jessiblue
Well-Known Member
Okay, okay….we will still agree to disagree….for now….or maybe we’re both a little bit right?
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Is The Beast Of Revelation 13:1-8 A Political System On Earth?
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Timtofly
Well-Known Member
Then Satan is the only candidate for being the AC. Only one beast then? Satan Himself.
Addressing the question asked in the thread title: -
The answer is no. The understanding lies in our understanding of "who" or "what" the "entity" is that is described as the beast of Rev 13:1-8.
The beast described in Rev 13 is the same beast that is described in Daniel 7:19-26, is the four beasts of Daniel 7:1-12 acting in unison as if just one beast and the Rev 13 beast will exercise his influence over the peoples of the earth such that they follow his lead.
It is my understanding that the "beasts of Daniel 7 and the beast described also in Rev 13 are wicked fallen heavenly angels who are to be judged soon, at the same time that the kings of the earth are judged and that they with the judged kings of the earth will be locked up in a pit for many days to await their time of punishment. In Dan 7:12 we are told that the three beasts are kept alive for a season, i.e. for 1,000 years as described in Rev., and also for the little while period that immediately follows.
Now if the beast/beasts of the Bible are wicked fallen heavenly hosts, i.e. angels, then spiritually the can exercise dominion over many people to do their desired deeds that reflect the respective beasts will.
The understanding that has been developed over time hides the truth from us as to who the beasts actually are. Satan and the beasts have been successful in their deception of who they are and their desired purposes to lord it over the people of the earth.
Shalom
"Is The Beast Of Revelation 13:1-8 A Political System On Earth?"
The answer is no. The understanding lies in our understanding of "who" or "what" the "entity" is that is described as the beast of Rev 13:1-8.
The beast described in Rev 13 is the same beast that is described in Daniel 7:19-26, is the four beasts of Daniel 7:1-12 acting in unison as if just one beast and the Rev 13 beast will exercise his influence over the peoples of the earth such that they follow his lead.
It is my understanding that the "beasts of Daniel 7 and the beast described also in Rev 13 are wicked fallen heavenly angels who are to be judged soon, at the same time that the kings of the earth are judged and that they with the judged kings of the earth will be locked up in a pit for many days to await their time of punishment. In Dan 7:12 we are told that the three beasts are kept alive for a season, i.e. for 1,000 years as described in Rev., and also for the little while period that immediately follows.
Now if the beast/beasts of the Bible are wicked fallen heavenly hosts, i.e. angels, then spiritually the can exercise dominion over many people to do their desired deeds that reflect the respective beasts will.
The understanding that has been developed over time hides the truth from us as to who the beasts actually are. Satan and the beasts have been successful in their deception of who they are and their desired purposes to lord it over the people of the earth.
Shalom
Ziggy
Well-Known Member
It seems this happens a lot.
Luk 11:52 Woe unto you, lawyers! for ye have taken away the key of knowledge: ye entered not in yourselves, and them that were entering in ye hindered.
Jer 2:8 The priests said not, Where is the LORD? and they that handle the law knew me not: the pastors also transgressed against me, and the prophets prophesied by Baal, and walked after things that do not profit.
Which puts a whole new spin on these verses when considering "handling the word of God"
Col 2:20 Wherefore if ye be dead with Christ from the rudiments of the world, why, as though living in the world, are ye subject to ordinances,
Col 2:21 (Touch not; taste not; handle not;
Col 2:22 Which all are to perish with the using; ) after the commandments and doctrines of men?
Col 2:23 Which things have indeed a shew of wisdom in will worship, and humility, and neglecting of the body; not in any honour to the satisfying of the flesh.
So many teachers in the world telling us not to question their authority.
And every teacher has an interpretation of what the Bible says, and don't you question it.
I question EVERYTHING..
I personally believe the Beast is a worldly system controlled by the spirit of disobedience.
The same Beast that brought on the destruction of the flood in Noah's day.
The same Beast that caused the earth to become void and covered in darkness from the beginning.
Totalitarianism.
That's how I see it today.
Perhaps the Lord will show me something different tomorrow.
I'm not picky.. I eat whatever he puts on my plate.
Hugs
Dave Watchman
Active Member
Four beasts in Revelation, but Satan is our end time Antichrist.
He's the little horn, the stern faced king, from Daniel 11.
Same guy all the way throughout that evil chronology.
No human man, "is this the man that made the nations tremble?", could fulfill the specifications of Paul's "man" of sin.
