Can Only Mods Solve This Problem?

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Hidden In Him

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Part 2 of my response:
but it is not my place, neither my job to try and convince other people about what I believe.

I am not trying to convince the other person... we have an entirely different perspective on this. I am concerned with the onlooker, Helen. The onlooker, including you. I see even you as someone who may have accepted false teaching in the matter that brought this whole discussion up to begin with, so let me ask you: If I were to see you or some other member here that I cared about swallowing rank heresy at some point in the future because of such things, your advice to me is that I should only concern myself with convincing the heretic? If he won't be convinced by me, then oh well? Nothing I can do? I should just post my opinion and let you go right down the spiritual sewer, LoL. Yes, I can post you privately and try to dissuade you, but what about all the people I don't know, and who are not even logged on? I don't see it, Helen, and I think you would change your tune if the doctrine in question was something you had very deep problems with and you saw multiple people buying into a lie. The argument that we can't do anything about it is a weak one, and just spiritually irresponsible to me. Just saying.
Chris, it is God's business. And I say again.

A Christian Forum , is just that, it is not a church meeting or gathering...it is just " A Forum" ...and like the old ancient forums ..anyone can get up on his hind legs and speak.

Yes, but I don't think one should be allowed to monopolize the forum with threads while ignoring the counter-arguments of multiple other members here and then boasting that he cannot be refuted. It is 1. arrogant, 2. spiritually irresponsible, 3. disrespectful to others, 4. inconsiderate, 5. spiritually destructive... Suppose CoreIssue refused to answer anyone's counter-arguments yet was to this day still posting threads like a mad-man? What about THBE, who marathon-posted us to death. At least those two had the decency to respond to those who disagreed with them, so in my opinions what they were doing was far less destructive to this forum.

I could go on and on here, but I just don't think we're going to see eye to eye on it, unfortunately. If the majority feels the same way as you do, I will certainly accept it. But my conscience will be clear that I did everything in my power to see that people weren't being allowed to be deceived in the name of this place "just being a forum."

Just as soon this discussion ended as soon as possible frankly, LoL. There's a great deal about being faithful to what God tells you to do that is unquestionably unpleasant, to say the least.
 
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Hidden In Him

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1 Corinthians 11:18-19
"For first of all, when ye come together in the church, I hear that there be divisions among you; and I partly believe it. For there must be also heresies among you, that they which are approved may be made manifest among you."

I wouldn't be so quick to repaint.

Reminds me . . .

OK.

The pastor on his day off decides to paint the fellowship hall, but the day is nearly over, the paint's running low . . . so he mixes in a little water, finishes the job.

And when he comes in Sunday to preach, everyone is looking at the new paint, and where the old color shows through on that last part.

Ouch! And then the still small voice . . .'Repaint! And thin no more!"

Much love!
Mark

LoL! I needed a little humor.

530204_f52033bbe74e3b57566532a48020d6d7_large.jpg


With that I think I'll call it a day... maybe : )
 
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Hidden In Him

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I know I already answered you above. BUT
This thread is weighing heavily upon me.

I feel it is a subtle play to get a brother (and whatever anyone thinks....
He is a brother.) banned by drawing attention to the Admins,because some do not like what the brother believes. That is pretty sad...

No, no. I don't want him or anyone else banned. I just want him to answer my bloody arguments if he's going to monopolize the forum with new threads posting the exact same things over and over, and then troll and boast that no one can ever refute his arguments when he can't even present the slightest responses in reply.

But it's going nowhere unfortunately. All I keep doing is repeating myself over and over against false misrepresentations of what I'm saying while what I am actually saying goes completely unresponded to.
 

aspen

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I have come across a new problem this weekend (well, it's new for me anyway); one that appears can only be solved by the moderators, if they so choose to. I formally invite the mods to post on this thread as well.

Here is the dilemma:

Suppose you have a member or members who post threads espousing heresy, but when their arguments are challenged they refuse to address the counter-arguments, and instead use every evasive tactic in the book. But they then turn around and continue to post thread after thread openly claiming that no one can refute their claims. Now many may know who I am referring to specifically here as having inspired me to write this thread, and some may actually side with him doctrinally, and therefore not see what he is teaching as heresy. But for the sake of argument, just suppose we are talking here about someone you DO believe teaches heresy.

