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ScottA

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Does all of the truth needs to known in order to be saved or is it rather that the Truth needs to be loved... including any part not yet known correctly or clearly?

When and if one grows in Christ, the Truth [is this Jesus?] loved should be becoming clearer. In order to grow, I believe, one must admit the possibility of error in what he believes at a given moment so as allow the Spirit within to work! ["Quench not the Spirit." I Thess 5:19

"And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved.
And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:" II Thess 2:10-11

The delusions are what one receives when he refuses to admit that something he holds may be mistaken. He blocks God! This is free will at work against God, is it not?

"He must increase, but I must decrease." John 3:30 [increase the new man in me as the old man in me is decreased]

"For now we see through a glass, darkly; but then face to face: now I know in part; but then shall I know even as also I am known." I Cor 13:12

"And Jesus increased in wisdom and stature, and in favour with God and man." Luke 2:52
If we are not similarly increasing, can the following be true about us?

"Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is." I John 3:2
You've got it!

The thing that was to be different during our times, is that those who love God would not continue to reject Him and those whom He sends. "My sheep here My voice" is to be within and written on our hearts. Meanwhile, we also have the dividing of the wheat and tares, and the sheep from the goats, the wise from the foolish, the faithful from the unfaithful. And His spirit is poured out upon all flesh, even the evil, until the end.
 

amigo de christo

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@ScottA
Does all of the truth needs to known in order to be saved or is it rather that the Truth needs to be loved... including any part not yet known correctly or clearly?

When and if one grows in Christ, the Truth [is this Jesus?] loved should be becoming clearer. In order to grow, I believe, one must admit the possibility of error in what he believes at a given moment so as allow the Spirit within to work! ["Quench not the Spirit." I Thess 5:19

"And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved.
And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:" II Thess 2:10-11

The delusions are what one receives when he refuses to admit that something he holds may be mistaken. He blocks God! This is free will at work against God, is it not?

"He must increase, but I must decrease." John 3:30 [increase the new man in me as the old man in me is decreased]

"For now we see through a glass, darkly; but then face to face: now I know in part; but then shall I know even as also I am known." I Cor 13:12

"And Jesus increased in wisdom and stature, and in favour with God and man." Luke 2:52
If we are not similarly increasing, can the following be true about us?

"Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is." I John 3:2
We are never too old to learn or to be reminded . I bet you AGREE big time with that my friend .
So allow this flea of a dog to remind us of something .
YOUR right , ITS ABOUT THE LOVE OF TRUTH .
SEE , even as a babe when i knew little , STILL if one came and preached a false hood i wanted no part of it .
Even though i did not know WHY that was . I DID NOT yet have knowledge i do now , NOR do i have all knowledge even now .
BUT ONE THING I DO KNOW . LAMBS no matter if babes or mature , no matter if they have yet attained understanding
THEY WONT BUY A LIE . Example .
WHEN GOD , BY GRACE and I MEAN BY GRACE for i did NOT DESERVE IT , drew me to CHRIST and put me in the bible
i was hungry for the truth . Now i did begin to visit churches , i even turned on TBN and watched it ,
YET I WAS ALWAYS EMPTY with what they taught , YET ALWAYS FILLED and FULLFILLED In what i read in that bible .
I DID NOT KNOW THEY WERE FALSE . Now after some time and much reading of the bible
by the grace of GOD , by the power of the SPIRIT , I SOON LEARNED WHY that stuff had left me so empty .
IT WAS FALSE . WE MUST FLEE THE UNITY WE ARE ONE CHURCHES . FLEE RICK warren , flee tbn
flee most all churches . AND LEARN that bible . WE NEED TO LET EVERY WORD OF GOD BE TRUE
AND every man a liar . IN OTHER WORDS , TRUST WHAT IS WRITTEN IN THE BIBLE as SOLID TRUTH
and TEST ALL MEN AGAINST those words . LET GOD BE TRUE , EVERY MAN A LIAR . YOU ever wonder why paul wrote that .
I MEAN WE ALL KNOW GOD IS TRUE . SOWHY Did he say LET GOD BE TRUE YET EVERY MAN A LIAR .
We also know not every man is a liar . THE THING IS , WE NEED TO KNOW THAT GOD IS TRUE < HIS WORD IS TRUE
and we need TO NOT TRUST IN MAN but rather TEST EVERY WORD OF MAN and do so against the bible .
 

amigo de christo

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You've got it!

