Can Only Mods Solve This Problem?

[GodsGrace]

Oh come on Fran..."his name was not mentioned" , but we all knew ..except @marks maybe, who we were talking about and which thread.
I agree...I too can see what he is saying in this threads. And people are free to disagree. Which most do. Some like bbyrd009 over and over and over... lol

Really Helen,,,,I didn't know for about 2 pages, or more. I don't think his name was ever mentioned....Plus I don't go through whole posts like I know you do. They seem to go to fast. I see my alerts and I might see the one before mine or after mine and sometimes I'll make comments.

You're like the mother hen of the group!
You know everything that's going on!
I'll tell you this about me... I have my faults
but I don't lie. There's never a reason to.
Unless you know my address, of course!
LOL

 

[Helen]

@GodsGrace
((( Hugs... )))

 

[Helen]

No, just a hypothetical.


I didn't put it like that, LoL. It was a hypothetical, as in suppose I did see it happening to you. I wanted your opinion on what my response should be.


I think if we took a poll, no one on the forum would not "see grace." The only question is what do we see in addition to grace in the scriptures, and I think you take the side that doesn't see anything else but grace. But my post wasn't intended to get off into discussing that here again. It was intended to give you a hypothetical situation and ask what you think your proper course of action would be in such a circumstance.


Again, Helen, I keep telling you I don't want his or anyone else's mouth stopped. I want it opened. I want him to provide a defense of what he believes from scripture if he insists on jamming it down everyone's throats with a new thread on it every other day.


We haven't even fully discussed what you believe yet, so I wasn't saying I had made any such determination with certainty. I said I suspect you might agree with him, as I recall you saying similar things in the past and you seem very sympathetic to him. But we haven't discussed what you believe in full yet. I was presenting it as a hypothetical because I wanted your response to that specific scenario. And I still do. It goes to point.


Yes, praying and fasting. But as I've said, this is an issue that I think may need to be addressed by management... somehow, because if not fasting and prayer is the only thing we would be able to do, and I think management can play a role so it does not have to be the only thing. I know you will say, "that's a different thing," but imagine if you told me that all we can doing is fast and pray about THBE, or that demon-possessed guy who kept posting all those videos, or more recently the st3712 guy who basically told everyone he was God and no one could defeat him in a debate. I don't agree that all we can do is fast and pray in those instances and I don't believe it is all we can do here.


If I am I wanna know why, LoL, and if I were the type to troll the daylights out of this site, I wouldn't want you all to simply be allowing me to do it. It wouldn't be good for me, and it certainly wouldn't be any good for anyone else.

Good post Chris.

At least we are on level ground.

Question. Did you ever INBOX HR and ask him to share what he believes with you personally and post him your verses.

( Not that I personally would ever play the- "my scripture beats your scripture" any more. Years of doing that for me, only proved to me that cherry picking scripture can prove any 'argument' both ways. One cancels out the other.
That is why, unlike some here, you never see me posting pages of scriptures to "prove something." )


As we know by the open letter from bbyrd009 to HR thread, just to have more digs at a guy and telling them more strongly what you think of him...isn't the same as a PM trying to build bridges and finding out 'where he is coming from.'

This too shall pass...one way or the other.

And we have the wisdom of our friend @aspen here to pour oil on troubled waters. I so appreciate his wisdom. ( when he isn't political that is. )

Bless you Chris.

 

[Hidden In Him]

The question that follows seems to be, should unexamined opinions, backed only with ‘doubling down’ and ad hominem be allowed on this forum.

Close. But more specifically, should they be allowed to do so repeatedly, continually and incessantly (how's that for a synonym barrage, LoL), and with braggadocio, while yet refusing to answer the counter-arguments raised by numerous members at the site.

1. We live in an Age of doubling down, uneducated opinion, and bravado. I do not like it and it appears that you do not like it. It is certainly the bane of every educated person out there, unfortunately it is also reality, whether online, on tv, or in personal contact. Asking for it to be different on Christianityboard is asking too much

Not sure I agree it has to be accepted at a Christian website. For rank sinners who visit, yes. They are not to be held to the standards of Christ. But for those professing His name, it is demonstrating we are no better than the world in our conduct, which is a bad testimony and sets a bad precedent, IMO.

