Romans 6:6-7 shows you, so why is it a lie to say you are free from sin? Verse 1 John 1:9 goes WITH verse 8 in order to not be a liar. But you and Carl don't want to hear it. You would just rather take a verse out of context and run with it into false doctrine and right off the cliff.

Without holiness, no man shall see God. Good luck nursing your sin nature.

Do you speak in tongues? Also curious and just to get back to the OP. LOL

Just because I have a sin nature, doesn't mean I have to dwell on it or even think much about it at all. God looks at our perfect spirit so He thinks we're just wonderful. Doesn't mean He doesn't know we are flesh (He brings that very truth up not infrequently), but he thinks so much of us He just ignores it. My earthy mother was much the same way. Some of the things I did and yet felt nothing but love from my parents amazes even me. I'm sure I'm not the only one with a mother like that either. In any case, God loves us, period, end of story. I take my cue from Him and don't worry about something I can't do anything about anyway. I have this sinful flesh body and I'll have it til Jesus gives me my new one. That's pretty much what Paul related in Romans 7. Plus, when I do feel bad for going against God's will (remember, I'm not Jesus ), all I do is exactly what 1 John says, i.e., I admit to God I did it, He says, "Don't worry about it. I forgive you and hereby declare you free from all unrighteousness. Now get back to doing the work I laid out for you." Of course, no confession, no forgiveness and no cleansing. We just end up carrying around a bunch of baggage and end up walking in darkness.

I have no problem with this arrangement. I think it's absolutely beyond brilliant. But what other kind of plan would God dream up? I mean, He's God. Of course He would go beyond anything we could come up with. All our stuff is foolishness to God.

I speak in tongues much, I interpret, prophecy, get word of knowledge and wisdom, I've discerned spirits, I've performed miracles, healings, and finally I've operated faith to do the impossible. Do they all look like the 9 manifestations? They are! Like I said, I have the gift of holy spirit and I've been instructed on how to manifest it into the visible world in service to others. So I do.

You really need not worry about me.

 

[1stCenturyLady]

Just because I have a sin nature, doesn't mean I have to dwell on it or even think much about it at all. God looks at our perfect spirit so He thinks we're just wonderful. Doesn't mean He doesn't know we are flesh (He brings that very truth up not infrequently), but he thinks so much of us He just ignores it. My earthy mother was much the same way. Some of the things I did and yet felt nothing but love from my parents amazes even me. I'm sure I'm not the only one with a mother like that either. In any case, God loves us, period, end of story. I take my cue from Him and don't worry about something I can't do anything about anyway. I have this sinful flesh body and I'll have it til Jesus gives me my new one. That's pretty much what Paul related in Romans 7. Plus, when I do feel bad for going against God's will (remember, I'm not Jesus ), all I do is exactly what 1 John says, i.e., I admit to God I did it, He says, "Don't worry about it. I forgive you and hereby declare you free from all unrighteousness. Now get back to doing the work I laid out for you." Of course, no confession, no forgiveness and no cleansing. We just end up carrying around a bunch of baggage and end up walking in darkness.

I have no problem with this arrangement. I think it's absolutely beyond brilliant. But what other kind of plan would God dream up? I mean, He's God. Of course He would go beyond anything we could come up with. All our stuff is foolishness to God.

I speak in tongues much, I interpret, prophecy, get word of knowledge and wisdom, I've discerned spirits, I've performed miracles, healings, and finally I've operated faith to do the impossible. Do they all look like the 9 manifestations? They are! Like I said, I have the gift of holy spirit and I've been instructed on how to manifest it into the visible world in service to others. So I do.

You really need not worry about me.

How can 1 John 3:9 be true if you still have your sin nature? How can you be free from sin and still have a sin nature? Romans 6:6-7. This is why Jesus said we MUST be born again. Romans 8:9 shows that if you have the Spirit you don't have the sin nature. You are no longer in the flesh/sin nature. Gifts don't matter if you still have a sin nature by sinning. Romans 6:15-16; Matthew 7:21-23. You can go back to satan, but you cannot have God AND satan. Somewhere along the way you have believed and held onto the unholy doctrine that Jesus didn't take away ALL of our sin and cleanse us of all unrighteousness; no, He left you with you sin nature, the one thing we inherited from Adam that Jesus didn't think to take away? The sin nature is the SOURCE of sin. Of course that is the first thing he took away and why it is written that we partake of the divine nature. Did you understand that, Rich. THE DIVINE NATURE OF GOD, HIMSELF. I know I feel Him in me, and have for the last 45 years, and it just gets stronger and easier every year. But with this false believe in a dual nature, THAT is why you and Carl believe 1 John 1:8 is a Christian, though it was the previous verse that is a true Christian. Verse 9 is how verse 8 can become a Christian.