The thing that was to be different during our times, is that those who love God would not continue to reject Him and those whom He sends. "My sheep here My voice" is to be within and written on our hearts. Meanwhile, we also have the dividing of the wheat and tares, and the sheep from the goats, the wise from the foolish, the faithful from the unfaithful. And His spirit is poured out upon all flesh, even the evil, until the end.
WHO changes us . GOD DOES . WHO puts the love for HIM , for truth , for His glorious words in our heart . HE DOES .
Most folks are not born again . I Dont say that to be mean or judgmental . BUT i know what GOD did for me .
I did not change me , i did not put the love for truth in my heart . ONE DAY , GOD JUST drew me to Christ and changed me .
Even as a babe i could not like what i read in rick warrens purpose driven LIE , or life as it is called .
Now some time later i grew in knowledge and knew why that was , THE MAN IS FALSE .
IT was the same way with many , many , many churches i visisted . I loved the praise time
but was always empty and not filled when the pastor would speak and teach . AGAIN , at first i did not know why this was .
YET at the same time when i read the bible i was as joyous as a ten tongued ant eater over a nest of ants .
I mean i was filled , fat and happy when i read that bible . YET TBN could not fullfill me . AGAIN i know NOW WHY that was .
CAUSE THEY FALSE . GOD , HIS LOVE , PUT LOVE FOR HIM UPON OUR HEARTS and that means LOVE FOR THE TRUTH .
WE love the TRUTH HE LOVES we cant stand the evil he hates . Most folks are NOT born again .
THE PROBLEM Is most folks have only the head knowledge , and it aint biblical head knowledge , ITS KNOWLEDGE
of thus sayeth their teacher , denomination or etc . WE are in dire trouble this generation is .............
TIME TO POINT THE FOLKS TO JESUS and if aint the biblical one , WELL its the devil . PEROID . AND I mean PEROID .
 

amigo de christo

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You've got it!

The thing that was to be different during our times, is that those who love God would not continue to reject Him and those whom He sends. "My sheep here My voice" is to be within and written on our hearts. Meanwhile, we also have the dividing of the wheat and tares, and the sheep from the goats, the wise from the foolish, the faithful from the unfaithful. And His spirit is poured out upon all flesh, even the evil, until the end.
Many be called .................But many reject . Few be chosen .
 

Desire Of All Nations

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Jesus did not say that, but said that the Kingdom of God had come. Which is confirmed by the prophecies of His Day and Hour, which had come upon that evil generation fulfilling all things...just as He said.

The mistake of ages, is not to believe it, just as He said it.
The Bible clearly teaches through the imagery of the Dan. 2 statue that the Kingdom of God has not arrived. If it did, there wouldn't be any human led governments since Daniel said that every last trace of human governments will be destroyed when the Kingdom arrives. You would be wise to take the advice you gave at the beginning and allow the Bible to correct you instead of holding onto erroneous beliefs.
 

ScottA

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The Bible clearly teaches through the imagery of the Dan. 2 statue that the Kingdom of God has not arrived. If it did, there wouldn't be any human led governments since Daniel said that every last trace of human governments will be destroyed when the Kingdom arrives. You would be wise to take the advice you gave at the beginning and allow the Bible to correct you instead of holding onto erroneous beliefs.
So your take is Daniel was right, and Jesus and I are erroneous.

Talk about not wise!

See--that is a perfect example of pitting scripture against scripture, and not reconciling them (and accomplishing nothing and remaining in darkness). Which I have reconciled, but apparently you have not.
 
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Robert Gwin

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Jesus did not say that, but said that the Kingdom of God had come. Which is confirmed by the prophecies of His Day and Hour, which had come upon that evil generation fulfilling all things...just as He said.

The mistake of ages, is not to believe it, just as He said it.
May I ask why the world is as it is since the Kingdom is here Scott?
 

