Difference between Catholic and Protestant.

  • Welcome to Christian Forums, a Christian Forum that recognizes that all Christians are a work in progress.

    You will need to register to be able to join in fellowship with Christians all over the world.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!

Status
Not open for further replies.

Illuminator

Well-Known Member
Jan 11, 2020
3,389
1,194
113
72
Hamilton
Faith
Christian
Country
Canada
women not being good enough to be priests etc.
Gen. 3:15; Luke 1:26-55; John 19:26; Rev. 12:1- Mary is God’s greatest creation, was the closest person to Jesus, and yet Jesus did not choose her to become a priest. God chose only men to be priests to reflect the complimentarity of the sexes. Just as the man (the royal priest) gives natural life to the woman in the marital covenant, the ministerial priest gives supernatural life in the New Covenant sacraments.

Judges 17:10; 18:19 – fatherhood and priesthood are synonymous terms. Micah says, “Stay with me, and be to me a father and a priest.” Fathers/priests give life, and mothers receive and nurture life. This reflects God our Father who gives the life of grace through the Priesthood of His Divine Son, and Mother Church who receives the life of grace and nourishes her children. In summary, women cannot be priests because women cannot be fathers.

Mark 16:9; Luke 7: 37-50; John 8:3-11 – Jesus allowed women to uniquely join in His mission, exalting them above cultural norms. His decision not to ordain women had nothing to do with culture. The Gospel writers are also clear that women participated in Jesus’ ministry and, unlike men, never betrayed Jesus. Women have always been held with the highest regard in the Church (e.g., the Church’s greatest saint and model of faith is a woman; the Church’s constant teaching on the dignity of motherhood; the Church’s understanding of humanity as being the Bride united to Christ, etc.).

Mark 14:17,20; Luke 22:14 – the language “the twelve” and “apostles” shows Jesus commissioned the Eucharistic priesthood by giving holy orders only to men.

Gen. 14:10; Heb. 5:6,10; 6:20; 7:15,17 – Jesus, the Son of God, is both priest and King after the priest-king Melchizedek. Jesus’ priesthood embodies both Kingship and Sonship.

Gen. 22:9-13 – as foreshadowed, God chose our redemption to be secured by the sacrificial love that the Son gives to the Father.

Matt. 26:26; Mark 14:22; Luke 22:19 – because the priest acts in persona Christi in the offering to the Father, the priest cannot be a woman.

Mark 3:13 – Jesus selected the apostles “as He desired,” according to His will, and not according to the demands of His culture. Because Jesus acted according to His will which was perfectly united to that of the Father, one cannot criticize Jesus’ selection of men to be His priests without criticizing God. (Dropsmith doesn't care, he does it anyway)

John 20:22 – Jesus only breathed on the male apostles, the first bishops, giving them the authority to forgive and retain sins. In fact, the male priesthood of Christianity was a distinction from the priestesses of paganism that existed during these times. A female priesthood would be a reversion to non-Christian practices. The sacred tradition of a male priesthood has existed uncompromised in the Church for 2,000 years.

1 Cor. 14:34-35 – Paul says a woman is not permitted to preach the word of God in the Church. It has always been the tradition of the Church for the priest or deacon alone (an ordained male) to read and preach the Gospel.

1 Tim. 2:12 – Paul also says that a woman is not permitted to hold teaching authority in the Church. Can you imagine how much Mary, the Mother of God, would have been able to teach Christians about Jesus her Son in the Church? Yet, she was not permitted to hold such teaching authority in the Church.

Rom. 16:1-2 – while many Protestants point to this verse denounce the Church’s tradition of a male priesthood, deaconesses, like Phoebe, were helpers to the priests (for example, preparing women for naked baptism so as to prevent scandal). But these helpers were never ordained.

Luke 2:36-37 – prophetesses, like Anna, were women who consecrated themselves to religious life, but were not ordained.

Isaiah 3:12 – Isaiah complains that the priests of ancient Israel were having their authority usurped by women, and this was at the height of Israel’s covenant apostasy.

