How to Authentically Speak in Tongues

[Christ4Me]

Enoch illustrates the godless need of fundamentalists who don't know Greek to mindlessly pontificate on what Greek words mean, using outdated and linguistically incompentence concordances to compensate for their ignorance. the massive articles of the Theological Dictionary of the New Testament delve into the secular Greek usage, the usage in Judaism and the OT, and the usage in the NT and early Christianity of all the spiritually relevant words in the NT.

Where in the scripture does it instruct future believers to study the Greek because the message or meaning of His words can be lost in translation to a foreign tongue for us to have any wisdom in knowing what is truly written?

The fact that Bible versions do not all agree with John 6:63 & 2 Corinthians 3:6 as not pertaining to the Holy Spirit goes to show the limitation of understanding the Greek with man's wisdom today. This is why the modified Nicene creed of 381 A.D. crediting the Holy Spirit as the Giver of Life is wrong when Jesus is as the Bread of life that gives life to the world by coming to & believing in Him John 6:30-36

So which scripture is correct? Scripture testifies Whom that the scripture points to for us to come to in order to have life; John 5:39-40

That's wisdom from the Lord that trumps the wisdom of knowing Greek.

The lengthy article on "glossai" in vol. I makes the point that this word need not mean "human languages." In secular Greek usage "glossai" can mean not a human language, but "an expression which in speech or manner is strange or obscure and needs explanation...There are various kinds (12:10, 28; cf. 14:10); some are tongues of men and others of angels (13:1)." [pp. 720, 722].

You just testified that angelic tongues are gibberish nonsense and yet we find scripture testifying to familiar spirits as speaking gibberish nonsense.

Isaiah 8:19 And when they shall say unto you, Seek unto them that have familiar spirits, and unto wizards that peep, and that mutter: should not a people seek unto their God? for the living to the dead?

If the angels can testify to us in the language we can understand, then what need to speak to them in gibberish nonsense as of by the Holy Ghost?

In 14:12 Paul rightly views the Corinthians as "zealots of spirits" and therefore as utterers of the "tongues of angels" of 13:1. Hermas Mandates 11 (c. 105 AD) confirms this understanding of ecstatic prophetic gifts as angel speech.

Yet in context, Paul is referring to spiritual gifts and not tongues of spirits nor tongues of angels for surely there are tongues of fallen angels.

Fundamentalists here have been led astray by the unique outburst of comprehensible human tongues in Acts 2.

As many did understand the wonderful works of God in their native foreign tongue, recognizing that the disciples only spoken Galileans, some bystander beside them mocked because they did not know the language they were speaking in & so assumed they were drunk. If they were falling down as if drunk, I am sure the devout Jews from all nations have seen that to just keep on walking and not be mystified by that at all.

Its comprehensible nature prompts Peter to identify this speaking in tongues as the "prophesying" foretold in Joel 2 (see Acts 2:17).

Since these devout Jews knew they spoke Galilean is why Peter spoke in his native language to them all when he did in getting them all to listen including those whom were mocking them as being drunk. Peter can't be falling down while saying that to them all or else, again, they'd be walking.

Elsewhere in Acts Luke carefully distinguishes tongues from prophesying (19:6) because the outbursts of tongues in Cornelius' household and at Ephesus are neither interpreted nor comprehensible languages to the speakers.

But others understood it as a foreign language for why it was God's gifts of tongues that the speaker was uttering & not gibberish nonsense as if by a wizard or a medium and the Bible has informed them and us how they speak by familiar spirits is gibberish nonsense.

That would make God the copy cat of Satan's tongues rather than the other way around since Satan's tongue was before Pentecost as found in Isiaah 8:19. That means any pagan supernatural tongue that is gibberish nonsense is not the real God's gift of tongues that came at Pentecost.

 

[Cassandra]

Contemporary Jews believed godly men could understand angelic speech.

