Co- Redemptrix

[Stranger]

What an asinine argument.

I never claimed that Moses or the others were sinless - only Mary.
She is the ONLY one in Scripture to be described as "Kecharitomene."

Pay attention. You were using Abraham, Moses, and Isaiah, as examples of salvation like unto Mary's. Which is a false comparison because you are saying Mary was sinless. Which is a lie. But you acknowledge that Abaraham, Moses, and Isaiah were sinners...I assume. Who knows what you may believe.

Stranger

 

[Stranger]

Sure, we're talking about Joseph.
Just as Mary gave birth to GOD - Joseph raised God as his son.

Your Nestorian Heresy is an old, defeated position . . .

Pay attention. I didn't say Joseph didn't have a role in raising Jesus. I said Jesus was not adopted. He was born of Mary. Nothing Nestorian here. The heresy is your claim that Mary is sinless and the mother of God.

Stranger

 

[BreadOfLife]

Pay attention. I didn't say Joseph didn't have a role in raising Jesus. I said Jesus was not adopted. He was born of Mary. Nothing Nestorian here. The heresy is your claim that Mary is sinless and the mother of God.

Stranger

Mary IS sinless (Kecharitomene/Luke 1:28) and she IS the Mother of God.
She's not the Mother of the Trinity, my Nestorian friend . . .

 

[BreadOfLife]

Pay attention. You were using Abraham, Moses, and Isaiah, as examples of salvation like unto Mary's. Which is a false comparison because you are saying Mary was sinless. Which is a lie. But you acknowledge that Abaraham, Moses, and Isaiah were sinners...I assume. Who knows what you may believe.

Stranger

No - I only mentioned them because YOU said that Mary could NOT be sinless or saved without Christ.
This is absolutely correct - but she didn't have to wait until until the crucifixion in HER time. It was in GOD's time.

She was KECHARITOMENE . . .

 

[Stranger]

Mary IS sinless (Kecharitomene/Luke 1:28) and she IS the Mother of God.
She's not the Mother of the Trinity, my Nestorian friend . . .

I am neither Nestorian or your friend. Nothing in Scripture declares Mary sinless. You develop a lie with 'kecharitomene' to make it appear so.

Stranger

 

[BreadOfLife]

I am neither Nestorian or your friend. Nothing in Scripture declares Mary sinless. You develop a lie with 'kecharitomene' to make it appear so.

Stranger

The Word of God doesn't lie.
The angel called her "Kecharitomene" because she WAS.

If that bothers you - take it up with God . . .

 

[Stranger]

No - I only mentioned them because YOU said that Mary could NOT be sinless or saved without Christ.
This is absolutely correct - but she didn't have to wait until until the crucifixion in HER time. It was in GOD's time.

She was KECHARITOMENE . . .

Mary couldn't be saved without Christ. Just like Abraham, Moses, and Isaiah. Just like Abraham, Moses, and Isaiah were sinners as Mary was also. In other words, your comparison doesn't work.

Stranger

 

[Stranger]

The Word of God doesn't lie.
The angel called her "Kecharitomene" because she WAS.

If that bothers you - take it up with God . . .

It doesn't bother me that Mary was highly favoured. She was. What bother me is the lie of the Roman church and you that Mary was sinless.

Stranger

 

[pia]

It doesn't bother me that Mary was highly favoured. She was. What bother me is the lie of the Roman church and you that Mary was sinless.

Stranger

Yeah, that would have made her able to open the seals ( in Revelation ) wouldn't it, and as it clearly states no one was found, who was worthy to open them, if Mary had been sinless, she would have been a contender...

 

[Dcopymope]

Yeah, that would have made her able to open the seals ( in Revelation ) wouldn't it, and as it clearly states no one was found, who was worthy to open them, if Mary had been sinless, she would have been a contender...

Excellent point, but good luck with this inconvenient truth ever getting through the thick skull's of BOL and other catholic's here.

 

[pia]

Excellent point, but good luck with this inconvenient truth ever getting through the thick skull's of BOL and other catholic's here.

I gave up on BOL and a couple of others, as I don't want to be a stumbling block to them...All I can do is pray sincerely and in love for them and leave them with the Lord They simply do not understand that they are calling Jesus a liar.

 

[BreadOfLife]

It doesn't bother me that Mary was highly favoured. She was. What bother me is the lie of the Roman church and you that Mary was sinless.

Stranger

Then you believe that Scripture is a lie.

"Perfected" grace is what happens to us when we are perfectly united with God's will in Heaven.
Those of us on earth still stumble and are not perfected, either completely or enduringly like Mary was - which is what Kecharitomene means.

I realize this is like talking to a wall - but it gives me the opportunity to explain this to anybody else who might be reading.

 

[BreadOfLife]

I gave up on BOL and a couple of others, as I don't want to be a stumbling block to them...All I can do is pray sincerely and in love for them and leave them with the Lord They simply do not understand that they are calling Jesus a liar.

Actually - I've never even implied that Jesus is a liar - but thanks for exposing yourself as one who has to lie to get their point across.

It's like a disease with you people . . .

 

[BreadOfLife]

Mary couldn't be saved without Christ. Just like Abraham, Moses, and Isaiah. Just like Abraham, Moses, and Isaiah were sinners as Mary was also. In other words, your comparison doesn't work.

Stranger

And I never said she was saved without Christ, Einstein.
Really - just TRY to be honest in this conversation . . .

 

[mjrhealth]

Mary IS sinless (Kecharitomene/Luke 1:28) and she IS the Mother of God.
She's not the Mother of the Trinity, my Nestorian friend . . .

Sorry Mary is not sinless, she is not Jesus. Only Jesus was born sinless,He is the only one found worthy, not her, but this is what you get from those who need to justify there worship of idols, she can do nothing for anyone,even praying to her is of no use, we have but one mediator that is Christ.

 

[Stranger]

Then you believe that Scripture is a lie.

"Perfected" grace is what happens to us when we are perfectly united with God's will in Heaven.
Those of us on earth still stumble and are not perfected, either completely or enduringly like Mary was - which is what Kecharitomene means.

I realize this is like talking to a wall - but it gives me the opportunity to explain this to anybody else who might be reading.

It' an opportunity to see how you must manipulate Greek words to make them say something they don't.

'Kercharitomene' does not mean sinless. It never will mean it except in your Roman mind.

Stranger

 

[Stranger]

And I never said she was saved without Christ, Einstein.
Really - just TRY to be honest in this conversation . . .

You said she was saved as Abraham, Moses, and Isaiah were. The problem is, you are saying she was saved before she ever fell. The comparison with Moses, Abraham, and Isaiah, doesn't work with your lame argument as you at least recognize they were sinners. See? Try and keep up.

Or, quit trying to avoid your faulty comparison.

Stranger

 

[GodsGrace]

<chuckle> Let's see, how many "God's" are in my "pantheon"?

YHVH: Yes
Jesus: no
Mary: no
Bbyrd: no
Myself: no

Hmmm, seems I have a "pantheon" of one.

You don't believe Jesus is God?
Do you consider yourself a Christian? Looks like you don't.

 

[GodsGrace]

It' an opportunity to see how you must manipulate Greek words to make them say something they don't.

'Kercharitomene' does not mean sinless. It never will mean it except in your Roman mind.

Stranger

What DOES it mean?

 

[Stranger]

What DOES it mean?

It means 'highly favoured' or 'favoured one', 'to cause to find favour', 'to make graceful or gracious'. (Vines Expository Dictionary).

Stranger