Can We as Saved Christians Lose Our Salvation?

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BreadOfLife

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That's because the "Harlot" is pagan ROME'S (Babylon's) harlot.

WHO
persecuting the Early Church?
Rome - aided by the JEWS. What do you think Saul was doing before he became Paul (Acts 8:3)??

The Harlot is "drunk on the blood of God's holy ones" (Rev. 17:6).
They ALSO killed the Prophets killed the prophets - God's "holy ones" (Matt. 23:37, Luke 13:34).

Don't be content to wallow in ignorance.
STUDY the Scriptures, man.
 

BreadOfLife

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Ephesians 2 shows that grace is sovereign.
WHY do you keep cherry-picking instead of reading ALL of Scripture in CONTEXT??

2 chapters later in the SAME Letter - Paul makes the following points:

Eph. 4:1-3
As a prisoner for the Lord, then, I urge you to live a life worthy of the calling you have received. Be completely humble and gentle; be patient, bearing with one another in love. Make every effort to keep the unity of the Spirit through the bond of peace.

these are NOT the words of "automatic" and "Eternal" security.
They are words of admonishment to COOPERATE with God's grace.

Cherry-picking only begets more confusion until you have what we have today:
Tens of thousands
of disjointed and perpetually-splintering Protestant factions who ALL teach different doctrines yet ALL claim that they were "led" by the Holy Spirit.

It's a man-made mess . . .
 

CoreIssue

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That's because the "Harlot" is pagan ROME'S (Babylon's) harlot.

WHO
persecuting the Early Church?
Rome - aided by the JEWS. What do you think Saul was doing before he became Paul (Acts 8:3)??

The Harlot is "drunk on the blood of God's holy ones" (Rev. 17:6).
They ALSO killed the Prophets killed the prophets - God's "holy ones" (Matt. 23:37, Luke 13:34).

Don't be content to wallow in ignorance.
STUDY the Scriptures, man.

Who slaughters Christians, Rome and Catholicism.

Rome has existed from bc times to today.

Roman Catholicism from 325 AD to today.

Israel did not exist from 70 AM to 1948.

Who killed the most saints? Rome and Catholicism. Catholicism being part of Pagan Roman religion.
 

BreadOfLife

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Who slaughters Christians, Rome and Catholicism.
Rome has existed from bc times to today.
Roman Catholicism from 325 AD to today.
Israel did not exist from 70 AM to 1948.
Who killed the most saints? Rome and Catholicism. Catholicism being part of Pagan Roman religion.
This post is fill with so much nonsense, it's difficult to know just where to begin.
Let's start with Israel . . .

JERUSALEM have NEVER ceased to exist. The political entity that is Israel ceased for almost 2000 years - but apostate Jerusalem has been there ALL along.

As to "WHO slaughters" the most Christians - probably the Muslims.
As for who slaughtered the most i history - that's a an even matchup.

History points to about 100,000 in Edwardian and Elizabethan England alone. If you were to actually do your homework for a change instead of leaning on the manure you've been spoonfed your whole life - you would see that there is PLENTY of blood on everybody's hands.

HOWEVER - the Biblical evidence lies with apostate Jerusalem. as the "Hartlot".
 

BreadOfLife

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I didn’t write it God wrote it. Be patient maybe you’ll get your chance to argue it with Him, maybe not?
Like I said - your cherry-picking only causes more Protestant confusion - and more Protestant factionism . . .
 

CoreIssue

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This post is fill with so much nonsense, it's difficult to know just where to begin.
Let's start with Israel . . .

JERUSALEM have NEVER ceased to exist. The political entity that is Israel ceased for almost 2000 years - but apostate Jerusalem has been there ALL along.

As to "WHO slaughters" the most Christians - probably the Muslims.
As for who slaughtered the most i history - that's a an even matchup.

History points to about 100,000 in Edwardian and Elizabethan England alone. If you were to actually do your homework for a change instead of leaning on the manure you've been spoonfed your whole life - you would see that there is PLENTY of blood on everybody's hands.

HOWEVER - the Biblical evidence lies with apostate Jerusalem. as the "Hartlot".

