Once Saved Always Saved Garbage Teaching!!

[Ernest T. Bass]

this subject does nothing more than create DIVISION people are so busy arguing can you /you cant half dont even know the Bible . might i add we are more secure in salvation .than what many believe. i realize this will create a fire storm.. { i have plenty living water } what does it say norn of the incorruptible seed.. i was listening to a missionary baptist preacher sunday .. he said i believe in osas he then said . i also believe they will stay with it.. that point i agree
1 John 2:18-20 King James Version (KJV)
18 Little children, it is the last time: and as ye have heard that antichrist shall come, even now are there many antichrists; whereby we know that it is the last time.

19 They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would no doubt have continued with us: but they went out, that they might be made manifest that they were not all of us.

20 But ye have an unction from the Holy One, and ye know all things.

i have read about a former pastor denouncing his faith.. i doubt he was ever saved . sad thing is many don't even begin to understand the true teaching of eternal security... which is not a license to sin

1 John 2:19 does not teach eternal security. If it did, then why a few verses later in 1 John 2:24-26 are Christians be warned about "IF" the word of God continues in them and being lead astray/seduced if losing salvation were an impossibility? Could it be that John is warning Christians so they would not become apostates as those in 1 John 2:18-19?

Question: if a person became a Christian and for many, many years was faithful in worship attendance, studying the word of God and leading others to Christ but one day he runs away with his neighbors wife to live and die in adultery, will he still be saved anyway? Will he be lost?

I have had those that promote eternal security' turn to 1 John 2:19 and claim this verse proves he was never really saved to begin with. I have had others turn to 1 Corinthians 3:14-15 and claim he will be saved anyway, just his sinful works will be burned. Which is it? "Never really saved to begin with" or "saved anyway"? It cannot be both happening at the same time.

 

[Ezra]

1 John 2:19 does not teach eternal security

i never said it did

Question: if a person became a Christian and for many. many years was faithful in worship attendance, studying the word of God and leading others to Christ but one day he runs away with his neighbors wife to live and die in adultery, will he still be saved anyway? Will he be lost?

to answer that correctly
Romans 2:16

“In the day when God shall judge the secrets of men by Jesus Christ according to my gospel.” i am not the judge of salvation only the watchman sounding the trumpet of warning .that is Bible works as in burn up in the fire has nothing to due with eternal security..its judgment of works we do wood hay stubble works done of self. Gold silver precious stones works done led of the spirit

 

[Ernest T. Bass]

i never said it did to answer that correctly
Romans 2:16

“In the day when God shall judge the secrets of men by Jesus Christ according to my gospel.” i am not the judge of salvation only the watchman sounding the trumpet of warning .that is Bible

What then are you claiming 1 John 2:19 teaches?

If you believe in eternal security then you must say that person in my example who lived and died in adultery would be saved anyway for denying such is denying eternal security.

Below is a link to a thread I started on this over a year ago, (see my op post #1)
OSAS and Two Misused Passages

 

[Ezra]

What then are you claiming 1 John 2:19 teaches?

if one is truly saved they will stick with it if they fall away they will return king david had a man murdered after having sex with the man wife and she become with child.. what did nathan say to him after the parable he told him. THOU ART THE MAN what did DAVID DO AFTER HEARING THIS ? ................let ,me explain this clearly so as you can understand..i do not preach you can or can not.. preach that you may KNOW ..if ya don't know chances are you aint

 

[Ezra]

If you believe in eternal security then you must say

DID I SAY I DID ? i never said one way or the other it appears you are being my holy spirit

 

[Ernest T. Bass]

if one is truly saved they will stick with it

So here you are claiming it is impossible for a Christian to fall away?

if they fall away they will return

Now saying the Christian can fall away?

king david had a man murdered after having sex with the man wife and she become with child.. what did nathan say to him after the parable he told him. THOU ART THE MAN what did DAVID DO AFTER HEARING THIS ? ................let ,me explain this clearly so as you can understand..i do not preach you can or can not.. preach that you may KNOW ..if ya don't know chances are you aint

David conditionally repented of his sin, would he have been saved anyway had he not conditionally repented? Can the Christian be saved anyway if he does not conditionally confess his sins 1 John 1:9?

 

[Ezra]

So here you are claiming it is impossible for a Christian to fall away?



Now saying the Christian can fall away?




David conditionally repented of his sin, would he have been saved anyway had he not conditionally repented? Can the Christian be saved anyway if he does not conditionally confess his sins 1 John 1:9?

i have no more time for your silly questions .i will reference you to romans 2:16 who and how .if you cant understand that i am sorry

 

[Ernest T. Bass]

DID I SAY I DID ? i never said one way or the other it appears you are being my holy spirit

I just asked a question as to what you think 1 John 2:19 is teaching.

 

[Ernest T. Bass]

i have no more time for your silly questions .i will reference you to romans 2:16 who and how .if you cant understand that i am sorry

That is fine as long as you understand eternal security is a heresy and 1 John 2:19 does not teach it nor prove it.

