Does "LAW" matter?

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Willie T

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GINOLJC,
Romans 7:12 "Wherefore the law is holy, and the commandment holy, and just, and good.
(I hope that answered your question),

BUT,

Romans 7:13 "Was then that which is good made death unto me? God forbid. But sin, that it might appear sin, working death in me by that which is good; that sin by the commandment might become exceeding sinful.

Romans 7:14 "For we know that the law is spiritual: but I am carnal, sold under sin.

Romans 7:15 "For that which I do I allow not: for what I would, that do I not; but what I hate, that do I.

Romans 7:16 "If then I do that which I would not, I consent unto the law that it is good.

Romans 7:17 "Now then it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.

Romans 7:18 "For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh,) dwelleth no good thing: for to will is present with me; but how to perform that which is good I find not.


PCY
So, since the laws are good, but we fail at keeping them, are we to, as Josho's article seems to suggest, dismiss them and just ignore the fact that they were once given as a way to live? Is that the way we are to consider them?
 
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101G

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So, since the laws are good, but we fail at keeping them, are we to, as Josho's article seems to suggest, dismiss them and just ignore the fact that they were once given as a way to live? Is that the way we are to consider them?
YES, if you're in Christ JESUS, for the scripture states the law is not made for the righteous in Christ Jesus. it was "ADDED" until the seed come. since now that seed is come, no Law, for it's for sinners. I hope you're in Christ Jesus.

PCY
 
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Willie T

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Wow! That's a bit frightening. Especially when there is now (as you seem to believe) no law against something like Homosexuality. After all, both that and even Pedophilia are based in a professed love. (The sole criteria of social interaction, as I hear it often being stated here.)
 
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bbyrd009

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Wow! That's a bit frightening. Especially when there is now (as you seem to believe) no law against something like Homosexuality. After all, both that and even Pedophilia are based in a professed love. (The sole criteria of social interaction, as I hear it often being stated here.)
the part that always seems to get dropped there is that you should not be worried about keeping the law because you serve even higher laws, and would not think of deliberately breaking a written law.
Doesn't mean they don't apply to you, but that you have even more stringent personal codes, that make those moot
 

bbyrd009

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YES, if you're in Christ JESUS, for the scripture states the law is not made for the righteous in Christ Jesus. it was "ADDED" until the seed come. since now that seed is come, no Law, for it's for sinners. I hope you're in Christ Jesus.

PCY
and Paul's discourse on the subject? How do you treat that?
 
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Willie T

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the part that always seems to get dropped there is that you should not be worried about keeping the law because you serve even higher laws, and would not think of deliberately breaking a written law.
Doesn't mean they don't apply to you, but that you have even more stringent personal codes, that make those moot
I have never said, and never will say, keeping any laws is a "requirement" for anything, as is usually thrown back at me whenever "law" is mentioned, nor that we should be worried about it. I am saying that the law was designed to provide a much better and smoother life for us than most of the mess we have decided is so much better.
 
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Willie T

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And, although we like to claim this is an isolated group and none of the rest of us push any kind of agenda... the Westboro Baptists will swear they are jeering and shaming families of soldiers at their funerals out of pure "love" for those bereaved family members.
 
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Josho

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Wow! That's a bit frightening. Especially when there is now (as you seem to believe) no law against something like Homosexuality. After all, both that and even Pedophilia are based in a professed love. (The sole criteria of social interaction, as I hear it often being stated here.)

They are both acts of wickedness against Jesus's 2 commandments of Love, if you love the Lord and love thy neighbour, you would do neither of them, for both will drag you to hell, there's no such thing as a homosexual Christian for where is the repentance? And the same goes for pedophiles, they both burn in hell if they don't repent and change their ways. Both reject the true Love of Christ, and both are dark deadly sins and acts of wickedness. So no the New Covenant is not a license to sin either, but it's righteousness through Christ, by following Christ, by repentance of our sins, by the Cross, by the blood of Jesus, by the grace, love and forgiveness of Jesus.
 