But Islam does not claim to be Christian, therefore cannot be a Christian whore. To be apostate you must first claim to be part of what you're apostate from.

So when did England slaughtered Christians?

The Bible points solidly to Rome.
 
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BreadOfLife

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But Islam does not claim to be Christian, therefore cannot be a Christian whore. To be apostate you must first claim to be part of what you're apostate from.

So when did England slaughtered Christians?

The Bible points solidly to Rome.
Is there something wrong with you?
Do you actually R*E*A*D the posts you're responding to??

I made it CLEAR that Islam is NOT the Harlot.
The Bible points solidly to Pagan Rome (Babylon) and Apostate Jerusalem (The Harlot).

As for England - I guess you never went to school.

Top 10 Heads That Rolled During the Reign of Henry VIII
"During the reign of Henry VIII, between 1509 and 1547, an estimated 57,000 [source: The Tudors] and 72,000 [source: Historic Royal Palaces] English subjects lost their heads. It was a violent time in history, but Henry VIII may have been particularly bloodthirsty, executing tens of thousands during his 36-year reign. By comparison, the daughter who succeeded him on the throne, who came to be called "Bloody Mary," killed fewer than 300 people during her six years as queen."

Funny how the Catholic Queen Mary gets the title of “Bloody” Mary – yet her dad killed 240 times more people than she did – and he gets away scott-free in the annals of skewed Protestant history.

Also – her half sister Elizabeth I is responsible for an additional 45,000 . . .
 

APAK

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@Berean ..

To the next verses on your list - 2 Peter 2:20-21

(2Pe 2:20) For if, after they have escaped the pollutions of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ, they are again entangled in them and overcome, the latter end is worse for them than the beginning.
(2Pe 2:21) For it were better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than after knowing it, to turn back from the holy commandment delivered to them.

You ask, why did Peter write these words? It is obvious that Peter was saying there would be many folks after barely hearing about the gospel and the knowledge of how to be truly righteous through Christ that they would maintain and love their own self-righteousness and remain slaves to the way of the world. False teachers of God would always entice and lure them and ensure their self-righteousness is secure. And there are especially many of both types today; the false teacher and the lukewarm false believer of self-righteousness that God utterly detests.


The parable concerning the seed sown on ground full of weeds or thistles suits these self-righteous folks quite well. They were happy to be overcome and choked out by the ways of the world again. They returned to their old ways as verse 22 describes them as dogs returning back to their own vomit.

(2Pe 2:22) It has happened to them according to the true proverb: A dog returns to his own vomit and a sow, having washed, to her wallowing in the mire.

Peter is saying there are many folks that never truly turn to God and his Son. They would rather just sit on the fence and listen and be comforted by boastful and empty words and worldly ideas from false teachers. They were always destined to go back to the world as their hearts would never completely accept the gospel.

They tasted the wine of salvation and still did not take it to heart. They never would make a commitment in their hearts to say without a doubt they loved or hated the spiritual living water of God. To not just taste it, but to drink it all down with joy. God knew of these rejecting folks already.


(2Pe 2:18) For when they speak great swelling words of emptiness, they allure through the lusts of the flesh, through lewdness, the ones who have actually escaped from those who live in error;

(2Pe 2:19) promising them liberty, while they are in fact slaves to corruption. For of whom a person is overcome, of the same is he also brought into bondage.


Verse 18 speak of these folks as newly escapees from the world. They had just heard the gospel of God with the fresh new knowledge of God. They have just placed one step out of the world. Unfortunately, they never were able to move the other foot off from the world as they loved its chains of bondage too much.

They loved their material things, the lusts and sensations of the body, and the comforts of sinning in the flesh. They ultimately determined that their ways were still righteousness to God as they considered themselves good and decent people as many of them attend and are members of a 'church' today.


There were and are never true believers that truly accepted or accept the good news of God, his Son and salvation. These never acquired or acquire the spirit of truth to gain true righteousness. They loved their own righteousness found in themselves and loved by the world.



Bless you,


APAK
 

Lady Crosstalk

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Romans 8 says it all.