See, the situation leaves the forum (and by that I mean any forum) with the following problem, and puts moderators in a difficult position. Members who can pick apart the flaws in their theology nevertheless really can't fix the problem. Such members really have only one of two choices as I see it:

1. Either continue to refute and refute and refute them all day long, every day, as if that has now become their new occupation in life (even though their posts will be almost completely ignored by the offending party), or

2. Simply allow the person to continue teaching falsehoods unchallenged, day after day. And when you are dealing with someone who boasts openly in every thread that no one can challenge or refute their claims, onlookers who view such threads continually going unchallenged may therefore be inclined to believe they actually are un-refutable.

Because membership can't fix such a problem, it forces moderators to have to make a determination themselves about whether what is taught is heresy or not, since the problem can only be solved by outside intervention from site management.

Any thoughts? I post this out of concern for saving Christian forums in general from being undermined by a rather insidious problem, but especially ours. This is a good community, and it's a problem I'm having a hard time seeing can be solved by the membership alone.

This is not an attack on the offending party in question, nor is it posted out of resentment. I'm simply coming up empty, as it is an especially tough dilemma to figure out a good solution for.

Blessings in Christ, and thanks for considering the issue.
Hidden In Him

Ok. Well, is this really a problem? Hear me out

1. Most people, like God’s Grace mentioned, have their own standards regarding heresy
2. Many people who post here, are looking for their tribe, someone to fight with, and/or practice expressing their options about doctrine and feeling “right”.
3. It is rare to find anyone who is here to learn new ideas or an absolute truth, unless it is their own.

Seeking out orthodoxy on a religion based message board is foolhardy. Also, if it was possible without turning into CARM or some other police state, it would deny everyone the opportunity to articulate the reasoning behind their opinions.
 

marks

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I don't post anything I am not ready to defend, because I feel spiritually responsible to others for what I say, and will answer to God for it all one day. I simply get the impression that many do not feel the same way, and are playing "teacher" when it is a far more serious matter than that. James said so.

Hi HIH,

I stand ready to "defend" anything I post, which for me is to say that I will elaborate and explore and harmonize Scriptures that may seem in conflict, or will modify my view upon consideration at times.

One of the especially difficult things I find is to drag someone's actual meaning into the light. People talk around the edges of things, but when questioned for clarity, back away from the discussion. Often using ad hominems to make it look like the other person is causing problems. And I've seen where this tactic has been successful.

Yes, I think that many may not feel that James' warning is for them, but if I'm here sharing the I believe the Bible means, then what else would you call it?

At the end of the day, this forum is someone's property, and functions according to what that someone wants. You can make a public appeal, but it seems to me that the posts should be reported, and then owners/operators will do what they choose.

I've heard one person suggest the individual of whom you speak, but you've not verified that, unless I've missed something.

I have a tough time with hypotheticals. Personally I like it when people come straight out with what they are saying.

Much love!
Mark
 
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Jane_Doe22

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Good post. There probably aren't a ton of young or new Christians visiting anyway, since we're only talking about 40-50 people viewing at any one time on average, and my guess is most are actually members who are simply not logged on but checking to see what is being posted. And if it were just us in a closed setting I suppose it wouldn't matter so much.

But then it only takes misleading a few here and there to make waves if you will in the spiritual world, and every soul has value in God's eyes, so to me it is still a matter of importance.

Heresy is indeed too strong a word for me as well, but "false teaching" sometimes doesn't quite convey the seriousness of the matter either, so I tend to use both in combination to balance things out.

About things being heard differently, I actually will go into discussions trying to ask questions in an attempt to figure out if what I am hearing is actually correct. But once I get a handle on exactly what is being said, I tend to zero in on where I think a problem lies. And because I am taking the time to engage this person out of genuine interest and/or potential concern, I expect them to take me seriously and not just blow off what I'm saying, especially when it becomes pretty obvious that they are doing so because they do not have a good answer, and yet they feel they have no need to account for any other scriptures than the ones that favor their interpretation. I do "want to be heard," and do find it offensive personally when I am not in that context, but it is not about gaining attention or out-arguing someone. I'm deeply in love with the truth and always have been since the day I got born again, and value it above all else in this life. It is what I live for above absolutely everything and everyone else. So my involvement in religious discussions of any kind is purely for the sake of seeking out the truth with someone, and when I encounter game-playing from people I will hold them accountable.

