Is it time for Christians to become more accepting towards muslims in politics?

[GodsGrace]

Go forth and make enemies of your neighbors? Strange interpretation of the Great commision

The Great Commission?
You think Islam cares about the great commission?

They'd like to see all Christians die.
Please correct me if I've misunderstood you.
THEY WILL NOT be changed.
They think YOU are the devil incarnate.

It took the crusades to get them out of Europe last time. It took hundreds of years. You want a repeat? Except we're so dumb these days that there won't even be a crusade. We'll just sit back and take it.

 

[Stranger]

Go forth and make enemies of your neighbors? Strange interpretation of the Great commision

Nations don't operate on the 'Great Commission'. islam would like us to...sure. Then they walk in unopposed.

Stranger

 

[truthquest]

I just read an encouraging news story. This is amazing.

ISIS – Pushing Muslims Toward Christ
Islamic State (ISIS) is now believed to have fully operational branches in 18 countries across the world, not only persecuting Christians, but also pushing Muslims toward Christ.
Its efforts to create a ‘pure’ Islamic nation are causing a growing number of Muslims to examine their faith more closely and more critically. “There are a lot of people turning from Islam”, said Ibrahim Al-Jamil, a pastor in northern Iraq. “Jesus has a big net and ISIS is pushing people toward this net. What we are seeing now is like the tip of the iceberg”.
Ibrahim said he also sees evidence on social media and elsewhere on the Internet that Muslims are leaving Islam. He said they are repulsed by what ISIS is doing and increasingly disagree with Islam’s teachings.
“ISIS is making people, especially Muslims, think about their faith and question the faith they were born in and don’t understand”, he said. “They were reading the Koran, but there is a veil. So now when they are reading the Koran they have better understanding and they are questioning if this is the true faith and if Allah is ordering people to kill each other”.
When they first leave Islam, Ibrahim said, many people initially claim no religion. They have been taught that Christianity is a false religion, and Judaism isn’t an option because Jews have long been viewed as the enemy.
“That is why if they didn’t see a dream or vision, they don’t come to Christianity”, Ibrahim added. “When they see a dream or vision, the first thing after Islam is Christianity because the vision and dream is about Jesus saving them or telling them something”.
Ibrahim estimates that about 80% of the Christian converts he has met came to Christ after having a dream about Jesus.
“Muslims strongly believe in dreams and visions”, he said. “And when we pray for the Muslims, the Lord is going to use the way that they are believing strongly, which is dreams and visions. Because a lot of people and a lot of churches are praying for Muslims specifically, that is why they see dreams and visions.
“One guy came to me and said, ‘I want to become a Christian.’ I said, ‘Why?’ He said, ‘Because I was in the river and no one could help me, but I saw a face full of light come to me and I was reaching my hand to Him and He took me out from the river.’ I asked him, ‘Who was this man?’ He said, ‘Jesus.’ I said, ‘How did you know Him?’ He said, ‘I just know Him.’
Another man who responded to a dream is now leading Muslims to Christ and helping believers grow in their faith.
“This guy saw all the prophets coming in his dream”, Ibrahim said. “All the prophets, one after one, starting from Moses. At the end he saw Jesus coming, the last one, and he said, ‘I waited for Muhammad to come,’ because for them he is the last one, ‘and nobody showed up.’ When I asked, ‘Where is the last one?’ they said, ‘Jesus is the last one.’ He became a Christian and now he is a pastor”.
Ibrahim said that being baptised means “they became a Christian, and they left their life, and now they are ready to die for Jesus”.
While ISIS continues to push Muslims toward Christ, it also continues to drive them out of their homes. ISIS has displaced over 3.3 million people in Iraq alone, with millions more fleeing Syria in search of safety. Though Christians are part of this exodus, Ibrahim’s church is continually replenished with new believers.
“It is constantly difficult [to keep people]”, he said, “but new people are coming, so the church is full every Sunday because a lot of people are coming to know Jesus”.
Many Christians in Iraq still fear ISIS attacks. While Ibrahim does not advise people whether to stay or leave, he does share his thoughts on what could happen if Christianity ceased to exist in Iraq.
“I usually say if you take the salt and the light out of Iraq, we are going to be more dark and without any taste”, he said. “So, the most challenging thing is to encourage people to stay in this area and minister”.
ISIS – Pushing Muslims Toward Christ - Voice of the Martyrs

 

[GodsGrace]

I just read an encouraging news story. This is amazing.