ChristisGod

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We are never too old to learn or to be reminded . I bet you AGREE big time with that my friend .
So allow this flea of a dog to remind us of something .
YOUR right , ITS ABOUT THE LOVE OF TRUTH .
SEE , even as a babe when i knew little , STILL if one came and preached a false hood i wanted no part of it .
Even though i did not know WHY that was . I DID NOT yet have knowledge i do now , NOR do i have all knowledge even now .
BUT ONE THING I DO KNOW . LAMBS no matter if babes or mature , no matter if they have yet attained understanding
THEY WONT BUY A LIE . Example .
WHEN GOD , BY GRACE and I MEAN BY GRACE for i did NOT DESERVE IT , drew me to CHRIST and put me in the bible
i was hungry for the truth . Now i did begin to visit churches , i even turned on TBN and watched it ,
YET I WAS ALWAYS EMPTY with what they taught , YET ALWAYS FILLED and FULLFILLED In what i read in that bible .
I DID NOT KNOW THEY WERE FALSE . Now after some time and much reading of the bible
by the grace of GOD , by the power of the SPIRIT , I SOON LEARNED WHY that stuff had left me so empty .
IT WAS FALSE . WE MUST FLEE THE UNITY WE ARE ONE CHURCHES . FLEE RICK warren , flee tbn
flee most all churches . AND LEARN that bible . WE NEED TO LET EVERY WORD OF GOD BE TRUE
AND every man a liar . IN OTHER WORDS , TRUST WHAT IS WRITTEN IN THE BIBLE as SOLID TRUTH
and TEST ALL MEN AGAINST those words . LET GOD BE TRUE , EVERY MAN A LIAR . YOU ever wonder why paul wrote that .
I MEAN WE ALL KNOW GOD IS TRUE . SOWHY Did he say LET GOD BE TRUE YET EVERY MAN A LIAR .
We also know not every man is a liar . THE THING IS , WE NEED TO KNOW THAT GOD IS TRUE < HIS WORD IS TRUE
and we need TO NOT TRUST IN MAN but rather TEST EVERY WORD OF MAN and do so against the bible .
One thing happened to me when I was saved in 1980. I never really liked to read. I was always a good student up until high school where I was no longer interested in the classes and just did enough to get a passing grade and did not like to read.

But when I was saved I could not put the Bible down and felt I never could get enough. From day one I made it a habit to read the first thing in the morning and when I went to bed. That habit never left me and every morning I get up early and read the bible and study. I'm always in a constant state of learning, I'm always first and foremost a student of the Bible. Its the only thing in this life that I'm truly hungry for is to know Christ and learn about Him as His follower/disciple. I'm always wanting more and never satisfied, always hungry to learn. One of the first things I read by AW Tozer in his book the pursuit of God was as the deer pants for the water-brook so to does my soul pant after Thee oh Lord. That passage gripped me early on and it became my passion. God speaks to us through His word and us to Him through prayer. Like any relationship we only get out of it what time we invest into that relationship.
 
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ScottA

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May I ask why the world is as it is since the Kingdom is here Scott?
This too is written:

Luke 21:24
And they will fall by the edge of the sword, and be led away captive into all nations. And Jerusalem will be trampled by Gentiles until the times of the Gentiles are fulfilled.

Romans 11:25
For I do not desire, brethren, that you should be ignorant of this mystery, lest you should be wise in your own opinion, that blindness in part has happened to Israel until the fullness of the Gentiles has come in.
Which is not to say that things are perfect, but that things should remain imperfect until the times of the gentiles are fulfilled--even though the reign of Christ began when He had overcome the world, and “The kingdoms of this world have become the kingdoms of our Lord and of His Christ, and He shall reign forever and ever!”

Which would not seem right, except that He revealed the times to be what they are to Paul, the apostle to the gentiles, saying "My strength is made perfect in weakness" 2 Corinthians 12:9.
 

Robert Gwin

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This too is written:

Luke 21:24
And they will fall by the edge of the sword, and be led away captive into all nations. And Jerusalem will be trampled by Gentiles until the times of the Gentiles are fulfilled.

Romans 11:25
For I do not desire, brethren, that you should be ignorant of this mystery, lest you should be wise in your own opinion, that blindness in part has happened to Israel until the fullness of the Gentiles has come in.
Which is not to say that things are perfect, but that things should remain imperfect until the times of the gentiles are fulfilled--even though the reign of Christ began when He had overcome the world, and “The kingdoms of this world have become the kingdoms of our Lord and of His Christ, and He shall reign forever and ever!”

Which would not seem right, except that He revealed the times to be what they are to Paul, the apostle to the gentiles, saying "My strength is made perfect in weakness" 2 Corinthians 12:9.

The times of the gentiles have ended sir, Jesus is now sitting on God's throne which entered us into the last days. Do you recognize that the appointed times of the nations meant that no King would sit on God's throne until Jesus came? We believe Jesus was enthroned as King in 1914 and the last day period which would not exceed a generation, is just about over Scott. If our calculations are correct, Jesus should be returning very soon.
 

ScottA

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The times of the gentiles have ended sir, Jesus is now sitting on God's throne which entered us into the last days. Do you recognize that the appointed times of the nations meant that no King would sit on God's throne until Jesus came? We believe Jesus was enthroned as King in 1914 and the last day period which would not exceed a generation, is just about over Scott. If our calculations are correct, Jesus should be returning very soon.
Then you all have errored by 1,881 years, for He said, "All authority has been given to Me in heaven and on earth." Matthew 28:18 Past tense.

