25 reasons why you should abandon Premillennialism

[WPM]

Says the one who cannot produce even one scripture that says Satan was "bound" 2,000 years ago to support his claim, but only produces his sheer conjecture produced by pulling other scriptures that have nothing to do with the subject together, all of which comes straight out of the classic Amil text book and say nothing that all Amils haven't already said when they lie about what those scriptures "mean".

Same tired old clumsy and failed attempts at proving the unprovable.

I showed clear Scripture. You carefully sidestepped them. You have to. You have also been unable to address/rebut one single point I presented in the Op. That proves the veracity of the Amil position.

 

[Zao is life]

I showed clear Scripture. You carefully sidestepped them. You have to. You have also been unable to address/rebut one single point I presented in the Op. That proves the veracity of the Amil position.

If I had a dollar for every time your opinions expressed in this thread were fact (like the above one), I'd be stinking rich by now.

As it is, I'm still a poor man.

Sad.

I produced plenty of scriptures in my first post #109 in this thread refuting all your false claims.

You have been unable to refute even one of them.

 

[Zao is life]

(1) Premil is totally preoccupied with, and dependent upon, one chapter in the Bible – Revelation 20.

When someone starts off a long thesis with a totally straw man argument, then you know the rest of what he says will go along the same sort of line.

The word Amillennialist only exists because of one school of Christian's interpretation of only one chapter in the Bible - Revelation chapter 20.
The word Pre-millennialist only exists because of one school of Christian's interpretation of only one chapter in the Bible - Revelation chapter 20.
The word Post-millennialist only exists because of one school of Christian's interpretation of only one chapter in the Bible - Revelation chapter 20.
The word Past-millennialist only exists because of one school of Christian's interpretation of only one chapter in the Bible - Revelation chapter 20.

It's the only chapter in the entire New Testament to mention a thousand years, the binding of Satan and rule of people who had been beheaded and were seen alive in their bodies again, with Christ for the same thousand years.

When Amillennialists argue that it's symbolic, they are talking about only one chapter in the entire Bible, and they do not do a very good job at all of finding scriptures to support their view about it being symbolic, because there aren't any, so they are forced to (always and only through sheer conjecture) pull a whole bunch of other scriptures together that have nothing to do with the subject, and applying all their conjecture to only one chapter - Revelation 20.

When Premillennialists argue that Revelation 20's thousand years is a literal thousand years, at least they are able to produce a whole bunch of other scriptures from other parts of the New Testament to support their claim, such as in Post #109 in this thread.

And so it goes.

What a total straw man argument to use as a first statement in a long, long nothing-burger thesis!!

 

[WPM]

When someone starts off a long thesis with a totally straw man argument, then you know the rest of what he says will go along the same sort of line.

The word Amillennialist only exists because of one school of Christian's interpretation of only one chapter in the Bible - Revelation chapter 20.
The word Pre-millennialist only exists because of one school of Christian's interpretation of only one chapter in the Bible - Revelation chapter 20.
The word Post-millennialist only exists because of one school of Christian's interpretation of only one chapter in the Bible - Revelation chapter 20.
The word Past-millennialist only exists because of one school of Christian's interpretation of only one chapter in the Bible - Revelation chapter 20.

It's the only chapter in the entire New Testament to mention a thousand years, the binding of Satan and rule of people who had been beheaded and were seen alive in their bodies again, with Christ for the same thousand years.

When Amillennialists argue that it's symbolic, they are talking about only one chapter in the entire Bible, and they do not do a very good job at all of finding scriptures to support their view about it being symbolic, because there aren't any, so they are forced to (always and only through sheer conjecture) pull a whole bunch of other scriptures together that have nothing to do with the subject, and applying all their conjecture to only one chapter - Revelation 20.

When Premillennialists argue that Revelation 20's thousand years is a literal thousand years, at least they are able to produce a whole bunch of other scriptures from other parts of the New Testament to support their claim, such as in Post #109 in this thread.

And so it goes.

What a total straw man argument to use as a first statement in a long, long nothing-burger thesis!!