God foreknew who would love him and he predestined them all the way to glorification.

OSAS

To say you lose your salvation says you have to do work. And we are not saved by work.

When we are born again we have new hearts and minds.

To say one can lose their salvation says that those in hell can still be saved.

It puts Christ back on the cross.

It says that if you can gain it then you can lose it then gain it. So you better make sure you don't die you've lost it.

And how can you be unborn again unchanged in mind and spirit. Lose the Holy Spirit.

Yes. There is something like 31 separate things that happen during the new birth. God caused us to be born into our physical bodies and as we respond to Him in repentance and faith, He causes us to be born spiritually from on high. How can we, as feeble human beings undo what God has done? Those who have been born again do not pop into and out of and then into salvation, only to pop out again. Where is the evidence for that? How do we oust the Holy Spirit from ourselves? We can grieve Him with sin but those who truly belong to Christ loathe every bit of sin which we commit. As we mature in Christ, sin becomes not only unappealing but even disgusting. Christians cringe when they consider their former lives--not that God reminds us of it--He has "thrown it into the sea of forgetfulness". But there is a sadness and humility that goes with considering our former lives.
 

Phoneman777

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A concept that is held by many Christian people is that eternal salvation IS ASSURED once we have accepted Christ as our personal Savior and have become a "new creature" in Christ.
But if this were so, that once we have received God's grace, it is impossible to lose it . . . THEN . . .
. . . WHY does Paul say, "I keep under my body, and bring it into subjection: lest
. . . I MYSELF SHOULD BE A CASTAWAY?" 1 Corinthians 9:27
. . . WHY can some RECEIVE "THE GRACE OF GOD IN VAIN?" 2 Corinthians 6:1
. . . WHY must we be "FAITHFUL UNTO DEATH" to receive a "crown of life?" Revelation 2:10
. . . WHY does Peter say, "For if after they have escaped the pollutions of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, they are again entangled therein, and overcome, THE LATTER END IS WORSE WITH THEM THAN THE BEGINNING. For it had been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than, after they have known it, to return from the holy commandment delivered unto them?" 2 Peter 2:20, 21
. . . WHY are we told that only "he that ENDURETH TO THE END shall be saved?" Matthew 10:22.
. . . WHY are we told "For it is IMPOSSIBLE for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, . . . If they shall fall away, to RENEW THEM AGAIN UNTO REPENTANCE?" Hebrews 6:4-6
. . . WHY must we KEEP OURSELVES into the LOVE OF GOD? Jude 21
. . . WHY are RESURRECTED SAINTS the only ones upon whom the "SECOND DEATH hath NO POWER?" Revelation 20:6
. . . WHY are we told "IF WE SIN WILFULLY after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there REMAINETH NO MORE SACRIFICE FOR SINS, He that despised Moses's law died without mercy . . . OF HOW MUCH SORER PUNISHMENT . . . shall he be . . . worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing?" Hebrews 10:26, 28, 29
. . . WHY must we "work out our own salvation with fear and trembling?" Philippians 2:12
. . . WHY are we told "IF WE BE DEAD with him, we shall also live with him: IF WE SUFFER, we shall also reign with him: if we deny him, HE ALSO WILL DENY US?" 2 Timothy 2:11-13
. . . WHY are we told "Know ye not that they which run in a race run all, but one receiveth the prize? SO RUN, THAT YE MAY OBTAIN?" 1 Corinthians 9:24
. . . WHY are we told "add to your faith virtue . . . knowledge . . . temperance . . .
patience . . . godliness . . . brotherly love . . . charity . . . he that lacketh these things is blind, . . . and hath forgotten that he was purged from his old sins . . . give diligence to MAKE YOUR CALLING AND ELECTION SURE, for IF ye do these things ye shall never fall?" 2 Peter 1:5-10

From the above Scriptures it becomes readily apparent that heavenly salvation is dependent on more than JUST BECOMING a true Christian. Faithfulness unto death will be required for all who will obtain the crown of life. Revelation 2:10