ISIS – Pushing Muslims Toward Christ
Islamic State (ISIS) is now believed to have fully operational branches in 18 countries across the world, not only persecuting Christians, but also pushing Muslims toward Christ.
Its efforts to create a ‘pure’ Islamic nation are causing a growing number of Muslims to examine their faith more closely and more critically. “There are a lot of people turning from Islam”, said Ibrahim Al-Jamil, a pastor in northern Iraq. “Jesus has a big net and ISIS is pushing people toward this net. What we are seeing now is like the tip of the iceberg”.
Ibrahim said he also sees evidence on social media and elsewhere on the Internet that Muslims are leaving Islam. He said they are repulsed by what ISIS is doing and increasingly disagree with Islam’s teachings.
“ISIS is making people, especially Muslims, think about their faith and question the faith they were born in and don’t understand”, he said. “They were reading the Koran, but there is a veil. So now when they are reading the Koran they have better understanding and they are questioning if this is the true faith and if Allah is ordering people to kill each other”.
When they first leave Islam, Ibrahim said, many people initially claim no religion. They have been taught that Christianity is a false religion, and Judaism isn’t an option because Jews have long been viewed as the enemy.
“That is why if they didn’t see a dream or vision, they don’t come to Christianity”, Ibrahim added. “When they see a dream or vision, the first thing after Islam is Christianity because the vision and dream is about Jesus saving them or telling them something”.
Ibrahim estimates that about 80% of the Christian converts he has met came to Christ after having a dream about Jesus.
“Muslims strongly believe in dreams and visions”, he said. “And when we pray for the Muslims, the Lord is going to use the way that they are believing strongly, which is dreams and visions. Because a lot of people and a lot of churches are praying for Muslims specifically, that is why they see dreams and visions.
“One guy came to me and said, ‘I want to become a Christian.’ I said, ‘Why?’ He said, ‘Because I was in the river and no one could help me, but I saw a face full of light come to me and I was reaching my hand to Him and He took me out from the river.’ I asked him, ‘Who was this man?’ He said, ‘Jesus.’ I said, ‘How did you know Him?’ He said, ‘I just know Him.’
Another man who responded to a dream is now leading Muslims to Christ and helping believers grow in their faith.
“This guy saw all the prophets coming in his dream”, Ibrahim said. “All the prophets, one after one, starting from Moses. At the end he saw Jesus coming, the last one, and he said, ‘I waited for Muhammad to come,’ because for them he is the last one, ‘and nobody showed up.’ When I asked, ‘Where is the last one?’ they said, ‘Jesus is the last one.’ He became a Christian and now he is a pastor”.
Ibrahim said that being baptised means “they became a Christian, and they left their life, and now they are ready to die for Jesus”.
While ISIS continues to push Muslims toward Christ, it also continues to drive them out of their homes. ISIS has displaced over 3.3 million people in Iraq alone, with millions more fleeing Syria in search of safety. Though Christians are part of this exodus, Ibrahim’s church is continually replenished with new believers.
“It is constantly difficult [to keep people]”, he said, “but new people are coming, so the church is full every Sunday because a lot of people are coming to know Jesus”.
Many Christians in Iraq still fear ISIS attacks. While Ibrahim does not advise people whether to stay or leave, he does share his thoughts on what could happen if Christianity ceased to exist in Iraq.
“I usually say if you take the salt and the light out of Iraq, we are going to be more dark and without any taste”, he said. “So, the most challenging thing is to encourage people to stay in this area and minister”.
ISIS – Pushing Muslims Toward Christ - Voice of the Martyrs

THIS IS ENCOURAGING TO YOU???

Yes. Usually I capitalize for emphasis.
Here, I'm actually speaking LOUDLY.
When are we going to wake up??
This is worse,,,not better!

 

[truthquest]

THIS IS ENCOURAGING TO YOU???

Yes. Usually I capitalize for emphasis.
Here, I'm actually speaking LOUDLY.
When are we going to wake up??
This is worse,,,not better!

It's encouraging that Muslims are coming to Christ. This isn't a perfect world but this is progress.

 

[GodsGrace]

It's encouraging that Muslims are coming to Christ. This isn't a perfect world but this is progress.

They're being kicked out of Islam because they're not radical enough.

It's good for them personally, but it's not good for the rest of the world which will see an ever increasing hatred in Muslims toward all others.

It's like ridding the Hitler regime of all moderates so only the big haters of Jews are left and willing to kill them off.

 

[truthquest]

They're being kicked out of Islam because they're not radical enough.

According to the news story this is what happened. they are repulsed by what ISIS is doing and increasingly disagree with Islam’s teachings.
“ISIS is making people, especially Muslims, think about their faith and question the faith they were born in and don’t understand. So they weren't kicked out. They chose to leave.