You say you still have your sin nature in all its darkness - 1 John 1:6. Rich, you have to pray to be born again and not just play church. Still claiming to be a Christian that is free from sin but still hanging on to your sin. You can't be both! Romans 8:8-9 tells you that those in the flesh as you claim to be cannot please God. That is why Paul said if you do not have the Spirit of Christ you don't belong to Him. And you can't have your sin nature at the same time. We do not have a sin nature AND a divine nature. So which one do you want to claim?

Do you honestly believe that you will go to heaven and still sin? Well, think again, Revelation 22:11. See, you can't be both! Jesus was the firstborn of many just like Him. Did Jesus have a sin nature? NO! He was conceived with the seed of the Father, just as we are when we are born again and freed from sin. Has no one ever told you that before. IT IS WRITTEN!!! No sinners will be in heaven!

Get it through your head that "the old man" IS the sin nature! It is dead. It is gone. It has been taken away. Romans 6:6-7

 

[Rich R]

How can 1 John 3:9 be true if you still have your sin nature? How can you be free from sin and still have a sin nature? Romans 6:6-7. This is why Jesus said we MUST be born again. Romans 8:9 shows that if you have the Spirit you don't have the sin nature. You are no longer in the flesh/sin nature. Gifts don't matter if you still have a sin nature by sinning. Romans 6:15-16; Matthew 7:21-23. You can go back to satan, but you cannot have God AND satan. Somewhere along the way you have believed and held onto the unholy doctrine that Jesus didn't take away ALL of our sin and cleanse us of all unrighteousness; no, He left you with you sin nature, the one thing we inherited from Adam that Jesus didn't think to take away? The sin nature is the SOURCE of sin. Of course that is the first thing he took away and why it is written that we partake of the divine nature. Did you understand that, Rich. THE DIVINE NATURE OF GOD, HIMSELF. I know I feel Him in me, and have for the last 45 years, and it just gets stronger and easier every year. But with this false believe in a dual nature, THAT is why you and Carl believe 1 John 1:8 is a Christian, though it was the previous verse that is a true Christian. Verse 9 is how verse 8 can become a Christian.

You say you still have your sin nature in all its darkness - 1 John 1:6. Rich, you have to pray to be born again and not just play church. Still claiming to be a Christian that is free from sin but still hanging on to your sin. You can't be both! Romans 8:8-9 tells you that those in the flesh as you claim to be cannot please God. That is why Paul said if you do not have the Spirit of Christ you don't belong to Him. And you can't have your sin nature at the same time. We do not have a sin nature AND a divine nature. So which one do you want to claim?

Do you honestly believe that you will go to heaven and still sin? Well, think again, Revelation 22:11. See, you can't be both! Jesus was the firstborn of many just like Him. Did Jesus have a sin nature? NO! He was conceived with the seed of the Father, just as we are when we are born again and freed from sin. Has no one ever told you that before. IT IS WRITTEN!!! No sinners will be in heaven!

Get it through your head that "the old man" IS the sin nature! It is dead. It is gone. It has been taken away. Romans 6:6-7

What do you see when you look in a mirror? Flesh or spirit?

 

[L.A.M.B.]

There are instructions to us on what to dwell or think upon in this life.Phillipians 4 :8 ( cxt 6-9 )

This is excellent Phillipians 2:2-6 to our thinking, we are to be lowly of mind ( humble ), to do for the glory of God, not ourselves. We are to exhibit the 2nd commandment of Jesus to love our neighbor as ourselves. The mind of Christ must be in us for the mind and heart are the seat of our repentance and must be changed to godly ways. Then we STAND on this thought that as Jesus was equal with the Father, him being our advocate will stand alongside of us, plead our case to the Father and obtain for us forgiveness!

Until our death we will be in this flesh, until our glorification WE CANNOT CHANGE! Even Paul warred with the flesh to overcome the things that IT wanted to do over the things God wanted him to do.

SIN, what is it ?
Seperation from God thru disobedience ,whether it be by direct unbelief or battles we lose over the fleshly desires. If you think you walk above this then it is selfrighteousness, not the righteousness of God. When we think this way we end up thinking all is well and fail to seek him in all things.

