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Ronald Nolette

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But calvin was wrong on some things . I suggest we simply teach the bible .
What kind of man would support tribunals that put witches to DEATH , and etc . OH yeah CALIVIN DID . SOMETHING was NOT RIGHT with that man .I could have understood if he had said Witches had to be cast out of the church . But them tribunals DID much more than that .
And calvin never stopped them . SO YOU TELL ME . WHO has the RIGHT , the ONLY RIGHT to execute the letter of death
against a person . OH YEAH THE JUDGE OF THE LAW . THAT WOULD BE GOD , not man .
The man had serious ISSUES .


Well something is not right with all men! Calvin was a product of His day. He fled Catholicism and they put witches to death. It takes time from fleeing Catholicism and studying the word to unlearn the old ways and learn better ways.

Calvin probably got a lot of things wrong! He is a man! None of us are perfect. But when He speaks truth, I will defend that truth. Not because Calvin came up with it, but because it is SCripture!
 

amigo de christo

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Well I have not seen Calvin teach any such thing! all go to th elake of fire by nature! It is the destiny of every sould if god does nothing! All are lost. Calvin did confirm what teh bible teaches- that is god has chosen to recue some from our deserved fate and grant us everlasting life!
Yet GOD himself says HIS DESIRE is not that the wicked would perish but rather they would repent .
WHY would GOD tell ISRAEL , TO REPENT and WHY WILL YE DIE . THE PROBLEM IS NOT WITH GOD , ITS MAN who refuses .
JESUS said what the ONLY CONDMENATION was .
LETS go look at it real close .
First i am gonna say it like calvin would .
Calvins JESUS would have said , THE ONLY CONDEMNATION IS that GOD SIMPLY created some to be destroyed .
BUT that AINT WHAT JESUS SAID . HE said the only condemation a man has is , HE WONT COME , AKA HE WONT
notice the words HE WONT come to the LIGHT that he might be saved .
We are soley saved by grace , After being called , one had better continue to heed the SPIRIT
or the flesh is gonna lead them to their ruin and demise .
I think folks forget WHY the early church was so dire with so many reminders . CAUSE IT WAS ALL SPIRIT INSPIRED
and if one takes off from heeding it , WELL its on them .
Folks think me a monster when i am so grave and so dire about warnings , YET how much more the early church leaders
were grave and dire too . SEE THE SPIRIT OF GOD KNOWS HOW TO KEEP US SAFE
and folks that warn , often do so by the SPIRIT , yet get accused anyway . THE CHURCHES destroy themselves .
They quit being dire and grave , they quit warning against sin , CAUSE THEY GOT LULLED INTO
an idea , an acroynm an idea that once saved always saved . THEY QUIT TAKING Things serious .
TRUTH IS if one does come out from amongst us THEY WERE NEVER OF US , OR THEY WOULD HAVE CONTINUED
BUT THE TRUTH ALSO IS , IF ONE IS A LAMB , THEY GONNA BE WARNING JUST LIKE THE EARLY CHURCH AND JESUS DID .
FOR THEY have the SPIRIT and the SPIRIT IS KEEPING THEM SAFE and they by that SPIRIT DO ALL TO KEEP THE CHURCH THEY LOVE SAFE .
When folks quit with the original reminders , YOU KNOW LIKE YA GOTTA CONTINUE TO THE END
they started chipping away the very reminders BY THE SPIRIT , which keeps us safe , which keeps us on gaurd , which keeps
us alert . MY ADVICE FLEE CALVIN , FLEE acronyms , SIMPLE take every warning , eveRY IF in that bible and what does follow it
AS SOUND TRUTH AND GOOD FOR OUR SOUL .
 

Behold

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Freewill does not exist for an unbeliever!


How did i know you would say that freewill does not exist?
How can i know that about you?
Have i ever met you?
See, i dont have to meet you to know that Calvinism has taken your mind, ad that is what it does.
Its a mental mind TRAP that uses a handful of verses to destroy a person's ability to see past it, or even see it as it exists.
And that is how you can know that i know all about this Hell Vomited Satainic Theology that owns you, and some others here.