You are not quite grasping my point. I'm not talking about the actual name Amillennialist, Pre-millennialist, Post-millennialist or Past-millennialist. I am talking about the doctrine. My main point is that you have no corroboration for all of the main tenets of your position anywhere in Scripture. Your location of Revelation 20 and what you attribute to that chapter are not supported by other Scripture. Where is your support?

Corroboration is what kills Premil. It has nothing. The rejection of Premil is based on the fact:

· It is built of one passage located in the most symbolic setting in Scripture that enjoys no corroboration for all of its main tenets anywhere in Scripture.
· Everywhere else in the Bible shows us that the coming of the Lord is the end. It is the end of incorruption, mortal man and the end of time.
· The Bible only recognizes a 2-age model, that of this evil age and the perfect age to come. Premil invents a 3rd age through their faulty understanding of this lone chapter

What you attribute to Revelation 20 is found nowhere else in Scripture. You have zero corroboration. For example: where are your 2 resurrection days separated by a thousand years mentioned elsewhere in Scripture? Where are your 2 judgment days separated by a thousand years mentioned elsewhere in Scripture? There is no corroboration for Premil scenario of the binding of Satan at the second coming and his release 1000 years later to deceive the millennial inhabitants as the sand of the sea. Amils have many passages that teaches the binding, curtailing, defeating and subjugation of Satan 2000 years ago. They also have many Scriptures that show Christ is the first resurrection.

This is a major difference between Premillennialism and Amillennialism: you analyze every passage in Holy Writ through the lens of your mistaken understanding of Revelation 20. Amillennialism interprets Revelation 20 through the lens of the rest of Scripture. This gives us a proper sense of this highly debated passage in the most obscure setting in Scripture.

 

[Truth7t7]

That's total rubbish. You have now added the words "of Armageddon" to the words "to battle" and added the words "And the beast was taken, and with him the false prophet doing signs before it, (by which he deceived those who had received the mark of the beast), and those who had worshiped his image. The two were thrown alive into the Lake of Fire burning with brimstone." to the words below:

The only thing you needed to add to the above words was what is written:

And the Devil who deceived them was cast into the Lake of Fire and Brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet were. And he will be tormented day and night forever and ever.

Are you ready to repent of adding words to the Revelation, shoving a battle that had already taken place in where it does not belong and does not appear, and giving that battle a name?

The battles seen in Revelation chapters 16, 19, 20, are all the same battle in parallel teachings

The book of Revelation is seen in "Parallel" teachings of same events, not "Chronologically" as dispensationalism falsely teaches

Jesus Is The Lord

 

[Zao is life]

The battles seen in Revelation chapters 16, 19, 20, are all the same battle in parallel teachings

The book of Revelation is seen in "Parallel" teachings of same events, not "Chronologically" as dispensationalism falsely teaches

Jesus Is The Lord

The saints are not hurt by the Gog and Magog armies that surround them.

The saints are hurt by the armies of the beast who will make war against them and overcome them, and the two witnesses will be overcome and killed by the same beast.

Your theory is incorrect.

And I apologize for the words "that's total rubbish". Kicked myself because it was uncalled for. Please forgive my lack of grace.

But you are wrong.

 

[Zao is life]

My main point is that you have no corroboration for all of the main tenets of your position anywhere in Scripture.

Your main point is false, and it has already been proved to you.

It's been proved to you that though there are no scriptures stating unequivocally that Satan was destroyed in the lake of fire at Calvary, and there are no scriptures stating unequivocally that Satan was bound at Calvary (though scripture states that he was utterly defeated at Calvary), yet there are a number of scriptures stating the exact opposite to Satan being "bound" at Calvary.

Scriptures which you are unable to refute or draw into your list of scriptures pulled together by conjecture that are not even talking about the binding of Satan.

Your location of Revelation 20 and what you attribute to that chapter are not supported by other Scripture.

On the contrary, the very fact that people are said to have been beheaded for their refusal to worship the beast or receive his image or mark or the number of his name places Revelation 20 in a time following the ascending of the beast from the abyss,

but your conjecture regarding your location for what Revelation 20 says about the binding of Satan for a thousand years and rule of saints who had been killed by the beast and were seen alive after that, is not supported by the scripture

- but scripture refutes your false notion that Satan was bound at Calvary, and these scriptures have already been supplied to you, and your conjecture and position already proved false.