Every time an angel speaks in the Bible, it is in a language that the person they speak to can understand. It makes no sense then for man to be able to speak like the angels (?) when the angels speak in our own language to us. It would be of no use to speak "angel" in prayer. It is probably hyperbole.

 

[Behold]

It's a simple fact that WHEN a person is "Baptized in the Holy Spirit" (to use Assembly of God vernacular), they will "speak in tongues" as an initial phenomenon. .

Tbis is baloney.
Its the AOG baloney that you are taught to preach instead of the Gospel.
Nothing new.
Ive heard this standard meat cult sandwich theological nonsense for 40 yrs.

The fact is, everyone who is born again, become so by the Indwelling Christ, who "Is that Spirit".
So, to have "Christ in You, the hope of Glory", IS the Baptism, as without the Spirit of Christ in you, Paul teaches you are "none of His"

You can't be born again, and not have this Spiritual Baptism that is in fact the Holy Spirit of God, birthing your spirit into His Holy Spirit.

End result? The believer, born again, has become "The temple of the HOLY SPIRIT", and that is every born again.

So, the AOG, and all the Charismatic ' Pentecostal branches, take what is the born again spiritual baptism, and recreate it as their Theatrical Opera of Flesh and Fakery and Fantasy.

My advice ?
Get out of that mess, and find a real body of believers, while you have a few years left to do it.

 

[Behold]

It sounds reasonable and plausible but I disagree for the simple truth that Paul had to pray that another would interpret that tongue

No one had to interpret when the Holy Spirit was manifesting tongues to speak to foreigners in their native tongue in outreach ministry. This was not done in the church where not every one is understanding what was being said, including the tongue speaker, until it was interpreted.

Acts 2:5 And there were dwelling at Jerusalem Jews, devout men, out of every nation under heaven. 6 Now when this was noised abroad, the multitude came together, and were confounded, because that every man heard them speak in his own language.
Thank you for sharing.

Typical of a Charismatic, you are teaching that a prayer language that "cannot be uttered", is the "gift of Tongues".

Also, Paul didnt "pray for someone to interpret Him".......so, you made that up.
You should get a NT and actually read it, and burn all your commentaries as they are heretical.

Finally, your posted verse says..."they heard in their own LANGUAGE"

So, what is a LANGUAGE?....Its a "TONGUE".........and the Gift of Tongues, is exactly that.....exactly.

 

[Cassandra]

I don't think Christ4me is charismatic.

 

[Behold]

I don't think Christ4me is charismatic.

"Charismatic"

"One whose spiritual development is related to the Corinthian Church" ...."whose focus is on Gifts and the Supernatural aspect of carnal christianity".

"One who tries to prove that unless you speak in tongues, you are not "filled with the spirit""

"one who teaches that there is a 2nd work of Grace"

"one who teaches..: entire santification"

"one who does not understand the difference between "prayer language"...>"tongues of Angels".....>"Gift of Tongues".

"Pentecostal" : "same thing".

 

[Cassandra]

I still don't think he is. he speaks out against tongues.

 

[Behold]

I still don't think he is. she speaks out against tongues.

Well,

"tongues" are not what causes the confusion.
The confusion is caused by a carnal movement that has confused "prayer language", with "the gift of Tongues".
They teach it as the same, and its not.
They teach also, falsely, that you must do it, or you "dont have the spirit".

So, trying to teach what you dont even understand, and then you demand that this is true....... is what they do.

Enter : confusion, strife, every evil work.

 

[Christ4Me]

Typical of a Charismatic, you are teaching that a prayer language that "cannot be uttered", is the "gift of Tongues".

Not sure where you got that from unless you are reading somebody else's post.

I do not believe there is such a thing as a prayer language. The Holy Spirit cannot utter His own prayers from Himself per John 16:13. The Lord has to know the mind of the Spirit to give the Spirit's silent intercessions to the Father for the Father to even know about the Spirit's intercessions for us per Romans 8:26-27 as even His groanings cannot be uttered if you go with the KJV.