He has (past tense) become Lord of Lords and King of Kings. He is on the throne of God, and has been since He went to the Father. Which was not the end of the times of the gentiles, but the beginning. Which only came after He had "finished" with the house of Israel, for whom He first came. Then began (past tense) the times and the salvation of the gentiles, which He said, "I must also bring"--which He himself began as the firstfruits of the Spirit, the born again.

As for Jesus' return, if He has come into even one person since that time--He has begun His returned already. For which Paul clarified, does not come as a onetime finale event, but to, "each one in his own order." "Then comes the end." Which, if you can receive it...is no more future than the Lamb slain before the foundation of the world, was past. But rather, the one was before-the-fact, while the other is after-the-fact...all things being "in Christ", "in God", and actually taking place during His hour, aka: "The Day of the Lord", "That Day", "That Time", "That very Hour", "My Hour."
 
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Robert Gwin

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Then you all have errored by 1,881 years, for He said, "All authority has been given to Me in heaven and on earth." Matthew 28:18 Past tense.

He has (past tense) become Lord of Lords and King of Kings. He is on the throne of God, and has been since He went to the Father. Which was not the end of the times of the gentiles, but the beginning. Which only came after He had "finished" with the house of Israel, for whom He first came. Then began (past tense) the times and the salvation of the gentiles, which He said, "I must also bring"--which He himself began as the firstfruits of the Spirit, the born again.

As for Jesus' return, if He has come into even one person since that time--He has begun His returned already. For which Paul clarified, does not come as a onetime finale event, but to, "each one in his own order." "Then comes the end." Which, if you can receive it...is no more future than the Lamb slain before the foundation of the world, was past. But rather, the one was before-the-fact, while the other is after-the-fact...all things being "in Christ", "in God", and actually taking place during His hour, aka: "The Day of the Lord", "That Day", "That Time", "That very Hour", "My Hour."

Yes Scott, he was given authority when he returned to heaven, actually taking the number 2 position just under Jehovah 1 Cor 11:3. But likely you remember he would sit at his Fathers right hand for a period of time, correct? It is difficult to understand, but the prophecy of when he would become King is found in Dan 4. The period of the nations (7X) would be 2520 yrs sir. Zedekiah was the last King to sit on Jehovah's throne, and there would be none until Jesus sit on His throne.
(Ezekiel 21:25-27) . . .your day has come, O fatally wounded, wicked chieftain of Israel, the time of your final punishment. 26 This is what the Sovereign Lord Jehovah says: ‘Remove the turban, and take off the crown. This will not remain the same. Raise up the low one, and bring low the high one. 27 A ruin, a ruin, a ruin I will make it. And it will not belong to anyone until the one who has the legal right comes, and I will give it to him.’

What convinced me that Jesus took the crown in 1914 was the brothers put it in print in 1879 and WW#1 the fulfillment of the first sign Jesus gave happened that yr. We entered into the last day period then sir.
 

ScottA

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Yes Scott, he was given authority when he returned to heaven, actually taking the number 2 position just under Jehovah 1 Cor 11:3. But likely you remember he would sit at his Fathers right hand for a period of time, correct? It is difficult to understand, but the prophecy of when he would become King is found in Dan 4. The period of the nations (7X) would be 2520 yrs sir. Zedekiah was the last King to sit on Jehovah's throne, and there would be none until Jesus sit on His throne.
(Ezekiel 21:25-27) . . .your day has come, O fatally wounded, wicked chieftain of Israel, the time of your final punishment. 26 This is what the Sovereign Lord Jehovah says: ‘Remove the turban, and take off the crown. This will not remain the same. Raise up the low one, and bring low the high one. 27 A ruin, a ruin, a ruin I will make it. And it will not belong to anyone until the one who has the legal right comes, and I will give it to him.’

What convinced me that Jesus took the crown in 1914 was the brothers put it in print in 1879 and WW#1 the fulfillment of the first sign Jesus gave happened that yr. We entered into the last day period then sir.
I appreciate your sincerity, and it is not wrong to be found in the midst of the times having the knowledge that was for that time. But we go unto all truth. This now is that time.

What your explanation shows is that you are stating the chronology as the facts, which they are well enough, but only for a time. What I have been explaining is as it was in the beginning and also is again. But to argue (not that we are arguing) those points of chronology against the summation, is only as effective as one is willing. When I cried out to God, I asked for the summation, and that is what I have been speaking of. It is hard to imagine that most do not actually want to know of it, while seeming to desire it.
 

robert derrick

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Doesn't everyone want to be right about God?.