Let me tell you again.

Calvinism teaches that some of your family are going to hell.
THats a fact.
So, you decide who that will be, as according to CALVIN, its a few of them who are BORN to die, and go to hell, never having the FREE WILL option to. believe on JESUS, and God to Heaven.
See it?
See that?
That deception, is CALVINISM, and it owns your mind, because you have never realized just how HELLISH it is... Ronald Nolette

And also.
When you come back here to scream more about Calvin........ask yourself, who is causing me to keep going to Behold's Thread. ??????
Is it my Free will or. .......what?
 

amigo de christo

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Well something is not right with all men! Calvin was a product of His day. He fled Catholicism and they put witches to death. It takes time from fleeing Catholicism and studying the word to unlearn the old ways and learn better ways.

Calvin probably got a lot of things wrong! He is a man! None of us are perfect. But when He speaks truth, I will defend that truth. Not because Calvin came up with it, but because it is SCripture!
Even when i was first called it was not in my heart to KILL anyone .
Calvin might have fled ROME , but ROME never left calvin .
IF we want good examples of what true repentance looks like , LEARN SOME of the ANA BAPTIST teachings .
THEY seemed to have got it right . Even near his death the man still supported his tribunals . THAT OUTTA TELL YA SOMETHING .
HE never seemed to repent of it . RATHER ODD , cause if HE was a seasoned and mature in the faith man
HE would long have fled it . Just something to ponder on my friend .
 

Ronald Nolette

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Yet GOD himself says HIS DESIRE is not that the wicked would perish but rather they would repent .
WHY would GOD tell ISRAEL , TO REPENT and WHY WILL YE DIE . THE PROBLEM IS NOT WITH GOD , ITS MAN who refuses .
JESUS said what the ONLY CONDMENATION was .
LETS go look at it real close .
First i am gonna say it like calvin would .
Calvins JESUS would have said , THE ONLY CONDEMNATION IS that GOD SIMPLY created some to be destroyed .


But AFAIK Calvin never taught such drivel. that is made up by those who opposed his biblical stances. I don't know all of His teachings, but I do know tulip well.

Natural man refuses because he has no capacity to accept unless God does a work in their heart! Romans 8 makes that very clear!


We are soley saved by grace , After being called , one had better continue to heed the SPIRIT
or the flesh is gonna lead them to their ruin and demise .

Sorry but Jesus clearly and definitively taught that once we are saved- we are saved forever!!! We can grieve the Spirit, we can sin a sin unto death but we cannot lose what Jesus is guarding for us in heaven! At salvation, when Jesus forgave our sins- He forgave all of them, not just 99 99/100% of them!
 

Ronald Nolette

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Calvinism teaches that some of your family are going to hell.
THats a fact.


OKay I will bite- cite me the reference form Calvins teachings that says this! YOu keep saying it, you now say it is a fact and not opinion, so put up or shut up!
 

amigo de christo

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A bishop deacon or any said teacher , OUGHT to long have had his senses exercised to discern between good and evil .
SO WHY DIDNT CALVIN . HE was in no position to TEACH . ITS NO wonder he taught some of the things he did .
HE was no in position to teach , IF HE still supported folks being put to death . PEROID .
NO wonder his TWO LIPS taught TULIP . HE was never right with GOD . HE sure was never in any postion to guide or lead the peoples .
 
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Behold

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OKay I will bite- cite me the reference form Calvins teachings that says this! YOu keep saying it, you now say it is a fact and not opinion, so put up or shut up!