Also, Paul didnt "pray for someone to interpret Him".......so, you made that up.
You should get a NT and actually read it, and burn all your commentaries as they are heretical.

Doubt you are understanding me.

When Paul is speaking in tongues while manifested by the Holy Spirit, he is praying as in it is his spirit that is praying while this is going on that somebody else may interpret that tongue so he can understand it and that tongue would be fruitful to himself.

Finally, your posted verse says..."they heard in their own LANGUAGE"

So, what is a LANGUAGE?....Its a "TONGUE".........and the Gift of Tongues, is exactly that.....exactly.

I agree. Not sure why you would think that I think otherwise. Gibberish nonsense is what I am speaking against as that is not a language of men for why many believers that pray today in tongues only because they assume it is for private use when it is not coming with interpretation, but I say that God's gift of tongues are not for private use for why praying in tongues is not of Him at all. Paul was just praying that someone will interpret that tongue as being manifested by the holy Spirit through Paul so he may understand it and benefit Paul from it also.

 

[amadeus]

Still coming off as "I have something most Christians do not have." You are separating yourself from the believers that did not experience that "second blessing". Not sure how you can prevent yourself from thinking higher than you ought to think in regards to that.

In his flesh alone, any person might think higher of himself than he ought because of any gift or gifts received from God. This pride too must be overcome in order to partake of the tree of Life!

"He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches; To him that overcometh will I give to eat of the tree of life, which is in the midst of the paradise of God." Rev 2:7

So as not to lie unintentionally any person should be very hesitant about insisting, presuming or concluding that God will not or cannot or does not give certain gifts outside of the person's own knowledge or experience. Who knows God so completely?

 

[Berserk]

Christ4Me: "Where in the scripture does it instruct future believers to study the Greek because the message or meaning of His words can be lost in translation to a foreign tongue for us to have any wisdom in knowing what is truly written?"

The Bible can never be accurately translated because, for many of the spiritually significant words, there is no one-to-one English translation. For example, neither the Hebrew ("amunah") and Greek ("pistis") translated "faith" mean that exactly. Both words mean "faith/ faithfulness." This is doctrinally important because it means we are saved by grace through a way of being that needs to be defined more precisely so we don't create the impression we are saved by works. I will discuss the relevance of this to the Catholic doctrine of justification in my Catholic thread.

C4M: "So which scripture is correct?"
Largely to tired scribes in the early centuries, there are 400,OOO variant readings in NT Greek manuscripts. To get the best possible text, Text Critics group these manuscripts by type, date, and region of origin to trace why, where, and why certain errors crept into the text. Then they compare that with NT quotations from Church Fathers whose writings precede that of the manuscripts in question. This methodology exposes the KJV and NKJV as based on the latest and most error-prone texts. So I recommend any modern translation you like because most of them are based on the best and most accurate critical text. The KJV also has several serious mistranslations, but it is the underlying corrupt Hebrew and Greek text that is the more serious issue. What I'm telling you is a rude surprise new students immediately learn at most evangelical seminaries.


C4M: "You just testified that angelic tongues are gibberish nonsense and yet we find scripture testifying to familiar spirits as speaking gibberish nonsense."
Any language you don't know will sound like gibberish nonsense. But your underlying point has merit: Satan counterfeits any spiritual gift that has the power to advance God's kingdom. That's why I started this thread. If Pentecostals willfully speak in tongues just for the joy of the emotional high it gives them, they open themselves up to inspiration from demonic spirits. That's why I vehemently oppose prompting the seeker with advice like this: "Just step out in faith and speak in tongues and the Holy Spirit will take over." Well, the Holy Spirit is sovereign and doesn't jump when we crack our whip.


