Get In A Bible Preaching Church!

[Nancy]

Maybe you... or me… or any of us. Who decided WE are the ones to tell others we are the "righteous" ones, and have some sort of right to "put them out?"?

Hi Willie,
Would you allow openly "practicing sinners", who claim the Name of Christ, into your gatherings/fellowship?

 

[Willie T]

Hi Willie,
Would you allow openly "practicing sinners", who claim the Name of Christ, into your gatherings/fellowship?

Of course. That's not to say that they wouldn't soon get awfully tired of hearing how they SHOULD be living. After all, if we had a crystal ball we just might be surprised at the "practicing" going on right in our own midst by some of the most respected "saints" sitting in our pews next to us.

 

[Nancy]

Of course. That's not to say that they wouldn't soon get awfully tired of hearing how they SHOULD be living. After all, if we had a crystal ball we just might be surprised at the "practicing" going on right in our own midst by some of the most respected "saints" sitting in our pews next to us.

Hmm. Interesting.
What if an unmarried couple who were living together were part of your regular gathering. Would breaking bread in Christ's name, in communion with them not mean you condone their living in sin?

 

[Rita]

Hi Willie,
Would you allow openly "practicing sinners", who claim the Name of Christ, into your gatherings/fellowship?

That is such an interesting question to ponder Nancy, I realise it was addressed to Willie- the thing is, what about the hypocrites , the proud, the unjust- how many sit in congregations claiming ‘ the name of Christ ‘ and yet, no one would put them in the same group as ‘ practicing sinners ‘ because their sins are hidden from view most of the time. I don’t think there would be anyone left in church if we could see into the hearts of everyone there..........
Rita

 

[Nancy]

That is such an interesting question to ponder Nancy, I realise it was addressed to Willie- the thing is, what about the hypocrites , the proud, the unjust- how many sit in congregations claiming ‘ the name of Christ ‘ and yet, no one would put them in the same group as ‘ practicing sinners ‘ because their sins are hidden from view most of the time. I don’t think there would be anyone left in church if we could see into the hearts of everyone there..........
Rita

Oh, I so agree Rita. The church will have left the building, lol. Now, if I rephrased that and said...instead of an unmarried couple living together how about, a gay couple? Would they be just as welcome, I wonder?? Not at all that I condone either one of these things. But then I think of verses like : "But now I am writing to you that you must not associate with anyone who claims to be a brother or sister but is sexually immoral or greedy, an idolater or slanderer, a drunkard or swindler. Do not even eat with such people." 1 Corinthians 5:11 and wonder how far removed it is from there.
And, for sure...many, many "hidden" hypocrites within the body, and from my experience it comes mostly from the "hierarchy".
xo

 

[Willie T]

Hmm. Interesting.
What if an unmarried couple who were living together were part of your regular gathering. Would breaking bread in Christ's name, in communion with them not mean you condone their living in sin?

It's a quandary. Would "kicking them out" bring them any closer to God?

I think you know as well as I do that there are probably few churches of any size (and sometimes even small ones) where some of the younger people are not sleeping around. And sometimes we almost have to be blind to claim we aren't aware of it. I know that if a homosexual couple comes...… we have to know they aren't just "friends". Do we shut the door in their faces?

 

[mjrhealth]

Hmm. Interesting.
What if an unmarried couple who were living together were part of your regular gathering. Would breaking bread in Christ's name, in communion with them not mean you condone their living in sin?

That depends on ones understanding of "marriage".

Mat 19:5 And said, For this cause shall a man leave father and mother, and shall cleave to his wife: and they twain shall be one flesh?
Mat 19:6 Wherefore they are no more twain, but one flesh. What therefore God hath joined together, let not man put asunder.

A wedding certificate is the worldy part need for tax and other purposes. Loo kat us, as "Christians", we have already received His "seed". the Holy Spirit, yet we have not yet had the wedding ceremony, does that make us all sinners, He says we are not...

 

[Nancy]

It's a quandary. Would "kicking them out" bring them any closer to God.

I think you know as well as I do that there are probably few churches of any size (and sometimes even small ones) where some of the younger people are not sleeping around. And sometimes we almost have to be blind to claim we aren't aware of it. I know that if a homosexual couple comes...… we have to know they aren't just "friends". Do we shut the door in their faces?

No, we don't shut the door in their faces. We give them the Gospel
...