It's good for them personally, but it's not good for the rest of the world which will see an ever increasing hatred in Muslims toward all others.

People have a choice whether to hate or not. Their choosing not to hate is good for them and the rest of the world.

It's like ridding the Hitler regime of all moderates so only the big haters of Jews are left and willing to kill them off.

If they are choosing not to hate then they are not going to be hating Jews.

 

[GodsGrace]

According to the news story this is what happened. they are repulsed by what ISIS is doing and increasingly disagree with Islam’s teachings.
“ISIS is making people, especially Muslims, think about their faith and question the faith they were born in and don’t understand. So they weren't kicked out. They chose to leave.


People have a choice whether to hate or not. Their choosing not to hate is good for them and the rest of the world.


If they are choosing not to hate then they are not going to be hating Jews.

I did not intend to say they hated Jews.
I believe you misunderstood my comment.
I'm happy some of them are coming to salvation.
Unfortunately, the haters will be left behind.

 

[aspen]

Hey Aspen,
The link is nice..I looked at it.
But not everyone is going to.
How's about you give a synopsis?
And tell us what YOU think about it?

I'll say this.
Muslims who DO NOT practice their religion are much more acceptable to me than those that do.

Sad comment, isn't it?

Actually, i posted the link because it seems like a good basic description of sharia law in Britian - i knew nothing about it before this thread and reading the link so I am not sure I can speak intellengently about the subject, yet.

Here is what i got from the article:

1. Sharia law is complicated
2. Sharia law is cultural, not legal
3. Sharia law has legal ramafications for British citizens, concerning how Muslims treat women.

My impressions:

1. Change is scary
2. Sharing power is scary
3. Sorting out new ideas and norms when cultures share space takes time, but can be done well.

 

[aspen]

Nations don't operate on the 'Great Commission'. islam would like us to...sure. Then they walk in unopposed.

Stranger

Really?

No one operated according the ideas of the Great Commision before Christ called us to do so...it didnt stop Him from telling us to do so.

It is interesting that you are selective about what constitutes a ‘Christian nation’.....special emphasis on the self serving aspects, hmm

 

[Helen]

Hey @truthquest
Amen... if that is truly what is happening...
Time will tell eh!

My guess my reserve is..it is one thing to change from "Muslim to Christian" if there is a heart conversion....and just not to "christian" by name. ie as in USA, Canada and England known as "christian" countries... is everyone a christian of the heart..No!
No longer wishing to be a Muslim because of ISIS, does not mean a great change has taken place from the heart. Do you think?

Because I am such a skeptic about all this ...I would expect some Muslims to "become christians"...as sleepers...the day arrives which is coming, when it is declared and the call goes out..... 'rise up'.
My trust level is way down..

As for Sharia law...
Brutal... least said about that..

 

[Truth]

I must be really hateful and mean spirited because I don't understand the reasoning behind wanting to embrace a people whose ultimate goal is world dominance and killing everyone who is not like them...namely christians.

We can not except such behavior, as killing others, we also can not except homo-sexuality, If we do except anything such as this, then we are going along with it, which makes us partakers of such activity! We also can not Mimic these ways. those that have lost their lives will be restored, at the Last Trump, all those will be crying out from under the Alter, waiting for our Savior to render His Judgement! THEY WILL BE RESTORED! There is the Differance

 

[aspen]

Hey @truthquest
Amen... if that is truly what is happening...
Time will tell eh!

My guess my reserve is..it is one thing to change from "Muslim to Christian" if there is a heart conversion....and just not to "christian" by name. ie as in USA, Canada and England known as "christian" countries... is everyone a christian of the heart..No!
No longer wishing to be a Muslim because of ISIS, does not mean a great change has taken place from the heart. Do you think?

Because I am such a skeptic about all this ...I would expect some Muslims to "become christians"...as sleepers...the day arrives which is coming, when it is declared and the call goes out..... 'rise up'.
My trust level is way down..

As for Sharia law...
Brutal... least said about that..

ISIS is political. Islam is a religion. I am Irish Catholic. I am not a member of the Irish Republican Army. The difference is stark.

Also, the idea of Muslims pretending to be Christian can lead to dangerous practices - it sparked an inquistition in southern Spain - Muslims lost their lifes.

Trust level and faith are the same thing, which can be a sobering fact.......can we claim to be persons of faith and live our lives without trust?

 

[aspen]

We can not except such behavior, as killing others, we also can not except homo-sexuality, If we do except anything such as this, then we are going along with it, which makes us partakers of such activity! We also can not Mimic these ways. those that have lost their lives will be restored, at the Last Trump, all those will be crying out from under the Alter, waiting for our Savior to render His Judgement! THEY WILL BE RESTORED! There is the Differance

What does it mean to not accept Muslims? Or homosexuals, for that matter.....