Here is a list of biblical arguments supporting women priests:

OIP.Qyz4t_Et4eWVGcd8oy75cwHaKg
 

Taken

Well-Known Member
Staff member
Encounter Team
Feb 6, 2018
24,554
12,967
113
United States
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
Difference between Catholic and Protestant.
OP ^

One has a “head” which is the “ONE SAME MAN”, who sits as “head” of both;
Governing Religious AND Governing Civil positions.
IF, he is conducting a Religious sermon; AND only, speaking the Word of God.......he is called “infallible”.
IF, he is speaking of his own words, he’s not “infallible”.
CONUNDRUM”...
this own Churches congregates do NOT know the difference and themselves Believe likewise, speak likewise and repeat likewise; AS IF, every word that comes forth out of “THEIR POPES” mouth, IS “infallible”, when it IS NOT.
Ya need this Churches “playbook” to know their rules.

Other Churches Clerics ANNOUNCE when they are Quoting the Word of God, and the congregates are taught and encouraged to READ the Scripture for themselves and VERIFY what they Hear IS TRUE or Not.
One only requires a Book of Scriptures for their “playbook”.
 
  • Like
Reactions: michaelvpardo

Illuminator

Well-Known Member
Jan 11, 2020
3,389
1,194
113
72
Hamilton
Faith
Christian
Country
Canada
2. This word of thanks to the Lord for his mysterious plan regarding the vocation and mission of women in the world is at the same time a concrete and direct word of thanks to women, to every woman, for all that they represent in the life of humanity.

Thank you, women who are mothers! You have sheltered human beings within yourselves in a unique experience of joy and travail. This experience makes you become God's own smile upon the newborn child, the one who guides your child's first steps, who helps it to grow, and who is the anchor as the child makes its way along the journey of life.

Thank you, women who are wives! You irrevocably join your future to that of your husbands, in a relationship of mutual giving, at the service of love and life.

Thank you, women who are daughters and women who are sisters! Into the heart of the family, and then of all society, you bring the richness of your sensitivity, your intuitiveness, your generosity and fidelity.

Thank you, women who work! You are present and active in every area of life-social, economic, cultural, artistic and political. In this way you make an indispensable contribution to the growth of a culture which unites reason and feeling, to a model of life ever open to the sense of "mystery", to the establishment of economic and political structures ever more worthy of humanity.

Thank you, consecrated women! Following the example of the greatest of women, the Mother of Jesus Christ, the Incarnate Word, you open yourselves with obedience and fidelity to the gift of God's love. You help the Church and all mankind to experience a "spousal" relationship to God, one which magnificently expresses the fellowship which God wishes to establish with his creatures.

Thank you, every woman, for the simple fact of being a woman! Through the insight which is so much a part of your womanhood you enrich the world's understanding and help to make human relations more honest and authentic.

3. I know of course that simply saying thank you is not enough. Unfortunately, we are heirs to a history which has conditioned us to a remarkable extent. In every time and place, this conditioning has been an obstacle to the progress of women. Women's dignity has often been unacknowledged and their prerogatives misrepresented; they have often been relegated to the margins of society and even reduced to servitude. This has prevented women from truly being themselves and it has resulted in a spiritual impoverishment of humanity. Certainly it is no easy task to assign the blame for this, considering the many kinds of cultural conditioning which down the centuries have shaped ways of thinking and acting. And if objective blame, especially in particular historical contexts, has belonged to not just a few members of the Church, for this I am truly sorry.

May this regret be transformed, on the part of the whole Church, into a renewed commitment of fidelity to the Gospel vision. When it comes to setting women free from every kind of exploitation and domination, the Gospel contains an ever relevant message which goes back to the attitude of Jesus Christ himself. Transcending the established norms of his own culture, Jesus treated women with openness, respect, acceptance and tenderness. In this way he honoured the dignity which women have always possessed according to God's plan and in his love. As we look to Christ at the end of this Second Millennium, it is natural to ask ourselves: how much of his message has been heard and acted upon?

Letter to Women (June 29, 1995) | John Paul II
 

Taken

Well-Known Member
Staff member
Encounter Team
Feb 6, 2018
24,554
12,967
113
United States
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
There is nothing "good samaritans" about your endless misrepresentations and insults. When presented with logical explanations of our authentic beliefs and practices, you don't reply to the content, you just heap more stupid insults.

That’s interesting.
INSULTS are only “stupid”, when you are insulted....but YET, you have a magical PASS, to hurl “stupid insults”...lol

Stop whining, whaa, whaa, poked me. PEOPLE DISAGREE.
And the list is LONG, what Catholics Preach and DO, that is bold face AGAINST the Word of God, to which y’all go about in Circles making excuses YOU CAN defy the Word of God, IF YOU CAN, CHANGE THE MEANING OF the Word of God.
It’s Hokus Pokus...AND many a men steadfastly DISAGREE with your circular reasoning.

