Do we sow Peace?

[Mayflower]

I guess Jesus didn't follow His own preaching. (Matt. 10:34) "Think not that I am come to send peace on earth; I came not to send peace, but a sword. For I am come to set a man at variance against his father, and the daughter against her mother, and the daughter in law against her mother in law. And a man's foes shall be they of his own household."

Now what?

Stranger

Peacemaker and peacekeeper are two different things.

 

[Mayflower]

Of course we are not to sow evil work. But neither are we seeking to bring about any world peace. You understand that satan is quite busy wanting to accomplish that. Why do you think the antichrist will force a mark upon people. To make clear the division.

And, like it or not, as a Bible believing Christian, you will be seen as evil, and doing evil work.

Jesus Christ is what is offensive about us. He divides.

Our message, the Gospel, brings peace with God to the individual, yet at the same time it divides.

Stranger

We are not to be yoked together with unbelievers. The wheat will be separated from the tares.

 

[Enoch111]

I guess Jesus didn't follow His own preaching. (Matt. 10:34) "Think not that I am come to send peace on earth; I came not to send peace, but a sword. For I am come to set a man at variance against his father, and the daughter against her mother, and the daughter in law against her mother in law. And a man's foes shall be they of his own household."

This is where context is critical.

The significance of the above statement is that the minute people believe on the Lord Jesus Christ they enter into a battle and spiritual warfare. This is most clearly seen where the majority of the population and the family are say Muslims or Hindus, and a person comes to Christ and is baptized as a believer. The unsaved family may be willing to murder this person because they have left the traditional religion. And many have been killed for their faith.

The same was frequently true among the Jews, where Christians were hated and even murdered for their faith. Saul the persecutor of Christians is a prime example.

At the same time Jesus also said this:Blessed are the peacemakers: for they shall be called the children of God.(Mt 5:9). This is the equivalent of pouring oil on troubled waters. When a Christian see a situation where there is animosity and bitterness between individuals, he or she can make an effort to help resolve the issue and thus bring about peace between enemies.

On the other had the so-called UN peace keepers are a total joke. They have always failed to keep the peace, and they have actually contributed to the problem. A good example is what happened in the Balkans and Rwanda some years ago: U.N.peacekeeping failures in the 1990s were partially responsible for the murder or massacre of nearly 1 million innocent civilians and citizen soldiers (trying to protect their communities) in Rwanda, Bosnia, and other places.
http://www.idppcenter.com/UN_Peacekeeping_Failures.pdf

 

[Stranger]

I’m not sure if you remember when I first came here to the board.
A Poem

Maybe you think I’m just a softy and want to talk about loving my enemies for the euphoria. That is not it. I don’t want to love those that harm me or my family. It is not an euphoric feeling at all, not when you lay awake at night and your body jerks with the need to get up and do something...to force your will and to make them pay so you will feel satisfied.

The poem. Maybe I’ve slipped from there but that is not how I see it anymore. Someone did pay. The Son. I have questions that may never be answered. I’d ask them here on the board but they are countless and I already ask enough questions.

I remember. I don't remember all our conversations but I remember when you came here.

That God is love is true. And will always be true. And yes, Jesus Christ has paid for all sin. But that doesn't mean there are no enemies of God and Christ. And God shall destroy His enemies.

I am unsure why you call (Is. 63:1-6) a 'poem'? Do you consider it just a poem? It isn't. It is a prophecy depicting the Second Coming of Christ when He destroys all those who have opposed Him and His Kingdom. The blood He is covered in this time is not His own. It is those of His enemies.
Nothing wrong with questions. Just don't let your questions create a doubt about God. When you say you have slipped from there, what do you mean?

Stranger

 

[Stranger]

Peacemaker and peacekeeper are two different things.

Good point.

Stranger

 

[Stranger]

We are not to be yoked together with unbelievers. The wheat will be separated from the tares.

Yes, unity under God. But then that divides us from all others.

