An Omniscient God Negates Free Will

[Matthias]

She is very intoxicating to think about.
Should I post that NIN song "The perfect drug" I think it's safe to say of myself that I'd rather be addicted to the thought of a person than a drug chemical. It's ultimately healthier, plus there's no chance those other drug's are going love me back. (I know) I should get addicted to God. So basically it all comes down to "Pick your addiction" Like George Carlin said "Pick your superstition. 50/50 it's all the same"

My advice: Forget Carlin. Listen to and believe Jesus.

 

[I.O.U]

My advice: Forget Carlin. Listen to and believe Jesus.

F you!

 

[BeyondET]

I'm afraid the logic states otherwise.

If God knows, with absolute 100% certainty that you will choose option A, rather than B or C, then very clearly it is impossible for you to pick B or C. How or why it's impossible doesn't really matter. The important fact is that if God says you're going to pick A, then you simply can not pick B or C since to do so would prove God to be fallible. The "choice" may seem like a choice to the human, but if all choices but one are impossible then it's not really a choice at all.

Same for B or C, if you choose any of them it's already known.

 

[Matthias]

F you!

Well bless my soul.

I hear you, but listen to and believe Jesus (Matthew 5:11).

 

[APAK]

I thought so for a while, but the moderators have been lax in enforcing the policy. In light of that, put me down for a maybe.



I changed my faith status to “Other“ for the sake of someone else’s conscience.



It has solely to do with the way I‘ve arranged my settings and my own personal policy regarding pm conversations. The owner, administrators, moderators and staff members haven’t prohibited it. I’m sorry if I inadvertently gave you the impression that they have.

Thanks for the answers. Much appreciated.

 

[I.O.U]

Well bless my soul.

I hear you, but listen to and believe Jesus (Matthew 5:11).

You hear what you believe, that is all you hear. Your belief filters the sensory information as it travels to your brain. If anything is true about believing, it is only a belief living out in you like a symbiotic creature. There is really nothing left to say, I I must get away from here and other people who live for believing.

 

[I.O.U]

You hear what you believe, that is all you hear. Your belief filters the sensory information as it travels to your brain. If anything is true about believing, it is only a belief living out in you like a symbiotic creature. There is really nothing left to say, I I must get away from here and other people who live for believing.

I guess your children will need this particular information at some point, so they'll have something that can remedy the damage you believers have caused. Look at case studies of children with schizophrenia. It is rare. Schizophrenia is found to occur in adulthood (Not unlike drug induced psychosis) Why is it rare for children to snap into psychosis? Because they haven't formed a body of belief systems. Nothing is distorting the information travelling to their brain.

 

[I.O.U]

Your silence teaches me that I am on the right track.

 

[Lapidem]

@I.O.U @Adam @Matthias

Could I politely ask the above users to kindly stop derailing this thread with personal discussions which have absolutely nothing to do with the topic of "An Omniscient God Negates Free Will". Perhaps you could create your own thread to discuss whatever it is you need to get off your chests?

Many Thanks

 

[Lapidem]

Not true. The premise is false.

Omniscience (all knowing) does not negate the choice God gives to each. That God knows what will be chosen at each point, does not negate the fact that a choice was given. God knows the choices. The persons choosing do not know until they choose.

Hi Adventageous

I submit that it is your premise that is astray here.

A choice can not exist if there are no options to choose from. If there are universal forces in play that determine that a given event will 100% happen then there can not be any choice in that event. For there to exist free will, and thus free choice, it MUST BY DEFINITION mean that God can not know in advance what the choice will be. The very second that God knows in advance what the choice will be we can then determine that there MUST exist forces in play that are determining that outcome, for otherwise it could not possibly be known in advance. What those forces are is not relevant. It could be that God can see the infinite intricacies of "cause and effect" of every atom in the universe and can compute it all and thus can see what will happen in the future. i.e. not some mysterious woo-science ability but simple physics and chemistry and real science. It could alternatively be that God sits outside time and that everything has already happened and God can view all past history and all future events like watching a film, being able to fast forward or rewind at will. But if this is the case, if everything HAS already happened, then once again there is no free choice. The choices have already happened and we are somehow just experiencing a slot in time as our human experience.