Although there is reference to Scripture this post, I don't see any warning whatsoever about having newly revealed truth of God's word, needing to be conformed to Scripture.

It is one thing to have revelations as Paul said, and spiritual visions and even personal meetings with the Lord in 3rd heaven, but it is entirely different to be given revealed truth of God's word, doctrine, gospel, and law, that Scripture does not plainly confirm.

But back to Jesus' declaration of how things are to be revealed during the church age: Clearly it is not by flesh and blood, but by the Father, whom is spirit. In other words, the rest of what is to be revealed of all truth is to be revealed spiritually.

Without being bound to all truth written in Scripture, then this statement says that the letters of the book are just those written by men of flesh and blood like us, so that those letters can be added to, without needing to be confirmed as true by them.

That is exactly how people make themselves with truth and authority above what is written in Scripture:

And these things, brethren, I have in a figure transferred to myself and to Apollos for your sakes; that ye might learn in us not to think of men above that which is written, that no one of you be puffed up for one against another.

I don't concede anything as truth of God, that is not proven as such in Scripture.

Doesn't everyone want to be right about God?

No. Many want only to be right about what they think, and others don't care about being right at all.

The real problem is only those saying they want to be right about God, but don't really care about being right with Scripture.

That is that these times have been ordered by Christ to lead us into all truth by the Holy Spirit.

These times are no different than any other times since the resurrection of Jesus Christ. These are still the same old last days, that will continue as before, until He returns.

End times prophecy and declarations of soon coming is usually a racket for 'passionate' local church recruitment, or worse a cult for personal lordship over the sheep.

If we are of His flesh and bones and looking for Him today, then that is al we need to know about the time of His return, including any special 'revelations' about it.

Nonetheless, scary or not--that is the order of the day. Which, no, does not come in the many ways imaginable.

What is scary is thinking we have some newly revealed truth, that no one else on earth knows, but me and God, and even Scripture doesn't know about it.

I never ever want to even think of going there. There's already too many cults on earth.


Well...it doesn't look like one scripture pit against another as if God made a mistake on the other scripture.
The only ones that 'pit' Scripture against itself, are unbelievers finding fault and trying to prove contradiction.

Believers have honest disputes in knowing the truth of all Scriptures, which is what Jesus disputed with them of His day, as well as the apostles being mighty in Scriptures.

Anyone who says they don't 'argue' about Scriptural truth, are those who refuse to be corrected by God, Scripture, or any man on earth.

There are plenty of private interpretations of Scripture, that may or may not be true. We just shouldn't preach them for Scripture, unless what is written plainly says and proves it.


What it does look like then, is that we should expect "knowledge shall increase." EXPECT IT.

If increased knowledge is not confirmed by Scripture, then lying wonders are on the rise.

Increased knowledge of the truth is only by clearer understanding of what Scripture teaches and confirms as true of God and Jesus Christ:

It seemed good to me also, having had perfect understanding of all things from the very first, to write unto thee in order, most excellent Theophilus, That thou mightest know the certainty of those things, wherein thou hast been instructed.

The only revelations of truth that matter, is when God by His Spirit shows the clear sense of what Scripture is showing of itself: Scripture interprets accurately all Scripture.

Because error is a foretold fact by Jesus, as well as both Peter and Paul. So much so, that it is referred to as the believing of a "lie" and "strong delusion." Jesus made a few statements along these lines specifically regarding Israel, telling them things like "You have heard such and such, but I say this." He was addressing hundreds of years of what needed correction. And with the somber predictions of what would occur during our own times--it might even be worse for us.

Dittoes strong delusion: believing a lie about Scripture, that is nowhere written in Scripture, nor written sensibly in that way.

Jesus was correcting the errors of traditions and commandments of men being taught for doctrine of God, and He did so by quoting Scripture with it's right sense:

So they read in the book in the law of God distinctly, and gave the sense, and caused them to understand the reading.

What is rare is someone studying and believing what is true of Scripture, and yet being willing to be corrected by others quoting Scripture that does so.

I have been corrected in several good ways on this sight, not just in knowledge but in daily living with Jesus, such as being rid of the self-justifying tradition that man is made by Christ with a sin 'spirit' of some sort.


So, what, should we just put our blinders on, believe what we have always believed, not heeding the warnings, and continue the same old pitting of one scripture against another, and squabbling? Or should we take a more honest approach and be prepared to concede before we die and get hit with it all at once, in shame?