Stranger

 

[Stranger]

This is where context is critical.

The significance of the above statement is that the minute people believe on the Lord Jesus Christ they enter into a battle and spiritual warfare. This is most clearly seen where the majority of the population and the family are say Muslims or Hindus, and a person comes to Christ and is baptized as a believer. The unsaved family may be willing to murder this person because they have left the traditional religion. And many have been killed for their faith.

The same was frequently true among the Jews, where Christians were hated and even murdered for their faith. Saul the persecutor of Christians is a prime example.

At the same time Jesus also said this:Blessed are the peacemakers: for they shall be called the children of God.(Mt 5:9). This is the equivalent of pouring oil on troubled waters. When a Christian see a situation where there is animosity and bitterness between individuals, he or she can make an effort to help resolve the issue and thus bring about peace between enemies.

On the other had the so-called UN peace keepers are a total joke. They have always failed to keep the peace, and they have actually contributed to the problem. A good example is what happened in the Balkans and Rwanda some years ago: U.N.peacekeeping failures in the 1990s were partially responsible for the murder or massacre of nearly 1 million innocent civilians and citizen soldiers (trying to protect their communities) in Rwanda, Bosnia, and other places.
http://www.idppcenter.com/UN_Peacekeeping_Failures.pdf

Yes, the very thing that should bring and does bring peace, Jesus Christ, is the very thing that divides.

Also, I believe the 'Sermon on the Mount', (Matt. 5-7), pertains to the Kingdom rule which is yet future. I don't see it as law or instruction for the Church to live by. We can draw application from it, but it speaks to a time when satan is no longer on the earth, Jesus Christ is ruling and reigning in Jerusalem, and righteousness is the overall condition of the world, forced by Christ when He has to.

Stranger

 

[VictoryinJesus]

I remember. I don't remember all our conversations but I remember when you came here.

That God is love is true. And will always be true. And yes, Jesus Christ has paid for all sin. But that doesn't mean there are no enemies of God and Christ. And God shall destroy His enemies.

I am unsure why you call (Is. 63:1-6) a 'poem'? Do you consider it just a poem? It isn't. It is a prophecy depicting the Second Coming of Christ when He destroys all those who have opposed Him and His Kingdom. The blood He is covered in this time is not His own. It is those of His enemies.
Nothing wrong with questions. Just don't let your questions create a doubt about God. When you say you have slipped from there, what do you mean?

Stranger

Sorry. I didn’t know how to link to an old thread. The thread was titled: a poem. I was trying to link to OP not (Isaiah 63:1-6) or calling it “a poem”...it just took it there for some reason. The point was I also could not wait for God to come slaughter His enemies. The point was when I came here I had it all neatly down what I believed: rapture, seven year tribulation, and the slaughter of all the enemies. After reading His word, that has changed.

The church (the body) inherits(gains) one of its greatest enemies. Acts 26:14-15 And when we were all fallen to the earth, I heard a voice speaking unto me, and saying in the Hebrew tongue, Saul, Saul, why persecutest thou me? it is hard for thee to kick against the pricks. [15] And I said, Who art thou, Lord? And he said, I am Jesus whom thou persecutest.

 

[farouk]

We are not to be yoked together with unbelievers. The wheat will be separated from the tares.

John's First Epistle, with its themes - among others - of walking in the light and the contrast between light and darkness - bears this out.

 

[VictoryinJesus]

John's First Epistle, with its themes - among others - of walking in the light and the contrast between light and darkness - bears this out.

Yes but there is also: Luke 1:79
[79] To give light to them that sit in darkness and in the shadow of death, to guide our feet into the way of peace.
Which connects to: Isaiah 52:7 “How beautiful upon the mountains are the feet of him that bringeth good tidings, that publisheth peace; that bringeth good tidings of good, that publisheth salvation; that saith unto Zion, Thy God reigneth!