For example.....You PRAY “TO” saints. BOL goes off on a tangent of what pray means, that has nothing to do with .....
Praying “TO” a dead person, called an abomination in Scripture.

So, WHY do you ‘pray’ “TO” dead people? What is your “Scriptural support” ?
 
  • Like
Reactions: Dropship

theefaith

Well-Known Member
Aug 25, 2020
20,070
1,354
113
63
Dallas
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
Exodus 20 and Deuteronomy 4:13 KJV are in perfect harmony - you're interpretation of Exodus 20 makes them DISHARMONIOUS. The Catholic church claims the power to change God's law and had eliminated the commandment forbidding image worship...and claims that she changed the Sabbath from the 7th day to the 1st day, "a change for which there is no Biblical authority", she boasts.

Therefore, since the Catholic church doesn't keep the same commandments the church in the beginning kept, it can't be the end time "remnant" church!

worship still requires intent

kneeling by my bed to pray I am not worshiping my bed cos I have no intent to do so!

which brings us to the question of real worship of God in spirit and truth

how do you do so?
You have no temple
No ark
No ministerial priesthood
No altar
No censor with incense
No propitiatory sacrifice

all equal no possible worship!
 

theefaith

Well-Known Member
Aug 25, 2020
20,070
1,354
113
63
Dallas
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
I don't think anybody here is anti-catholic, we're simply trying to be good samaritans by helping them see the illogicality of some cath beliefs like praying to dead humans, hell having a swing door, women not being good enough to be priests etc.
In fairness to caths, they're not the only ones with odd beliefs, that's why I'm non-denominational because I can't find any other organised religion or cult whose beliefs i feel comfortable with..:)

only a man can be a father
Only a woman can be a mother
Husband and wife are equal so drop it!
It’s a matters of roles not equality
 

marksman

My eldest granddaughter showing the result of her
Feb 27, 2008
5,578
2,446
113
82
Melbourne Australia
Faith
Christian
Country
Australia
I created a thread to discuss what sin is. And I found that my understanding of sin was vague. But now I have a clear understanding. With that I have grown beyond some churches. I watch Catholic mass online and sometimes attend the parish down the road. But they don't have married clergy so I find them not following biblical teachings.

That lead me to the protestants. But I'm wondering how they differ from the Catholics. I'm somewhat familiar with the Catholic denomination and don't accept all of it. Would I fit better in a protestant denomination?

Not much except for this, that, and the other plus the one about thingmy jig and what its name and it's all over red rover, and not to mention the hows your father, or whose afraid of virgin woof, and that perennial favourite known as don't believe everything you are told, and watch out for pie in the sky, and Humpty Dumpty who sat on a wall, and watch out for the walls come tumbling down, and be careful not to get caught up in solitaire,
and keep out of the way of the sugar plum fairy, and be sure to say three hale and hearties, two turtle doves, and a partridge in a pear tree. Merry Christmas to all.
 

theefaith

Well-Known Member
Aug 25, 2020
20,070
1,354
113
63
Dallas
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
I don't think anybody here is anti-catholic, we're simply trying to be good samaritans by helping them see the illogicality of some cath beliefs like praying to dead humans, hell having a swing door, women not being good enough to be priests etc.
In fairness to caths, they're not the only ones with odd beliefs, that's why I'm non-denominational because I can't find any other organised religion or cult whose beliefs i feel comfortable with..:)

we pray to God by the intercession of the saints rev 5:7
 

theefaith

Well-Known Member
Aug 25, 2020
20,070
1,354
113
63
Dallas
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
I don't think anybody here is anti-catholic, we're simply trying to be good samaritans by helping them see the illogicality of some cath beliefs like praying to dead humans, hell having a swing door, women not being good enough to be priests etc.
In fairness to caths, they're not the only ones with odd beliefs, that's why I'm non-denominational because I can't find any other organised religion or cult whose beliefs i feel comfortable with..:)

petitions are made to the queen, the mother of the king, she presents them to the king with her maternal plea and Christ the king obeys his own commandments
Honor Thy father and mother!