Where is your support in scripture for all that conjecture which you have been giving, and why do you simply brush aside facts like those I've just mentioned once again above, and the context of scriptures that you have wrongly pulled together through conjecture as "support" that Satan was bound at Calvary?

Where is your support for what you say?

Corroboration is what kills Premil. It has nothing. The rejection of Premil is based on the fact:

No corroboration is what kills Amil, besides all the above. The rejection of Amil is based on fact, though you deny and ignore and brush all the facts and scriptures aside.

And your wording (the words you choose for your weak arguments) is so much like that of another poster here that it makes me wonder if you have more than one account to support yourself.

Forgive me if I'm wrong.

· It is built of one passage located in the most symbolic setting in Scripture that enjoys no corroboration for all of its main tenets anywhere in Scripture.

OK I will stop here because you are now playing the same "repeat, repeat, repeat this mantra" game that the other Amil your posts remind me of plays, and the same game of "ignore, ignore, ignore all facts that utterly refute these assertions".

"And he cast him into the abyss and shut him up and set a seal on him, that he should deceive the nations no more until the thousand years should be fulfilled."

In Genesis chapter 3, we read of how Satan appeared in the Garden of Eden and deceived mankind.
Revelation 12:9 calls Satan "the great dragon" and "the old serpent called Devil, and Satan, who deceives the whole world."
The reason given for Satan being bound in Revelation 20:1-3 is that he should deceive the nations no more until the thousand years have expired.

If we look for statements in the New Testament implying that Satan was bound when Jesus died and rose again, all we will ever find is passages stating the opposite:

Jesus called Satan "the ruler of this world" and the New Testament calls him "the prince of the power of the air who works in the sons of disobedience", who we are told will give the beast and false prophet his seat, power and great authority (Revelation Chapter 13). The saints are warned to be weary of his wiles and to resist him, and to put on the full armor of God because "we do not wrestle against flesh and blood" ( John 12:31; 1 Peter 5:8-9; Ephesians 6:11-12; Revelation 2:9-10 & Revelation 2:13; 1 Thessalonians 2:18; James 4:7 ).

Ephesians 2:2 tells us about Satan's influence over the societies of this world, this Age.

Revelation Chapters 12-13 portray this current status quo as spanning the entire present Age and culminating in the beast's war against the saints in Revelation Chapter 13 (see Revelation 13:7).

I suppose you'd like me to do the same thing and just repeat and repeat and repeat again the scriptures and facts that refute ALL your arguments and false assertions. But limitation on characters will prevent me from doing that all in one post, so,

TO BE CONTINUED..

 

[Zao is life]

THE DESTRUCTION OF SATAN'S WORKS

This is what we have been told about this:

"Since then the children have partaken of flesh and blood, He also Himself likewise partook of the same; that through death He might destroy him who had the power of death (that is, the Devil), and deliver those who through fear of death were all their lifetime subject to bondage." Hebrews 2:14-15.

"And they overcame him (the devil) because of the blood of the Lamb, and because of the word of their testimony. And they did not love their soul to the death." Revelation 12:11.

The blood of the Lamb speaks of the death of Christ.

"He who practices sin is of the Devil, for the Devil sins from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was revealed, that He might undo the works of the Devil." 1 John 3:8

"For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh." Romans 8:3

1. Satan's works consist primarily in the death that became part of human experience, and the sin that leads to death.

2. The destruction of Satan's works will not last only for a thousand years, only to be "reversed for a short period at the close of the thousand years", as though his works were merely bound for a thousand years.

3. Not only is the devil not more powerful than God, Satan is not even nearly as powerful as the Holy Spirit, and does not need to be 'bound' in order for God to work or for the gospel of the Kingdom of Christ to spread. God is infinitely more powerful than the devil, who can be bound by God at will, at any time. Jesus showed He was able to do this each time He cast out demons, even before His death and resurrection. Satan's power to cause disruption in the spread of God's Kingdom in the world has always been limited to how much God will allow him.