2. The majority of people in this Age do not know how to think through ideas; not only do they lack reasoning skills, they lack basic vocabulary. Many mistake bullying for strength, consuming with expertise, knowing with feeling, and opinion with truth. Indeed, postmodernism is being lived out as post-reason and thuggery.

I agree. But this again supports my point that we as believers should be different.

3. Christianity has been rebranded as anti-intellectual by secular society, which is not surprising because it is lived out in this manner by Christians who reject religion, church history, and even basic theological tenets, which are labeled as extra-biblical.

Yes, but now you're really making my point, LoL.

... and depressing me.

4. Antisocial behavior has shifted from once acceptable, hatred for people of other cultures, races, and religions to people of different politics, classes, and degrees of separation (people in cars, on tv, on Internet.

And thank God Almighty we're not CF, LoL. As I said, I think they're getting better, but I still have nightmares myself.

These ideas have lead me to recognize the limitations of modern human beings and helped to cultivate more compassion within me, if I can just be patience enough to suspend my disbelief/rejection long enough to recognize God’s love for others.

So, I have found that adjusting expectations for others, suspending my negative response, and focusing on clarifying my beliefs for my own sake rather than over focusing on making myself understood by others has really helped lower my frustration level

Yeah, see.. this is just an entirely different perspective from mine. I understand it, but I am just more leadership-oriented if you will. It gets resented in the context of discussing what should go on at a public forum, but what am I to do? I am built this way, and I am only interested in serving my purpose in Him. I think we are all actually responsible for more than simply clarifying our beliefs and focusing on our own conduct before our fellow man, though these are certainly important and the initial steps we should be taking...

Just a different take from mine is all. Nothing wrong with it, but I'm having a tough time getting people to acknowledge that there's nothing wrong with mine either.

 

[Hidden In Him]

Question. Did you ever INBOX HR and ask him to share what he believes with you personally and post him your verses.

No. I'm not really big on private conversations I'm afraid. Just ask Mayflower. She sends me 15 messages a week sometimes and I'm lucky if I can respond to 3-4 of them, and it will be two weeks later at the earliest, LoL. Besides, when it's someone who it appears is already not all that fond of me to begin with, I stand a good chance of them getting even uglier with me in person and out of the public's eye, and that won't help matters at all, LoL.
HaHa!

( Not that I would ever play the- "my scripture beats your scripture" any more. Years of doing that for me, only proved to me that cherry picking scripture can prove any 'argument' both ways. One cancels out the other.

Well, now this is one take on it, but you'll find many don't agree with that. Marks mentioned seeking to arrive at a harmonization of the scriptures, and even those who normally are not one to back down very often (take Enoch, for example) will still nevertheless stop responding if they realize they've been caught in a contradiction.

It takes work - a lot of work often times - but those who trust that the Lord was not contradicting Himself in His word believe that harmony can be arrived at if the scriptures are all interpreted properly.

As we know by the open letter from bbyrd009 to HR posting just to have more digs at a guy and telling them more strongly what you think of him...isn't the same as building bridges and finding out 'where he is coming from.'

Well yes, although I can't respond concerning that thread because I never actually read it. I just know Byrd got set off like fireworks by the time he got to the thread I was involved in.

This too shall pass...one way or the other.

Praise God Almighty, LoL! I'm looking forward to it.

I'm hoping I can get back to my other pursuits soon, as a matter of fact, so here's hoping that word from God gets fulfilled sooner rather than later, LoL.

 

[marks]

Even now, within these past 5 minutes, I read posts from esteemed members smearing those who disagree.

On the one hand, I can't stand the injustice as so many will just accept these words, and the offended party is just smeared.

Do I jump in? What will it matter? This is the culture. Is God OK with that?

Do I grab the dog by the ears?

No good answer. Wait for God.

Much love ~ and I wish it were more contagious!

mark

 

[marks]

You know, @Hidden In Him ,

I read this thread, then I go on to read other threads, then I come back with a fresh appreciation for what you want to accomplish.

Even in the last 30 minutes I've read yet more posts that are so spiteful and vindictive just because someone questions them, it's enough to make me crazy if I let it. No discussion, just tit-for-tat getting uglier and uglier.

Talk about grieving the Holy Spirit. The way we talk to each other!