Mary all powerful advocate!
Help of Christian’s!

Mary ever virgin, mother of God, is all powerful in her prayers!

Mary’s prayers are all powerful not cos she is God but because her son is God!

and on becoming man He (Jesus) obeyed his own commandments

you might check out the one that says “honor Thy father and mother”

“My hour has not come”

The time set by almighty God for the public ministry of Christ had not come, Jesus Christ still performed the miracle cos his mother interceded, thus a higher law, “honor thy father and mother” if ANYONE else asked it would NOT have been done!
John 2

and cos of her intercession the disciples believed in Him!
Jn 2:11

Is Paul Divine?

Phil 4:13 I can do all things in Christ who strengthens me.

Jn 15:5 apart from me you can do nothing!
 

Dropship

Well-Known Member
Jun 2, 2022
2,213
1,514
113
76
Plymouth UK
Faith
Christian
Country
United Kingdom
Mary is God’s greatest creation..
The Gospel writers are also clear that women participated in Jesus’ ministry...
one cannot criticize Jesus’ selection of men to be His priests without criticizing God...
Jesus only breathed on the male apostles, the first bishops...

1- I thought John the baptist was God's greatest creation?
Jesus said- "John is the greatest man ever to be born" (Matthew 11:11)

2- Sure, plenty of women followed Jesus-
"Jesus cried out with a loud voice, and breathed his last. There were also women looking on from afar, among whom were Mary Magdalene and Salome, who followed him and ministered to him when he was in Galilee, and many other women who came up with him to Jerusalem" (Mark 15:37)
but it was a stuffy ingrained tradition of those times that women couldn't be priests or preach in church, but now times have changed..:)

Church of England women clergy-

rel-women-clergy.jpg
"In the last days, God says, I will pour out my Spirit on all people. Your sons and daughters will preach, your young men will see visions, your old men will dream dreams. On my servants, both men and women, I will pour out my Spirit in those days, and they will speak." (Joel 2:28-32)
And consider this- a church is not bricks and mortar but a gathering of people, so therefore this forum could be called a church, but nobody would think of banning women from here..:)

PS- I'm surprised that there are women catholics, perhaps they like being dominated and bossed about by men, i dunno..;)
 

Taken

Well-Known Member
Staff member
Encounter Team
Feb 6, 2018
24,554
12,967
113
United States
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
Again, you read into your own scriptures what isn't there. Praying to saints has nothing to do with consulting the dead. It's a straw man fallacy.

The Fallacy...is Catholic teaching. It has EVERYTHING TO DO WITH A LIVING MAN PRAYING “TO” a DEAD MAN!
It’s engaging in witchcraft and wizardness, opening a can of worms for Demonic influences to charm the individual with lies and deceit!

A LIVING bodily man praying TO, a DEAD bodily men...IS A:
NECROMANCER. He is literally INVITING demonic spirits to influence him!

Deut 18:
[11] Or a charmer, or a consulter with familiar spirits, or a wizard, or a necromancer.
[12] For all that do these things are an abomination unto the LORD: and because of these abominations the LORD thy God doth drive them out from before thee.
Put away your Catholic playbook, and READ the Word of God!
Pray TO ONLY the Lord God.
Pray FOR living men who persecute you.
Pray FOR living men who ARE your brethren, ie your brethren are the Catholics.

HUMANS ... DEAD or ALIVE are NOT “intercessors” TO “God”.
HUMANS....ALREADY “IN” Christ have a Direct Communication “TO” God for their personal benefit.
HUMANS...praying “FOR” any another, direct their prayers FOR the other, THROUGH Christ Jesus. —-> the ADVOCATE, the INTERCESSOR!

Strawman claim, with a meme for verification...:rolleyes: LOL
 
  • Like
Reactions: Brakelite

BreadOfLife

Well-Known Member
Jan 2, 2017
20,936
3,387
113
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
Bereft Of Logic.
Bereft Of Logic.
Bereft Of Logic
Bereft Of Logic
Bereft Of Logic
Bereft Of Logic
Bereft Of Logic
You see, no matter how many ways I write it, the result is always the same.
When I want a lesson in insanity, you'll be the first person I ask.
TRANSLATION:
“I CANNOT debate the Scriptural argument you made, so I’ll rave on repeatedly instead.”

That's what I thought . . .