As we consider these Scriptures, further questions come to mind:
What is implied by being faithful unto Death? What happens to those who fail?
Will only Christians receive salvation? Will all Christians go to heaven? How
will God's will be done in earth as it is in heaven? Matthew 6:10.
"By their Fruits you shall know them," says our Lord [Matthew 7:18-21]. But fruits aren't grown instantaneously; they neither come in a fit of ecstasy, nor should they come at the moment death
closes our eyes. This process is one which the Apostle Paul terms "being transformed by the
renewing of your mind." [Romans 12:2] These fruits of character can come in only one way -- and that is the way of the cross, the strait and narrow gate, a way of self denial, of daily taking up our crosses, presenting our bodies, "living sacrifices," and being dead "with Him." This class is termed by our Lord as his "little flock," [Luke 12:32] for they are a "peculiar people zealous of good works" [Titus 2:14], to whom the scriptures promise the chief blessings as overcomers [Revelation 3:20].
OSAS comforts those who refuse to make a total surrender to Jesus as both Lord and Savior with the false security that they may by dead faith obtain that which can only be obtained by living faith: eternal life.
 

CoreIssue

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OSAS comforts those who refuse to make a total surrender to Jesus as both Lord and Savior with the false security that they may by dead faith obtain that which can only be obtained by living faith: eternal life.

How do you know who totally surrenders to Christ does not?
 

Phoneman777

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How do you know who totally surrenders to Christ does not?
"Hereby we do know that we know Him IF WE KEEP HIS COMMANDMENTS. He that saith, I know Him, and keepeth not His commandments is a liar andthe truth is not in him."

It is impossible for those who are not totally surrendered to Christ to obey His law (Romans 8:7), therefore if a man willfully breaks and teaches others to break God's law, he's labeled "least" by those in heaven who are witness to his deeds.
 

Lady Crosstalk

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"Hereby we do know that we know Him IF WE KEEP HIS COMMANDMENTS. He that saith, I know Him, and keepeth not His commandments is a liar andthe truth is not in him."

What should keep us humble is knowing that we fall short of the standard that Jesus set before us.

In answer to the question, it seems that, if you can "lose it", you never had it to begin with. The evangelist, Charles Templeton saw many saved through his ministry--yet, he eventually said that he never truly believed. Many suspect he remained that way till he died. I don't know about all of you but I find that desperately sad.
 
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CoreIssue

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"Hereby we do know that we know Him IF WE KEEP HIS COMMANDMENTS. He that saith, I know Him, and keepeth not His commandments is a liar andthe truth is not in him."

It is impossible for those who are not totally surrendered to Christ to obey His law (Romans 8:7), therefore if a man willfully breaks and teaches others to break God's law, he's labeled "least" by those in heaven who are witness to his deeds.

I repeat, how do we know who keeps his commandments.

But be careful here, if you're talking about legalism then nobody who tries to keep the law is saved, legalism is death.

And where in the Bible does it say totally surrendered?

The Bible says everyone falls short.

And which calls? If the Mosaic they
were annulled at the cross.
 

Lady Crosstalk

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I repeat, how do we know who keeps his commandments.

But be careful here, if you're talking about legalism then nobody who tries to keep the law is saved, legalism is death.

And where in the Bible does it say totally surrendered?

The Bible says everyone falls short.

And which calls? If the Mosaic they
were annulled at the cross.

We become victors the moment we realize that we love God more than we love ourselves. I don't know why we always want to concentrate on the "rules" when the Lord of Life bids us welcome to His palace and sets a banquet in front of us. We are citizens of heaven--who would ever want to go back to the prison we were in?
 
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Phoneman777

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What should keep us humble is knowing that we fall short of the standard that Jesus set before us.

In answer to the question, it seems that, if you can lose it, you never had it to begin with. The evangelist, Charles Templeton saw many saved through his ministry--yet, he eventually said that he never truly believed. Many suspect he remained that way till he died. I don't know about all of you but I find that desperately sad.
"If you can lose it, you never had it to begin with" is an oxymoron. The example you give is that of a hypocrite - and does not preclude a saint becoming a sinner.