 

[Zao is life]

@WPM ALL the arguments of Amil have been refuted.

I will now sit back and watch your "repeat, repeat, repeat this mantra" game unravel. I notice you have it on auto

 

[WPM]

@WPM ALL the arguments of Amil have been refuted.

I will now sit back and watch your "repeat, repeat, repeat this mantra" game unravel. I notice you have it on auto

This is the classic Premil tactic: hit and run. You have to! That is because their arguments do not abide biblical scrutiny.

 

[WPM]

Your main point is false, and it has already been proved to you.

It's been proved to you that though there are no scriptures stating unequivocally that Satan was destroyed in the lake of fire at Calvary,

Who said he was? That is a typical Premil red herring. You create a strawman and then take shows at it. You are playing games.

Satan is a spiritual being. We are therefore looking in Revelation 20 at spiritual chains and a spiritual prison. The abyss is a spiritual condition. A physical chain and a physical prison will not cut it. The restraint upon him is spiritual. He is like a dog on a chain. A chain does not prevent movement, it limits movement.

Do prisoners have movement within a prison?
Can prisoners hurt?
Can prisoners steal?
Can prisoners kill?
Can prisoners scheme?
Can prisoners commit disorder?

Of course they do.

The wicked are repeatedly depicted in Scripture as being in a prison and being in chains, does that suggest an inability to move?

Of course not!

and there are no scriptures stating unequivocally that Satan was bound at Calvary (though scripture states that he was utterly defeated at Calvary), yet there are a number of scriptures stating the exact opposite to Satan being "bound" at Calvary.

Scriptures which you are unable to refute or draw into your list of scriptures pulled together by conjecture that are not even talking about the binding of Satan.

Jesus said just prior to His death in Matthew 12:28-29, “Then was brought unto him one possessed with a devil, blind, and dumb: and he healed him, insomuch that the blind and dumb both spake and saw. And all the people were amazed, and said, Is not this the son of David? But when the Pharisees heard it, they said, This fellow doth not cast out devils, but by Beelzebub the prince of the devils. And Jesus knew their thoughts, and said unto them, Every kingdom divided against itself is brought to desolation; and every city or house divided against itself shall not stand: And if Satan cast out Satan, he is divided against himself; how shall then his kingdom stand? And if I by Beelzebub cast out devils, by whom do your children cast them out? therefore they shall be your judges. But if I cast out devils by the Spirit of God, then the kingdom of God is come unto you. Or else how can one enter into a strong man’s house, and spoil his goods, except he first bind (deo) the strong man? And then he will spoil his house.”

This is referring to His earthly ministry. When it talks about Satan and his kingdom being bound, being in chains or being imprisoned it is not talking about physical metal chains a physical brick prison because Satan is not a physical being. He is a spiritual being. It is talking about a spiritual condition of restraint that curtails him in regard to his influence and power.

Jesus describes Satan here as the “strong man.” He depicts Himself as the One who enters the house the strong man and plunders his goods. But before this happens he must first be incapacitated.

The Lord identifies the casting out of devils, and the resulting liberating of souls, with the actual binding of the strong man. He in turn presents this as proof that Satan is curbed through the presence and victorious function of the kingdom of God. Christ was specifically referring to Satan here (the strong man) and his demonic kingdom, and expressly connects his binding with the manifestation of the kingdom of God during His earthly ministry. The subjugating of devils was proof of the spiritual restraint of the evil one. Satan could not prevent this. Satan could not overcome those who had been rescued by Christ.

The devil was subject to the purposes of God and hurt by the spiritual advance of the kingdom of God. This kingdom is still alive and active today. Souls are still being marvelously delivered from the power of Satan. The binding of the strong man continues today wherever the Gospel prevails.

Mark 3:11, 23-27 also records: “unclean spirits, when they saw him, fell down before him, and cried, saying, Thou art the Son of God ... And the scribes which came down from Jerusalem said, He hath Beelzebub, and by the prince of the devils casteth he out devils. And he called them unto him, and said unto them in parables, How can Satan cast out Satan? And if a kingdom be divided against itself, that kingdom cannot stand. And if a house be divided against itself, that house cannot stand. And if Satan rise up against himself, and be divided, he cannot stand, but hath an end. No man can enter into a strong man's house, and spoil his goods, except he will first bind (deo) the strong man; and then he will spoil his house.”