“If you tell a lie big enough and keep repeating it, peo0ple will eventually come to believe it”
- Joseph Goebbels
 

BreadOfLife

Well-Known Member
Jan 2, 2017
20,936
3,387
113
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
You got it..:)
Jesus said "This is how you should pray- 'Our Father which art in heaven.."
So why do catholics disobey him by praying to his mum?
Careful, the naughty step again..
Because JESUS prayed to people, my ignorant, clueless friend . . .
(Matt. 5:46, Matt. 5:47, Matt. 6:27, Matt. 6:28, Matt. 7:3, Matt. 7:16, Matt. 8:26, Matt. 9:4, Matt. 9:5, Matt. 9:15, Matt. 9:28, Matt. 11:7, Matt. 11:16, Matt. 12:11, Matt. 12:29, Matt. 12:34, Matt. 12:48, Matt. 14:31, Matt. 15:3, Matt. 15:34, Matt. 16:9, Matt. 16:13, Matt. 16:15, Matt. 16:26, Matt. 17:17, Matt. 17:25, Matt. 18:12, Matt. 19:17, Matt. 20:21, Matt. 20:22, Matt. 20:32, Matt. 21:25, Matt. 21:28, Matt. 21:42, Matt. 22:18, Matt. 22:42, Matt. 23:17-19, Matt. 23:33, Matt. 26:10, Matt. 26:40, Matt. 26:53, Matt. 26:54, Matt. 26:55, Matt. 27:46, Mark 2:8, Mark 4:21, Mark 4:30, Mark 4:40, Mark 5:9, Mark 5:30, Mark 5:39, Mark 7:18, Mark 7:18, Mark 8:12, Mark 8:17-18, Mark 8:19, Mark 8:20, Mark 8:21, Mark 8:23, Mark 9:12, Mark 9:33, Mark 9:50, Mark 10:3, Mark 10:18, Mark 10:51, Mark 12:15, Mark 13:2, Mark 14:37, Mark 14:37, Luke 2:49, Luke 2:49, Luke 5:22, Luke 5:23, Luke 6:46, Luke 8:25, Luke 8:30, Luke 8:45, Luke 10:15, Luke 10:26, Luke 10:36, Luke 11:40, Luke 12:14-15, Luke 12:25, Luke 12:57, Luke 14:31, Luke 14:34, Luke 15:4, Luke 15:8, Luke 16:11, Luke 17:17, Luke 18:7, Luke 18:8, Luke 22:27, Luke 22:46, Luke 23:31, Luke 24:17, Luke 24:19, Luke 24:26, Luke 24:38, Luke 24:41, John 1:38, John 2:4, John 3:10, John 3:12, John 4:7, John 5:6, John 5:44, John 5:47, John 6:5, John 6:61, John 6:62, John 6:67, John 6:70, John 7:19, John7:19, John 7:23, John 8:10, John 8:43, John 8:46, John 8:46, John 10:36, John 11:9, John 11:26, John 11:33, John 13:12, John 14:9, John 18:4,7, John 18:11, John 18:34, John 18:21, John 18:23, John 20:15, John 21:5, John 21:17, John 21:22)

STUDY your Bible.
Your posts are embarrassingly ignorant . . .
 

michaelvpardo

Well-Known Member
Feb 26, 2011
4,204
1,734
113
67
East Stroudsburg, PA
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
In my entire lifetime I have only ever heard ONE person say they hated the Catholic Church....and he was forced to go to a Catholic Church AND Catholic School, and wanted nothing to do with a Catholic Church, since the day he left home.

As far as hating Catholics, I have never heard a single person make that claim.
I mentioned to my pastor Wednesday night, that I was drawn into another futile argument with some RCC apologists and he quietly confided that the people he knew with "the strongest anti-Catholic sentiments" were all former Catholics who felt robbed of God's grace and were angry that their families were caught up in deceptions that obliged them to blind faith.
He believes that the only possibility for the salvation of Catholics is that they come out of their "holy mother, the church" to receive the gospel. I however, hope, pray, and work toward Reformation in that church.

The Pastor's view is derived from the traditional reformed view that the RCC is mystery Babylon. I'm not convinced of that as my studies and interests coincidentally gave me an understanding of Free Masonry and the ancient traditions of the builders that also passed through the Roman empire to spread throughout Europe, North Africa, the Middle East, and Asia minor.