 

[Pearl]

A friend whose ministry takes them among people who believe it is ok to have more than one wife was made to think about what the church's response should be if they got saved. Should they be asked to discard more than one wife as well the children from those relationships. Perhaps we should be asking that question, 'What would Jesus do? In regard to the illustrations in previous posts. In my church two people who had been having an affair were asked to leave. She was a widow and he was a prominent member of the church whose ministry it was to pastor a small group - I think he was called a deacon. Anyway his comforting of the widow after her husband was murdered went much further than it should have so they were told to leave.

 

[Nancy]

A friend whose ministry takes them among people who believe it is ok to have more than one wife was made to think about what the church's response should be if they got saved. Should they be asked to discard more than one wife as well the children from those relationships. Perhaps we should be asking that question, 'What would Jesus do? In regard to the illustrations in previous posts. In my church two people who had been having an affair were asked to leave. She was a widow and he was a prominent member of the church whose ministry it was to pastor a small group - I think he was called a deacon. Anyway his comforting of the widow after her husband was murdered went much further than it should have so they were told to leave.

Hi Pat,
I wonder, was the deacon married? divorced?

 

[Willie T]

I think there is a lot of studying we need to do about letting the tares grow with the wheat. The line we draw about where our right is to do the judging seems to be a delicate one.

 

[mjrhealth]

I think there is a lot of studying we need to do about letting the tares grow with the wheat. The line we draw about where our right is to do the judging seems to be a delicate one.

The problem is, in the end of it all, no one here really knows what sin is, we like to think we do, and most of all, How can any of us make a " righteous" judgement, I know I cant.

Joh_7:24 Judge not according to the appearance, but judge righteous judgment.

We still stuck at looking at the outside because we, unlike God, cannot see the inside.

 

[Helen]

Hi Willie,
Would you allow openly "practicing sinners", who claim the Name of Christ, into your gatherings/fellowship?

Hi.
Agree with @Willie T
Jesus did! The ones who need it are the sinners not the saints.

People "in church" drift from church to church never growing up...huffing off to the next one when the pastor says something they don't like.
Jesus preached as much to the unsaved as saved.

If our churches are free of all sinners then why even bother to preach the saving gospel ?
...the night I got saved I was a sinner, right there in the church, heard the message of the prodigal son and the waiting Father , the Holy Spirit did His work on me...and I got saved.

If we pick and choose who can come and who can't , is the not blocking the chance of the Holy Spirit to speak to them as He did to us?

"Christians" that live in sin , or practice sin...are backsliders...
Paul had them in his congregation. LOL xxx

 

[amadeus]

A friend whose ministry takes them among people who believe it is ok to have more than one wife was made to think about what the church's response should be if they got saved. Should they be asked to discard more than one wife as well the children from those relationships. Perhaps we should be asking that question, 'What would Jesus do? In regard to the illustrations in previous posts. In my church two people who had been having an affair were asked to leave. She was a widow and he was a prominent member of the church whose ministry it was to pastor a small group - I think he was called a deacon. Anyway his comforting of the widow after her husband was murdered went much further than it should have so they were told to leave.

Not precisely the same situation but certainly a similarly difficult one is seen here for the Jews returning out of captivity with forbidden wives and the children born of such forbidden marriages:

"Now therefore let us make a covenant with our God to put away all the wives, and such as are born of them, according to the counsel of my lord, and of those that tremble at the commandment of our God; and let it be done according to the law." Ezra 10:3

"And the children of the captivity did so. And Ezra the priest, with certain chief of the fathers, after the house of their fathers, and all of them by their names, were separated, and sat down in the first day of the tenth month to examine the matter.
And they made an end with all the men that had taken strange wives by the first day of the first month." Ezra 10:16-17

 

[Nancy]

Not precisely the same situation but certainly a similarly difficult one is seen here for the Jews returning out of captivity with forbidden wives and the children born of such forbidden marriages:

"Now therefore let us make a covenant with our God to put away all the wives, and such as are born of them, according to the counsel of my lord, and of those that tremble at the commandment of our God; and let it be done according to the law." Ezra 10:3

"And the children of the captivity did so. And Ezra the priest, with certain chief of the fathers, after the house of their fathers, and all of them by their names, were separated, and sat down in the first day of the tenth month to examine the matter.
And they made an end with all the men that had taken strange wives by the first day of the first month." Ezra 10:16-17

Hi John,
Is Ezra 10:3 saying to put these wives and the children they had with them, out of the home, land? Don't say they were to be killed!!!! Yikes!

 

[Nancy]

I think there is a lot of studying we need to do about letting the tares grow with the wheat. The line we draw about where our right is to do the judging seems to be a delicate one.