"Let no corrupt word out of your mouth go forth, but what is good unto the needful building up, that it may give grace to the hearers." ~ Ephesians 4:29

. . . and, vs 30 . . . And grieve not the Holy Spirit . . .

How? Well, speak corrupt words that don't give grace.

Much love!

 

[Hidden In Him]

You know, @Hidden In Him ,

I read this thread, then I go on to read other threads, then I come back with a fresh appreciation for what you want to accomplish.

Even in the last 30 minutes I've read yet more posts that are so spiteful and vindictive just because someone questions them, it's enough to make me crazy if I let it. No discussion, just tit-for-tat getting uglier and uglier.

Talk about grieving the Holy Spirit. The way we talk to each other!

"Let no corrupt word out of your mouth go forth, but what is good unto the needful building up, that it may give grace to the hearers." ~ Ephesians 4:29

. . . and, vs 30 . . . And grieve not the Holy Spirit . . .

How? Well, speak corrupt words that don't give grace.

Much love!

Excellent verses on the subject.

Marks, if it were an easy problem to solve, the church would have fixed it a long time go. Even in church settings where more discipline could be administered when necessary, you had James admitting that "no man can tame the tongue, it is an unruly evil, full of deadly poison." He wasn't referring to individual believers taming their own tongues here since he gave several commands in the letter to do just that. Instead I believe he was saying that even as leaders, no man can bring the tongue under control among congregations. No matter how you try or how many times you preach against its destructiveness, it just keeps dealing out incredible damage.

So to me it's more like, can it be tamed? No. But can it at least be contained? Yes. It seems to me that when it comes to leadership, the tongue is like a snake that has to at least be contained as much as possible, or it will keep filling people with as much venom as it can.

Very tough problem to solve, however.

 

[aspen]

Here is another reason it seems that people come across so rough on message boards - they are not metacognitive; they do not know how to think about their thoughts when they are thinking them. Therefore, they over identify with their thoughts......they are their ideas. Disagreement with their ideas is disagreement with who they are as a person

 

[marks]

Marks, if it were an easy problem to solve, the church would have fixed it a long time go. Even in church settings where more discipline could be administered when necessary, you had James admitting that "no man can tame the tongue, it is an unruly evil, full of deadly poison."

Here is one more . . .

Philippians 3:20-21
"For our conversation is in heaven; from whence also we look for the Saviour, the Lord Jesus Christ: Who shall change our vile body, that it may be fashioned like unto his glorious body, according to the working whereby he is able even to subdue all things unto himself."

That same power with which we will be transformed to have a glorious body like His, that same power is able to bring us to newness of life in the present day.

He is able to subdue even my tongue. Man cannot.

Much love!
Mark

 

[amadeus]

Actually Amadeus, I think there is a fairly simple means to accomplish it. I think people should be required to give an answer to repeated legitimate counter-arguments to their claims instead of completely ignoring those arguments and persisting to post thread after thread repeating the same indefensible arguments over and over again.

I hear you but am not sure we are doing more than spinning our wheels. This is hardly a democracy although the powers that be on the forum may listen I would very surprised if they changed anything as a result.

I remember joining a battle many years ago on a forum to stop the change to more stringent rules and a more precise definition of what a Christian was. I was on the losing side and even though I had been an active member for a couple of years, the new rules reduced me without due process to a second class membership unable to participate in any sub-forums designated as "Christian". This is because I would not and could not agree with their "statement of faith" without question. In the moment of their effective change I was according to the rules no longer a "Christian". It was the beginning of the end for me there.

Is this different because we are the "good" guys?

But... I will say a few things.

Among those who to fail to respond according to your specifications, are there not some who simply don't know enough to do it differently or better? They may simply be living by faith without much in the way of knowledge. They may need to grow in the Lord and don't even know it yet. They may answer briefly, yea, or , nay, because they do not have a deeper scriptural explanation... nevertheless out they must go. Perhaps there are none here like that at the moment, but with such a rule in place perhaps there never would be. We would have closed the door by our pre-judgment. Doesn't that possibility bother you?

There were on the face of it apparently black and white rules from God in the OT, but when David broke them...? Would God let the mods know that a particular new guy coming on the forum is an exception, one like David who needed to receive some mercy in spite of his terrible crime against our rules. Will God say to the mods he is seems to be rule breaker but he is an exception with a message to you from me. Allow him in and allow him to break the rule. I would not expect this of God.

