A tiny bit more thought on this from a non-SDA perspective:
Are Jesus and Michael one and the same? (Audio) | Bible Question Archive | Amazing Facts
Are Jesus and Michael one and the same? (Audio) | Bible Question Archive | Amazing Facts
Rapture(Catching up) will be the Greatest day ever in a Born Agin Believers Life!
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Because I have manners and do not wish to divert threads from their original topic.
I will not discuss this in length, but ask you one question. How can Jesus know when He comes who are the goats and who are the sheep without first a judgement of sorts to divide them? You are welcome to relate this to your beloved rapture if you like.
Some of us Adventists do not believe in the trinity as our church teaches it, but that is another matter. That we identify Jesus as Michael does not elevate an angel to the Godhead, nor does it diminish the divinity of the Son of God. It merely gives the OT Son a name, and assigns the Son as the Lord (chief or arch) of hosts...HIs rightful position. Nothing unbiblical, blasphemous, heretical, or weird. Simple good exegesis.
And Jesus wasn't the head of the angels then?
CoreIssue
Well-Known Member
Please learn to quote properly, I cannot quote you the way you answer.
Though He foreknew, then why judgement?
Michael aka Jesus not hinted at in the Bible? Surely you jest. Listen to and/or read the links Willie put up.
The Son of God did not exist in the flesh beforel the incarnation. But the person of the Son of God as revealed in Christ, did.
Though He foreknew, then why judgement?
Michael aka Jesus not hinted at in the Bible? Surely you jest. Listen to and/or read the links Willie put up.
The Son of God did not exist in the flesh beforel the incarnation. But the person of the Son of God as revealed in Christ, did.
BreadOfLife
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Nice dodge - but this subject has nothing to do with the Pope.
Can't you simply debate it on its own merit or weaknesses??
Taken said;
Noah and his Family were lifted up above the face of the earth.
All other people were left behind on the Earth to be drowned by Flood water.
Funny...you should have read Genesis.
Gen 7
[17] And the flood was forty days upon the earth; and the waters increased, and bare up the ark, and it was lift up above the earth.
Gen 7
[23] And every living substance was destroyed which was upon the face of the ground, both man, and cattle, and the creeping things, and the fowl of the heaven; and they were destroyed from the earth: and Noah only remained alive, and they that were with him in the ark.
You should have paid attention;
Jesus is speaking of;
They...They...Them...being left behind on the earth, swept away in the flood waters, dead, not saved was all people, excluding Noah and his family who were Lifted up above the face of the earth and Saved from being swept away in the flood waters.
Gen 7
[13] And God said unto Noah, The end of all flesh is come before me; for the earth is filled with violence through them; and, behold, I will destroy them with the earth.
And Noah absolutely did know the flood waters were coming!
Gen 6
[17] And, behold, I, even I, do bring a flood of waters upon the earth...
Glory to God,
Taken
Noah and his Family were lifted up above the face of the earth.
All other people were left behind on the Earth to be drowned by Flood water.
Funny...you should have read Genesis.
Gen 7
[17] And the flood was forty days upon the earth; and the waters increased, and bare up the ark, and it was lift up above the earth.
Gen 7
[23] And every living substance was destroyed which was upon the face of the ground, both man, and cattle, and the creeping things, and the fowl of the heaven; and they were destroyed from the earth: and Noah only remained alive, and they that were with him in the ark.
You should have paid attention;
Jesus is speaking of;
They...They...Them...being left behind on the earth, swept away in the flood waters, dead, not saved was all people, excluding Noah and his family who were Lifted up above the face of the earth and Saved from being swept away in the flood waters.
Gen 7
[13] And God said unto Noah, The end of all flesh is come before me; for the earth is filled with violence through them; and, behold, I will destroy them with the earth.
And Noah absolutely did know the flood waters were coming!
Gen 6
[17] And, behold, I, even I, do bring a flood of waters upon the earth...
Glory to God,
Taken
I am not blindly following the Lords teaching....
Nor blindly following your pope as you do.
Hey, I don't know who Darby is, nor do I know all the names of the men you call "Father", that keep a stash of wine and break their vows to God by raping youthful boys.
If it was someone who was named Darby, Who began using the English term RAPTURE for Scriptures term "caught Up"...
Well good for him. He was spot on, because that IS what Rapture means.
If it is your hope to remain on Earth and be destroyed by the Earth....God Is Just ...We all shall get what we hope for.
Personally, I expect to be lifted up above the Earth, in a glorified body, with my saved soul, with my quickened spirit, with my Lord, and with all members of Christs Church....
While...the TRIBES of ISRAEL...who are scattered to the 4 corners of the earth; are hearing Christ preached to them, BY faithful JEWS, that they also will believe in Christ Jesus, and obtain martyrdom, salvation, quickening, be also lifted up ...off the face of the earth...and saved from Gods wrath, destruction and indignation He has prepared to pour out upon the face of the earth and the people left behind upon the face of the earth.
You don't seem to fit into Christs Church or the Tribes of Israel...to be lifted up off the face of the earth...so it looks like your hope will be effected and you will be left behind on the earth and become destroyed by the earth...
Just as happened in the days of Noah!
See...all around Good.
You and I will each get what we hoped for.
God is Faithful and Just!
Glory to thee Lord God Almighty,
Taken
Have you ever sowed a garden?
You don't simply sow a garden and then harvest it without tending to it.
The Lord sows His SEED in a Converted man.