This familiar discourse by our Lord came as a response to the crude scoffs of the religious Scribes (during His earthly ministry) dismissing Christ’s deliverance ministry as a work of Satan. Christ’s reply confirmed that the binding of Satan commenced 2,000 yrs ago and is not simply a future hope that will occur after the Lord’s return. He said: “No man can enter into a strong man's house, and spoil his goods, except he will first bind the strong man; and then he will spoil his house.” Christ was firstly referring to the false charge that was laid at his door in relation to his assault on the demonic realm. Secondly, He was describing the subjugation of the “unclean spirits” as “when they saw him” they “fell down before him” in surrender.

Jesus said in the corresponding passage in Luke 11:20-22, “if I with the finger of God cast out devils, no doubt the kingdom of God is come upon you. When a strong man armed keepeth his palace, his goods are in peace: But when a stronger than he shall come upon him, and overcome him, he taketh from him all his armour wherein he trusted, and divideth his spoils.”

Here, Christ highlights the Sovereign power of the kingdom of God and reveals how the “strong man” – Satan – and his kingdom of devils can only be defeated by One that is stronger than them, namely Himself – the Son of God. As we examine the gospels we discover, Satan was stripped everywhere that Christ confronted him. The Lord entered the devil’s house and took authority over him and spoilt His goods. Previously, Satan's grip on the nations was so strong and so embedded that the truth of God's Word could not penetrate through. The devil overwhelmingly controlled the Gentile nations.

Christ said: “When a strong man armed keepeth his palace, his goods are in peace.” This was a direct reference to the unchallenged power of Satan over the nations in the Old Testament. The vast territory of the Gentile nations was under his evil control. He governed the nations at will and operated in an unmolested environment – thus “his goods” were said to be “in peace.”

Satan’s wicked grip over the nations was loosened by the life, death and resurrection of Christ. Many millions were liberated by His message of hope and liberation. In fact, if anything was representative of Christ’s ministry it was the binding of the works of darkness and the deliverance of the afflicted. Christ defeated the power of Satan and all his minions with His sinless life, His vicarious death and His victorious resurrection and therefore wholly fulfilled His earthly assignment. The advance of the kingdom of God therefore has seen the pushing back of the devil’s frontline throughout the nations. It is not that he can’t still create havoc and deceive people; it is that he can’t hinder the triumphant advance of the Gospel throughout the world.

 

[WPM]

the very fact that people are said to have been beheaded for their refusal to worship the beast or receive his image or mark or the number of his name places Revelation 20 in a time following the ascending of the beast from the abyss,

but your conjecture regarding your location for what Revelation 20 says about the binding of Satan for a thousand years and rule of saints who had been killed by the beast and were seen alive after that, is not supported by the scripture

Revelation 20 is speaking about "the souls" (plural) collectively reigning for the symbolic millennial period. This does not exclude those who die “in Christ” today from joining the overall ongoing heavenly millennial reign from the first Advent. If I was to say that ‘Americans have been standing for freedom for a few hundred years’, that does not in any way negate or exclude current Americans from being part of that ongoing group. That did not require them to be alive 250 years ago when their forefathers were pioneering the way. All would consider them part of that continuous fight for freedom.

Similarly, the Christian witness has been powerfully alive in the British Isles since before the Reformation 500 years ago. However, the current believer in the United Kingdom weren’t around 500 years ago, although they would very definitely be considered part of that great general cohesive throng that have stood for the truth of God’s Word. Revelation 20 is therefore similarly talking about the collective reign of the saints during (this so far) 2,000 years intra-advent period.

The redeemed - in total in heaven and on earth - refuse the mark. The wicked (in hell now or on earth that eventually receive the mark through reprobation). The redeemed that reign with Christ now in heaven (Revelation 5:5-10, 20:6) embody all the dead in Christ (both the martyrs and those that have died natural deaths). They do not take part in the beast's market place of sin. They shun the devil's economy.