We need to be more than careful about who we weed out with our hard and fast "simple" rules. I would leave it simply in the hands of the moderators especially since we do not the lawful ability to do more than suggest changes. Having worked as a moderator on a Christian forum, I well understand the difficulty to do the right and fair thing for everyone in accord with the established rules without letting my own bias interfere. I could not do it and resigned.

I do understand your point. You want to insist that people who disagree with you do more than say, no, I don't agree. If such a rule were to be implemented for it to have any chance of working it would require closer moderation than we have now. More moderation does not automatically mean a better forum any more than more government makes a better nation.

If not, what they are doing is essentially just trolling, and should be considered as such by management. If they persist in it in total disregard for other members at this website, they should be dealt with in the same way trolls are dealt with.

A forum can have too much or too little moderation. Moderators can do a good job or a poor one in the calls they make. People coming in here members can be innocent, ignorant, hateful, loving, and almost countless other things. Who is able to assure that everyone is fair and everything is always run in accord the stated purposes of the forum owners?

You see answers but isn't it likely they really have been seen before on other forums if not on this one.

"The thing that hath been, it is that which shall be; and that which is done is that which shall be done: and there is no new thing under the sun." Ecc 1:9

Someone is always going to be unhappy about the way things are done unless they are doing it all themselves. Then everyone else would complain about them. Could you be the perfect moderator here implementing all of your suggestions? Don't say yes, because you could not. Neither could I.

If not, we open ourselves to anyone posting absolutely any indefensible thing under the sun they wish to here (including some of the rather crude things @bbyrd009 mentioned in a thread today to illustrate the point), and we place ourselves in the position of being hypocrites if we take actions against them but not against others.

I could agree that things could be better here, but again wishing it were so won't make it so. Good rules and good moderation might make a good forum, but more rules and more moderation implemented with the best of intentions are really unlikely to improve things unless somehow all of the people involved are also improved.

Please respond to me in this discussion. I realize that you and "ByGrace" may take the other side of the fence on the particular doctrinal issue at hand, but I want those who disagree with me responding to what I have to say instead of ignoring me like H. Richard has done repeatedly. This issue concerns me, and before anyone argues that I alone am the only one making a big issue out of this, it's not just me who was upset today. When people repeatedly get ignored, this site is already becoming what we all agree we do NOT want it to become: a click where no responsibility is felt to even give reasoned replies to people who disagree with a particular line of teaching or theology.

While I can certainly understand your feeling when someone refuses to discuss an issue with you, if a rule were implemented in which a person must discuss, I would probably soon be gone this forum myself. For good reason or for bad, God does not twist people's arms to make them do the right thing, and neither should we. I was on another forum where I got after one of the moderators on this very point that you suggest. As it is written there is nothing new under the sun. I was wrong for insisting even though I thought it was important.

It is important for people to seek the Truth which is Jesus, but as we know most people do not.

Blessings in Christ, and you know I mean you no offense, but your responses strike me as if you have not read through my responses in this thread and once again my arguments are not only being dismissed out of hand but I'm not even being responded to.

I admit that probably you did not sway my thinking here from where it was before I posted anything to this thread, but hopefully my above responses make it clear why I believe like I do on this issue. May God richly bless you in your walk with Him my friend.

 

[Hidden In Him]

Here is another reason it seems that people come across so rough on message boards - they are not metacognitive; they do not know how to think about their thoughts when they are thinking them.

Had to look it up, but yes, LoL. I would simply define it more as they are not that adept at critical thinking, something that is not taught in most public education systems today. So they get overwhelmed and then resentful. I think the same problem partially accounts for why there is a tremendous drop out rate at the larger forums, and why such a small percentage of Christians tough it out at forums like this one. It's not easy to begin with on the emotional side. When you add in having to be mentally savvy and think on your feet, it becomes an insurmountable hill to climb for most.

 

[Hidden In Him]

He is able to subdue even my tongue. Man cannot.

Yes. And I am slowly having greater success with it myself by His grace and mercy. But the question is how well is the membership as a whole doing at it, and some are doing better than others. Some are truly admirable, and I look up to them for it. But we are also all built differently, and being in Christ does not change that. So each man has his own burden to bare. That's why it's best not to condemn, but rather just to try and circumvent.