Can I save myself, absolutely NOT. There is nothing we can do to redeem ourselves from the wages of sin, NOTHING! I fear that ppl that believe they have already reach glorification are missing the mark.

 

[Rich R]

There are instructions to us on what to dwell or think upon in this life.Phillipians 4 :8 ( cxt 6-9 )

This is sxcellent Phillipians 2:2-6 to our thinking, we are to be lowly of mind ( humble ), to do for the glory of God, not ourselves. We are to exhibit the 2nd commandment of Jesus to love our neighbor as ourselves. The mind of Christ must be in us for the mind and heart are the seat of our repentance and must be changed to godly ways. Then we STAND on this thought that as Jesus was equal with the Father, him being our advocate will stand alongside of us, plead our case to the Father and obtain for us forgiveness!

Until our death we will be in this flesh, until our glorification WE CANNOT CHANGE! Even Paul warred with the flesh to overcome the things that IT wanted to do over the things God wanted him to do.

SIN, what is it ?
Seperation from God thru disobedience ,whether it be by direct unbelief or battles we lose over the fleshly desires. If you think you walk above this then it is selfrighteousness, not the righteousness of God. When we think this way we end up thinking all is well and fail to seek him in all things.

Can I save myself, absolutely NOT. There is nothing we can do to redeem ourselves from the wages of sin, NOTHING! I fear that ppl that believe they have already reach glorification are missing the mark.

Nothing compares to the beauty and simplicity of God's word!

 

[1stCenturyLady]

What do you see when you look in a mirror? Flesh or spirit?

My body must die because of Adam's sin, but it by itself does not produce sin - never has. Our nature is what produces sin and mine has been born again. Just like the Father and Holy Spirit, my mind and conscience are invisible, but very much real, regenerated and are immortal. They are my spirit and soul. Once my body dies and is buried, it will be resurrected but new and immortal also to match my spirit and soul and come together at Christ's return. You really don't get this stuff?????

I'd really like to know why you believe the old man is still in you if Romans 6:6-7 is true. I believe what it says because I've experienced it. So why do you believe it is still in you. Look at Christ's cross. You'll see my old man hanging there with Jesus.

 

[Rich R]

My body must die because of Adam's sin, but it by itself does not produce sin - never has. Our nature is what produces sin and mine has been born again. Just like the Father and Holy Spirit, my mind and conscience are invisible, but very much real, regenerated and are immortal. They are my spirit and soul. Once my body dies and is buried, it will be resurrected but new and immortal also to match my spirit and soul and come together at Christ's return. You really don't get this stuff?????

I'd really like to know why you believe the old man is still in you if Romans 6:6-7 is true. I believe what it says because I've experienced it. So why do you believe it is still in you. Look at Christ's cross. You'll see my old man hanging there with Jesus.

Well then you must be able to say along with Jesus, "I always do my Father's will." You have no problems with that? If not, OK, but I'll not make such a claim.

 

[Rich R]

Good luck…I have been trying to teach this for years, but people have a tendency to read what they believe rather than what is written.

Well, after hundred or so replies, I'm afraid I have to agree with you 100%. It usually falls on deaf ears for whatever reason.

But I plug along anyway. Just a few weeks ago I was blessed to lead a woman into tongues. She loves it. She just asked me today about interpretation of tongues. So, while there can indeed by long dry spells, every once in a while we can catch a fish!

 

[1stCenturyLady]

Well then you must be able to say along with Jesus, "I always do my Father's will." You have no problems with that? If not, OK, but I'll not make such a claim.

Rich, do you sometimes go against your conscience and against what it is telling you to do and live with feeling guilty; or do you do what your conscience tells you and feel no guilt?

 

[Rich R]

Rich, do you sometimes go against your conscience and against what it is telling you to do and live with feeling guilty; or do you do what your conscience tells you and feel no guilt?

Neither. I sometimes do go against my conscience but I don't feel guilt. I confess my indiscretion to God, and, as per 1 John, He forgives me and cleanses me from all unrighteousness. What's to feel guilty about?

One of these days God is going to use me (and you, and all Christians) as an example of His loving genius.

Eph 2:7,

That in the ages to come he might shew the exceeding riches of his grace in [his] kindness toward us through Christ Jesus.
​

"The ages to come" are not yet though. He's going to wait until I get my new physical body, the one that actually will not sin. Something to look forward to!

 

[Helen]

In our Assembly of God church in Duncanville, TX, Gifts such as tongues/interpretation/Prophesy are only allowed by agreement with the Sr.Pastor, who normally does any interpretation that is required - of course it's a BIG church (5-600) so I guess they do that to prevent confusion.

