Gun Control

[aspen]

That's not true. Pick something, anything. Most things, all things, have safe guards. It's only people who either have safe guards or not, a conscience or not, love or hate. And guns may be a terrible scapegoat, but they're just a scapegoat, not the problem, and not the solution.

Ok. Most people are not responsible enough to own a gun. So we need regulation

 

[ScottA]

Ok. Most people are not responsible enough to own a gun. So we need regulation

I agree. But the regulations should target the problem and not the general right to keep and bear arms. But therein lies the problem. Regulating the problem means regulating morality which is a tricky prospect. As a society we have done just the opposite. Kids can legally divorce their parents. You can hardly lay a hand on your child without facing charges, etc.. How would you do it - any ideas?

 

[aspen]

I agree. But the regulations should target the problem and not the general right to keep and bear arms. But therein lies the problem. Regulating the problem means regulating morality which is a tricky prospect. As a society we have done just the opposite. Kids can legally divorce their parents. You can hardly lay a hand on your child without facing charges, etc.. How would you do it - any ideas?

Well, i think separating the gun lobby interests paid for by gun companies from the opinions of real gun owners is a start.

 

[ScottA]

Well, i think separating the gun lobby interests paid for by gun companies from the opinions of real gun owners is a start.

Yeah, I could do without the lobby system too. But I am not sure the interest of gun owners would be any different than the gun companies.

 

[aspen]

Yeah, I could do without the lobby system too. But I am not sure the interest of gun owners would be any different than the gun companies.

We need to let gun owners speak for themselves or we will never know.

 

[APAK]

We need to let gun owners speak for themselves or we will never know.

aspen:

The subject here is one of personal responsibility, morality, civility and love for our neighbors. Governments don't do moral legislation well.

It is even more critical today that we protect our 2nd Amendment because as each generation rises, duty to our creator, family, country and our way of life, free form governmental interference and modern forms of bondage, is waning, at an alarming rate. There are more potential and active criminals (robbers and killers) today lining up to harm us in our homes and on the streets, and in our schools. The public and even the private school systems, especially in the major cities, must take some responsibility for molding the minds of children into good citizens of mental and political misfits, many drugged on simulated games, and alternate realities. Of course there are many that have survived this daily bombardment of brain-washing. And no, I don't think I being extreme.

I personally would not group a non-military arms lobbyist with other lobbyists. Are the other lobbyists protecting any of our Constitutional rights? I would say no, at least those with major influence today in government. They are out for profit and influence and do not enhance the American people’s way of life. These types of lobbyists should be curtailed in government affairs.

The opinions of ‘real’ gun owners would generally side with the NRA. If the NRA did not exist today, it would be by tomorrow; especially because the ‘weak’ and cowardly types in places of power today are undermining our way of life. (I’m not a NRA member)

There is no such thing as 'gun-control' when the government takes charge of it. History has always shown it is another name for gun confiscation and the prohibition of guns for the average person who have no political or power status in society. The government will dictate who shall be allowed to protect themselves. Governments are jealous beasts that have a tendency to squelch any opposing power if given this power BY the PEOPLE. I hope Americans have the guts to stand up and not relinquish their right to protect themselves from criminals whether they be a common robber or their own government officials.

Bless you,

APAK

 

[Helen]

Yes, Well said!

 

[aspen]

aspen:

The subject here is one of personal responsibility, morality, civility and love for our neighbors. Governments don't do moral legislation well.

It is even more critical today that we protect our 2nd Amendment because as each generation rises, duty to our creator, family, country and our way of life, free form governmental interference and modern forms of bondage, is waning, at an alarming rate. There are more potential and active criminals (robbers and killers) today lining up to harm us in our homes and on the streets, and in our schools. The public and even the private school systems, especially in the major cities, must take some responsibility for molding the minds of children into good citizens of mental and political misfits, many drugged on simulated games, and alternate realities. Of course there are many that have survived this daily bombardment of brain-washing. And no, I don't think I being extreme.

I personally would not group a non-military arms lobbyist with other lobbyists. Are the other lobbyists protecting any of our Constitutional rights? I would say no, at least those with major influence today in government. They are out for profit and influence and do not enhance the American people’s way of life. These types of lobbyists should be curtailed in government affairs.

The opinions of ‘real’ gun owners would generally side with the NRA. If the NRA did not exist today, it would be by tomorrow; especially because the ‘weak’ and cowardly types in places of power today are undermining our way of life. (I’m not a NRA member)

There is no such thing as 'gun-control' when the government takes charge of it. History has always shown it is another name for gun confiscation and the prohibition of guns for the average person who have no political or power status in society. The government will dictate who shall be allowed to protect themselves. Governments are jealous beasts that have a tendency to squelch any opposing power if given this power BY the PEOPLE. I hope Americans have the guts to stand up and not relinquish their right to protect themselves from criminals whether they be a common robber or their own government officials.

Bless you,

APAK

Wow. You live in a scary place in your head. What if everything you said is true....or worse - the only thing a gun does is allow you to kill someone too. Is that really the solution? Is adding to the kill rate going to build your faith.

 

[aspen]

Guns and faith seem opposed to one another.

 

[ScottA]

We need to let gun owners speak for themselves or we will never know.

I am okay with that...but I hope you can see how silly this idea is getting.