Masonic teaching is more openly opposed to Christ and embraces works based righteousness in any religious form that includes belief in some god and some form of resurrection (Egyptian worship of Osiris is completely acceptable in their society.) Free Masonry was actively spread throughout the British empire. Their armies typically included a tent to serve as a mobile Masonic temple and they recruited members wherever they ventured if the local religion met their basic membership requirements. Collecting gold is a big part of Masonic lore and tradition.

The RCC teaches the basics of the gospel in the person of our Lord and His resurrection, but have made it another gospel with their traditions, just as the Jews who tried to force the Early Church to observe the law of Moses and be circumcised.

Martin Luther was a Catholic monk delivered by the gospel as he received it from scripture. He tried to bring Reformation in the RCC, but was not in a position to affect real change, given that Rome was deeply caught up in corruption for monetary gain (plenary indulgences for cash.)

Only the Pope and college of Cardinals can bring about real and effective doctrinal reform, but their doctrine of papal infallibility has enshrined error and made it next to impossible to eliminate. However, though it be impossible for men, with the Lord all things are possible.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Wrangler

michaelvpardo

Well-Known Member
Feb 26, 2011
4,204
1,734
113
67
East Stroudsburg, PA
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
TRANSLATION:
“I CANNOT debate the Scriptural argument you made, so I’ll rave on repeatedly instead.”

That's what I thought . . .

“If you tell a lie big enough and keep repeating it, peo0ple will eventually come to believe it”
- Joseph Goebbels
Yup, the Roman church has been telling lies for at least 7 centuries and millions of indoctrinated Catholics have believed them, but most were simply indifferent to the nonsensical doctrines derived from dreams, fables, and the consensus of carnal minds.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Dropship

BreadOfLife

Well-Known Member
Jan 2, 2017
20,936
3,387
113
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
@Dropship ~
BOL has beat his copy and paste “pray and ask” teaching into the ground.

Scripture is clear; TO and FOR is the merit of understanding.

Matt 6:
[6] But thou, when thou prayest, enter into thy closet, and when thou hast shut thy door, pray to thy Father which is in secret; and thy Father which seeth in secret shall reward thee openly.
Matt.26
[53] Thinkest thou that I cannot now pray to my Father, and he shall presently give me more than twelve legions of angels?
2Cor.13
[7] Now I pray to God that ye do no evil; not that we should appear approved, but that ye should do that which is honest, though we be as reprobates.

Matt.5
[44] But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you;
Luke.6
[28] Bless them that curse you, and pray for them which despitefully use you.
John.17
[9] I pray for them: I pray not for the world, but for them which thou hast given me; for they are thine.
1Thes.5
[25] Brethren, pray for us.

Praying TO THE DEAD?

Deut 18:
[
10] There shall not be found among you any one that maketh his son or his daughter to pass through the fire, or that useth divination, or an observer of times, or an enchanter, or a witch,
[
11] Or a charmer, or a consulter with familiar spirits, or a wizard, or a necromancer.
[12] For all that do these things are an abomination unto the LORD: and because of these abominations the LORD thy God doth drive them out from before thee.

BOL...you have been schooled!
As usual, in the depths of your ignorance, you FAIL to understand what “necromancy” is,
Allow me to educate you.

Necromancy is the seeking of oracles from the dead. In other words, Einstein – it’s when you try to glean information FROM the dead. This is why it’s referred to as “soothsaying”. This is what Saul was guilty of when he had the witch conjure up Samuel (Sam. 28:3–25).

ASKING perfected members of the Body of Christ to pray FOR us is a good thing.

James 5:16 says that the prayers of a RIGHTEOUS person are very powerful. Last time I debated a Protestant about Mary – they said that NOE was righteous, per Rom. 3.

Those in Heaven ARE righteous because they have been made PERFECT upon entering Heaven (Rev. 21:2).

As for Jesus teaching the crowds to pray – the ENTIRE chapter leading up to this is about communicating with the FATHER. You fail to understand CONTEX Y(bid surprise).

To “PRAY” simply means to “ASK” – and I’ve posted the definitions THREE times now.

The following s a PRIME example of what I’m talking about from YOUR own KJV . . .

Acts 27:34 - KJV
"Wherefore I pray you to take some meat: for this is for your health: for there shall not an hair fall from the head of any of you".

Game.
Set.
MATCH.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.