If this thread is about stopping all the Scripture 'pitting', and just believe whatever someone says is so, because they got it straight from God's mouth, then count me out.

And the whole earth was of one language, and of one speech.

I don't join any more cults. One was enough for me.

Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;

Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.


Sounds to me like Paul is speaking of someone that is getting special revelations of truth not found in Scripture, and then telling everyone else they can stop arguing about Scripture so much, because he has something greater than ever before to proclaim.
 

Taken

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Concede Now, or Concede Later.
OP ^

Oh so true.

* Believe, and HOPE you can endure Believing to the day you die to Receive your gift of Salvation....despite the multiple warnings of powerful evil and powerful wicked influences outnumbering the good upon this earth.

* Believe, and BE ASSURED by receiving your gift of Salvation now, according to the Lords, Order and Way.

* Reject Believing, And subject your soul to WAITING in very unpleasant surroundings, eh, for at least a 1,000 years, BEFORE you will SEE...then oooh, aaah, BELIEVE, bow down in worship to the Lord....then receive bummer judgement.

Glory, Glory, Glory to our great Lord God Almighty,
Taken
 

ScottA

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Although there is reference to Scripture this post, I don't see any warning whatsoever about having newly revealed truth of God's word, needing to be conformed to Scripture.

It is one thing to have revelations as Paul said, and spiritual visions and even personal meetings with the Lord in 3rd heaven, but it is entirely different to be given revealed truth of God's word, doctrine, gospel, and law, that Scripture does not plainly confirm.



Without being bound to all truth written in Scripture, then this statement says that the letters of the book are just those written by men of flesh and blood like us, so that those letters can be added to, without needing to be confirmed as true by them.

That is exactly how people make themselves with truth and authority above what is written in Scripture:

And these things, brethren, I have in a figure transferred to myself and to Apollos for your sakes; that ye might learn in us not to think of men above that which is written, that no one of you be puffed up for one against another.

I don't concede anything as truth of God, that is not proven as such in Scripture.



No. Many want only to be right about what they think, and others don't care about being right at all.

The real problem is only those saying they want to be right about God, but don't really care about being right with Scripture.



These times are no different than any other times since the resurrection of Jesus Christ. These are still the same old last days, that will continue as before, until He returns.

End times prophecy and declarations of soon coming is usually a racket for 'passionate' local church recruitment, or worse a cult for personal lordship over the sheep.

If we are of His flesh and bones and looking for Him today, then that is al we need to know about the time of His return, including any special 'revelations' about it.



What is scary is thinking we have some newly revealed truth, that no one else on earth knows, but me and God, and even Scripture doesn't know about it.

I never ever want to even think of going there. There's already too many cults on earth.



The only ones that 'pit' Scripture against itself, are unbelievers finding fault and trying to prove contradiction.

Believers have honest disputes in knowing the truth of all Scriptures, which is what Jesus disputed with them of His day, as well as the apostles being mighty in Scriptures.

Anyone who says they don't 'argue' about Scriptural truth, are those who refuse to be corrected by God, Scripture, or any man on earth.

There are plenty of private interpretations of Scripture, that may or may not be true. We just shouldn't preach them for Scripture, unless what is written plainly says and proves it.




If increased knowledge is not confirmed by Scripture, then lying wonders are on the rise.

Increased knowledge of the truth is only by clearer understanding of what Scripture teaches and confirms as true of God and Jesus Christ:

It seemed good to me also, having had perfect understanding of all things from the very first, to write unto thee in order, most excellent Theophilus, That thou mightest know the certainty of those things, wherein thou hast been instructed.

The only revelations of truth that matter, is when God by His Spirit shows the clear sense of what Scripture is showing of itself: Scripture interprets accurately all Scripture.



Dittoes strong delusion: believing a lie about Scripture, that is nowhere written in Scripture, nor written sensibly in that way.

Jesus was correcting the errors of traditions and commandments of men being taught for doctrine of God, and He did so by quoting Scripture with it's right sense:

So they read in the book in the law of God distinctly, and gave the sense, and caused them to understand the reading.

What is rare is someone studying and believing what is true of Scripture, and yet being willing to be corrected by others quoting Scripture that does so.

I have been corrected in several good ways on this sight, not just in knowledge but in daily living with Jesus, such as being rid of the self-justifying tradition that man is made by Christ with a sin 'spirit' of some sort.




If this thread is about stopping all the Scripture 'pitting', and just believe whatever someone says is so, because they got it straight from God's mouth, then count me out.

And the whole earth was of one language, and of one speech.

