Believers stay righteous through their obedience

[bbyrd009]

Can you see any other reason.

bc even though it is recognized as inadequate and a minimum standard from which to build upon, it is nonetheless Holy?
and we are told many times to obey the law, even going so far as to obey the laws that the lawgivers themselves do not obey?
Or how bout bc you want to be able to have the rule of law enforced when it is broken upon you even?

 

[H. Richard]

It's not an affront to God ...
when the true believer co-operates with the Holy Spirit
while He tries to fully sanctify the believer,

Because of the many dire warnings about losing salvation,
gaining eternal death, etc. we see that salvation must be a process.

The Father and the Lord Jesus both have been warning Their prophets/watchmen
about the deplorable state of the church (of which you are a part).
Actually, it sounds like the Laodicean church of Revelation 3.
Here is an excerpt from one of them (it's easy for me to remember):
"shepherds leading multitudes to hell".

Should I post some more of these warnings from the Godhead?
.

You believe in progressive salvation, progressive sanctification, and progressive justification and I do "NOT"" based on the following scriptures;

1 Cor 6:11-12
11 And such were some of you. But you """were""" washed, but you ""were sanctified"", but you ""were justified"" in the name of the Lord Jesus and by the Spirit of our God.
12 All things are lawful for me, but all things are not helpful. All things are lawful for me, but I will not be brought under the power of any.
NKJV

The word ""WERE"" is past tense, not future.

 

[bbyrd009]

Wow!

Thank you very much.

um, definitely
it was 5 o'clock doncha know :)

 

[justbyfaith]

The law did nothing but kill and still does today.

Actually, the law for unbelievers today acts as a schoolmaster to lead them to Christ (Galatians 3:24-25). And it also governs the believer from the inside through the love of the Lord Jesus dwelling in the heart (Hebrews 8:8-10, Hebrews 10:16, Romans 8:4 (kjv), Romans 8:7; Romans 5:5 w/ Romans 13:8-10, 1 John 5:2-3, 2 John 1:6).

See also Romans 7:12.

 

[Zachary]

You believe in progressive salvation, progressive sanctification, and progressive justification and I do "NOT"" based on the following scriptures;
1 Cor 6:11-12
11 And such were some of you. But you """were""" washed, but you ""were sanctified"", but you ""were justified"" in the name of the Lord Jesus and by the Spirit of our God.
12 All things are lawful for me, but all things are not helpful. All things are lawful for me, but I will not be brought under the power of any.
NKJV
The word ""WERE"" is past tense, not future.

How many times do I have to explain ...
Initially given grace ---- is NOT forever given grace
Initially righteous---- is NOT forever righteous
Initially justified ---- is NOT forever justified
Initially sealed ---- is NOT forever sealed
Do I need to continue?
Heavens NO! ... 'cause it's a waste of time!

 

[justbyfaith]

How many times do I have to explain ...
Initially given grace ---- is NOT forever given grace
Initially righteous---- is NOT forever righteous
Initially justified ---- is NOT forever justified
Initially sealed ---- is NOT forever sealed
Do I need to continue?
Heavens NO! ... 'cause it's a waste of time!

Simply because you're wrong and you can't convince people of a lie who actually know the truth.

 

[H. Richard]

How many times do I have to explain ...
Initially given grace ---- is NOT forever given grace
Initially righteous---- is NOT forever righteous
Initially justified ---- is NOT forever justified
Initially sealed ---- is NOT forever sealed
Do I need to continue?
Heavens NO! ... 'cause it's a waste of time!

How many times do I have to tell you of the wonderful GIFT that Jesus gave us when HE went to the cross and PAID of all of our sins????

It never says salvation under grace is something you have to earn by doing works or by being obedient to laws. He set us free from the law. Paul said HE (Jesus) nailed the requirements of the law to the cross. But you just won't believe. WELL I DO...

IMHO you are thinking your way is the way to God and it is by your works to earn it. Therefore to you it is not a gift from God.

I have said it before by you don't listen, Jesus has made it possible for sinners, the ungodly to be saved.

As for you, think about the vision Jesus sent Peter, God said what God calls clean let no man call unclean. God has made a way for the unclean to be clean and the person who does not believe in it is denying the will of God.

 

[Enoch111]

Heavens NO! ... 'cause it's a waste of time!

It would be a waste of time trying to show you that you are totally off base. Hope you enjoy your temporary salvation.

 

[Zachary]

error

 

[Zachary]

The problem remains (and I will be gracious) ...

You simply refuse to deal with the NT verses that you don't like!
You need to RECONCILE (to make agree) your verses and mine.
I.E. They all have to fit ... instead of being ignored and/or rejected.

Ignoring dozens of NT verses won't get you anywhere,
except in trouble with the Lord.

 

[Helen]

How many times do I have to explain ...
Initially given grace ---- is NOT forever given grace
Initially righteous---- is NOT forever righteous
Initially justified ---- is NOT forever justified
Initially sealed ---- is NOT forever sealed
Do I need to continue?
Heavens NO! ... 'cause it's a waste of time!

Rubaloadofwahatish interpretation = whataloadofrubbish.

Says you!! :
You can keep on saying it buddy, but it still wont make it truth.
This whole thread is a total "waste of time"

 

[mjrhealth]

Rubaloadofwahatish interpretation = whataloadofrubbish.