C4M: "If the angels can testify to us in the language we can understand, then what need to speak to them in gibberish nonsense as of by the Holy Ghost?"
Good question! Paul and the Corinthians realize that much of their glossolalia is not a comprehensible human language. Yet it is so life-changing and such a powerful aid to worship that Paul and much of the first-century church (e. g. Hernas) interpreted this apparent gibberish as either human language that no one present understood or angelic language. Remember, no one understands or interprets the glossolalia spoken in Cornelius's household or at Ephesus.

To be clear, I'm not saying that people are unsaved if they haven't spoken in tongues. But Christians even get the nature of the regenerating work of the Spirit wrong. My next planned post will lay out Paul's view of our initial reception of the Spirit.

 

[Behold]

Not sure where you got that from unless you are reading somebody else's post.

I do not believe there is such a thing as a prayer language.
When Paul is speaking in tongues while manifested by the Holy Spirit, he is praying.

"tongues", is the Gift of Tongues......one of the 9 spiritual Gifts.
You dont "pray" in this Spiritual Gift....you PREACH in it......See PETER in ACTS 2.


A "Prayer language", is this....."unknown tongue"

'""""" Likewise the Spirit also helpeth our infirmities: for we know not what we should pray for as we ought: but the Spirit itself maketh intercession for us with groanings which cannot" be uttered."""""

Why do you do that?

"""" He that speaketh in an unknown. tongue (prayer language) = edifieth himself""""

 

[Christ4Me]

In his flesh alone, any person might think higher of himself than he ought because of any gift or gifts received from God. This pride too must be overcome in order to partake of the tree of Life!

"He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches; To him that overcometh will I give to eat of the tree of life, which is in the midst of the paradise of God." Rev 2:7

So as not to lie unintentionally any person should be very hesitant about insisting, presuming or concluding that God will not or cannot or does not give certain gifts outside of the person's own knowledge or experience. Who knows God so completely?

Not every believer will test the spirits and the tongues they bring because they want to believe that special phenomenon was of God. 1 John 4:1-6

Therefore their heart is not right with the Lord then when they believe the lie that they can receive the Holy Spirit again for why God would permit that strong delusion to occur as those seducing spirits bring that tongue of gibberish nonsense with them as mediums & wizards do by that sign of tongues.

Matthew 15:18 But those things which proceed out of the mouth come forth from the heart; and they defile the man. 19 For out of the heart proceed evil thoughts, murders, adulteries, fornications, thefts, false witness, blasphemies: 20 These are the things which defile a man:

So when the devil has been speaking in gibberish nonsense before Pentecost came with God's gift of togues which is a foreign language.

Let me ask you this, how can sinners in idolatry and the occult know if they have departed from those spirits and that kind of tongue if Christians do the same thing?

How can churches know that those sinners have departed from that kind of tongue & those spirits if they have that same kind of tongue which they assume is for private use?

Therefore the real God's gift of tongues is a foreign language to speak unto the people and it WILL come with interpretation in the assembly.

John 7:7 The world cannot hate you; but me it hateth, because I testify of it, that the works thereof are evil.

1 Thessalonians 5:21 Prove all things; hold fast that which is good. 22 Abstain from all appearance of evil.

Isaiah 8:19 And when they shall say unto you, Seek unto them that have familiar spirits, and unto wizards that peep, and that mutter: should not a people seek unto their God? for the living to the dead?

1 Timothy 4:1Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils; 2 Speaking lies in hypocrisy; having their conscience seared with a hot iron;

 

[Christ4Me]

The Bible can never be accurately translated because, for many of the spiritually significant words, there is no one-to-one English translation. For example, neither the Hebrew ("amunah") and Greek ("pistis") translated "faith" mean that exactly. Both words mean "faith/ faithfulness." This is doctrinally important because it means we are saved by grace through a way of being that needs to be defined more precisely so we don't create the impression we are saved by works. I will discuss the relevance of this to the Catholic doctrine of justification in my Catholic thread.