Brakelite
Well-Known Member
When the early church became corrupted by departing from the simplicity of the gospel and accepting heathen rites and customs, she lost the Spirit and power of God; and in order to control the consciences of the people, she sought the support of the secular power. The result was the papacy, a church that controlled the power of the state and employed it to further her own ends, especially for the punishment of "heresy."
In order for the United States to form an image of the beast, the religious power must so control the civil government that the authority of the state will also be employed by the church to accomplish her own ends.
This is what is taking place before your eyes. The evangelical and charismatic wing of Christianity has for decades now sought to so control the political power in the United States that the inevitable result is an image to the papal beast. A union of church and state destined to persecute anyone who may differ from the popular teachings of that power.
I wonder if there's any evidence that like evangelicals are doing today, the infant papal institution in the 6th century focused attention on the heretics and schismatics, on the 'liberals and the socialists', as the chief enemies of Christ... Of course there is...What the modern Protestant church fail blindingly to acknowledge is that they themselves are becoming the enemy, and by distracting everyone by pointing to social causes and politics, all they are accomplishing is to cover their own adulterous practise of canoodling with the emperors.
In order for the United States to form an image of the beast, the religious power must so control the civil government that the authority of the state will also be employed by the church to accomplish her own ends.
This is what is taking place before your eyes. The evangelical and charismatic wing of Christianity has for decades now sought to so control the political power in the United States that the inevitable result is an image to the papal beast. A union of church and state destined to persecute anyone who may differ from the popular teachings of that power.
I wonder if there's any evidence that like evangelicals are doing today, the infant papal institution in the 6th century focused attention on the heretics and schismatics, on the 'liberals and the socialists', as the chief enemies of Christ... Of course there is...What the modern Protestant church fail blindingly to acknowledge is that they themselves are becoming the enemy, and by distracting everyone by pointing to social causes and politics, all they are accomplishing is to cover their own adulterous practise of canoodling with the emperors.
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Ari Goldberg
New Member
Gotquestions.org says the beast sometimes represents a coalition of nations and sometimes a person - the Antichrist. Are there not other places in Revelation that use words that seemingly refer to an individual but actually represent a group? Isn't the false church sometimes referred to as a whore? Doesn't the Mother of Harlots refer to a false religious system? How about the word "child" representing the true church? The men on the different colored horses of Revelation 6: did four men on four horses do all the things spoken of them (conquering, taking peace from the earth, power over a fourth of the earth, etc.)? Why couldn't the beast refer to a beast system, such as the Power Elite of today, who are in charge of the UN, the World Economic Forum, the central banks, etc.?
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Ari scripture clearly teaches the bad guy (The Antichrist) will be a individual human man, a King/Ruler, and he will be a Jew/Hebrew, his fathers worshipped the true Hebrew (God) or (God Of His Fathers)
Daniel 11:36-37KJV
36 And the king shall do according to his will; and he shall exalt himself, and magnify himself above every god, and shall speak marvellous things against the God of gods, and shall prosper till the indignation be accomplished: for that that is determined shall be done.
37 Neither shall he regard the God of his fathers, nor the desire of women, nor regard any god: for he shall magnify himself above all.
Both beasts are persons, but they simultaneously run and control political and military systems.
The beast that comes out of the sea is a being. That it’s a being is evident - it has seven crowns and ten horns, just like Dragon does - is Satan a political system?
One beast comes out of the earth representing out of hell, and it has ten crowns indicating its a person who controls ten kingdoms or kings.
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The beat that rise up out of the sea are the seven head with their kingdom, ruling as kingdoms upon this earth. John was told the sixth king was ruling during his time. A seventh one would come and comes to an end. Then out of the seven will one come up from the bottomless pit to rule as the eighth king with his kingdom reviving the beast one again. The first seven kings coming from the sea are from the world. But the eighth will be from the bottomless pit. The devil to rule the last kingdom of the beast here on earth.
Brakelite
Well-Known Member
Why would God be so inconsistent as to change the rules of prophetic interpretation just when it matters most? Is God confusing the issue deliberately, or is He the same yesterday and today and wants His people to be clear in their understanding so as not to be deceived in these last days?
He sent Gabriel to tell Daniel what the beasts were in his visions. Specifically empires. Babylon. Media-Persia. Greece. Named directly. The 4th beast wasn't named, but history attests to it being Rome. Empires. Every one. All of them rising from the sea. And the sea is?
KJV Revelation 17:15
15 And he saith unto me, The waters which thou sawest, where the whore sitteth, are peoples, and multitudes, and nations, and tongues.
Then to Revelation 13. Another beast also rising from the sea. A composite of all the previous 4 from Daniel. And all of a sudden this beast is an individual? Please guys show some insight and common sense. Be consistent to interpretation.