I'm sure some may view this as being too heavy-handed and dictatorial about things, but it again reminds me of something Byrd said yesterday. "I take it personally," because it is not a game to me. I feel that no one should monopolize forums for their own ends, no matter how justified they may feel about it, and especially a forum like this one. I personally am never all that involved - I just visit and see what others are posting usually - so it is more about keeping things balanced, to where no one ruins what I see as a pretty good place to discuss the scriptures, and spiritual matters in general; one that is still better than the rest of the options, and therefore worth fighting for.
I hear you there, HIH. Your high-quality attitude hear makes huge difference and really shine through in your posts. I likewise try really hard to listen to people, and like to be heard, and have real actual discussions where two (or more) people really listen to each other and talk about things.

But sadly, not all posters are high quality like that. They're just not.

An example from my life: I'm a LDS Christian (nicknamed "Mormon") and I have met dozens of posters online that post downright lies about what I believe -- falsehoods a huge as "you don't believe that Jesus is the Son of God" and things like that. Downright hugely false information about extremely important subjects. Now, if a person is instructed in talking, I'll talk to them about it and set the record straight. But a lot of the times they aren't interested in talking--- they just want to spam all of that false information and shout how it's their God -given duty to spread these "warnings". Frankly, it's a waste of time for me engage these people-- again they don't want to talk, they just want to hate. And I can't police them-- it's not my job to police the internet or even a particular forum. And while I feel that such behavior is sinful and stupid, it's not against forum rules and I don't think somebody should get kicked off a forum just for that.

It's the same with all of the other low quality posters here: we can't police people to "hey pay attention and actually listen to another person". We can't. Even when what they are saying is downright damnable junk, we can't. If you see a new person here, maybe you take a minute to talk to them about things and explain your views-- sure, that's good. But it's a waste of time for me to address the troll's millionth "you don't believe Jesus is the Son of God!" claim just in case any new person sees it-- such just spreads the pig's filth. And likewise it's a waste of time for any other person to address another troll's millionth false claim and spread the pig's filth.
 

Hidden In Him

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Seeking out orthodoxy on a religion based message board is foolhardy. Also, if it was possible without turning into CARM or some other police state, it would deny everyone the opportunity to articulate the reasoning behind their opinions.

Oh, Aspen. I'm not angry at you for it. For one thing you are showing up late to the discussion. But my problem with others is precisely that they are not articulating the reasoning behind their opinions. They are simply expressing them - repeatedly and incessantly - yet adamantly refusing to articulate their reasoning behind their opinions whenever someone uses scripture to call what they are teaching into question.

I utterly DESPISE the police state approach. But I also despise what I have been repeating in this thread, as described above.

Please read through the thread and give me your honest opinion after you have read it. I could use a voice of reason, and one of consideration for a change.
 

Enoch111

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...yet adamantly refusing to articulate their reasoning behind their opinions...
Those who have been indoctrinated into false beliefs do not have any basis other that what they have been taught as a misrepresentation of Scripture. Therefore they cannot reason. It is akin to brainwashing. The best solution is to ignore all further posts.
 

Hidden In Him

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I stand ready to "defend" anything I post, which for me is to say that I will elaborate and explore and harmonize Scriptures that may seem in conflict, or will modify my view upon consideration at times.

And this is precisely what I am after as well! When I present arguments (as in the thread in question), I am honestly asking people how they account for certain scriptures. I'm not daring them to, :rolleyes: I'm honestly asking if they have an answer because I am open to what they're saying if they can support it well enough. But when they have no answer yet adamantly still hold to their view, that is IMO completely abandoning all attempts to harmonize the scriptures, preferring instead to stay closed minded and urge that everyone else should as well.
One of the especially difficult things I find is to drag someone's actual meaning into the light. People talk around the edges of things, but when questioned for clarity, back away from the discussion.

This is where I nearly always get myself in trouble. I interpret scriptures very strictly, and it rubs people the wrong way (as if I'm attacking them) when in reality I'm simply trying to get to the bottom of things.
Often using ad hominems to make it look like the other person is causing problems. And I've seen where this tactic has been successful.

Common fare, unfortunately, which is why I am putting myself through the torture of having to deal with this subject publicly.
Yes, I think that many may not feel that James' warning is for them, but if I'm here sharing the I believe the Bible means, then what else would you call it?

At the end of the day, this forum is someone's property, and functions according to what that someone wants. You can make a public appeal, but it seems to me that the posts should be reported, and then owners/operators will do what they choose.

Marks, I truly appreciate this post. When no one seems to be getting it, you start to feel like you're some sort of alien or something, LoL. Thank you for these words.
I've heard one person suggest the individual of whom you speak, but you've not verified that, unless I've missed something.