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bbyrd009

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I have never said, and never will say, keeping any laws is a "requirement" for anything, as is usually thrown back at me whenever "law" is mentioned, nor that we should be worried about it. I am saying that the law was designed to provide a much better and smoother life for us than most of the mess we have decided is so much better.
i don't think any 2 of us even have the same definition for law anymore; that thing Scripture calls holy
And, although we like to claim this is an isolated group and none of the rest of us push any kind of agenda... the Westboro Baptists will swear they are jeering and shaming families of soldiers at their funerals out of pure "love" for those bereaved family members.

upload_2018-4-28_8-7-48.jpeg
 
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Willie T

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They are both acts of wickedness against Jesus's 2 commandments of Love, if you love the Lord and love thy neighbour, you would do neither of them, for both will drag you to hell, there's no such thing as a homosexual Christian for where is the repentance? And the same goes for pedophiles, they both burn in hell if they don't repent and change their ways. Both reject the true Love of Christ, and both are dark deadly sins and acts of wickedness. So no the New Covenant is not a license to sin either, but it's righteousness through Christ, by following Christ, by repentance of our sins, by the Cross, by the blood of Jesus, by the grace, love and forgiveness of Jesus.

This is where, sadly, we go wrong in much of this. Pedophilia being a different subject, altogether, that few who do not labor in the psychiatric field really don't comprehend, I will address Homosexuality only.

I think we all know Gay couples who are genuinely in love with one another. We can mock it all we want, but I can name two couples, right off the top of my head, that are more lovingly involved than many straight couples. And, to them, that is very definitely the clear definition of "love."

So. By dismissing and discarding the only place we have anything authoritatively written down in black and white about prohibiting Homosexual interaction, GOD'S LAW, we really leave not only that kind of relationship wide open and approved, but even child-focused love and all the way to the extent of Bestiality. Everything is fair game, and wide open for engaging in, if there is no word that we accept from the creator of us all saying anything different.
 
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tabletalk

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See, where you might have looked at a day's living as, "Did I break any laws?", I never did. I was taught that there were no laws to break since Jesus' sacrifice covered the penalty for all of them.

The older man that I am now sees things differently. I ask, today, "Is there anything more that I can learn to do more acceptably?"

I like what David said in how he delighted in God's law. "Oh, how I love your teachings! They are in my thoughts all day long." (Ps 119:97)


From John Calvin's Institutes of the Christian Religion:

"To sum up, the (Mosaic) law is an exhortation to believers. This is not something to bind their consciences with a curse, but to shake off their sluggishness, by repeatedly urging them, and to pinch them awake to their imperfection."

Paul also said in Romans 7: 25…"So then, with the mind I myself serve the law of God, but with the flesh the law of sin."
 

mjrhealth

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Wow! That's a bit frightening. Especially when there is now (as you seem to believe) no law against something like Homosexuality. After all, both that and even Pedophilia are based in a professed love. (The sole criteria of social interaction, as I hear it often being stated here.)

And JEsus said,

Joh 8:15 Ye judge after the flesh; I judge no man.
Joh 8:16 And yet if I judge, my judgment is true: for I am not alone, but I and the Father that sent me.

When men can see inside teh hearts and minds of men, when they can look inside teh physical body and determine why they are the way they are, than you may have the right to judge a man., Far to many "perfect" christians in this world who dont understand what "fallen nature" means. and one day, when they stand before teh Lord and ask, "what are all these people doing there, why are they not entering in,? His only reply could ever be, "because you wont let them, you have determined them to be guilty by your own understanding and there fore judged them", shall i not than judge you as you have judged them?? are you not guilty of sin as they are???

I leave that to you.
 

Willie T

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And JEsus said,

Joh 8:15 Ye judge after the flesh; I judge no man.
Joh 8:16 And yet if I judge, my judgment is true: for I am not alone, but I and the Father that sent me.

When men can see inside teh hearts and minds of men, when they can look inside teh physical body and determine why they are the way they are, than you may have the right to judge a man., Far to many "perfect" christians in this world who dont understand what "fallen nature" means. and one day, when they stand before teh Lord and ask, "what are all these people doing there, why are they not entering in,? His only reply could ever be, "because you wont let them, you have determined them to be guilty by your own understanding and there fore judged them", shall i not than judge you as you have judged them?? are you not guilty of sin as they are???

I leave that to you.
I was asking about the law as each of us sees it governing all our lives collectively. Are you suggesting using it to, instead, only judge others, and not apply it universally?
 