Are we not to follow the Head in likeness? To be a doer of the word, not just a talker? To give light to them that sit in darkness.

2 Corinthians 4:6-10
[6] For God, who commanded the light to shine out of darkness, hath shined in our hearts, to give the light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Jesus Christ. [7] But we have this treasure in earthen vessels, that the excellency of the power may be of God, and not of us. [8] We are troubled on every side, yet not distressed; we are perplexed, but not in despair; [9] Persecuted, but not forsaken; cast down, but not destroyed; [10] Always bearing about in the body the dying of the Lord Jesus, that the life also of Jesus might be made manifest in our body.

He shined into the darkness for us.

To give as we have received, are we not to? Our God is an all-consuming Fire that consumes the darkness with light. We (His Spirit) are to be that light that shines to those that sit in darkness. We attribute ‘to consume’ by nature as how man ‘consumes’ and ‘devours’ another. But what if God’s consume is to invite, to take in, to fully devour one with the Holy presence of God unto darkness is consumed by light? Matthew 5:43-48
[43] Ye have heard that it hath been said, Thou shalt love thy neighbour, and hate thine enemy. [44] But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you; [45] That ye may be the children of your Father which is in heaven: for he maketh his sun to rise on the evil and on the good, and sendeth rain on the just and on the unjust. [46] For if ye love them which love you, what reward have ye? do not even the publicans the same? [47] And if ye salute your brethren only, what do ye more than others ? do not even the publicans so? [48] Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.

There are two messeges running along side each other. That of the flesh. And that of The Spirit. Flesh is used to bring about division. That is who we say we are. But they are weapons of destruction for our benefit that flesh will be destroyed and brought low and we will be saved by the renewing of Spirit of God...brought to life.
In a great house there are vessels of honour and vessels of dishonor...which do we want to be? Those vessels that bring dishonor and shame to our Father or those vessels of 2 Timothy 2:20-21 Purged by the blood of the Son and “prepared unto every good work” before the foundation of the earth IN HIM.? “But in a great house there are not only vessels of gold and of silver, but also of wood and of earth; and some to honour, and some to dishonour. [21] If a man therefore purge himself from these, he shall be a vessel unto honour, sanctified, and meet for the master's use, and prepared unto every good work.”

 

[Waiting on him]

Yes but there is also: Luke 1:79
[79] To give light to them that sit in darkness and in the shadow of death, to guide our feet into the way of peace.
Which connects to: Isaiah 52:7 “How beautiful upon the mountains are the feet of him that bringeth good tidings, that publisheth peace; that bringeth good tidings of good, that publisheth salvation; that saith unto Zion, Thy God reigneth!

Are we not to follow the Head in likeness? To be a doer of the word, not just a talker? To give light to them that sit in darkness.

2 Corinthians 4:6-10
[6] For God, who commanded the light to shine out of darkness, hath shined in our hearts, to give the light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Jesus Christ. [7] But we have this treasure in earthen vessels, that the excellency of the power may be of God, and not of us. [8] We are troubled on every side, yet not distressed; we are perplexed, but not in despair; [9] Persecuted, but not forsaken; cast down, but not destroyed; [10] Always bearing about in the body the dying of the Lord Jesus, that the life also of Jesus might be made manifest in our body.

He shined into the darkness for us.

To give as we have received, are we not to? Our God is an all-consuming Fire that consumes the darkness with light. We (His Spirit) are to be that light that shines to those that sit in darkness. We attribute ‘to consume’ by nature as how man ‘consumes’ and ‘devours’ another. But what if God’s consume is to invite, to take in, to fully devour one with the Holy presence of God unto darkness is consumed by light? Matthew 5:43-48
[43] Ye have heard that it hath been said, Thou shalt love thy neighbour, and hate thine enemy. [44] But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you; [45] That ye may be the children of your Father which is in heaven: for he maketh his sun to rise on the evil and on the good, and sendeth rain on the just and on the unjust. [46] For if ye love them which love you, what reward have ye? do not even the publicans the same? [47] And if ye salute your brethren only, what do ye more than others ? do not even the publicans so? [48] Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.