That SEED quickens a mans spirit.
The Lords Spirit feeds the mans spirit with His Word of Truth.
Any man receiving the Lords SEED, IS sown in righteousness.
Which is to say...that man IS prepared to leave this earth and go into the Lord...at ANY...moment in time.
Like in a garden...the gardener TENDS what he does...feeds the plants, plucks out weeds, makes sure the plant gets plenty of SON...and since all that is sowed does not mature at the same time, the Gardner keeps an eye on what he has sown, and plucks off the vine that which IS baring ripe fruit and takes the fruit unto himself.
^ THAT is not a Harvesting.
Harvesting comes at the end of the season. After the rest of the fruit has been Tended and gathered from the entirety and All corners of the Garden.
Once all fruit is gathered...the cycle and mower cuts down and destroys the Tares and weeds that they become but dirt.
The analogy is:
Men who have already believed in God AND Christ Jesus have received Gods SEED.
They are Christs Church.
They are prepared at any moment to be plucked off the earth and gathered unto Christ Jesus.
Those men remaining are the Tribes of Israel...scattered across the entire Garden (Earth).
They must be Tended to, by hearing of Christ Jesus, so they also can believe and receive Gods Seed, and become Prepared for the harvest... before the Garden (Earth) is plowed under and they become nothing but dirt.
You have had the word of God in you...Yes?
Have YOU ... been seeking out the LOST Jews? Preaching to them the Good news of Jesus Christ?
Point being...if Men in Christ are not actively preaching Christ to Jews NOW...what do you think Christs Church would be doing on Earth during the Tribulation?
Then preaching to the Jews?
Since you know...
All of Israel will be saved...
And no man is saved until he Receives Gods Seed and becomes born again.
Not a problem. God is not leaving it up to the Gentile Christ saved believers to save Gods elect Israel.
Once again God is sending Jews (144,000) To the Jews to Tend to the Jews that they will hear, believe, accept Christ Jesus, become saved and harvested up off the face of the earth...saved and also be with the Lord their God....up and out of the destruction to befall the earth.
The prepared and Tended Christ's Church first...
Then the rest of the garden Tended and prepared (ISRAEL) harvested...
Then the tares plowed under.
Glory to God,
Taken
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Yes, I would agree.
Not only the Office, (papacy), but the person sitting in the office (Pope) claims absolute sovereignty and supremely over millions who choose to be his faithful subjects...religiously and politically. Their Supreme Holy Father...and probably as you say...Their King.
Not my cup...
I have a different Supreme Holy Father and King.
Glory to thee Lord God Almighty,
Taken
What I meant by that reference was that the answers were simply from the Bible, not from The Boss Lady's opinion. LOL I know, full well, that Doug Bachelor is, and Joe Crews was SDA.Actually my friend, Amazing Facts is very much Seventh Day Adventist.
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CoreIssue
Well-Known Member
From the link
Who is Michael the Archangel in the Bible? Is this Jesus? Jesus is certainly not an angel and Michael is never called an angel, but an Archangel.
Seventh-Day Adventists Teach Jesus is Michael
I'm sorry, but I learned a long time ago that if you want to know what any group thinks or believes, the LAST place to go is to a site that opposes them. A site like that just doesn't prove anything for me.
Helen
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Why does any of this really matter?
If we live with out hearts hungry for God...rapture, no rapture, pre trib , mid trib, post trib... IF the heart is ready at ALL times...it matters not. With all the silly confusion and hassle ... I believe no rapture ( as taught)
Denominations ...there are NONE perfect, not one is totally right or wrong...they are all rubbish..."Let GOD be God/true, but every man a liar.." !!
If we live with out hearts hungry for God...rapture, no rapture, pre trib , mid trib, post trib... IF the heart is ready at ALL times...it matters not. With all the silly confusion and hassle ... I believe no rapture ( as taught)
Denominations ...there are NONE perfect, not one is totally right or wrong...they are all rubbish..."Let GOD be God/true, but every man a liar.." !!
CoreIssue
Well-Known Member
In matters because when one throws away the truth in one area you can't trust them in any area.
But, accepting what someone else says about a group, instead of going to see their own words, is NOT looking for truth.
Helen
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Haha!!
Psalm 118
8 It is better to trust in the Lord than to put confidence in man."
and 3 "Put not your trust in princes, nor in the son of man, in whom there is no help."
Sad day if/when you find that your confidence in an event was misplaced!!
Have a good day. ....H
Nancy
Well-Known Member
It seems that so many Christians think they can somehow be "Rapture Ready"...should we not be just plain ready at all times as we are to be "walking in The Spirit"? My only problem with so many spewing their erroneous beliefs is that what happens if the "rapture" (pre-trib) does NOT happen and all those unsaved folks out there were taught it was true, will their faith be shattered? Will their unsaved loved ones possibly say that "well, so much for your Jesus...He's not here", turn around and receive the mark of the beast so they can buy and sell? Other than that...I have no issue with the pre-trib
"Let GOD be God/true, but every man a liar.."!! Amen sisser!!!
"Denominations ...there are NONE perfect, no one is totally right or wrong...they are all rubbish"
Indeed...I don't think I have ever believed totally in every single thing a pastor or teacher says, and most likely never will! ♥♥♥
CoreIssue
Well-Known Member
And what about the Bible sayings about witnesses, verifying the claims of others. It does not say just trust God to let you know the truth. He requires you to check.
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