Yes, that's who I was talking about, but I have specially tried to avoid making the conversation just about him because it is not. I've seen others do very similar things here, and as I was telling someone else, if the site continues to just allow it to go on, this will become apparent to every troll who visits the site and decides he or she wants to join in on all the fun as well. As the scripture says, "we are not ignorant of his devises."
 
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Hidden In Him

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I hear you there, HIH. Your high-quality attitude hear makes huge difference and really shine through in your posts. I likewise try really hard to listen to people, and like to be heard, and have real actual discussions where two (or more) people really listen to each other and talk about things.

But sadly, not all posters are high quality like that. They're just not.

An example from my life: I'm a LDS Christian (nicknamed "Mormon") and I have met dozens of posters online that post downright lies about what I believe -- falsehoods a huge as "you don't believe that Jesus is the Son of God" and things like that. Downright hugely false information about extremely important subjects. Now, if a person is instructed in talking, I'll talk to them about it and set the record straight. But a lot of the times they aren't interested in talking--- they just want to spam all of that false information and shout how it's their God -given duty to spread these "warnings". Frankly, it's a waste of time for me engage these people-- again they don't want to talk, they just want to hate. And I can't police them-- it's not my job to police the internet or even a particular forum. And while I feel that such behavior is sinful and stupid, it's not against forum rules and I don't think somebody should get kicked off a forum just for that.

It's the same with all of the other low quality posters here: we can't police people to "hey pay attention and actually listen to another person". We can't. Even when what they are saying is downright damnable junk, we can't. If you see a new person here, maybe you take a minute to talk to them about things and explain your views-- sure, that's good. But it's a waste of time for me to address the troll's millionth "you don't believe Jesus is the Son of God!" claim just in case any new person sees it-- such just spreads the pig's filth. And likewise it's a waste of time for any other person to address another troll's millionth false claim and spread the pig's filth.

Thank you for this post as well, sister. See, this is exactly what I am talking about. Frankly, I've come to appreciate the different denominations we have represented here, and IMO many of them represented quite well. I truly want to learn about other people's doctrines even if I may not believe them. How else can one reach others if they don't even understand them? Nor do I automatically dismiss what someone is saying just because they're Baptist, or Catholic, or SDA, or whatever... I truly LIKE talking with people from different perspectives, including your own. And I agree there's really nothing membership can do because they are wasting their time. If the problem is simply tolerated and excused, those offering well-constructed and thought-out posts are just being manipulated; allowing their time and efforts to be washed down the drain.

I think it's a job for management, honestly. I think requirements need to be in place that people offer reasonable responses to members and not just troll them from now until doomsday, feeling no responsibility to answer for what they teach.

Thanks again : )
 
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Hidden In Him

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Those who have been indoctrinated into false beliefs do not have any basis other that what they have been taught as a misrepresentation of Scripture. Therefore they cannot reason. It is akin to brainwashing. The best solution is to ignore all further posts.

Well, I would have thought this to be a potential solution, but with the persistent types it really isn't. As I was saying, they just take the opportunity of being ignored to gloat that no one can refute their claims.

But I agree it is akin to brainwashing in a way. It's as if the strategy is, "Let me present this teaching just as often as humanly possible, thread after thread, until it becomes a majority opinion."
 
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Helen

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I didn't think so. His name was never mentioned.
He has his right to believe as he will. I don't agree with him in many ways, but in other ways, I DO understand what he's trying to say.

He's always answered my posts.
Censorship is not good.

Oh come on Fran..."his name was not mentioned" , but we all knew ..except @marks maybe, who we were talking about and which thread.
I agree...I too can see what he is saying in this threads. And people are free to disagree. Which most do. Some like bbyrd009 over and over and over... lol
 

marks

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I've seen others do very similar things here, and as I was telling someone else, if the site continues to just allow it to go on, this will become apparent to every troll who visits the site and decides he or she wants to join in on all the fun as well. As the scripture says, "we are not ignorant of his devises."

I'd go farther to say that there is an overall negative culture overlaid on this forum. There is a tolerance not only for what you are posting here, but just in general bad behavior, calling people everything from dogs and pigs to carnal and unsaved, and that's just the surface!

So many posts with people just getting in their digs without responding to what was written.

One can get to the point of, why even bother?

But like you said . . . there could be just one person in this world, and God wants to share something to them, may it be through me.

Much love!
 

Helen

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Not everyone is against me in this thread! I think you're misreading some of the posters initial responses as their final opinions, but it may not be true. If it is so be it, I will bow to the majority opinion. But I will not go willingly into simply allowing deception and false teaching to go unchallenged. If I did, I would answer to God for it, and I am not going to be condemned by Him simply to go along with whatever the consensus felt about things without speaking up.