Says you!! :
You can keep on saying it buddy, but it still wont make it truth.
This whole thread is a total "waste of time"

Actually Helen, this thread is probably the most important of them all, it is the only thing that matters, if we are not in Christ and covered in His righteousness, than we are blind and naked, it is always the same story, the law and flesh, vs Grace and love. Just so sad to see the law and flesh winning over Gods grace and Love.

God bless

 

[mjrhealth]

ya, Luke 9:5 And whosoever will not receive you, when ye go out of that city, shake off the very dust from your feet for a testimony against them has a

I see you have being listening, Just remember that it might bite you one day.

 

[brakelite]

Actually Helen, this thread is probably the most important of them all, it is the only thing that matters, if we are not in Christ and covered in His righteousness, than we are blind and naked, it is always the same story, the law and flesh, vs Grace and love. Just so sad to see the law and flesh winning over Gods grace and Love.

God bless

There are some who believe that by their obedience they gain brownie points with God, and give themselves a "better chance" of making it into heaven. We all see these people, and I agree, it is sad. But what is even more sad is that there are so many who think that grace and law have to be at war with each other. They seem incapable of seeing that grace, while granting us something we don't deserve, includes the power and capacity to obey the law. Thus in that sense, grace and law, far from being at enmity with one another, complement one another.
Another mistake I have observed is the common error of believing that the OT was all about the law, that Israel were saved by obeying the law, while the NT is all about grace, and no law is involved. The truth is that God is the same yesterday, today, and forever. Salvation has always been about grace and mercy. It was because we broke the law, we needed grace. We needed mercy. How could it be otherwise? But God has never removed the obligation to obedience. The difference between the OT and the NT is that in the old, Israel, the nation, (unlike Abraham who was accounted righteous because of his faith) went about establishing their own righteousness, but did not receive the righteousness that comes from God through faith. The righteousness that fulfills the law. And sadly, many in the church have not received that righteousness that comes through faith either, the evidence of that being the antagonism they reveal against the law.

 

[stunnedbygrace]

If God is only concerned with the condition of our hearts, why would He give commands?

So that we can see and be aware of where our heart is wrong/messed up, so we can pray for the help we need.

Of course, that will be approved of by two sets of men - men like you who are concerned with the inside of their cup, leading to a growing honest self- assessment of themselves, and another set of men, who are concerned with the outside of the cup.

It's always been about the inside of the cup with God.

 

[Hidden In Him]

So that we can see and be aware of where our heart is wrong/messed up, so we can pray for the help we need.

Of course, that will be approved of by two sets of men - men like you who are concerned with the inside of their cup, leading to a growing honest self- assessment of themselves, and another set of men, who are concerned with the outside of the cup.

It's always been about the inside of the cup with God.

Hey! Good analogy! But now, let me play off of this just a little bit then.

You are right that He is more concerned with the inside of the cup, especially since religious types can have a habit of working hard to look clean on the outside while being filthy on the inside (spiritually). But now, I believe He ultimately wants both the outside and the inside of the cup to be clean. One verse for this might be 1 Thessalonians 5:23, "And may the very God of peace sanctify you wholly, and you whole spirit and soul and body be preserved blameless unto the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ."

I think He gives commands because we are being prepared to become citizens of His eternal kingdom, and this will require obedience to the laws of the King. So to this end, I think the command was to become so purified that not only were our spirits and souls pure, but that the actions of our bodies eventually become sanctified as well in obedience to the Lord. I think the conviction of the Lord comes upon us not just to show us we are in need of a Savior, but to compel us unto ever increasing obedience, so as to be ever more pleasing to God. :)

 

[brakelite]

Hey! Good analogy! But now, let me play off of this just a little bit then.

You are right that He is more concerned with the inside of the cup, especially since religious types can have a habit of working hard to look clean on the outside while being filthy on the inside (spiritually). But now, I believe He ultimately wants both the outside and the inside of the cup to be clean. One verse for this might be 1 Thessalonians 5:23, "And may the very God of peace sanctify you wholly, and you whole spirit and soul and body be preserved blameless unto the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ."

I think He gives commands because we are being prepared to become citizens of His eternal kingdom, and this will require obedience to the laws of the King. So to this end, I think the command was to become so purified that not only were our spirits and souls pure, but that the actions of our bodies eventually become sanctified as well in obedience to the Lord. I think the conviction of the Lord comes upon us not just to show us we are in need of a Savior, but to compel us unto ever increasing obedience, so as to be ever more pleasing to God. :)

Yes. Without spot or blemish. Able to look the Father in the face without melting before Him. Literally.

 

[H. Richard]

It would be a waste of time trying to show you that you are totally off base. Hope you enjoy your temporary salvation.

My salvation was purchased by Jesus on the cross. IMPO, Since your salvation is determined by what you do and not what God has already done, it is you who has no salvation at all.

 

[bbyrd009]

I see you have being listening, Just remember that it might bite you one day.

what is "it" mjr, and how do you imagine that "it" might bite me?
sorry, i am not following

 

[Enoch111]

My salvation was purchased by Jesus on the cross. IMPO, Since your salvation is determined by what you do and not what God has already done, it is you who has no salvation at all.

You must have mistaken me for someone else. I don't believe such nonsense.