Largely to tired scribes in the early centuries, there are 400,OOO variant readings in NT Greek manuscripts. To get the best possible text, Text Critics group these manuscripts by type, date, and region of origin to trace why, where, and why certain errors crept into the text. Then they compare that with NT quotations from Church Fathers whose writings precede that of the manuscripts in question. This methodology exposes the KJV and NKJV as based on the latest and most error-prone texts. So I recommend any modern translation you like because most of them are based on the best and most accurate critical text. The KJV also has several serious mistranslations, but it is the underlying corrupt Hebrew and Greek text that is the more serious issue. What I'm telling you is a rude surprise new students immediately learn at most evangelical seminaries.

Any language you don't know will sound like gibberish nonsense. But your underlying point has merit: Satan counterfeits any spiritual gift that has the power to advance God's kingdom. That's why I started this thread. If Pentecostals willfully speak in tongues just for the joy of the emotional high it gives them, they open themselves up to inspiration from demonic spirits. That's why I vehemently oppose prompting the seeker with advice like this: "Just step out in faith and speak in tongues and the Holy Spirit will take over." Well, the Holy Spirit is sovereign and doesn't jump when we crack our whip.

Good question! Paul and the Corinthians realize that much of their glossolalia is not a comprehensible human language. Yet it is so life-changing and such a powerful aid to worship that Paul and much of the first-century church (e. g. Hernas) interpreted this apparent gibberish as either human language that no one present understood or angelic language. Remember, no one understands or interprets the glossolalia spoken in Cornelius's household or at Ephesus.

To be clear, I'm not saying that people are unsaved if they haven't spoken in tongues. But Christians even get the nature of the regenerating work of the Spirit wrong. My next planned post will lay out Paul's view of our initial reception of the Spirit.

Not every believer will test the spirits and the tongues they bring because they want to believe that special phenomenon was of God. 1 John 4:1-6

Therefore their heart is not right with the Lord then when they believe the lie that they can receive the Holy Spirit again for why God would permit that strong delusion to occur as those seducing spirits bring that tongue of gibberish nonsense with them as mediums & wizards do by that sign of tongues.

Matthew 15:18 But those things which proceed out of the mouth come forth from the heart; and they defile the man. 19 For out of the heart proceed evil thoughts, murders, adulteries, fornications, thefts, false witness, blasphemies: 20 These are the things which defile a man:

So when the devil has been speaking in gibberish nonsense before Pentecost came with God's gift of togues which is a foreign language.

Let me ask you this, how can sinners in idolatry and the occult know if they have departed from those spirits and that kind of tongue if Christians do the same thing?

How can churches know that those sinners have departed from that kind of tongue & those spirits if they have that same kind of tongue which they assume is for private use?

Therefore the real God's gift of tongues is a foreign language to speak unto the people and it WILL come with interpretation in the assembly.

John 7:7 The world cannot hate you; but me it hateth, because I testify of it, that the works thereof are evil.

1 Thessalonians 5:21 Prove all things; hold fast that which is good. 22 Abstain from all appearance of evil.

Isaiah 8:19 And when they shall say unto you, Seek unto them that have familiar spirits, and unto wizards that peep, and that mutter: should not a people seek unto their God? for the living to the dead?

1 Timothy 4:1Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils; 2 Speaking lies in hypocrisy; having their conscience seared with a hot iron;

 

[Christ4Me]

"tongues", is the Gift of Tongues......one of the 9 spiritual Gifts.
You dont "pray" in this Spiritual Gift....you PREACH in it......See PETER in ACTS 2.


A "Prayer language", is this....."unknown tongue"

'""""" Likewise the Spirit also helpeth our infirmities: for we know not what we should pray for as we ought: but the Spirit itself maketh intercession for us with groanings which cannot" be uttered."""""

Why do you do that?

"""" He that speaketh in an unknown. tongue (prayer language) = edifieth himself""""

1 Corinthians 14:12 Even so ye, forasmuch as ye are zealous of spiritual gifts, seek that ye may excel to the edifying of the church.