I don't join any more cults. One was enough for me.

Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;

Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.


Sounds to me like Paul is speaking of someone that is getting special revelations of truth not found in Scripture, and then telling everyone else they can stop arguing about Scripture so much, because he has something greater than ever before to proclaim.
Well, you've done a fine job of summing up the fears of those whose do not have spiritual discernment, as well as restating the position of the Pharisees who believed in the scriptures but didn't know His voice. Terrific.
 
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robert derrick

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Well, you've done a fine job of summing up the fears of those whose do not have spiritual discernment, as well as restating the position of the Pharisees who believed in the scriptures but couldn't hear His voice. Terrific.
And so then it is confirmed brothers and sisters: when given opportunity to correct a possible oversight, that all voices must be judged by Scripture, it is rejected and called Pharisitical to be bound by letters of a book, and will not hear the voice of God upon high.

Needing to confirm revelation of truth from God by written Scripture, is not necessary with some. And it's not just revelations and visions and dreams etc... but revelation of the truth of God's word and doctrine and gospel, that the flesh and blood prophets and apostles were never given to write.

Be warned brothers and sisters: The true God and Jesus Christ does not speak His gospel truth to any man on earth, that which cannot be confirmed by Scripture already written.

It is being declared here that those who refuse to receive spiritual revelation from God as being true, whether in prophecy or doctrine, except it be confirmed by Scripture, are spiritual cowards: if we are not willing to add God's voice to Scripture, whether agreeing with Scripture or not, then we are judged as beggarly and weak and even dead by letter of script written on paper only.

Brothers and sisters be warned: It is one thing to hear the voice of the Lord and Jesus speaking personally within us daily, to comfort, guide, instruct in righteousness, and give power to stand by His faith, but it is entirely devilishly different to think to rise up in our own vain imagination and hear any voice in heaven as gospel of truth, where also is the prince and power of the air, and take no care to judge it by what is written in Scripture on earth.

Also be warned: any man that preaches no dissent, but only agreement, and accuses honest dispute in Scripture to be 'pitting' Scripture against one another, is someone that only wants their special revelations to be recieved and believed by others, without any regard to Scripture of truth.

They want the way cleared for them to speak from the heavenly mount, without contradiction of others.

Beware of them that teach to receive any other gospel of truth, than that which is already written, because such men think to rise above the Scriptures written by men, so as to have revealed to them in higher places a last times new revelation of full truth.

For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places.

That is an open door to Rev 13:

And I stood upon the sand of the sea, and saw a beast rise up out of the sea, having seven heads and ten horns, and upon his horns ten crowns, and upon his heads the name of blasphemy.

Now, if anyone wants to correct their error, and state plainly that no gospel truth can be revealed by Jesus Christ, that is not already written, then by all means do so.

I marvel that ye are so soon removed from him that called you into the grace of Christ unto another gospel: Which is not another; but there be some that trouble you, and would pervert the gospel of Christ.

But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed.


The book of Mormon revealed by an angel to a man, that contradicts openly the gospel and doctrine of Christ in Scripture, as for a subtitle on it's cover: Another Testament of Jesus Christ.

If I am doing anything terrific here, it is exposing what is being attempted here: a new revelation gospel of truth to be revealed in due time, and any argument against it with Scripture is unedifying and cowardly, because that is not a good way to receive new truth from on high, while also thinking to judge it by a bunch of dead old letters from past men of flesh and blood.

Perhaps that revelation goes something like this:

Them truly born of God and risen from the dead in Christ Jesus, are already resurrected into heavenly places, as well as have recieved their immortal spiritual bodies: they have arrived, where no manner of sinning with flesh on earth can possibly touch their eternally saved souls and spiritual bodies in heaven.

They are not only seated in the heavenlies, they are flying around with the angels, and talking to one of them.

Does anyone else denounce this resurrection is past already doctrine? Or even correct it? It's certainly not my teaching, but I heard it from another.

Brothers and sisters, do not trust the voice of another John the Revelator.

Unless of course Revelation is being quoted as written, and only as written. Then it's the same old good John of ages past still writing to us today with ink and paper: Scripture of truth.
 

ScottA

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And so then it is confirmed brothers and sisters: when given opportunity to correct a possible oversight, that all voices must be judged by Scripture, it is rejected and called Pharisitical to be bound by letters of a book, and will not hear the voice of God upon high.

Needing to confirm revelation of truth from God by written Scripture, is not necessary with some. And it's not just revelations and visions and dreams etc... but revelation of the truth of God's word and doctrine and gospel, that the flesh and blood prophets and apostles were never given to write.