You said in your post "sad thing is many don't even begin to understand the true teaching of eternal security... which is not a license to sin "

Eternal security is nothing but a license to sin. I have seen it myself with people who say they are Christians but lie, cheat and steal knowing it is wrong but do it anyway for they have been brainwashed with the idea of eternal security thinking they cannot lose salvation no matter what they do.

 

[Nondenom40]

Nondenom,

When push comes to shove, don't the Calvinists make OSAS = eternal security = unconditional election?

Matt 24:13 states, 'But the one who endures to the end will be saved' (NLT). That's why I prefer the language 'Perseverance of the Saints' that was supported by both John Calvin and Jacobus Arminius. See John Calvin's commentary on 1 John 3:9 and Arminius on Perseverance of the Saints.

Oz

Hi, i'm not a calvinist. But election is certainly taught in the bible. Those who are elect will persevere, they will endure and they have overcome. Thats the nature of the believer in Christ.

 

[Ezra]

Eternal security is nothing but a license to sin. I have seen it myself with people who say they are Christians but lie, cheat and steal knowing it is wrong but do it anyway for they have been brainwashed with the idea of eternal security thinking they cannot lose salvation no matter what they do.

i have seen it on both sides

That is fine as long as you understand eternal security is a heresy and 1 John 2:19 does not teach it nor prove it.

that is your words.. i understand many things

 

[Ernest T. Bass]

i have seen it on both sides

I have only seen those that have been lead to believe in eternal security to continue in sin thinking it will not cause them to be lost. I have not seen this with any others than eternal security believers.

that is your words.. i understand many things

1 John 2:19 does not teach nor prove eternal security. Eternal security is forced into the verse.

 

[Zachary]

Yes agree , good post...

I'm in cardiac arrest as I'm trying to post.
As I recall, you've always disagreed with me previously!
Ah yes, your post #123 clearly showeth that ...
we are NOT in agreement at all ... on eternal security.
.

 

[Miss Hepburn]

I think that might be the funniest Subject Title I have ever seen in a Christian forum.

 

[Zachary]

The verb "doeth" in 1 John 2:17 and "abideth" in 1 John 3:6 are in the present tense denoting the action is ongoing, sustained.

Yes, Ernie, and John 3:16's "believe" is in the continous present tense, as well.
Just how many ENDURANCE verses in the NT do people need to read ... to believe them?
IOW, no endurance ... no salvation!
Kapishola, everyone?
.

 

[Zachary]

1 John 3:9 is in context with 1 John 3:4. That type of sin is no longer
in a Spirit-filled Christian's nature so they won't commit them.

Agreed ... from Scripture and from personal experience.
.

 

[Ezra]

I have only seen those that have been lead to believe in eternal security

you best be getting out more then lol i been in the ministry close twenty years . seen it all over tell me when you go to sleep at night.. do you wake up in fear you lost your salvation ? yes or no

 

[justbyfaith]

Calvinists can't really know if they're even really saved UNLESS they persevere till the end.

I'm more of a secure Arminianist...and I have such assurance.

What happens if the Christians do not continue to "doeth" and does not continue to "abideth"? What "IF" the Christian quits walking in the light, 1 John 1:7 and quits confessing his sins 1 John 1:9 will he be unconditionally saved anyway?

Notice that it says that he who does the will of God abideth for ever.

Nor is there any verse that says there is accountability upon God to see to it that the Christian continues to doeth the will of God, will continue to abideth in Christ, will continue to walk in the light, will continue to confess his sins.

It is not that God is accountable, or forcefully required to keep us; but that He chooses to keep those who have been regenerated by the Holy Ghost. For those of us for whom this has happened, we are sealed with the Holy Spirit and He is a deposit in our hearts guaranteeing what is to come...that we will receive our inheritance from the Father.

 

[Zachary]

i been in the ministry close twenty years

Many hearty congratulations! ... It means absolutely nothing!
The churches are absolutely filled with shepherds and sheep who are FAST ASLEEP.
MANY have been indoctrinated with false doctrines from Satan.
Such as: OSAS, grace-only, hyper-grace, easy-believism, etc.
Lots of false doctrines in the churches from the very pits of hell.
.

 

[illini1959]

It IS of ourselves that we remain righteous.

You're all hung up on the initial salvation experience,
but you really need to focus on the process of salvation
... going all the way to the end.

One's salvation needs to be maintained.

“Little children, let no one deceive you.
He who practices righteousness is righteous,
just as He is righteous … In this the children of God
and the children of the devil are manifest:
Whoever does NOT practice righteousness is NOT of God,
NOR is he who does NOT love his brothers and sisters.”
(1 John 3:7-10)

And there are dozens of other NT verses!
.

1 John 3:7 Little children, make sure no one deceives you; the one who practices righteousness is righteous, just as He is righteous;

^^^ saved

1 John 3:8 the one who practices sin is of the devil; for the devil has sinned from the beginning. The Son of God appeared for this purpose, to destroy the works of the devil.

^^^ unsaved

1 John 3:10 By this the children of God and the children of the devil are obvious: anyone who does not practice righteousness is not of God, nor the one who does not love his brother.

Why is this hard?