Co- Redemptrix
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Dcopymope
Well-Known Member
Well, not for me it isn't. For one, I understand that the son and the Father are two distinct individuals. For two, since the son also always existed from eternity as "the word", which was God, you can't really call Mary his "mother" either. She was only used as the vessel, to be the earthly incarnation of the word made flesh, because him being born of the seed of the woman was the requirement for his sacrifice to be valid. When you call Mary the "mother of God", that implies she preceded the totality of the deity itself. She was only his mother during his time on earth, but catholic doctrine takes it ten steps further, claiming her to be the "mother of all", and the "queen of heaven and all things", and other such tripe.
aspen
“"The harvest is plentiful but the workers are few
I can see how it might be difficult for you if you reject the true nature of God as a Trinune being. What is difficult for me to understand is your critical eye regarding Mary being the mother of God and demands for reason to be employed, but no mention of the ‘ridiculous’ nature of the virgin birth. Why is one tenet of faith and doctrine ‘tripe’ and not the other?
Also, your polytheism is disturbing, to say the least.....if I am understanding you correctly regarding Jesus and the Father being separate gods.
Dcopymope
Well-Known Member
The only polytheism I see being espoused here is the Catholic churches blatant deification of Mary. As far as scripture is concerned, there is no "queen of heaven of all life", there is only a king of all life, and that king is recognized as the Father, Son and the Holy Ghost. Anything more than that is straight up blasphemy. God shares his power and authority with no one.
aspen
“"The harvest is plentiful but the workers are few
God shares his commission with us, as he did with Mary.
Mary is the churches example of obedience to God.
A minority of Protestants are the only active group that mistakes Mary for a God.
Rejection of the Trinity is polytheism, however; pure and simple.
Mary is the churches example of obedience to God.
A minority of Protestants are the only active group that mistakes Mary for a God.
Rejection of the Trinity is polytheism, however; pure and simple.
no just another big word that learned men use to demand you must believe because I am learned and therefore you must believe me. Jesus never used big words, he was for the fool who had nothing to prove. God was teh I am before Mary existed. He is He has no mother, another excuse to idolise a human.
Dcopymope
Well-Known Member
You aren't understanding the magnitude of what the Catholic church has done with Mary. She has been elevated to the point akin to the role of Jesus Christ as the high priest who sits on the right hand of the father as our redeemer and intercessor. That's not just God "sharing his commission", that is Mary being deified to the status of Godhood. I might as well screw Jesus, and worship and pray to Mary like many do for the hell of it if I am to believe catholic dogma. BOL, and others of his ilk, have sworn up and down that this is not the case, yet the very text he cites proves all the accusations brought against it, how ironic.
aspen
“"The harvest is plentiful but the workers are few
I disagree. There are however, uneducated catholics who have placed too much emphasis on many aspects of Catholic doctrine. Which is why it is unwise to judge the validity of doctrine based on the behavior of pewsitters.
aspen
“"The harvest is plentiful but the workers are few
Dcopymope
Well-Known Member
Exactly, and this is not an assumption, or an inference, Jesus referred to himself as "I AM", which pissed the Jews off royally because they knew exactly what he meant.
Dcopymope
Well-Known Member
I judge the validity of Catholic doctrine based on the word of God which exposes the dogma of your church as nothing more than the traditions of men, not on some "uneducated" catholic. His word does not recognize Mary as having any authority in heaven or earth. I cannot cast out demons, heal the sick, give prophecy and wisdom, or save souls in her name. Her seed was used to give birth to 'the word' in the flesh to bruise the head of the serpent, and nothing more than that.
aspen
“"The harvest is plentiful but the workers are few
Why do you sound incensed? The Catholic Church takes Paul literally when he wrote 8:38-39 - death does not separate is from the love of God in Christ. We remain one body and can continue to help each other in the work of the great commission. No one is teaching anyone to worship another human being, nor is it taught that we must prayer to saints, but staying in contact with the whole body of Christ is a benefit.
in the meantime, lighten up. Follow Christ and love God and neighbor! Just because BOL gets all worked up about being right doesnt mean we need to.
Dcopymope
Well-Known Member
Well OK, fine. Since Revelation is all about the end times, I would just like for the catholic bunch to explain to me why Mary is of no importance in the entire narrative. She isn't even mentioned as having any role at all in the new heaven and earth. We're talking about the "queen of heaven" and "mother of all things" for Christs sake, so one would think that her role as the "queen" would play some significant role in end times events.
aspen
“"The harvest is plentiful but the workers are few
Mary is just another example of an obedient, glorified human being, which is a miracle of Gods grace and justification and sanctification. We will all be in the same position, through Gods grace and we will all be brides of Heaven, married to Christ.
Yes what does teh bible say of it.
Mar 7:6 He answered and said unto them, Well hath Esaias prophesied of you hypocrites, as it is written, This people honoureth me with their lips, but their heart is far from me.
Mar 7:7 Howbeit in vain do they worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.
Mar 7:8 For laying aside the commandment of God, ye hold the tradition of men, as the washing of pots and cups: and many other such like things ye do.
Mar 7:9 And he said unto them, Full well ye reject the commandment of God, that ye may keep your own tradition.
Never change, once men got involved it all got messed up, prefer there doctrines than revelation from God, fight, bicker argue over it just liek teh disciples.
Mar 9:34 But they held their peace: for by the way they had disputed among themselves, who should be the greatest.
And that is all that happens when men get together to argue over doctrines.
There are a lot of "christians" who will not make it, and a lot by the skin of there teeth simply because they prefer men and his religions to Jesus and His truth.
This bit
Mat 7:21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.
Mat 7:22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
Mat 7:23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.
We danced we called but you would not come...
aspen
“"The harvest is plentiful but the workers are few
This is not a thread about the only topic you like to discuss....’why I hate church and teh Bible does too’ mjr. Go start a thread
Dcopymope
Well-Known Member
So she has already received her glorified body? Is that it? Where is this in scripture? And what does this have to do with her being the "queen of heaven"?
No its about the truth which so few pursue, its about Glorifying Jesus and God, which elevating "people" does not do, is about faith in Jesus and teh works He has done, which so few have, this was never about Mary, it was about mens doctrines which is what most discussions are based on. Who cares what God thinks, who cares what Jesus thinks, we have our bible we have our smarts lets argue over whos right.
Mary was no greater than any one else and does not deserve teh elevate to idol status she has, she must weep everyday over teh foolishness of man.
aspen
“"The harvest is plentiful but the workers are few
1. Already? There is no time in Heaven. All Christians are kneeling with her at the throne, right now.
2. Mary was the first Christian and the new Eve - she represents Christ’s Church (us) who are wed to Christ the King. Sounds like a Queen to me
Which one the ones that claim to be or teh real ones who belong to Him.
The only queen of heaven teh bible speaks of is not Mary but another idol of men, heaven has no queen we are all equal,
Jer 44:18 But since we left off to burn incense to the queen of heaven, and to pour out drink offerings unto her, we have wanted all things, and have been consumed by the sword and by the famine.
Jer 44:19 And when we burned incense to the queen of heaven, and poured out drink offerings unto her, did we make her cakes to worship her, and pour out drink offerings unto her, without our men?
Rev_19:10 And I fell at his feet to worship him. And he said unto me, See thou do it not: I am thy fellowservant, and of thy brethren that have the testimony of Jesus: worship God: for the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy.
and she is no different than any of us.