 

[brakelite]

Ok, LoL. I appreciate that. Not sure it addresses the concerns brought up by the OP, but it certainly paints the word "heresy" in a bad light.

You have a good head on your shoulders , Brakelite. Now apply all that to what we do about our present problem, LoL.

I have the same exasperating issue with people who fall short of our expectations in defending their beliefs. I too get a little frustrated that those who disagree with me on certain subjects criticise my belief as 'heresy' but fail to explain precisely where in the scriptures their own belief is to be found. But that frustration and exasperation is my failing, not theirs. I have explained previously how I see my role here. A "brake" light. I I like to think that my posts make people think... That is all. Just like when you see a brake light ahead of you on the motorway. It should motivate you to consider your options. It is the holy Spirit that, is they are willing, will change their mind, or guide them in which direction they ought to take to avoid whatever pitfall, obstacle, a detour necessary to avoid trouble.
Paul's counsel I think applies here. Hold fast to that which is good. This particular forum I think is the only one where moderators haven't banned, excluded me from certain discussions, or deleted posts on account of my being Adventist. I have been semi involved in threads elsewhere where all manner of opinion and nonsense has been permitted to be excused against me and/or my church and beliefs, but forbade me from explaining or expounding on anything to defend them. I think we have all experienced that in one form or another on other forums. The open free manner in which this forum is run, at least to my mind, is to be lauded. Some might say it gives me to much licence to teach heresy... But it also gives everyone else the same freedom to critique those same 'heresies'... If they can.
For the observer, I think we can trust God to lead and guide them in their quest for truth...I think we would take too much upon ourselves if we started going down the road where others have been and gotten stuck on one way systems that lock out dissent and free thinking. Dissent... Debate... Is part and parcel of the Protestant ethic without which we would still be in darkness and subservient to the Masters of the divinity schools and seminaries.

 

[Hidden In Him]

I hear you but am not sure we are doing more than spinning our wheels. This is hardly a democracy although the powers that be on the forum may listen I would very surprised if they changed anything as a result.

I hear you. Worth a shot in my book, though.

I remember joining a battle many years ago on a forum to stop the change to more stringent rules and a more precise definition of what a Christian was. I was on the losing side and even though I had been an active member for a couple of years, the new rules reduced me without due process to a second class membership unable to participate in any sub-forums designated as "Christian". This is because I would not and could not agree with their "statement of faith" without question. In the moment of their effective change I was according to the rules no longer a "Christian". It was the beginning of the end for me there.

Yes. I personally don't see the statement on faith approach and exercising discipline based on it working very well. The statement of faith at CF is partly what got me banned for a month over there, and I got so turned off by what I perceived as superficially judgmental nonsense that I've never recovered from it, and I was once very faithful to them. I see only an augmentation of proper rules of conduct making any sense on this issue, and as I said earlier, I actually LIKE the fact that we have many different doctrinal viewpoints represented here. I think it's extremely healthy that we can have so many represented and yet still dialogue with each other as a family. But strife will tear any community apart eventually, so it needs to be prevented as much as possible.

Among those who to fail to respond according to your specifications, are there not some who simply don't know enough to do it differently or better? They may simply be living by faith without much in the way of knowledge. They may need to grow in the Lord and don't even know it yet. They may answer briefly, yea, or , nay, because they do not have a deeper scriptural explanation... nevertheless out they must go.

No, no. Aspen and I were discussing that. I agree that some, maybe many in fact, may not be that well equipped to debate others on scriptural matters, but here is my response to that: I feel that the job of the educated is to not demean those less equipped so that they are encouraged to improve in their ability to expound on the scriptures well, but they certainly shouldn't just acquiesce to incorrect teaching. If anything, this sets the worst example. It implies that the entire pursuit of the truth is not something they should worry about attaining to. I think the trend towards Biblical illiteracy has been steadily increasing precisely because of that mentality, so I take the approach that you encourage people to excellence by holding them to a higher standard.

It's almost like that thing about giving a trophy to everybody so that we all win. The problem is, we all actually kinda suck, LoL, and in Biblical interpretation that's not something that should be encouraged.

There were on the face of it apparently black and white rules from God in the OT, but when David broke them...? Would God let the mods know that a particular new guy coming on the forum is an exception, one like David who needed to receive some mercy in spite of his terrible crime against our rules.