Those that reign with Christ are not limited to martyrs (if that is what you are pushing at). This is seen in the text you quoted where all that refused the mark and those that had been martyred are seen reigning as kings and priest.

The dead in Christ in total ("the souls") are depicted here (both those that die through natural death and those that die through martyrdom). Collectively this redeemed host reign with Christ in glory until the physical resurrection. This therefore is a picture of the immediate state.

Where one places the tribulation period will color one’s view of the duration of the reign of the saints in heaven. Notwithstanding, the Amillennialist believes the tribulation period to be intra-Advent. They reject the futuristic interpretation of the tribulation, although they accept that there will be an intensification of persecution prior to the end when Satan’s restraint is unleashed.

 

[Zao is life]

Who said he was?

Likewise there are NO scriptures stating unequivocally that he was bound. The scriptures you quote do not state it and you keep repeating the obvious - that in your imagination you have inserted that meaning into scriptures that are not saying anything about the binding of Satan (like you did in the rest of your post above - yet again - arguments you make which have already been totally and completely refuted, so there is no point me doing so again just because you keep repeating the same refuted arguments like they're your mantra).

 

[Zao is life]

Revelation 20 is speaking about the symbolic millennial period.

The word "symbolic" does not appear in Revelation 20.

Why do you lie to yourself about what scripture is saying by adding words to the text that are neither there nor implied by the text?

You should repent of lying to yourself like that, because in the process you have believed your own lies and blinded yourself, and are expressing the same lies to others trying to get them to believe you.

Your false claims regarding the above have already been thoroughly, completely and exhaustively refuted by myself and by others in this thread. I'm not going to repeat it all again because unlike you we do not follow "repeat, repeat, repeat these same statements that have been completely refuted, and repeat them like a magic mantra that makes them come true", the way you do.

 

[WPM]

Likewise there are NO scriptures stating unequivocally that he was bound. The scriptures you quote do not state it and you keep repeating the obvious - that in your imagination you have inserted that meaning into scriptures that are not saying anything about the binding of Satan (like you did in the rest of your post above - yet again - arguments you make which have already been totally and completely refuted, so there is no point me doing so again just because you keep repeating the same refuted arguments like they're your mantra).

This is blatantly untrue! You keep ducking around the Scriptures that show Jesus bound Satan 2000 years ago.

Jesus said just prior to His death in Matthew 12:28-29, “Then was brought unto him one possessed with a devil, blind, and dumb: and he healed him, insomuch that the blind and dumb both spake and saw. And all the people were amazed, and said, Is not this the son of David? But when the Pharisees heard it, they said, This fellow doth not cast out devils, but by Beelzebub the prince of the devils. And Jesus knew their thoughts, and said unto them, Every kingdom divided against itself is brought to desolation; and every city or house divided against itself shall not stand: And if Satan cast out Satan, he is divided against himself; how shall then his kingdom stand? And if I by Beelzebub cast out devils, by whom do your children cast them out? therefore they shall be your judges. But if I cast out devils by the Spirit of God, then the kingdom of God is come unto you. Or else how can one enter into a strong man’s house, and spoil his goods, except he first bind (deo) the strong man? And then he will spoil his house.”

Mark 3:11, 23-27 also records: “unclean spirits, when they saw him, fell down before him, and cried, saying, Thou art the Son of God ... And the scribes which came down from Jerusalem said, He hath Beelzebub, and by the prince of the devils casteth he out devils. And he called them unto him, and said unto them in parables, How can Satan cast out Satan? And if a kingdom be divided against itself, that kingdom cannot stand. And if a house be divided against itself, that house cannot stand. And if Satan rise up against himself, and be divided, he cannot stand, but hath an end. No man can enter into a strong man's house, and spoil his goods, except he will first bind (deo) the strong man; and then he will spoil his house.”

He came to the strong man's house (this sinful world) and spiritually chained Satan. He is like a dog on a leash that will only harm those that foolishly get close to him. He has power and movement but it is restrained and limited since the ministry of Christ. The devil was subject to the purposes of God and hurt by the spiritual advance of the kingdom of God. This kingdom is still alive and active today. Souls are still being marvellously delivered from the power of Satan. The binding of the strong man continues today wherever the Gospel prevails.