Oh I know Chris...I must have written my post unclearly...sorry, I wasn't saying that.. I can see that you have plenty of support here.

We don't need is any more divisions on the Site...there are enough differences already, I have "said my bit" twice, so I have nothing more to add here. ( although I have not read all the new posts here yet. )

I appreciate you as a brother. I don't wish to fall-out over this issue.
God knows the hearts. :)

Bless you H.
 

Hidden In Him

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Oh I know Chris...I must have written my post unclearly...sorry, I wasn't saying that.. I can see that you have plenty of support here.

We don't need is any more divisions on the Site...there are enough differences already, I have "said my bit" twice, so I have nothing more to add here. ( although I have not read all the new posts here yet. )

I appreciate you as a brother. I don't wish to fall-out over this issue.
God knows the hearts. :)

Bless you H.

Wonderful post, dear, and I'm glad we could a least talk it over a little. It's not just about HR, and I honestly don't want to see him go anywhere. I just need to address something I've seen happening around here for awhile now, and I feel convicted needs to be addressed.

I don't want any fallings out over it either. :)
 

aspen

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HinH,

Ok, I read as much of the thread as I am willing to read for now - about 3 pages. I think I have an understanding of what is troubling you - tell me what you think:

It is not necessarily the content of people’s opinions that bother you, it is, in fact, the unexamined nature of their opinion, especially the bravado that often accompanies unexamined opinion. The question that follows seems to be, should unexamined opinions, backed only with ‘doubling down’ and ad hominem be allowed on this forum. Here are my related thoughts

1. We live in an Age of doubling down, uneducated opinion, and bravado. I do not like it and it appears that you do not like it. It is certainly the bane of every educated person out there, unfortunately it is also reality, whether online, on tv, or in personal contact. Asking for it to be different on Christianityboard is asking too much

2. The majority of people in this Age do not know how to think through ideas; not only do they lack reasoning skills, they lack basic vocabulary. Many mistake bullying for strength, consuming with expertise, knowing with feeling, and opinion with truth. Indeed, postmodernism is being lived out as post-reason and thuggery.

3. Christianity has been rebranded as anti-intellectual by secular society, which is not surprising because it is lived out in this manner by Christians who reject religion, church history, and even basic theological tenets, which are labeled as extra-biblical. Incredibly, it has just been brought to my attention that 30% of the United States population is too functionally illiterate to hold a job, yet true to the Dunning Kruger effect, people remain trapped in their ignorance without insight.

4. Antisocial behavior has shifted from once acceptable, hatred for people of other cultures, races, and religions to people of different politics, classes, and degrees of separation (people in cars, on tv, on Internet.

These ideas have lead me to recognize the limitations of modern human beings and helped to cultivate more compassion within me, if I can just be patience enough to suspend my disbelief/rejection long enough to recognize God’s love for others.

So, I have found that adjusting expectations for others, suspending my negative response, and focusing on clarifying my beliefs for my own sake rather than over focusing on making myself understood by others has really helped lower my frustration level
 
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marks

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Well, I would have thought this to be a potential solution, but with the persistent types it really isn't. As I was saying, they just take the opportunity of being ignored to gloat that no one can refute their claims.

But I agree it is akin to brainwashing in a way. It's as if the strategy is, "Let me present this teaching just as often as humanly possible, thread after thread, until it becomes a majority opinion."

"Gaslighting" again, very effective.

But . . . at some point we have to give our care over to God.

Much love!
 
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Helen

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I see even you as someone who may have accepted false teaching in the matter that brought this whole discussion up to begin with, so let me ask you: If I were to see you or some other member here that I cared about swallowing rank heresy at some point in the future because of such things, your advice to me is that I should only concern myself with convincing the heretic?

Okay, obviously I didn't read all your posts before saying I was done with this subject. So, sorry..'here I come again.' :)

See Chris.
You obviously feel qualified to tell me that I have -"accepted false teaching."

My encounter re this "false teaching " was back in the 80's WITH GOD.
So, the cry now goes out .."Oh dear, she was listing to demons."

TO YOU, it is false teaching, because YOU do not see it in scripture.

I once sat where you now sit.

It took me ten long years of prayer and waiting on the Lord. I was praying -
"Lord, I can see this in Your Word..is what I am seeing and hearing when I read your word, of You or some false demon?"