What does it look like? Are we supposed to force them to convert or kill them? Seems to me that God allows people the freedom and dignity to make their own choices, shouldnt we?

 

[Dcopymope]

What does it mean to not accept Muslims? Or homosexuals, for that matter.....

What does it look like? Are we supposed to force them to convert or kill them? Seems to me that God allows people the freedom and dignity to make their own choices, shouldnt we?

There is a difference between tolerance and acceptance. I can tolerate your existence, and your religion, but I don't have to accept it. In other words, don't tread on my toes and we won't have a problem. Its not really our job to convert, our job is to simply spread the gospel. They will either accept it or they won't, and if they don't, you shake the dust off your feet and move on in life, real simple.

 

[Helen]

Trust level and faith are the same thing, which can be a sobering fact.......can we claim to be persons of faith and live our lives without trust?

I ask myself the same question Aspen.

I just resent that everyone now is supposed ( by law) to hop-to and play nice when all the time the aggressors brought this upon us all...and started changing all the rules of how everyone must live.
Now we are the bad guys if don't pretend that all is well and the world is 'warm and fuzzy' toward one and all.
I cannot just drop my guard and pretend that everything is going to work out well. I can't. Because I don't think it will.

 

[truthquest]

Hey @truthquest
Amen... if that is truly what is happening...
Time will tell eh!

My guess my reserve is..it is one thing to change from "Muslim to Christian" if there is a heart conversion....and just not to "christian" by name. ie as in USA, Canada and England known as "christian" countries... is everyone a christian of the heart..No!
No longer wishing to be a Muslim because of ISIS, does not mean a great change has taken place from the heart. Do you think?

There was something mentioned in the news story that I think can answer that. “they became a Christian, and they left their life, and now they are ready to die for Jesus”.
Also some of them become pastors and then reach out to other Muslims to witness to them.

Because I am such a skeptic about all this ...I would expect some Muslims to "become christians"...as sleepers...the day arrives which is coming, when it is declared and the call goes out..... 'rise up'.
My trust level is way down..

If we can imagine how the Christians feel who live in Iraq and other countries, under intense persecution, living in some of the worst conditions, being attacked from all sides, yet they still have enough trust and faith to reach out to Muslims, witness to them, help them in any way they can, and show kindness and compassion to them. And there are many Muslims who become Christians because they see the love, compassion and kindness in Christians.
Christians in those countries want to live in peace with their neighbors. There are also Muslims who want to live in peace with their neighbors.

 

[aspen]

I ask myself the same question Aspen.

I just resent that everyone now is supposed ( by law) to hop-to and play nice when all the time the aggressors brought this upon us all...and started changing all the rules of how everyone must live.
Now we are the bad guys if don't pretend that all is well and the world is 'warm and fuzzy' toward one and all.
I cannot just drop my guard and pretend that everything is going to work out well. I can't. Because I don't think it will.

Well, i am certainly not questioning your faith bygrace. I struggle with change, just like everyone else. I do however, see the benefit of dropping my guard......when you have forsaken everything.....you enjoy everything in your life. It will all pass away, but we will not.

 

[Helen]

I struggle with change, just like everyone else. I do however, see the benefit of dropping my guard......when you have forsaken everything.....you enjoy everything in your life. It will all pass away, but we will not.

Ouch Aspen.You got me good.
Yours is indeed 'the higher way'. You are right, I was posting as speaking as from the flesh life and not from our life in the Spirit.

Yet back at you brother ...if you 'live in the Spirit' why do you have such strong opinions re Trump? I don't think you "enjoy Trump" in your life any more than I enjoy what I read what the Dems that hate him say?
We are not yet 'dead to the world' maybe getting there...but not there yet.
Your words ( bold) were good for me..they jerked me back ...agree, all this will pass away...I forget to 'hold the vision.' Thanks.

 

[aspen]

Ouch Aspen.You got me good.
Yours is indeed 'the higher way'. You are right, I was posting as speaking as from the flesh life and not from our life in the Spirit.

Yet back at you brother ...if you 'live in the Spirit' why do you have such strong opinions re Trump? I don't think you "enjoy Trump" in your life any more than I enjoy what I read what the Dems that hate him say?
We are not yet 'dead to the world' maybe getting there...but not there yet.
Your words ( bold) were good for me..they jerked me back ...agree, all this will pass away...I forget to 'hold the vision.' Thanks.

I am convicting myself and simply speaking out loud

As far as Trump is concerned, i have stopped all news stories about him for my new years resolution