I mean, remove the word "gun" from our last several posts and replace it with say... "roofing", and people with roofs and roofing manufacturers must surely be up to no good - those roofing material manufacturers, are just out to make money off other people's shelter needs, exploiting innocent homeowners, and the next thing you know people are falling off of roofs and just think of how dangerous it is and how we need more roofing regulations for some people, because some people have no business up on a roof!

So, yeah, I get your point. Do you get mine?

 

[ScottA]

Guns and faith seem opposed to one another.

"Roofing" and faith seem opposed to one another too.

 

[aspen]

I am okay with that...but I hope you can see how silly this idea is getting.

I mean, remove the word "gun" from our last several posts and replace it with say... "roofing", and people with roofs and roofing manufacturers must surely be up to no good - those roofing material manufacturers, are just out to make money off other people's shelter needs, exploiting innocent homeowners, and the next thing you know people are falling off of roofs and just think of how dangerous it is and how we need more roofing regulations for some people, because some people have no business up on a roof!

So, yeah, I get your point. Do you get mine?

I get your point....but I am not snowflaking here, or running around demonizing everyday objects. Guns are a different sort of beast - convenient, everywhere, and deadly.

I understand the risks of many parts of everyday life - processed meat, tap water, plastic, and on and on and on, but I do not think they are worth soapboxing over.

 

[ScottA]

I get your point....but I am not snowflaking here, or running around demonizing everyday objects. Guns are a different sort of beast - convenient, everywhere, and deadly.

I understand the risks of many parts of everyday life - processed meat, tap water, plastic, and on and on and on, but I do not think they are worth soapboxing over.

Okay, fair enough. So guns are like seat belts, plastic bag warnings, high voltage, etc... But none of those are a defense against tyranny, and yet we have regulations on them all already. The only thing missing is some way of regulating the unstable. The problem is, England would have defined George Washington and John Adams as unstable, so that is not the solution.

You can't just go after the object used - you have to go after what causes the tipping point in a person. The point is, guns are not the cause, and therefore regulating them further will never fix the problem.

Identify the problem. Identify the cause. Then, and only then, will we arrive at a solution that will actually work.

 

[Taken]

Ok. Most people are not responsible enough to own a gun. So we need regulation

Owning? The government should regulate what people can own?

God Bless,
Taken

 

[aspen]

Okay, fair enough. So guns are like seat belts, plastic bag warnings, high voltage, etc... But none of those are a defense against tyranny, and yet we have regulations on them all already. The only thing missing is some way of regulating the unstable. The problem is, England would have defined George Washington and John Adams as unstable, so that is not the solution.

You can't just go after the object used - you have to go after what causes the tipping point in a person. The point is, guns are not the cause, and therefore regulating them further will never fix the problem.

Identify the problem. Identify the cause. Then, and only then, will we arrive at a solution that will actually work.

Guns will not protect us from the government. Perhaps we should all be guaranteed computers and decent wifi for hacking - much better chance of defending ourselves nowadays.

 

[aspen]

Owning? The government should regulate what people can own?

God Bless,
Taken

Um yes? The government regulates how we earn a living, what we eat, and what we own

 

[Taken]

Um yes? The government regulates how we earn a living, what we eat, and what we own

Why? Because the Constitution that established the government and established who, how, when, a man could be a SERVANT "OF" the people, are doing what?
Serving the people or Oppressing the people?

A servant is SUPPOSED to PROTECT the rights of the people.

A tyrant OPPRESSES the rights of the people.

Our own declaring Government Document, called the Delcaration of Independence; Declares the Government recognized the Liberty of People is from God.

WHAT exactly is the METHOD used to supersede a mans Liberty?
Create a Law.

And precisely WHY, the Constitution was VERY LIMITED on a LIST of things, the Government COULD Govern and create Laws and Regulations FOR the governance, per the list.

Nearly ALL of the "list" was accomplished shortly after the Constitution was established.
And yes, without FULL participation of Congress, SOME things on the list were deceitfully CHANGED.

And for YEARS, the Congress has enacted LAWS, that are NOT authorized by the Constitution.

Really? The government should have the authority to dictate what job a man can do, what a man must eat, what a man can buy or MUST buy? Ridiculous!

God Bless,
Taken

 

[ScottA]

Guns will not protect us from the government. Perhaps we should all be guaranteed computers and decent wifi for hacking - much better chance of defending ourselves nowadays.

You are missing the point.

The right is not limited to guns, but to "arms", which would change with the times. But guns are not outdated yet, neither are knives or clubs for that matter.

None of which will fix the problem of the mental tipping point that actually causes the problems we are now seeing. That is the point.

 

[Dcopymope]

Um yes? The government regulates how we earn a living, what we eat, and what we own

Where exactly does it say any of this in the constitution? So the government can deny me the right to eat a cheeseburger? Is that the idea here?

 

[aspen]

You are missing the point.

The right is not limited to guns, but to "arms", which would change with the times. But guns are not outdated yet, neither are knives or clubs for that matter.

None of which will fix the problem of the mental tipping point that actually causes the problems we are now seeing. That is the point.

Yes. I do not see your point. My point is that arming the populous does not guarantee a free people.

It does however, suggest a situation Syria has been experiencing over the past couple of years.

We Americans, have romantic ideas of shooting down our tyrannical government - as if we had a united purpose, the will to carry it out and enough fire power to succeed! What a pipe dream! And the same people who are so confident in their abilities to topple governments have zero confidence in the Amareican people, who they berate for being lazy snowflakes, sapping our GDP by refusing to work and living on welfare!

Guns are as healthy and useful as cigarettes