If you are not of the Pre Destined ELECT.
Where do you Go when you die?
And who chose you before you were born to be one the Elect or not?
So, according to your nutbar theology (Calvinism), some of your family are not the elect, as not all of them can be, (dont fool yourself).
So, who is it, in your family that are PREDESTINED to NOT BE the ELECT?
Will you lie and say that all of your family somehow won the spiritual Lottery and all of them are of the Elect ???
Most Calvinist will say..>"well all my family, and all my friends, and all my church members are of the Elect" = BIG FAT LIE.
So, dont live any longer in that fantasy world, Ronald Nolette

C'mon Ronald, time to be honest.
It'll be something new for you, here.
 

amigo de christo

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Last time i checked a bishop , deacon , elder or leader WAS SUPPOSED to be blameless so as they could actually lead a church .
SO two things . WHY DID PEOPLE even sit under calvin or make him a leader , WHEN THE MAN still believed
witches ought to be put to DEATH . THAT AINT BLAMELESS nor is it a small error . ITS A GRAVE AND DEADLY ERROR .
SO if i had been around and calvin had been teaching , I WOULD have said DISQUALIFIED to teach anyone .
CAUSE HE was in no position to teach . Again i say NO WONDER HIS TWO LIPS taught tulip . THE man
was not right to teach peroid . FOLKS , leaders and elders FOR SURE have to be RIGHT before they can teach .
LEST THEY DECIEVE THE CHURCH . I THINK ITS TIME WE OPEN BIBLES . What says you .
 
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amigo de christo

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But AFAIK Calvin never taught such drivel. that is made up by those who opposed his biblical stances. I don't know all of His teachings, but I do know tulip well.

Natural man refuses because he has no capacity to accept unless God does a work in their heart! Romans 8 makes that very clear!




Sorry but Jesus clearly and definitively taught that once we are saved- we are saved forever!!! We can grieve the Spirit, we can sin a sin unto death but we cannot lose what Jesus is guarding for us in heaven! At salvation, when Jesus forgave our sins- He forgave all of them, not just 99 99/100% of them!
HE supported his tribunals . HAD calvin truly been a seasoned man and apt to teach
HE would have told his tribunals , HEY WE DONT PUT ANYONE TO DEATH . WE simply cast them OUT of the church till they repent .
He never stopped them , he never stopped them from putting folks to death .
IF i set up tribunals and saw them doing things which ought not to be done , REST ASSURED
i would have corrected them and if they heeded not , THEY HAD BEEN DISQUALIFIED . NO , calvin
was in no position to lead nor teach . A LEADER , must be blameless . TRY and imagine paul allowing TRIBUNALS that put anyone to death .
IF calvin knew the bible WELL , WELL HE WOULD NEVER have allowed what HE allowed them to do .
THUS it proves HE was DISQUALIFIED in the EYES OF THE LORD to teach anyone .
 
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Behold

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A bishop deacon or any said teacher , OUGHT to long have had his senses exercised to discern between good and evil .
SO WHY DIDNT CALVIN . HE was in no position to TEACH . ITS NO wonder he taught some of the things he did .
HE was no in position to teach , IF HE still supported folks being put to death . PEROID .
NO wonder his TWO LIPS taught TULIP . HE was never right with GOD . HE sure was never in any postion to guide or lead the peoples .

The MYSTERY is how this man, Calvin, who was a part of the reason that another born again believer was burned alive, at the stake...
How in the world did this NUTBAR, end up, owning about 80% of Christianity.
His poison, much of His theology, has infected most "Denominations".
Its really remarkable that this one man has been able to sabotage so much of Christianity for hundreds of Years.
Anything that he ever taught that isn't wrong, is engulfed by the "predestined elect", demonic theology that has ruined so many people, even millions who are not Christians have Calvin-Infection.

Unbelievers, millions of them, believe that..>"it was all meant to be"...>"it is some cosmic design"...>"no free will".
And that is the heresy of JOHN CALVIN, that has even warped the minds of unbelievers.
 
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amigo de christo

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The MYSTERY is how this man, Calvin, who was a part of the reason that another born again believer was burned alive, at the stake...
How in the world did this NUTBAR, end up, owning about 80% of Christianity.
His poison, much of His theology, has infected most "Denominations".
Its really remarkable that this one man has been able to sabotage so much of Christianity for hundreds of Years.
Anything that he ever taught that isn't wrong, is engulfed by the "predestined elect", demonic theology that has ruined so many people, even millions who are not Christians have Calvin-Infection.