Be warned brothers and sisters: The true God and Jesus Christ does not speak His gospel truth to any man on earth, that which cannot be confirmed by Scripture already written.

It is being declared here that those who refuse to receive spiritual revelation from God as being true, whether in prophecy or doctrine, except it be confirmed by Scripture, are spiritual cowards: if we are not willing to add God's voice to Scripture, whether agreeing with Scripture or not, then we are judged as beggarly and weak and even dead by letter of script written on paper only.

Brothers and sisters be warned: It is one thing to hear the voice of the Lord and Jesus speaking personally within us daily, to comfort, guide, instruct in righteousness, and give power to stand by His faith, but it is entirely devilishly different to think to rise up in our own vain imagination and hear any voice in heaven as gospel of truth, where also is the prince and power of the air, and take no care to judge it by what is written in Scripture on earth.

Also be warned: any man that preaches no dissent, but only agreement, and accuses honest dispute in Scripture to be 'pitting' Scripture against one another, is someone that only wants their special revelations to be recieved and believed by others, without any regard to Scripture of truth.

They want the way cleared for them to speak from the heavenly mount, without contradiction of others.

Beware of them that teach to receive any other gospel of truth, than that which is already written, because such men think to rise above the Scriptures written by men, so as to have revealed to them in higher places a last times new revelation of full truth.

For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places.

That is an open door to Rev 13:

And I stood upon the sand of the sea, and saw a beast rise up out of the sea, having seven heads and ten horns, and upon his horns ten crowns, and upon his heads the name of blasphemy.

Now, if anyone wants to correct their error, and state plainly that no gospel truth can be revealed by Jesus Christ, that is not already written, then by all means do so.

I marvel that ye are so soon removed from him that called you into the grace of Christ unto another gospel: Which is not another; but there be some that trouble you, and would pervert the gospel of Christ.

But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed.


The book of Mormon revealed by an angel to a man, that contradicts openly the gospel and doctrine of Christ in Scripture, as for a subtitle on it's cover: Another Testament of Jesus Christ.

If I am doing anything terrific here, it is exposing what is being attempted here: a new revelation gospel of truth to be revealed in due time, and any argument against it with Scripture is unedifying and cowardly, because that is not a good way to receive new truth from on high, while also thinking to judge it by a bunch of dead old letters from past men of flesh and blood.

Perhaps that revelation goes something like this:

Them truly born of God and risen from the dead in Christ Jesus, are already resurrected into heavenly places, as well as have recieved their immortal spiritual bodies: they have arrived, where no manner of sinning with flesh on earth can possibly touch their eternally saved souls and spiritual bodies in heaven.

They are not only seated in the heavenlies, they are flying around with the angels, and talking to one of them.

Does anyone else denounce this resurrection is past already doctrine? Or even correct it? It's certainly not my teaching, but I heard it from another.

Brothers and sisters, do not trust the voice of another John the Revelator.

Unless of course Revelation is being quoted as written, and only as written. Then it's the same old good John of ages past still writing to us today with ink and paper: Scripture of truth.
My comment was not only according to the scriptures, but also confirmed according to biblical history.

You are showing a double standard, not adhering to the very thing you stated. Such a practice shows a lack of credibility.
 

keithr

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Any new revelation/teaching has to be confirmed by the written Scriptures, otherwise it should not be fully believed.

Acts 17:10-11 (WEB):
(10) The brothers immediately sent Paul and Silas away by night to Beroea. When they arrived, they went into the Jewish synagogue.
(11) Now these were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, examining the Scriptures daily to see whether these things were so.
(12) Many of them therefore believed; also of the prominent Greek women, and not a few men.
2 Timothy 3:16 (WEB):
(16) Every Scripture is God-breathed and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, and for instruction in righteousness,
 

Robert Gwin

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I appreciate your sincerity, and it is not wrong to be found in the midst of the times having the knowledge that was for that time. But we go unto all truth. This now is that time.

What your explanation shows is that you are stating the chronology as the facts, which they are well enough, but only for a time. What I have been explaining is as it was in the beginning and also is again. But to argue (not that we are arguing) those points of chronology against the summation, is only as effective as one is willing. When I cried out to God, I asked for the summation, and that is what I have been speaking of. It is hard to imagine that most do not actually want to know of it, while seeming to desire it.

Yes Scott, I relate to your summation, but moreso on the Bible's message, most seem to want it, yet choose to reject it, makes no sense to me, so obviously 2 Cor 4:4 comes into fulfillment here.
 
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