TEN YEARS....Then one day , when I was not thinking of anything much at all, I had an open vision. And God unfolded for me His word and the light shined into the darkness that morning.
I cried on my face before the Lord for hours, saying...'But, If I follow You and step over this line, there is no going back for me.' But, I cannot resist the voice of God for long. Life would no be worth living if I did. He 'is' my life.

To my dying breath I will not deny what the Lord showed me about His Father heart and Plan of salvation that day.
As far as I can see , H.Richard does not even go as far as I do! He has seen Grace...so that is what he shares on.

Christendome is full of people who paint a negative harsh judgment picture of God..hell and destruction....and they have no problem in putting it upon other people.
I don't stomp around challenging it...when talking one to one to a person...I just say.."interesting, but have you ever considered... this?"

No, my issue is with people trying to get the mouths of those who have ...stopped.
If 'you' or anyone, can't see the depth of God and all that Jesus did, fine...most can't, or too frightened to get before God and ask Him.....then, if they do...they are then too lazy to wait even a month, let alone years.

Go ahead, you are free to believe that I have accepted 'false teaching'.
But I will say again..I had a Good Teacher.

Instead of judging others to be in error...how about you praying and fasting and getting before the Lord. Ask Him 'what is this all about, have You something more to show me?' Put away your bible that you can only read 'as you have been taught' You have the word and scriptures within you.

Ask Him , and listen openly, if you are not too afraid to do so , incase you too find that you have been only seeing through the gloom, for decades .
No, not many can open their heart and trust God in a realm they are no comfortable with and have closed mind upon.

Ask God for light. He has much more to show you yet my brother.

And if not...just be faithful unto the end....( then you will see clearly :) )

"Fear not little flock, it is The Fathers good pleasure to give you the Kingdom"
 
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Hidden In Him

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See Chris.
You obviously feel qualified to tell me that I have -"accepted false teaching."

No, just a hypothetical.
My encounter re this "false teaching " was back in the 80's WITH GOD.
So, the cry now goes out .."Oh dear, she was listing to demons."

I didn't put it like that, LoL. It was a hypothetical, as in suppose I did see it happening to you. I wanted your opinion on what my response should be.
TEN YEARS....Then one day I had an open vision. And God unfolded for me His word and the light shined into the darkness.
I cried on my face before the Lord for hours, saying...'If I follow You and step over this line, there is no going back for me.'

To my dying breath I will not deny what the Lord showed me about His Father heart and Plan of salvation. As far as I can see , H.Richard does not even go as far as I do. He has seen Grace...so that is what he shares on.

I think if we took a poll, no one on the forum would not "see grace." The only question is what do we see in addition to grace in the scriptures, and I think you take the side that doesn't see anything else but grace. But my post wasn't intended to get off into discussing that here again. It was intended to give you a hypothetical situation and ask what you think your proper course of action would be in such a circumstance.
No, my issue is with people trying to get the mouths of those who have...stopped.

Again, Helen, I keep telling you I don't want his or anyone else's mouth stopped. I want it opened. I want him to provide a defense of what he believes from scripture if he insists on jamming it down everyone's throats with a new thread on it every other day.
Go ahead, you are free to believe that I have accepted false teaching.
But I will say again..I had a Good Teacher.

We haven't even fully discussed what you believe yet, so I wasn't saying I had made any such determination with certainty. I said I suspect you might agree with him, as I recall you saying similar things in the past and you seem very sympathetic to him. But we haven't discussed what you believe in full yet. I was presenting it as a hypothetical because I wanted your response to that specific scenario. And I still do. It goes to point.
Instead of judging others as in error...how about you praying and fasting and getting before the Lord. Put away your bible that you can only read 'as you have been taught' You have the word and scriptures within you.

Yes, praying and fasting. But as I've said, this is an issue that I think may need to be addressed by management... somehow, because if not fasting and prayer is the only thing we would be able to do, and I think management can play a role so it does not have to be the only thing. I know you will say, "that's a different thing," but imagine if you told me that all we can do is fast and pray about THBE, or that demon-possessed guy who kept posting all those videos, or more recently the st3712 guy who basically told everyone he was God and no one could defeat him in a debate. I don't agree that all we can do is fast and pray in those instances and I don't believe it is all we can do here.
Ask Him , and listen openly, if you are not too afraid to do so incase you too find that you have been only seeing through the gloom, for decades .

If I am I wanna know why, LoL, and if I were the type to troll the daylights out of this site, I wouldn't want you all to simply be allowing me to do it. It wouldn't be good for me, and it certainly wouldn't be any good for anyone else.
 
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