There are two messeges running along side each other. That of the flesh. And that of The Spirit. Flesh is used to bring about division. That is who we say we are. But they are weapons of destruction for our benefit that flesh will be destroyed and brought low and we will be saved by the renewing of Spirit of God...brought to life.
In a great house there are vessels of honour and vessels of dishonor...which do we want to be? Those vessels that bring dishonor and shame to our Father or those vessels of 2 Timothy 2:20-21 Purged by the blood of the Son and “prepared unto every good work” before the foundation of the earth IN HIM.? “But in a great house there are not only vessels of gold and of silver, but also of wood and of earth; and some to honour, and some to dishonour. [21] If a man therefore purge himself from these, he shall be a vessel unto honour, sanctified, and meet for the master's use, and prepared unto every good work.”

Well served, bare the image of Christ. The apostles did it and invited us as well!

 

[Stranger]

Sorry. I didn’t know how to link to an old thread. The thread was titled: a poem. I was trying to link to OP not (Isaiah 63:1-6) or calling it “a poem”...it just took it there for some reason. The point was I also could not wait for God to come slaughter His enemies. The point was when I came here I had it all neatly down what I believed: rapture, seven year tribulation, and the slaughter of all the enemies. After reading His word, that has changed.

The church (the body) inherits(gains) one of its greatest enemies. Acts 26:14-15 And when we were all fallen to the earth, I heard a voice speaking unto me, and saying in the Hebrew tongue, Saul, Saul, why persecutest thou me? it is hard for thee to kick against the pricks. [15] And I said, Who art thou, Lord? And he said, I am Jesus whom thou persecutest.

That is sad indeed.

Concerning (Acts 26:14-15) you make a considerable jump. How did it change your views you described in the first paragraph?

Stranger

 

[VictoryinJesus]

That is sad indeed.

Concerning (Acts 26:14-15) you make a considerable jump. How did it change your views you described in the first paragraph?

Stranger

Not Acts 26:14-15 alone but the totality of the word. But one has to mediate on the obvious that instead of destroying Saul whom issued the orders of Stephen’s stoning...God destroyed Saul in another way ...by inviting Saul who becomes Paul. God destroyed any enemy of the body by putting the gospel of peace and restoration in his mouth. Galatians 1:23-24 But they had heard only, That he which persecuted us in times past now preacheth the faith which once he destroyed. [24] And they glorified God in me.

Do we have enemies of flesh? Or do they now serve us, the Spirit? Since all things work for the good of those that are called according to His good will? He will rule them with an rod of iron: and break and dash them to pieces. Do you say this is future tense? (IMO) the breaking and dashing to pieces is now...and it is for the good of those that love Him.

 

[Stranger]

Not Acts 26:14-15 alone but the totality of the word. But one has to mediate on the obvious that instead of destroying Saul whom issued the orders of Stephen’s stoning...God destroyed Saul in another way ...by inviting Saul who becomes Paul. God destroyed any enemy of the body by putting the gospel of peace and restoration in his mouth. Galatians 1:23-24 But they had heard only, That he which persecuted us in times past now preacheth the faith which once he destroyed. [24] And they glorified God in me.

Do we have enemies of flesh? Or do they now serve us, the Spirit? Since all things work for the good of those that are called according to His good will? He will rule them with an rod of iron: and break and dash them to pieces. Do you say this is future tense? (IMO) the breaking and dashing to pieces is now...and it is for the good of those that love Him.

Concerning Saul whose name was later changed to Paul, yes, God did a magnificent work. Just as God does with you and I who were once enemies of the Gospel. But how does that translate into God having no enemies that He will destroy later? How does that mean that all enemies of God will be saved? And if they are not saved...are they not still enemies?