Unbelievers, millions of them, believe that..>"it was all meant to be"...>"it is some cosmic design"...>"no free will".
And that is the heresy of JOHN CALVIN, that has even warped the minds of unbelievers.
MARVEL NOT . LOOK at ROME and how many followed them . Calvin was bad enough , ROME was just as bad if not worse
YET BOTH to this day STILL have MANY FOLLOWERS . AS DO THE MORMONS , AS DOES and that list goes on and on .
I simply say its high time we return to bibles and learn that JESUS for our own selves . THEN we can test what any man does teach and say .
 
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ChristisGod

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OKay I will bite- cite me the reference form Calvins teachings that says this! YOu keep saying it, you now say it is a fact and not opinion, so put up or shut up!
Calvins book Calvins Calvinism from page 34. I'm reading through the book now.

"As to the great deep? why one man believes and another does not, why God delivers one man and not another? let him who can, search into that profound abyss; but let him beware of the awful precipice." Again, in another place he says: "Who created the reprobate but God?

https://reformed.org/wp-content/uploads/2019/04/CalvinsCalvinismJohnCalvin.pdf

page 37

Augustine then adds this short sentence: "These are the mighty works of the Lord, shining with perfection in every instance of His will; and so perfect in wisdom, that when the angelic and human nature had sinned ? that is, had done not what God willed, but what each nature itself willed ? it came to pass that by this same will of the creature, God, though in one sense unwilling, yet accomplished what He willed, righteously and with the height of all wisdom, overruling the evils done, to the damnation of those whom He had justly predestinated to punishment, and to the salvation of those whom He had mercifully predestinated to grace,
 

ChristisGod

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More proof

John Calvin confessed that the doctrine of Double Predestination was a horrible and dreadful decree in his Institutes of the Christian Religion. Calvin believed that the scriptures taught that God made an "absolute decree" (latin. decretum absolutum) before the foundation of the world that all people would be divided into two classes of the elect and the reprobate that was determined by God's decision alone.

Unlike many Calvinists today, Calvin believed that God's absolute decree to predestine an individual to eternal death was not a wonderful or glorious thing, instead Calvin confessed that it was a dreadful and horrible decree. Is it not a horrible decree that God would create something for eternal perdition. https://postbarthian.com/2014/05/31...uble-predestination-horrible-dreadful-decree/
 

ChristisGod

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Calvinism and the Problem of Damnation and Hell – Ronnie W. Rogers, "Taking every thought captive…"

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ronniewrogers.com

Calvinism’s exclusive doctrines position it in an untenable place when it comes to people spending eternity in hell. They offer various responses to allay the indefensible entailments of Calvinism that consign people to hell (the reprobate non-elect class). Here are a few: first, some say they deserve to be there. While that is true, it does not tell us why they are there since the people in heaven equally deserve to be in hell. Second, some say it is so God can show his full glory in both love and wrath. But damning people to hell is unnecessary for God to show his wrath or holiness since no one needed to suffer God’s wrath to demonstrate his holiness because Christ suffering his wrath for our sin is the quintessential display of God’s wrath.[1]

Third, some say people in hell chose to reject God. But people are not in hell simply because they chose to reject God, for the very people in heaven rejected God before he overpowered them with efficacious grace. If God had overpowered the ones in hell, they would have accepted him; hence the missing element is God’s overpowering grace. We also know people are not in hell to highlight God’s compassion, love, and grace by pedestaling his contrasting wrath and holiness; the death of Christ sufficiently displayed that. We also know they are not in hell because God was unwilling to do what was necessary for them to not be in hell. Because the death of Christ sufficiently took away the sin of the world (John 1:29; 1 John 2:2).