Now this is a good point, and I concede it. Again, exactly what rules would need to be implemented and how and upon whom all falls in the domain of the moderators, so that would be beyond me to carry out.

I'll respond to the rest in a sec, and thanks for the post.

 

[Hidden In Him]

Having worked as a moderator on a Christian forum, I well understand the difficulty to do the right and fair thing for everyone in accord with the established rules without letting my own bias interfere. I could not do it and resigned.

Not sure I could do it either.

If such a rule were to be implemented for it to have any chance of working it would require closer moderation than we have now.

Well, if rules were in place, members would know that it was permissible to report it without coming off like a crybaby or troublemaker.

A forum can have too much or too little moderation. Moderators can do a good job or a poor one in the calls they make. People coming in here members can be innocent, ignorant, hateful, loving, and almost countless other things. Who is able to assure that everyone is fair and everything is always run in accord the stated purposes of the forum owners?

You see answers but isn't it likely they really have been seen before on other forums if not on this one.

I dunno. I think the moderation is very well done here. Not too much, and maybe just a hair too little. But without any rules change, it would likely stay exactly as is. The moderation is not a problem. I think the rules could be slightly augmented to make the moderation somewhat better, and I actually don't think it would make that much of an increased demand on the staff we currently have now (the primarily one-man staff, LoL).

Good rules and good moderation might make a good forum, but more rules and more moderation implemented with the best of intentions are really unlikely to improve things unless somehow all of the people involved are also improved.

Here we disagree. For one, good people make a good forum, first and foremost. Secondly, good rules maintain a good forum filled with good people from becoming one overrun by bad people. That is my primary concern with this thread, not that HR in particular is "bad," but more that the lack of a policy in place to deal with what I see as a problem could open the door increasingly in the future for the wrong kind of crowd and the wrong kind of behavior. We are already fighting the good fight of faith on a daily basis as it is here.

While I can certainly understand your feeling when someone refuses to discuss an issue with you, if a rule were implemented in which a person must discuss, I would probably soon be gone this forum myself. For good reason or for bad, God does not twist people's arms to make them do the right thing, and neither should we.

Yeah, we're seeing it different here. I'm really only suggesting such measures be taken in more extreme cases, such as the one I was mentioning. Boasting and gloating about how no one can refute your doctrinal stance and then turning around and refusing to even reply to those who raise strong arguments against it is, IMO, akin to trolling, so I would ask you if trolling were likewise something you think should be allowed to go on without correction or forum discipline.

I admit that probably you did not sway my thinking here from where it was before I posted anything to this thread, but hopefully my above responses make it clear why I believe like I do on this issue. May God richly bless you in your walk with Him my friend.

Certainly, and I'm very grateful for the response. I want dialogue on it from all sides because I think it concerns everyone here, and I certainly wouldn't advise that any decisions be made (if any decisions even do get made) without our most prominent members having a say in it.

 

[Truth]

I have come across a new problem this weekend (well, it's new for me anyway); one that appears can only be solved by the moderators, if they so choose to. I formally invite the mods to post on this thread as well.

Here is the dilemma:

Suppose you have a member or members who post threads espousing heresy, but when their arguments are challenged they refuse to address the counter-arguments, and instead use every evasive tactic in the book. But they then turn around and continue to post thread after thread openly claiming that no one can refute their claims. Now many may know who I am referring to specifically here as having inspired me to write this thread, and some may actually side with him doctrinally, and therefore not see what he is teaching as heresy. But for the sake of argument, just suppose we are talking here about someone you DO believe teaches heresy.

See, the situation leaves the forum (and by that I mean any forum) with the following problem, and puts moderators in a difficult position. Members who can pick apart the flaws in their theology nevertheless really can't fix the problem. Such members really have only one of two choices as I see it:

1. Either continue to refute and refute and refute them all day long, every day, as if that has now become their new occupation in life (even though their posts will be almost completely ignored by the offending party), or

I have just found this thread!! And am very tired, so I will just say this one thing. In the OT God gives us a understanding about this very thing, and I believe it is similar to what you are expressing. If there is among you, a brother who tries to lead you into worshiping other deity's,
In other words lead you into false doctrine's, do not listen to them!! And if by all means Ignore them, for they shall reap their own Reward!
There is an old saying, Kill them All, and let God sort them out. Refuse to respond, and they will find another source to spew their stuff!
God has Your Back, The Spirit has Your Heart, and Our Savior has Your Soul, and the Truth will Expose Itself!!