Yes, all things work together for the good for them who are called. Who are His people. Not for those who are not. Those in (Is. 63:1-6) are not believers. Yes it is a future judgement upon the enemies of God. And yes, of course, it is for the good of those who are His people. Just like the destruction of the world by the flood in Noah's day was for the good of Noah and his family.

Stranger

 

[Waiting on him]

1 Corinthians 4:10-16 KJV
[10] We are fools for Christ's sake, but ye are wise in Christ; we are weak, but ye are strong; ye are honourable, but we are despised. [11] Even unto this present hour we both hunger, and thirst, and are naked, and are buffeted, and have no certain dwellingplace; [12] And labour, working with our own hands: being reviled, we bless; being persecuted, we suffer it: [13] Being defamed, we intreat: we are made as the filth of the world, and are the offscouring of all things unto this day. [14] I write not these things to shame you, but as my beloved sons I warn you . [15] For though ye have ten thousand instructors in Christ, yet have ye not many fathers: for in Christ Jesus I have begotten you through the gospel. [16] Wherefore I beseech you, be ye followers of me.

Tecarta Bible PremiumThey are suffering the same thugs Jesus did!!!!

Be ye followers of me?

 

[VictoryinJesus]

Concerning Saul whose name was later changed to Paul, yes, God did a magnificent work. Just as God does with you and I who were once enemies of the Gospel. But how does that translate into God having no enemies that He will destroy later? How does that mean that all enemies of God will be saved? And if they are not saved...are they not still enemies?

Yes, all things work together for the good for them who are called. Who are His people. Not for those who are not. Those in (Is. 63:1-6) are not believers. Yes it is a future judgement upon the enemies of God. And yes, of course, it is for the good of those who are His people. Just like the destruction of the world by the flood in Noah's day was for the good of Noah and his family.

Stranger

When Stranger? When is He is going to rule them with a rod of iron and break and dash them to pieces? If He is going to slaughter them all til the blood comes to the horses bridle. If He is going to destroy them all with the brightness of His coming. 2 Thessalonians 2:8 And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming:

Jeremiah 23:29-30
[29] Is not my word like as a fire? saith the Lord ; and like a hammer that breaketh the rock in pieces? [30] Therefore, behold, I am against the prophets, saith the Lord , that steal my words every one from his neighbour.

“Love your neighbour as you love yourself.”

Revelation 19:13-15
[13] And he was clothed with a vesture dipped in blood: and his name is called The Word of God. [14] And the armies which were in heaven followed him upon white horses, clothed in fine linen, white and clean. [15] And out of his mouth goeth a sharp sword, that with it he should smite the nations: and he shall rule them with a rod of iron: and he treadeth the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God.

When is He going to rule them with a rod of iron? What flesh will make it through the brightness of His coming? When will He rule them and break and dash them that are His enemies? Is this the future you see in restoration?

I asked you if we have any enemies of the flesh since the flesh now serves us (Spirit) in all things working together for our good and His will? Romans 8:31 What shall we then say to these things? If God be for us, who can be against us?

Psalm 137:7-9
[7] Remember, O Lord , the children of Edom in the day of Jerusalem; who said, Rase it , rase it, even to the foundation thereof. [8] O daughter of Babylon, who art to be destroyed; happy shall he be , that rewardeth thee as thou hast served us. [9] Happy shall he be , that taketh and dasheth thy little ones against the stones.

What stones?

 

[Waiting on him]

When Stranger? When is He is going to rule them with a rod of iron and break and dash them to pieces? If He is going to slaughter them all til the blood comes to the horses bridle. If He is going to destroy them all with the brightness of His coming. 2 Thessalonians 2:8 And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming:

Jeremiah 23:29-30
[29] Is not my word like as a fire? saith the Lord ; and like a hammer that breaketh the rock in pieces? [30] Therefore, behold, I am against the prophets, saith the Lord , that steal my words every one from his neighbour.