Once we dismiss the pleasantries of Calvinism, the only reason some are in heaven and some are in hell is because it pleased God for them to be there. Notwithstanding the weak and misleading arguments to the contrary by many Calvinists, I maintain all consistent Calvinists inevitably believe in double predestination. They either believe God actively predestined some to hell, as Calvin does, or he did so by choosing not to offer what would have surely delivered them from hell to heaven, which is unconditional election and selective regeneration. Calvin refers to this cold, inescapable reality as the product of God’s wish, pleasure, and counsel.[2]

Commenting on what Paul says in Romans 9, John Calvin candidly explains, “He [Paul] concludes that God has mercy on whom he will have mercy, and whom he will he hardeneth (Rom 9:18). You see how he refers both to the mere pleasure of God. Therefore, if we cannot assign any reason for his bestowing mercy on his people, but just that it so pleases him, neither can we have any reason for his reprobating others but his will[3] (italics added). Calvin further says the reprobate are doomed in God’s “hidden purpose” while simultaneously (and quite contradictorily) maintaining “so wonderful is his love towards mankind that he would have them all to be saved.”[4] Calvin classifies God’s good pleasure to doom this innumerable group of people, whom he created, to such a ghastly and unalterable fate, which he did not have to choose, as “incomprehensible judgment.”[5]

Similarly, the Canons of Dort assert, “Moreover, Holy Scripture . . . further bears witness that not all people have been chosen but that some have not been chosen or have been passed by in God’s eternal election—those, that is, concerning whom God, on the basis of his entirely free, most just, irreproachable, and unchangeable good pleasure,made the following decision: to leave them in the common misery into which, by their own fault, they have plunged themselves; not to grant them saving faith and the grace of conversion, but finally to condemn and eternally punish them”[6] (italics added).

Fast forward to eternity. Imagine all the redeemed, unconditionally elected according to Calvinism, are standing on the precipice of hell in which untold billions of people suffer unimaginable, unquenchable, and unparalleled agony and torment. While the elect gaze into the cauldron of hell, one of the unconditionally elect exclaims God is holy. And that proclamation is immediately and worshipfully met by thunderous amens and hallelujahs since, whether redeemed or judged, God’s perfect and unlimited righteousness and holiness are irrefutably evident to all.

Then another of the unconditionally elect, caught up in the moment, resoundingly declares that God is love. An eerie pause follows this declaration. A hollow cavern of silence. A silence not from or awakening calmness, but a silence invoked by an insurmountable contradiction. A silence wherein an attribute of God is suppressed by the conquest of evidence; a silence like never before. It is not one of awe and glorious wonder but one of confusion and demoralization of the elect.

While God clearly dealt with the elect and the damned in holiness, and the elect in love, it is impossible to truthfully say God dealt with the damned, the reprobate, in perfect love, salvific love. Seeking to explain how God is perfect love and yet withholds his salvific love from those he created and predetermined for eternal torment is like trying to explain God as perfect holiness if he did not deal with all people and sin in perfect holiness.

Moreover, seeking to dismiss this contradiction of God’s perfect love by appealing to such as how God’s withholding his power at times does not equal that he is not omnipotent is fallacious. The reason this argument is fallacious is because love is a moral attribute like holiness and power is not. Consequently, he may display or withhold exercising his omnipotence based on his moral attributes, but his moral nature of perfect holiness, righteousness, and love is always perfectly present. Calvinism calls this type of inescapable dilemma a “mystery.” Anywhere else, it is called what it is, a tragic contradiction in Calvinism, that depicts God unlike the God of Scripture.

[1] Even if people in hell were necessary, a point I do not concede, it seems probable that far fewer reprobates are necessary, and maybe only one would sufficiently display God’s wrath.
[2] John Calvin, Institutes of the Christian Religion, translated by Henry Beveridge (Grand Rapids: Wm. B. Eerdmans, 1997), vol. 2, bk. 3, chap. 21, sec. 7, pg. 210.
[3] John Calvin, Institutes of the Christian Religion(Bellingham: WA: Logos Bible Software, 2010).
[4] John Calvin, “Commentaries on the Second Epistle of Peter,” Commentaries on the Catholic Epistles, edited by John Owen (Grand Rapids, MI: Baker, 1979), 419. Logos electronic edition.
[5] John Calvin, Institutes of the Christian Religion, translated by Henry Beveridge (Grand Rapids: Wm. B. Eerdmans, 1997), vol. 2, bk. 3, chap. 21, sec. 7, pg. 211.
[6] Canons of Dort, First Head of Doctrine, article 15.
 

Ronald Nolette

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What you wrote makes no sense.
So, use any bible you own, and find a verse that says that "all people go to the lake of fire by nature".

You find that quote buy try these from Gods Word:

Ephesians 2
King James Version

2 And you hath he quickened, who were dead in trespasses and sins;

2 Wherein in time past ye walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience:

3 Among whom also we all had our conversation in times past in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind; and were by nature the children of wrath, even as others.

Psalm 58:3
The wicked are estranged from the womb: they go astray as soon as they be born, speaking lies.

sorry but we are born with a sin nature! We sin because we are sinners. we don"t become sinners because we sin.
 

Ronald Nolette

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If you are not of the Pre Destined ELECT.
Where do you Go when you die?
And who chose you before you were born to be one the Elect or not?
So, according to your nutbar theology (Calvinism), some of your family are not the elect, as not all of them can be, (dont fool yourself).


so you think you are God now telling people who can and cannot be saved? wow what pride!!!! I don't know if all my family are elect or not. Only god and you (in your mind) know that!

So, who is it, in your family that are PREDESTINED to NOT BE the ELECT?

No one is predestined to be lost- except in your mind. Still waiting for you to sho wme whewre Calvin teaches this!


C'mon Ronald, time to be honest.
It'll be something new for you, here.

when you have3 nothing positive to write- you resort to ad-hominem attacks and strawmen. Teh defense of the juvenile.


Most Calvinist will say..>"well all my family, and all my friends, and all my church members are of the Elect" = BIG FAT LIE.
So, dont live any longer in that fantasy world, Ronald Nolette

did you do a survey of "most Calvinists" or are you just spewing verbal methane here?
 

Ronald Nolette

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I never said they were . I simply said that perhaps according to calivin they were .

But Calvin never taught that AFAIK.


imply learn Christ . Know and understand that the only way one is saved is by the Grace of GOD through faith in Christ .
This may shock you but even the man calvin , that folks place upon a pedastal next to Christ himself , WAS DEAD WRONG on some things .

Well as I don't put any man on a pedestal that is irrelevant.

So what do you do with all those inconveninet bible verses about predestination, election, etc? Just ignore them? They are part ands parcel of learning Christ and walking in His way!

I say it would be a whole lot better if we simply taught what is written , RATHER than the intepretations of certain men .

I do teach what is written. But Calvinism, Lutheran ism, Armenism, etc are titles given to how some people believe what is written is said. I use Calvins name because it identifies the five points we are discussing here. I believe in those five points Calvin was biblically correct.

I would have no man name a religion after me .

Well pat yourself on the back for your humility. But I do not think they had the sects they satarted called by their names until after they were dead.

Maybe Jesus would send you back so you could tell them to stop it?

BUT EVEN PAUL
who taught correct doctrine as did appollos , as did peter , WOULD REBUKE the church for trying to even call themselves after paul
OR appollos . THESE Denominations , GOTTA GO and fast too . TIME TO RETURN TO BIBLES and LEARN JESUS

I agree denominiationalism is carnal, but it is the world of believers we live in! And when Jesus speaks of predestination, and elect before th foundation of the world, what are you going to do? Ignore it?
 

Ronald Nolette

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Calvinism teaches that some of your family are going to hell.

Either prove this by citing a teaching from Calvin, or stop bearin false witness against him! That means stop being a liar about what Calvin teaches. If you don't do this, it is time to place you where you belong- on ignore!

It seems the only thing you can bring to a discussion, is unproven claims, lies and condemnation of those who disagree with you!

YOu have yet to show a bible verse to rebut anything. All you have done is insult, accuse and condemn. that is the retort of a hyper carnal believer!

Show calvin teaches what you say or repent!