 

[WPM]

The word "symbolic" does not appear in Revelation 20.

Why do you lie to yourself about what scripture is saying by adding words to the text that are neither there nor implied by the text?

You should repent of lying to yourself like that, because in the process you have believed your own lies and blinded yourself, and are expressing the same lies to others trying to get them to believe you.

Your false claims regarding the above have already been thoroughly, completely and exhaustively refuted by myself and by others in this thread. I'm not going to repeat it all again because unlike you we do not follow "repeat, repeat, repeat these same statements that have been completely refuted, and repeat them like a magic mantra that makes them come true", the way you do.

Revelation 1:1 begins with: “The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him, to shew unto his servants things which must shortly come to pass; and he sent and signified [Gr. semaino] it by his angel unto his servant John.”

The order here is: God – Christ – Angel – (signified or symbolized) John. This Greek word semaino is found seven times in the New Testament and is interpreted as follows in the King James Version:

• Signs (John 4:48)
• Signify (Acts 25:27)
• Signifying (John 12:33, 18:32, 21:19)
• Signified (Acts 11:28; Revelation 1:1)

Revelation is a unique book. It is wrapped in an apocalyptic genre. Understanding it is a mixture of deciphering coded language and putting a jigsaw puzzle together. You need to collate all the relevant information and descriptions, compare them and then establish what belongs to what. Remember, this book is a picture book to enlighten God’s people, not confuse them or conceal the truth.

In Bible times, they were very familiar with this type of communication in Bible times, but this is not the way we communicate today. Revelation presents a lot of symbolism. But the symbolism is not irrelevant; it is not meaningless; it describes spiritual realities.

Christian authority on Judeo/Christian Customs and historic developments and current lecturer at the Hebrew University in Jerusalem, Dr. James Fleming explains, “The western mind will have a tendency to focus too much on the details of visual images in the Apocalypse rather than what the images stand for.” He then advises, “One cannot interpret Revelation using a Western structure and form of perspective. The functions of the things described in Revelation have to be understood in order to know what they mean.”

The symbolic nature and style in which the apocalypse was written was largely familiar to 1st and 2nd century readers, the design, imagery, narrative, and symbols being commonly used in Judaic religious manuscripts of John's day. Notwithstanding, it is fair to say that this unique apocalyptic style creates many undoubted difficulties for the modern mind, as this genre is just not used today.

 

[WPM]

The word "symbolic" does not appear in Revelation 20.

Why do you lie to yourself about what scripture is saying by adding words to the text that are neither there nor implied by the text?

You should repent of lying to yourself like that, because in the process you have believed your own lies and blinded yourself, and are expressing the same lies to others trying to get them to believe you.

Your false claims regarding the above have already been thoroughly, completely and exhaustively refuted by myself and by others in this thread. I'm not going to repeat it all again because unlike you we do not follow "repeat, repeat, repeat these same statements that have been completely refuted, and repeat them like a magic mantra that makes them come true", the way you do.

Psalm 84:9-10: “Behold, O God our shield, and look upon the face of thine anointed. For a day in thy courts is better than a thousand. I had rather be a doorkeeper in the house of my God, than to dwell in the tents of wickedness.”

This figurative statement in essence asserts that a day in the Lord’s presence is more blessed than untold ordinary ones outside of such. It in no way indicates that one (twenty-four hour) day in God’s presence exactly represents one thousand days elsewhere, such a limit would be an unfair restriction upon the meaning intended. Such a literal interpretation is at clear variance with the undoubted general usage of the phrase in Scripture and the specific import of the reading under analysis.

The figure a thousand is also employed in Psalm 50:10-11 to denote the greatness of God’s providence, saying, “For every beast of the forest is mine, and the cattle upon a thousand hills. I know all the fowls of the mountains: and the wild beasts of the field are mine.”