13 Wherefore let him that speaketh in an unknown tongue pray that he may interpret. 14 For if I pray in an unknown tongue, my spirit prayeth, but my understanding is unfruitful.

15 What is it then? I will pray with the spirit, and I will pray with the understanding also: I will sing with the spirit, and I will sing with the understanding also.

Apply verse 13 to verse 14 to see that Paul is praying that someone will interpret the tongue coming through him by the Holy Ghost so that he may understand it. That is the message in context and verse 14 is not to be taken out of context as if Paul is praying in tongues by the holy Ghost when it is his spirit that is praying, not the Holy Ghost in verse 15.

 

[Behold]

How can churches know that those sinners have departed from that kind of tongue & those spirits if they have that same kind of tongue which they assume is for private use?

I wrote a Thread regarding your post..

The Anti-Christ spirit test.

 

[Behold]

13 Wherefore let him that speaketh in an unknown tongue <<<<<<<<<

"""UNKNOWN Tongue.""""

The Gift of Tongues is not Unknown.

See Peter in Acts 2 for an update.

See the difference yet?
Keep looking.

 

[Berserk]

Christ4Me: "Not every believer will test the spirits and the tongues they bring because they want to believe that special phenomenon was of God. 1 John 4:1-6."
And if you read post #4, you'll see that precisely that problem created a lot of doubt for me as a teen about the reality of these manifestations and, for that matter, about God and the Bible. The interpreter of tongues was usually our pastor or regional superintendent. No congregant dared to challenge their authority. And yet as a spiritually hungry teen, God gave me the gift of discernment and that gift told me that most of these messages were of the flesh. But the few that were real moved me to tears because I was so blessed by them!

C4M: "Let me ask you this, how can sinners in idolatry and the occult know if they have departed from those spirits and that kind of tongue if Christians do the same thing?"

"How can churches know that those sinners have departed from that kind of tongue & those spirits if they have that same kind of tongue which they assume is for private use?"

I have a great little book entitled "The Challenging Counterfeit," in which a medium who regularly experienced spirit (demonic)-inspired controlled speech experienced the love of Jesus. When he did, demons tried to put him in a trance and strangle him with his own hands! But Jesus spared him and he became a joyful Christian and tongues speaker.

Remember, Satan sees no need to molest dead evangelical churches but is eager to counterfeit any spiritual gifts that truly edify the believer and help build up God's kingdom. That means the real life in the Spirit immerses us in spiritual warfare and a Pauline antidote for that warfare is "pray in the Spirit" (Ephesians 6:18) as opposed to normal self-directed prayer. You can pray in the Spirit in your own language, but speaking in tongues is another form of it recommended by Paul, who says he wants us all to speak in tongues (1 Cor. 14:5) and thanks God that he speaks in tongues "more than you all (14:18)." In my view, most speaking in tongues is of the flesh, but genuine tongues can be the most powerful, beautiful, and life-changing experience in Christian spirituality. Therefore, Christians must heed Paul's command to "zealously strive for spiritual gifts (12:31; 14:1)."

One of the great perversions of Paul's teaching is to think of "the more excellent way" (12:31) as a rival to the gifts of the Spirit. Paul's "most excellent way" is agape love in the exercise of gifts like tongues and prophecy, so that the visiting outsider is not offended by uninterpreted tongues and other chaotic church manifestations. Of course, he encourages private prayer tongues.

 

[Bob Carabbio]

Tbis is baloney.
Its the AOG baloney that you are taught to preach instead of the Gospel.
Nothing new.
Ive heard this standard meat cult sandwich theological nonsense for 40 yrs.

The fact is, everyone who is born again, become so by the Indwelling Christ, who "Is that Spirit".
So, to have "Christ in You, the hope of Glory"

No problem there, no indwelling Holy Spirit = Not Born again. Simple as that. AT LEAST you've got that right in spite of the terminology you use.