2. Simply allow the person to continue teaching falsehoods unchallenged, day after day. And when you are dealing with someone who boasts openly in every thread that no one can challenge or refute their claims, onlookers who view such threads continually going unchallenged may therefore be inclined to believe they actually are un-refutable.

Because membership can't fix such a problem, it forces moderators to have to make a determination themselves about whether what is taught is heresy or not, since the problem can only be solved by outside intervention from site management.

Any thoughts? I post this out of concern for saving Christian forums in general from being undermined by a rather insidious problem, but especially ours. This is a good community, and it's a problem I'm having a hard time seeing can be solved by the membership alone.

This is not an attack on the offending party in question, nor is it posted out of resentment. I'm simply coming up empty, as it is an especially tough dilemma to figure out a good solution for.

Blessings in Christ, and thanks for considering the issue.
Hidden In Him
________________

Updated: Should anyone be just now finding this thread (as of Monday afternoon at 2:30 PM) and want to reply, please read through things first. Chances are your argument may have already been dealt with in the thread, possibly several times, so out of courtesy please read through things first before responding.

Thanks!
Hidden

 

[Hidden In Him]

Paul's counsel I think applies here. Hold fast to that which is good. This particular forum I think is the only one where moderators haven't banned, excluded me from certain discussions, or deleted posts on account of my being Adventist. I have been semi involved in threads elsewhere where all manner of opinion and nonsense has been permitted to be excused against me and/or my church and beliefs, but forbade me from explaining or expounding on anything to defend them. I think we have all experienced that in one form or another on other forums. The open free manner in which this forum is run, at least to my mind, is to be lauded. Some might say it gives me to much licence to teach heresy... But it also gives everyone else the same freedom to critique those same 'heresies'... If they can.

For the observer, I think we can trust God to lead and guide them in their quest for truth...I think we would take too much upon ourselves if we started going down the road where others have been and gotten stuck on one way systems that lock out dissent and free thinking. Dissent... Debate... Is part and parcel of the Protestant ethic without which we would still be in darkness and subservient to the Masters of the divinity schools and seminaries.

We're fairly close in agreement, as I expected we would be, only you fall on the side of keeping the status quo whereas I am advocating for slight change. Not major change, slight change. You see, the very things that irritate you in having your beliefs labeled heresy without anyone having to provide evidence are the very things I oppose. @Jane_Doe22 was mentioning the same thing. I am fighting against that. It doesn't matter to me that I don't agree with you on things. If I choose to discuss something with you, I respect you enough that I will explain to you WHY I disagree from scripture, and I think others should be held accountable to do so as well, especially if they are being ugly to you. You deserve an explanation, not to be treated like an inferior, and someone who's opinion and thoughts do not matter. It generates strife and division rather than community, and that's what I think we should be striving for here. Unlike other forums, this one has actually resembled that in some ways since the day I joined, and I think it could be improved upon... but not without a few minor changes.

 

[Hidden In Him]

Blessings in Christ, @Truth.
Was there something you wanted to post? All that came through on my end was the quote you provided of the OP.

 

[lforrest]

Hmmm tricky. Any way to limit debate threads to a certain number of pages? This is done with a group on facebook and it works really well.

There is no mechanism I have other than to manually lock threads when they get too big. But then there is the question of when is it large enough? Not every topic is created equal, some warrant more discussion. And it is better to have a single 80 page topic than multiple topics on the same subject when one is locked but someone wants it to continue.

This is from the OP, but I repeat it again later in the thread several times. THIS is the problem I take issue with:

We all have different opinions about what constitutes heresy and what doesn't. I understand that. What I take issue with is people repeatedly and consistently ignoring those who makes counter-arguments against what they teach, and then turn around and create a new thread espousing the EXACT same thing while professing that no one can refute their arguments. It is trolling.

I am against compelled speech, people may choose to respond to whoever they want or ignore what they choose. So long as they respond to some people and are not just dumping on the forums its within the rules. Some extra grace is necessary when dealing with people in unknown situations, there are many members up in years and have other problems. I don't expect people to share their impairments.