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mjrhealth

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the law applies to us in this regard,

Joh 13:34 A new commandment I give unto you, That ye love one another; as I have loved you, that ye also love one another.
Joh 13:35 By this shall all men know that ye are my disciples, if ye have love one to another.

if we do this we do well, and this is hard enough to do, and cant be done without Christ. No man can keep the law it is foolishness to try. And teh law is a good thing, it did what God set it out to do, it Crucified Christ, so that by His resurrection we could be redeemed back to God, without the law written in stone it would never have being possible. Now we are free in Christ, no longer can teh law or sin separate us from God, that is what unbelief does., and it does it well. Is why it says,

Rom 8:1 There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.
Rom 8:2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.
Rom 8:3 For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh:
Rom 8:4 That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.

It is finished, it was done before it started,

Rev_13:8 And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.

God had teh end in site before teh beginning had even begun.
 

Willie T

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the law applies to us in this regard,

Joh 13:34 A new commandment I give unto you, That ye love one another; as I have loved you, that ye also love one another.
Joh 13:35 By this shall all men know that ye are my disciples, if ye have love one to another.

if we do this we do well, and this is hard enough to do, and cant be done without Christ. No man can keep the law it is foolishness to try. And teh law is a good thing, it did what God set it out to do, it Crucified Christ, so that by His resurrection we could be redeemed back to God, without the law written in stone it would never have being possible. Now we are free in Christ, no longer can teh law or sin separate us from God, that is what unbelief does., and it does it well. Is why it says,

Rom 8:1 There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.
Rom 8:2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.
Rom 8:3 For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh:
Rom 8:4 That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.

It is finished, it was done before it started,

Rev_13:8 And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.

God had teh end in site before teh beginning had even begun.
A lot of words. So, I will ask again, "Does 'Law' matter?"
 

bbyrd009

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I have never said, and never will say, keeping any laws is a "requirement" for anything
ah, then i will, along with Paul.
Keeping the law is the minimum requirement, and being "over the Law" means that those laws do not apply to us bc we are supposed to have even more stringent personal codes, not less stringent. The law is not sufficient

Or does anyone here think that it is ok to sin (break the law) so that Grace may abound the more? May it never be!

Scripture tells us plainly, in many ways, to run from anyone teaching that ignoring the law is ok.
Not one jot or tittle will pass from the Law until all is fulfilled, and
So if you ignore the least commandment and teach others to do the same, you will be called the least in the Kingdom of Heaven.
But anyone who obeys God's laws and teaches them will be called great in the Kingdom of Heaven.

how much plainer anyone need it to be here lol. yikes.
 

mjrhealth

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Does 'Law' matter
Depends, are you a murderer, than yes it does. Are you in Christ, ? than no it does not, God is Love, Jesus is Love, everything they do is because of Love, we are called to walk in love, this bit

Joh 13:34 A new commandment I give unto you, That ye love one another; as I have loved you, that ye also love one another.
Joh 13:35 By this shall all men know that ye are my disciples, if ye have love one to another.

and

Mat 22:37 Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
Mat 22:38 This is the first and great commandment.
Mat 22:39 And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
Mat 22:40 On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.

It is enough

1Ti 1:9 Knowing this, that the law is not made for a righteous man, but for the lawless and disobedient, for the ungodly and for sinners, for unholy and profane, for murderers of fathers and murderers of mothers, for manslayers,

and as you can see, the law has never stopped anyone from murdering anybody, just brought in the condemnation, to slay men as it did Christ, for our sake.
 
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bbyrd009

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Are you in Christ, ? than no it does not, God is Love, Jesus is Love, everything they do is because of Love, we are called to walk in love
neat, so then all you gotta do is say "i'm in Christ, and i love love" and the law no longer applies to you then right
20160524lr-12-620x428.jpg
 

amadeus

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the part that always seems to get dropped there is that you should not be worried about keeping the law because you serve even higher laws, and would not think of deliberately breaking a written law.
Doesn't mean they don't apply to you, but that you have even more stringent personal codes, that make those moot
But so many presume on it all being done leaving us with effectively nothing to do to be with God always. What I see on the other hand is that Jesus opened the Way [highway of holiness] and the means to travel along that Way has also been provided. Rejection of the necessity for us to do anything else will still, as I see it, leave us dead in our sins, no matter what words we may spoken regarding belief in Him with good intentions.
 
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