Any way we slice and dice this the fundamental problem remains. The only way a choice can be free, the only way a choice can be a real, is if no-one at all, not even God, can know the outcome before it happens.

Thus we have a fundamental problem with our concept of God and our lives. Either our thinking that God is Omniscient is totally incorrect, or our belief that we have free will and free choice is incorrect. The former seems more likely imo.

 

[Adam]

A choice can not exist if there are no options to choose from. If there are universal forces in play that determine that a given event will 100% happen then there can not be any choice in that event.

What causes a person to make a decision? Is it purely random? Or does it follow some sort of logic?

 

[I.O.U]

@I.O.U @Adam @Matthias

Could I politely ask the above users to kindly stop derailing this thread with personal discussions which have absolutely nothing to do with the topic of "An Omniscient God Negates Free Will". Perhaps you could create your own thread to discuss whatever it is you need to get off your chests?

Many Thanks

WWJD

 

[I.O.U]

If a God gave us all free will (Absolute freewill) by which I assume we all mean a God who will not interfere with our choices. Is that your God? because the way I see it Christianity does not line up with that belief. Think about it, cause and effect. How do you get around cause and effect.

 

[Lapidem]

What causes a person to make a decision? Is it purely random? Or does it follow some sort of logic?

Nothing at all is random. The concept of random simply relates to large and complex matters of physics which humans can not compute and so to us it appears random, but in truth it is not. Nothing is random. Cause and Effect govern everything and again this is an infinitely complex situation. Every atom in the universe, every transfer of energy, effects the whole. Hence we don't really have free will.

 

[I.O.U]

Here doll-face have a phone wallpaper:

 

[I.O.U]

The ratio for that wallpaper is 1600x900

 

[Adam]

Nothing at all is random. The concept of random simply relates to large and complex matters of physics which humans can not compute and so to us it appears random, but in truth it is not. Nothing is random. Cause and Effect govern everything and again this is an infinitely complex situation. Every atom in the universe, every transfer of energy, effects the whole. Hence we don't really have free will.

We have free will to act according to our own nature and our own circumstances, to gain our own knowledge and opinions, to create our own reality.

But here is a question for you: where does consciousness come from? In a purely mechanistic universe, there would be no such thing as a conscious being, whatever strange shapes chemical processes might take.

Consciousness comes from God Himself, the Kingdom of God is in Man.

 

[I.O.U]

Why is it that people who profess they love you in the name of their God never seem interested in what interests you. They only show interest in you believing the same things they believe. Anything else you could offer is disregard as anti-this or anti-that. A long time ago when I really wanted to believe in Jesus, a Christian who believed it was his job to guide me in the faith was always suggesting that I give up things that interested me (Because it didn't honour God) I'll stop now: Writing this is bringing back traumatic memories.

 

[I.O.U]

Do you moderators realise that your ads are intrusive, making very difficult to post and edit on a mobile browser. So what are you going to do about it? Makes me nuts, and many times I close my browser and leave.

 

[Adam]

Why is it that people who profess they love you in the name of their God never seem interested in what interests you They only show interest in you believing the same things they believe. Anything else you could offer is disregard as anti-this or antui-that. A long time ago when I really wanted to believe in Jesus, a Christian who believed it was his job to guide me in the fairh was always suggesting that I give up things that interested me (Because it didn't honour God) I'll stop now: Writing this is bringing back tramatic memories.

Some people are just jerks. Jesus was killed by religious jerks. Some people believe in God but their faith has been corrupted by false teachings; others only pretend to believe for the sake of self-aggrandizement; and there are some people who are humble and genuinely loving to others. A person's real religion can be seen in how they treat others.