Of course what you miss is John 20:22 when the Holy Spirit was ministered to indwell the disciples by Jesus, the effects of which are recorded in Luke 24:45. And that Jesus specifically used the word "Endued" of the Acts 2:4 phenomenon, which is an external clothing - i.e. the same as when, in the OLD TESTAMENT, the Holy CAME UPON (endued) people who were not "Indwelled" by the Spirit (since NOBODY WAS, or even could be, until John 20:22).

So, the AOG, and all the Charismatic ' Pentecostal branches, take what is the born again spiritual baptism, and recreate it as their Theatrical Opera of Flesh and Fakery and Fantasy.

Standard Cessationist rhetoric typical of Pentehostiles.

My advice ?
Get out of that mess, and find a real body of believers, while you have a few years left to do it.

ANd as you already knew before you said it, your "advice", being worthless, is completely ignored.

 

[amadeus]

Not every believer will test the spirits and the tongues they bring because they want to believe that special phenomenon was of God. 1 John 4:1-6

I agree that not everyone will test the spirits. Why should you doubt that I have done so? Have I not testified of my daily contact with God? Do you doubt it because it differs in detail with your own? What is that to you?

"Peter seeing him saith to Jesus, Lord, and what shall this man do?
Jesus saith unto him, If I will that he tarry till I come, what is that to thee? follow thou me." John 21:21-22

Is the highway of holiness precisely the same for every member of the Body of Christ? Not everyone is the nose or the hand or the knee. We are what we are in accord with what we have or have not done with what God has given us... and how closely we have followed His lead.

You apparently believe that you can or should judge other people, questioning even their testimonies. Is anyone up to that job other than God, Himself?

Therefore their heart is not right with the Lord then when they believe the lie that they can receive the Holy Spirit again for why God would permit that strong delusion to occur as those seducing spirits bring that tongue of gibberish nonsense with them as mediums & wizards do by that sign of tongues.

Who is believing in the receiving the Holy Spirit again? Not me. There is another touch from the hand of the Master as per Mark 8:23ff. How many such touches may each of need before we are able to see "face to face"?

You are speaking as if you knew about things which you only believe. All babies of flesh babble before they speak clearly and communicate. That is only a shadow of the communication that develops between a sincere believer and God. Look then to your own vision if it is less than perfect before trying to assess mine.

Carnal people think they communicate, but when it comes to the things of God, they do not have a clue. Certainly, many of them never become hungry and thirsty for the right things, so they also remain always clueless.

Presuming that any tongues not fitting into your prescribed box is making a judgement call that is best not voiced. That is between me and God. You are not a competent judge of me.

Matthew 15:18 But those things which proceed out of the mouth come forth from the heart; and they defile the man. 19 For out of the heart proceed evil thoughts, murders, adulteries, fornications, thefts, false witness, blasphemies: 20 These are the things which defile a man:

Yes, that is right if the source of what is spoken is the carnal heart of the man led by the old man. Some believers certainly are doubleminded.

Do you ever speak carnal things? Do you ever speak the Word of God? No need to answer those two questions... Rather consider and meditate and talk to God about them remembering what Solomon wrote 3,000 years ago.

What did Daniel, Jeremiah, Isaiah, Elijah, Moses, and Ezekiel speak when they prophesied?

What did Peter, Paul, John and James speak when God put words in their mouths to speak?

So when the devil has been speaking in gibberish nonsense before Pentecost came with God's gift of togues which is a foreign language.

Let me ask you this, how can sinners in idolatry and the occult know if they have departed from those spirits and that kind of tongue if Christians do the same thing?

Who knows the things of the Spirit of God, but the Spirit of God? What man knew that God was calling him that very first time?

Where did we all start?

"Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that entereth not by the door into the sheepfold, but climbeth up some other way, the same is a thief and a robber.
But he that entereth in by the door is the shepherd of the sheep.
To him the porter openeth; and the sheep hear his voice: and he calleth his own sheep by name, and leadeth them out.
And when he putteth forth his own sheep, he goeth before them, and the sheep follow him: for they know his voice.
And a stranger will they not follow, but will flee from him: for they know not the voice of strangers." John 10:1-5

How can churches know that those sinners have departed from that kind of tongue & those spirits if they have that same kind of tongue which they assume is for private use?

Churches? What do churches know? It is people in the Spirit paying attention to the Spirit who know because they hear and recognize His voice.

Most churches [so named by men], groups of people gathered supposedly to worship God and follow the lead of the Spirit, do what routinely? They routinely quench the Spirit of God and are taught to do so by the men who have set up rules of when to speak and when to be silent, so then often limiting God Himself. Where is the lead of the Holy Spirit? Do only the pastors and ministers sitting on the platform hear from God? Do any of them hear from God? What happens when a dear old sister sitting on the pew with a Message God burning in her heart cannot be spoken because a "man of God" will not allow her to stand and speak?

When people in church gatherings stop quenching the Spirit and the Spirit is really in them will they not then begin to hear and recognize His voice? Who are His sheep?

Therefore the real God's gift of tongues is a foreign language to speak unto the people and it WILL come with interpretation in the assembly.

That is "A" real gift of God, but you should not presume to define and/or limit God! Too many people sitting in the pews and on the platforms of church buildings who either are not sheep at all... or being sheep, they quench the Holy Spirit and therefore are unable to hear God speak when He does.

The black and white rules were written out by Moses and others as led by God to do so in the OT for His purposes in that time. But today too many people want to set up again more black and white rules based on written NT scriptures instead of allowing the Holy Spirit to lead and teach so that people then, hearing and understanding, will follow and obey.

People still do not know that what God gave Jeremiah to write long before Jesus was born in Bethlehem still applies to them today:

"O LORD, I know that the way of man is not in himself: it is not in man that walketh to direct his steps" Jerem. 10:23

Yet, men continue to try to lead... neglecting or ignoring the Director or Comforter or Teacher which was sent on the day of Pentecost about 2,000 years ago. Men leading the way did not work well under the law given to Moses and it does not work well today under the rules of men. Men not led by the Holy Spirit and still are blind and deaf!

Meanwhile you nit pic about things, which perhaps you believe will glorify you. I don't know your purpose. Does God need you to condemn the errors you believe you see in others?

Do you know all of the right answers? Do you believe that everyone else must hear your voice instead of hearing from God for themselves?

God does work through men, but it is according to His will in His time rather than in ours. So, I believe!

John 7:7 The world cannot hate you; but me it hateth, because I testify of it, that the works thereof are evil.

1 Thessalonians 5:21 Prove all things; hold fast that which is good. 22 Abstain from all appearance of evil.

Isaiah 8:19 And when they shall say unto you, Seek unto them that have familiar spirits, and unto wizards that peep, and that mutter: should not a people seek unto their God? for the living to the dead?

1 Timothy 4:1Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils; 2 Speaking lies in hypocrisy; having their conscience seared with a hot iron;

You are preaching a whole lot of things at me. I do not know all of the answers and I am not flawless, but I know the One does have those answers and is flawless, the only One who gives us real increases, and... it really is not you!

You want to convince me that my testimony is false, but God has already talked to me about that.

You speak of delusions, but delusions are sent by God to people who do not love the Truth. That is one thing that I do. I love the Truth. My love still falls short of God's, but it is there, and I renew my commitment to my God daily.

Must a person know all of the details of God's Truth, in order to love it? Certainly not! I love my wife of nearly 50 years, and I still do not know her completely. With her as with God, I am seeing through a glass still somewhat darkly.

Please do not try to describe my relationship with God for me. That is between me and Him. It does exist and I am still growing closer to Him as He is increasing in me while I am decreasing in myself.

Give God the glory!