Oh yes, very delicate. But judge they do...and they do so love to pick and choose which and who's sin is worse.

 

[marksman]

Thank you so much for the updates...good days and very blessed ones.

We were probably in the very same meetings but never knew it! LOL
We didn't live in Chard, we lived in Bexhill on Sea , but we drove there many weekends for the meetings.

As I tell people that it was the only church we experienced where there was no programme, no platform, no set preaching, no pastor (elders),

Thank you so much for the updates...good days and very blessed ones.

We were probably in the very same meetings but never knew it! LOL
We didn't live in Chard, we lived in Bexhill on Sea , but we drove there many weekends for the meetings.

As did many, many people and a lot of them went back home and started something similar.

 

[marksman]

I have to admit after 10 years at South Chard which was exceptional and life-giving, my experience of the church leaves a lot to be desired. Here in Australia, there are many good churches, but very few Spirit-led churches. When we first arrived here 40 years ago, we were taken to one of the leading AOG churches and told afterward that the good thing about AOG churches they were not the same. In other words, they were different every week.

As this church was not where we lived we took a look at the local AOG churches. Guess what. They were all the same every week. Over the years we went to various AOG churches and there was not one single difference in any of them. In addition, any church that we went to that was listed as pentecostal or charismatic, was the same as the next one. They all had their programme and the Holy Spirit never got a look in.

There was one that was a bit different and the people were quite friendly and welcoming but it didn't last long because the pastor couldn't keep his hands of the women.

In the end, we settled for second best but I got so bored with sitting on the premises instead of standing in the promises I had to leave because it is not my idea of fun to flog a dead horse. Every suggestion I made to grow or improve the church was met with no thanks, we know what we are doing. The church that I left where this was the case had about 130 attending. Now it has about 30. New people come but for everyone that does another one goes out the back door.

The church here seems to be a revolving door. They come and they go either because it is boring or the minister is God almighty and does his best to keep everyone under his thumb. Having said that it is ideal for those who just want to do their weekly penance and not get involved.

You gotta laugh. "That was a wonderful sermon."

"Was it. What was it about."

"Um, I can't remember but I know it was wonderful."

In other words, it was nothing you could do anything with.

These days I get more out of blessing the saints on the internet and reading and learning in readiness for the outpouring of the Spirit that is coming and praying and asking the Lord to build us a church that is his church.

 

[farouk]

I have to admit after 10 years at South Chard which was exceptional and life-giving, my experience of the church leaves a lot to be desired. Here in Australia, there are many good churches, but very few Spirit-led churches. When we first arrived here 40 years ago, we were taken to one of the leading AOG churches and told afterward that the good thing about AOG churches they were not the same. In other words, they were different every week.

As this church was not where we lived we took a look at the local AOG churches. Guess what. They were all the same every week. Over the years we went to various AOG churches and there was not one single difference in any of them. In addition, any church that we went to that was listed as pentecostal or charismatic, was the same as the next one. They all had their programme and the Holy Spirit never got a look in.

There was one that was a bit different and the people were quite friendly and welcoming but it didn't last long because the pastor couldn't keep his hands of the women.

In the end, we settled for second best but I got so bored with sitting on the premises instead of standing in the promises I had to leave because it is not my idea of fun to flog a dead horse. Every suggestion I made to grow or improve the church was met with no thanks, we know what we are doing. The church that I left where this was the case had about 130 attending. Now it has about 30. New people come but for everyone that does another one goes out the back door.

The church here seems to be a revolving door. They come and they go either because it is boring or the minister is God almighty and does his best to keep everyone under his thumb. Having said that it is ideal for those who just want to do their weekly penance and not get involved.

You gotta laugh. "That was a wonderful sermon."

"Was it. What was it about."

"Um, I can't remember but I know it was wonderful."

In other words, it was nothing you could do anything with.

These days I get more out of blessing the saints on the internet and reading and learning in readiness for the outpouring of the Spirit that is coming and praying and asking the Lord to build us a church that is his church.

It's good when a local church continues steadfastly in the activities of Acts 2.42.

 

[Brakelite]

KJV James 1
27 Pure religion and undefiled before God and the Father is this, To visit the fatherless and widows in their affliction, and to keep himself unspotted from the world.

If there is religion that is pure and undefiled, then there is a religion that is defiled. The difference is whether that religion is founded in selfishness or love. If you go to church because you want a blessing, them you're there for the wrong reasons. On the other hand, if you go because through the church you can pool your talents and means in order to help others by alleviating their suffering, then you are truly a Christian.