“Love your neighbour as you love yourself.”

Revelation 19:13-15
[13] And he was clothed with a vesture dipped in blood: and his name is called The Word of God. [14] And the armies which were in heaven followed him upon white horses, clothed in fine linen, white and clean. [15] And out of his mouth goeth a sharp sword, that with it he should smite the nations: and he shall rule them with a rod of iron: and he treadeth the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God.

When is He going to rule them with a rod of iron? What flesh will make it through the brightness of His coming? When will He rule them and break and dash them that are His enemies? Is this the future you see in restoration?

I asked you if we have any enemies of the flesh since the flesh now serves us (Spirit) in all things working together for our good and His will? Romans 8:31 What shall we then say to these things? If God be for us, who can be against us?

Psalm 137:7-9
[7] Remember, O Lord , the children of Edom in the day of Jerusalem; who said, Rase it , rase it, even to the foundation thereof. [8] O daughter of Babylon, who art to be destroyed; happy shall he be , that rewardeth thee as thou hast served us. [9] Happy shall he be , that taketh and dasheth thy little ones against the stones.

What stones?

Paul had no enemies, just like Christ

 

[Stranger]

When Stranger? When is He is going to rule them with a rod of iron and break and dash them to pieces? If He is going to slaughter them all til the blood comes to the horses bridle. If He is going to destroy them all with the brightness of His coming. 2 Thessalonians 2:8 And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming:

Jeremiah 23:29-30
[29] Is not my word like as a fire? saith the Lord ; and like a hammer that breaketh the rock in pieces? [30] Therefore, behold, I am against the prophets, saith the Lord , that steal my words every one from his neighbour.

“Love your neighbour as you love yourself.”

Revelation 19:13-15
[13] And he was clothed with a vesture dipped in blood: and his name is called The Word of God. [14] And the armies which were in heaven followed him upon white horses, clothed in fine linen, white and clean. [15] And out of his mouth goeth a sharp sword, that with it he should smite the nations: and he shall rule them with a rod of iron: and he treadeth the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God.

When is He going to rule them with a rod of iron? What flesh will make it through the brightness of His coming? When will He rule them and break and dash them that are His enemies? Is this the future you see in restoration?

I asked you if we have any enemies of the flesh since the flesh now serves us (Spirit) in all things working together for our good and His will? Romans 8:31 What shall we then say to these things? If God be for us, who can be against us?

Psalm 137:7-9
[7] Remember, O Lord , the children of Edom in the day of Jerusalem; who said, Rase it , rase it, even to the foundation thereof. [8] O daughter of Babylon, who art to be destroyed; happy shall he be , that rewardeth thee as thou hast served us. [9] Happy shall he be , that taketh and dasheth thy little ones against the stones.

What stones?

When? At the Second Coming. Jesus is going to rule with a rod of iron during the Millennium which will begin after He destroy's His enemies.

Yes, these things are future.

Where do you get this connection with 'the flesh' and what Christ will do in the Second Coming? I do not see your method of interpreting.

Stranger

 

[VictoryinJesus]

When? At the Second Coming. Jesus is going to rule with a rod of iron during the Millennium which will begin after He destroy's His enemies.

Yes, these things are future.

Where do you get this connection with 'the flesh' and what Christ will do in the Second Coming? I do not see your method of interpreting.

Stranger

Proverbs 23:13
[13] Withhold not correction from the child: for if thou beatest him with the rod, he shall not die.

 

[101G]

Addressing the OP only. it depends which field you are sowing in.
1 Corinthians 9:22 "To the weak became I as weak, that I might gain the weak: I am made all things to all men, that I might by all means save some.

1 Corinthians 9:23 "And this I do for the gospel's sake, that I might be partaker thereof with you".


2 Timothy 4:2 "Preach the word; be instant in season, out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort with all longsuffering and doctrine.

2 Timothy 4:3 "For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears;