If the Truth appeared to you... would you believe it?

[Behold]

-
Lets Say that Jesus will appear to you in your bedroom tonight, and asks you...."Are you trusting in Me Alone, To get you into Heaven"?

And you say...."well, Lord, there are those verses In Hebrews Ch 4, 6, and 10...and that verse about "enduring to the end", and there is that Torah and those Commandments to keep, and .. ummmmmmmm, in not sure that im abiding enough this last few months"...

And Jesus says ...."I said, are you trusting in Me Alone, To get you into Heaven"?

And you say...> "Well, Lord, there is that verse about "willfully sinning", and that one about "Men gather them and they are cast into the fire", and that one about "depart from me, i never knew you", and oh yeah Lord, there is that one about being a "castaway"....

And Jesus smiles and says....>" I Didn't think you were....So, when do you think you will start trusting in Me Alone To get you into Heaven, or do you think that my Shed Blood and <>My Death and Resurrection<> and God's Grace are still not enough to do it for you"?

"When, will you learn to BELIEVE the Truth.... that I saved you and I alone keep you saved""

"When " ???

 

[justbyfaith]

Most definitely, the one who has a heart faith unto righteousness (Romans 10:10) and enduring to the end (Matthew 10:22, Hebrews 3:6, Hebrews 3:14) has eternal security...no doubt about it.

The nominal, lukewarm, or shallow faith does not provide the same security...see Luke 8:13.

As for me, I know that I have the first kind of faith mentioned...there is no doubt in my mind that Jesus has me in the palm of His hand and that I cannot lose my salvation.

 

[Behold]

enduring to the end (Matthew 10:22, .

Are you trying to prove that if a person does not endure to the end, who is born again, then in the end they will go to hell?

 

[marks]

Lets Say that Jesus will appear to you in your bedroom tonight, and asks you...."Are you trusting in Me Alone, To get you into Heaven"?

Isn't the question more like . . . are we trusting in Jesus to have life with Him? Now And forever?

Much love!

 

[justbyfaith]

Are you trying to prove that if a person does not endure to the end, who is born again, then in the end they will go to hell?

I am saying that if someone is truly born again, they will not fail to endure to the end...because they have been sealed by the Holy Spirit (Ephesians 1:13-14, 2 Corinthians 1:22, 2 Corinthians 5:5).

 

[BloodBought 1953]

Personally, I don’t care if I must “ endure” to the end...... I don’t care if the prerequisite for getting into Heaven is Juggling ten running chain- saws. Blind Folded.....
It’s up to God to “ finish the job that “ HE” started” ....If I must “endure” ,He will see to it that I endure. If I have to juggle Chain Saws to be Saved, God will see to it that will be able to JuggleChain Saws Before I Die.We either Trust God to Save us “ To the Uttermost”, or we don’t.I trust him.That is the only reason I am Saved and remain Saved..... “ The man who finds LIFE will find it by Trusting God....” My day - to - day Performance Stinks. Thanks to God and His Amazing Grace, I “DO” have “ONE” thing to offer, and it is enough— Faith. Faith enough to Rest in the Gospel Of Grace Plus Nothing....God Bless....

 

[justbyfaith]

If your day-to-day performance stinks, you need to seek the Lord.

See Hebrews 12:14.

 

[BloodBought 1953]

If your day-to-day performance stinks, you need to seek the Lord.

See Hebrews 12:14.

I already have “sought the Lord”....he extended to me His Grace...
According to The manner in which fallen humans weigh these things.....I am not a bad guy— not even close—- I am exaggerating my lousy Performance here to make a point. That point would be that I put NO Faith in “MY”
Performance .....I am too preoccupied with “ HIS” Performance— The Finished Work Of The Cross— to pay much heed to what I do and don’t do. I am much more “ SON” Conscience than I am “Sin” conscience.
The Preoccupation With Sin shows a lack of Faith . My Bible tells me that the Sin Problem was settled 2000 years ago. When I sin , I do the same thing with it that God does —- put it on the Cross.And then I “ Forget about them”. Just like God does.
I know that I am getting closer to God all of the time.It has been wisely noted that , “ The closer you get to God— the farther away from Him is how you see yourself”. I worry about those that are “ Just Fine” with their Performance.They have a bigger problem than I do.They need to get Closer to God, Perhaps.

 

[Behold]

Isn't the question more like . . . are we trusting in Jesus to have life with Him? Now And forever?

Much love!

A better question is found in the Thread's point. \
=Are we ONLY Trusting in Christ to get us to heaven, or are we trusting in US, instead.
Those who are trusting in themselves, have no real FAITH in Christ.
These heretics will talk about "enduring" which is s self effort and commandment keeping, which is a self effort, or abiding as a mental self effort.
All of this is SELF TRUST, ....and not real Faith in Christ.
The heretic believes that holding unto FAITH is holding onto Christ, which is to be self deceived as their trust in FAITH has replaced trust in Christ.

 

[Behold]

I am saying that if someone is truly born again, they will not fail to endure to the end...because they have been sealed by the Holy Spirit (Ephesians 1:13-14, 2 Corinthians 1:22, 2 Corinthians 5:5).

Well, you are mistaken to think that a backslider is not born again and kept saved by the blood of Jesus, exactly as a person who does not.
You can't seem to stop putting the responsibility for Salvaltion on the person's back.
In every post, you will quote a verse that says God is the savior, then you post one that you use to contradict Grace, with a self work.
Your theology, your personal theology is Jesus + Enduring.
Thats a Grace denying Theology, as it cant be Jesus + the Person's works as you keep on teaching.

 

[Episkopos]

The real "what if" here is...what if you actually knew God instead of all these inventions? What if you really had a close walk with Him instead of a fictional meeting scenario that plays with the mind? What if you actually encountered God and His Son Jesus to walk in the light?

Even this whole going to heaven thing shows how religious and dogmatic this all is. All theoretical. All made up from the flesh and the carnal mind.

The Pharisees and Scribes were the bible readers of their day. And it did them no good at all because they thought by reading them they too could "go to heaven."

But assumptions and presumptions take you the opposite way.

It has long been said that they who seek their utopia actually create hell. The road to hell is paved with religious dogmas and ideologies that bring people into the greatest bondage of all.

The bible is NOT meant to be taken religiously for one's own benefit. It is a call to humility and the fear of the Lord. It is a call to surrender all opinions, thoughts and presumptions. It is a call to seek the Lord.

 

[Behold]

The real "what if" here is...what if you actually knew God instead of all these inventions?

God knows me.
He's in me.
What if this happened to you?
All things are possible with God.
Dont give up.

 

[Episkopos]

God knows me.
He's in me.
What if this happened to you?
All things are possible with God.
Dont give up.

Such pride and arrogance in you proves that being born again is not enough. You are a mixture and everything you do is tainted by the flesh. Now you are blind to yourself and your own ways...you refuse correction...so you will remain filthy spiritually all your life. You refuse to consider repentance or even that you could be wrong: that you could be only half-baked and are drawing all the wrong conclusions.

So you are just spiritual enough to get things exactly wrong. You underestimate the depth that God is calling us to. So you think you've arrived when you have just fallen for a ploy that the devil plays on uncrucified people.

Do you have a satisfaction with yourself and your decisions? So the flesh is hiding so deep within you that you can't discern it.

 

[Behold]

Such pride and arrogance in you proves that being born again is not enough.

Before you can accuse me of not being born again, you yourself would need to discover what this means..

Start with understanding the Cross.
Continue to Paul and learn what "justification by Faith, without works" means.
Then learn to walk in the Spirit after you are born again.

You have a bit to do..
Let us know when you begin.

 

[Rocky Wiley]

The real "what if" here is...what if you actually knew God instead of all these inventions?

The Pharisees and Scribes were the bible readers of their day. And it did them no good at all because they thought by reading them they too could "go to heaven."

Joh 8:42 Jesus said unto them, If God were your Father, ye would love me: for I proceeded forth and came from God; neither came I of myself, but he sent me.
Joh 8:43 Why do ye not understand my speech? even because ye cannot hear my word.
Joh 8:44 Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.
Joh 8:45 And because I tell you the truth, ye believe me not.

Rev 2:9 I know thy works, and tribulation, and poverty, (but thou art rich) and I know the blasphemy of them which say they are Jews, and are not, but are the synagogue of Satan.

If one doesn't believe that Cain was a child of the devil, they need to study Gen 3 again.
Gen 3:13 And the LORD God said unto the woman, What is this that thou hast done? And the woman said, The serpent beguiled me, and I did eat.
beguiled - to be seduced

 

[justbyfaith]

I already have “sought the Lord”....he extended to me His Grace...
According to The manner in which fallen humans weigh these things.....I am not a bad guy— not even close—- I am exaggerating my lousy Performance here to make a point. That point would be that I put NO Faith in “MY”
Performance .....I am too preoccupied with “ HIS” Performance— The Finished Work Of The Cross— to pay much heed to what I do and don’t do. I am much more “ SON” Conscience than I am “Sin” conscience.
The Preoccupation With Sin shows a lack of Faith . My Bible tells me that the Sin Problem was settled 2000 years ago. When I sin , I do the same thing with it that God does —- put it on the Cross.And then I “ Forget about them”. Just like God does.
I know that I am getting closer to God all of the time.It has been wisely noted that , “ The closer you get to God— the farther away from Him is how you see yourself”. I worry about those that are “ Just Fine” with their Performance.They have a bigger problem than I do.They need to get Closer to God, Perhaps.

I agree with you to a certain extent. Our salvation is not based on our performance.

However, if we are truly saved/born again, then we are crucified with Christ, and we no longer live; but Christ lives in us; and the life we now live in the flesh we live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved us and gave Himself for us (Galatians 2:20).

If He is living His life in us and through us, how can He live a life that is anything short of perfection? For He is the perfect Son of God.

It is when we take back the control of our lives and begin again to live it for ourselves that we get in trouble and end up sinning.

Of course, if we are redeemed by the blood of the Lamb, there is a sense in which our performance doesn't matter...because God the Father looks down on us and sees the blood, righteousness, and perfect life of Jesus Christ His Son.

These heretics will talk about "enduring" which is s self effort and commandment keeping, which is a self effort, or abiding as a mental self effort.
All of this is SELF TRUST, ....and not real Faith in Christ.

Why then does the Bible teach us (Matthew 10:22, Hebrews 3:6, Hebrews 3:14) of the imperativity of enduring to the end?

Well, you are mistaken to think that a backslider is not born again and kept saved by the blood of Jesus, exactly as a person who does not.

A backslider ought to question whether he continues to be saved (2 Corinthians 13:5). If he is returning to his own vomit and to his own wallowing in the mire, he ought to question whether he is a dog or a pig rather than a sheep.

A sheep who is placed unwillingly in the mire or in vomit, hates the fact that he has been relegated to such filth, and reacts in disgust. There are those who have been forced into situations where they are in vomit or mud; but because they are sheep they will run back to the palace as soon as they get the opportunity. Whereas a pig, when cleaned up and put in the palace, will run back to the mud as soon as he gets the opportunity.

It is a matter of what is your nature on the inside.

In every post, you will quote a verse that says God is the savior, then you post one that you use to contradict Grace, with a self work.

How can any scripture contradict grace? This is assuming that grace is the sole teaching of God's word and is the whole of the gospel message.

Your theology, your personal theology is Jesus + Enduring.
Thats a Grace denying Theology, as it cant be Jesus + the Person's works as you keep on teaching.

So, you are saying that the Bible has grace-denying scriptures? (in Matthew 10:22, Hebrews 3:6, Hebrews 3:14).

 

[Behold]

If He is living His life in us and through us, how can He live a life that is anything short of perfection? For He is the perfect Son of God.

Have you actually ever been around other believers off of a forum?
I mean, you know, in real life?
Do you have any actual LIFE experience with actual Christianity and Christians?
If you did, you'd not talk fantasy..
Listen, believers are just people. And when you try to compare them to Paul, who was a person who was resurrected from the Dead, saw Heaven's Glory, and wrote the NT, nearly all of it because Jesus took this one person and used him to WRITE what we are to understand about Christianity,....

so, you can quote...>"its not i who live but Jesus who lives in me", yet, that is Paul's Christianity, and that is a totally unique experience that we can only hope to achieve.

 

[justbyfaith]

Have you actually ever been around other believers off of a forum?
I mean, you know, in real life?
Do you have any actual LIFE experience with actual Christianity and Christians?
If you did, you'd not talk fantasy..
Listen, believers are just people. And when you try to compare them to Paul, who was a person who was resurrected from the Dead, saw Heaven's Glory, and wrote the NT, nearly all of it because Jesus took this one person and used him to WRITE what we are to understand about Christianity,....

so, you can quote...>"its not i who live but Jesus who lives in me", yet, that is Paul's Christianity, and that is a totally unique experience that we can only hope to achieve.

I would say that my wife lives the life that I am talking about and she would say that I live it.

 

[Behold]

I would say that my wife lives the life that I am talking about and she would say that I live it.

This means that neither of you live the Life that im teaching, which is to be free from sinning and repenting and confessing.

This is not an insult, this is just the reality of you denying what i teach.
I simply Teach that we as believers are to understand how to live a perfected discipleship.
You say that "living Holy", as Paul explains as "If you walk in the Spirit, you shall not sin"...is according to you, "gnostic" teaching.

 

[justbyfaith]

This means that neither of you live the Life that im teaching,

Only if you are teaching that the life that we are to live is to be one of unholiness and unrighteousness.