I recall a "hat trick" probably 20 years ago in a smaller meeting, when there was a "Tongue", and the fellow to my left stood and began to deliver the interpretation. But at the same time I was burdened to interpret. The first guy just stopped in mid message, and I immediately stood, and continued the message from where he'd left off, until I "ran out of words", whereupon the fellow on my immediate Right stood, and completed the message. That's never happened again.

Wonderful …those were the days . we expected those kind of things to happen ..but I’ve not found a church these days that has that freedom of the Spirit moving.

 

[1stCenturyLady]

Neither. I sometimes do go against my conscience but I don't feel guilt. I confess my indiscretion to God, and, as per 1 John, He forgives me and cleanses me from all unrighteousness. What's to feel guilty about?

One of these days God is going to use me (and you, and all Christians) as an example of His loving genius.

Eph 2:7,

That in the ages to come he might shew the exceeding riches of his grace in [his] kindness toward us through Christ Jesus.
​

"The ages to come" are not yet though. He's going to wait until I get my new physical body, the one that actually will not sin. Something to look forward to!

You go against your conscience, but don't feel guilt? How? What makes you use 1 John 1:9 if you don't feel any guilt? Why did you go against your conscience in the first place? Don't you know that going against your conscience is willful sin? That's not walking in the Spirit.

There are Christian women who do that? They get pregnant out of wedlock, feel no guilt about the fornication and feel no guilt about getting an abortion, thinking I'll just use 1 John 1:9 later. Don't you know that 1 John 1:9 is to receive the Holy Spirit? How many times do you initially need to receive the Holy Spirit? Acts 2:38 is ONCE! It is not a get out of jail free card!

 

[Rich R]

You go against your conscience, but don't feel guilt? How? What makes you use 1 John 1:9 if you don't feel any guilt? Why did you go against your conscience in the first place?

Well, I guess you'd have to say I do feel guilty until I confess my sin to God. But I'll confess it as soon as I realize I did sin, so the guilt doesn't last long enough to make me feel too very bad.

Why do I go against my conscience in the first place?

Rom 7:20-25,

20 Now if I do that I would not, it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.

21 I find then a law, that, when I would do good, evil is present with me.

22 For I delight in the law of God after the inward man:

23 But I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members.

24 O wretched man that I am! who shall deliver me from the body of this death?

25 I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord. So then with the mind I myself serve the law of God; but with the flesh the law of sin.​

Of course, if all of this is taken to mean unsaved folks, it would mean nothing, but I don't see how this could be Paul talking about anything but his present state as a child of God, filled with holy spirit, but who still possesses the flesh in which no good thing dwells. I don't see how it could be construed as to mean anything else. I mean, does that natural man delight in the law of God? I don't think so, so at least verse 22 is not talking about the unsaved. It would seem quite odd of the other 5 verses here were talking about the unsaved. I think they are all talking about saved people who still have sinful flesh. The new birth is a new creation altogether. It's a spiritual creation. There is nothing God can do with the sinful flesh. That's precisely why He saved us via a new spiritual creation and not by giving us a "new and "improved" flesh. We'll get a new and improved flesh when Jesus comes back, but until then Romans 7 is very apropos.

 

[Tommy Cool]

Well, after hundred or so replies, I'm afraid I have to agree with you 100%. It usually falls on deaf ears for whatever reason.

But I plug along anyway. Just a few weeks ago I was blessed to lead a woman into tongues. She loves it. She just asked me today about interpretation of tongues. So, while there can indeed by long dry spells, every once in a while we can catch a fish!

I have no idea why it is that people prefer the word gift…. as opposed to what God identifies them as ….Maybe they are smarter than God ….and we should be following them........................................that should spark some ire.

As for the one person - That is great… Totally worth it!.....There is no greater joy!

 

[Rich R]

I have no idea why it is that people prefer the word gift…. as opposed to what God identifies them as ….Maybe they are smarter than God ….and we should be following them........................................that should spark some ire.

As for the one person - That is great… Totally worth it!.....There is no greater joy!

My theory, and it's nothing more than my theory, is that if they think it's a gift and they haven't been "privileged" to receive that gift, they are absolved from the responsibility of speaking in tongues much to edify themselves and others (when interpreted in the church).

If they don't like Corinthians, what about Jesus himself telling us we'd do the works he did? He did seven of the nine. Oh my...we don't want to lay that responsibility on the church. Sorry I brought it up. That's just way too much to ask.