Does Christ only own the cattle on one thousand hills or does he own them all? Of course there is no way that this passage suggests that Christ only owns the cattle on one thousand hills. Rather, He owns every beast on every hill, thus revealing His omnipotence. The statement reference the “thousand hills” is preceded y the introductory comment: “For every beast of the forest is mine.” This is simply presented in such a way as to express the unfathomable authority and power of the living God. It beautifully correlates with the truth expressed in 1 Corinthians 10:28, which states, “the earth is the Lord's, and the fulness thereof.”

The term “a thousand” is thus used to in some way express the nature and awesome power of Almighty God. The phrase is used to portray the Sovereignty of God and His supreme kingship over all creation. We must clearly acknowledge that the figure ‘a thousand’ is consistently and symbolically employed, throughout the Word of God, to denote an unfathomable amount or a vast period.

Even the figurative every-day statement ‘one in a thousand’ has emanated from the fountainhead of Scripture. It is found in Ecclesiastes 7:27-28 where Solomon laments, “one man among a thousand have I found; but a woman among all those have I not found. Lo, this only have I found, that God hath made man upright; but they have sought out many inventions.”

Solomon laments over the fact that he barely found any upright man in his travels. They were the exception rather than the rule. The thought here intended is that the man under consideration is of a particular choice character, being, as it where, the pick-of-the-bunch. The usage of the numbers one and a thousand is thus employed to represent a particular truth rather than specifically describing an accurate numerical equation.

In the same vein, Job 33:23 declares, “If there be a messenger with him, an interpreter, one among a thousand, to shew unto man his uprightness.” The same two common numbers are used here in the form of a contrast to simply portray the picture of a special vessel. Again, it is not the numbers that are important but the idea they represent.

 

[Zao is life]

Revelation 1:1 begins with: “The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him, to shew unto his servants things which must shortly come to pass; and he sent and signified [Gr. semaino] it by his angel unto his servant John.”

The order here is: God – Christ – Angel – (signified or symbolized) John. This Greek word semaino is found seven times in the New Testament and is interpreted as follows in the King James Version:

• Signs (John 4:48)
• Signify (Acts 25:27)
• Signifying (John 12:33, 18:32, 21:19)
• Signified (Acts 11:28; Revelation 1:1)

Revelation is a unique book. It is wrapped in an apocalyptic genre. Understanding it is a mixture of deciphering coded language and putting a jigsaw puzzle together. You need to collate all the relevant information and descriptions, compare them and then establish what belongs to what. Remember, this book is a picture book to enlighten God’s people, not confuse them or conceal the truth.

In Bible times, they were very familiar with this type of communication in Bible times, but this is not the way we communicate today. Revelation presents a lot of symbolism. But the symbolism is not irrelevant; it is not meaningless; it describes spiritual realities.

Christian authority on Judeo/Christian Customs and historic developments and current lecturer at the Hebrew University in Jerusalem, Dr. James Fleming explains, “The western mind will have a tendency to focus too much on the details of visual images in the Apocalypse rather than what the images stand for.” He then advises, “One cannot interpret Revelation using a Western structure and form of perspective. The functions of the things described in Revelation have to be understood in order to know what they mean.”

The symbolic nature and style in which the apocalypse was written was largely familiar to 1st and 2nd century readers, the design, imagery, narrative, and symbols being commonly used in Judaic religious manuscripts of John's day. Notwithstanding, it is fair to say that this unique apocalyptic style creates many undoubted difficulties for the modern mind, as this genre is just not used today.

Much of what you say about the Revelation proves that you do not understand much of what it says.

No amount of trying to teach others will help you, because you cannot change the meaning just because you have chosen to believe the lies you have told yourself.

 

[WPM]

Much of what you say about the Revelation proves that you do not understand much of what it says.

No amount of trying to teach others will help you, because you cannot change the meaning just because you have chosen to believe the lies you have told yourself.

I see a pattern: you never address or accept the biblical evidence. You prefer what you have been taught - Premil. You avoid all the evidence - you have to.

 

[Zao is life]

I see a pattern: you never address or accept the biblical evidence. You prefer your what you have been taught - Amil. You avoid all the evidence - you have to.

You shouldn't talk to yourself in these forums like that, WPM. It's embarrassing, even when you replace what you do to hang onto your Amil beliefs with the word "Premil"