The beast of Revelation is also an empire. A political power with global aspirations and a history that incorporates the attributes and cultures of those powers that preceded it. But there's something else. It's also a religious power. It's interested in worship and seeks it's own glory. And it received it's throne and seat and authority from the dragon... Satan. For those who are unfettered by preconceived ideas, an interest in history, and even a cursory understanding of the nature of the powers of Daniel and what this 5th power inherited, it isn't all that difficult to discern the true identity of this beast.
He sent Gabriel to tell Daniel what the beasts were in his visions. Specifically empires. Babylon. Media-Persia. Greece. Named directly. The 4th beast wasn't named, but history attests to it being Rome. Empires. Every one. All of them rising from the sea. And the sea is?
KJV Revelation 17:15
15 And he saith unto me, The waters which thou sawest, where the whore sitteth, are peoples, and multitudes, and nations, and tongues.
Then to Revelation 13. Another beast also rising from the sea. A composite of all the previous 4 from Daniel. And all of a sudden this beast is an individual? Please guys show some insight and common sense. Be consistent to interpretation.
The beast of Revelation is also an empire. A political power with global aspirations and a history that incorporates the attributes and cultures of those powers that preceded it. But there's something else. It's also a religious power. It's interested in worship and seeks it's own glory. And it received it's throne and seat and authority from the dragon... Satan. For those who are unfettered by preconceived ideas, an interest in history, and even a cursory understanding of the nature of the powers of Daniel and what this 5th power inherited, it isn't all that difficult to discern the true identity of this beast.
Earburner
Well-Known Member
That's nice, but you are 100% wrong!
Beasts are always world empires, and not ever are they horns, nor can horns ever become empires/beasts. See Daniel for the correct symbolism for beasts etc.
The 10H beast, that we see in KJV- Revelation 13:2, is the evolved states of the 4th beast of Daniel, having parts/remnants of the three beast before it.
1. It began as the Roman Empire
2. It evolved into the RCC and the countries of Europe, and has been evolving into its final stage of
3. A global Financial Empire, of which the MoB will be generated from.
In others words, the three stages of the 10h Beast have been
1st. A MIlitary system.
2nd. A Religious system.
and now is:
3rd. A Financial system.
That is nice. One pot calling the other pot black because of the fifty shades of Black, or is that Grey?
Until you understand what or who the entities are of the four winds of heaven, and how they are imprisoned, and when they are imprisoned, then this thread has all been about whose conjecture is closer to the truth.
The fact is that most of the positions adopted is just another shade of grey from the pig sty's washout.
Earburner
Well-Known Member
The fact is that in all of the positions, "there can always be more than one lie, but there can never be more than one truth."-
Earburner
Oh Earburner, the problem is that every false understanding is always wrapped around one or more "biblical" truth(s) to make it more palliative or acceptable.
Dave Watchman
Active Member
It looked that way didn't it.
But was there more to it?
It was not the Pope. He was just one of the "heads", the head that was wounded by the sword yet now lives. It was not Rome, it was not the Church in Rome. It was the combination of the two, church and state. Religious authority and government. Ask Anna Charboniere during her Piedmont Easter. Her blood cries out from beneath the alter.
What I think ultimately makes the fourth beast so different and exceedingly terrifying from the first 3 was not it's iron teeth but it's strange alliance of church and state, who can make war with it? It's not as simple as just Rome or a revival of the holy Roman empire that we need to be concerned about. It was how this unholy alliance between church and state morphed into a monster beast that had absolute and corrupt power over so many people. In the 1500's you had a guy like Martin Luther that wasn't always safe and on some occasions running from the stake in his own home country. And the King of England had to ask the Pope for permission to divorce his wife. See how the crowns, the authority, were still with the heads, the religious authority? But one of the most bizarre stories I found was the exhumation of John Wycliffe who they didn't manage to catch alive, so they dug him up and burned his dead body. That's what you call true hatred and I'm sure that this Dragon hates our guts as well.
Fast forward for a glimpse of our composite beast now. This is what the Dragon, the Antichrist, has given his power, and his throne, and his great authority to now. But this time the crowns on our present day composite beast have moved from the seven heads, the religious authority, to the ten horns, the governmental authority of the sea beast. Who can make war with it.
1) The Netherlands (2000)
2) Belgium (2003)
3) Canada (2005)
4) Spain (2005)
5) South Africa (2006)
6) Norway (2009)
7) Sweden (2009)
8) Argentina (2010)
9) Iceland (2010)
10) Portugal (2010)
11) Denmark (2012)
12) Brazil (2013)
13) England and Wales (2013)
14) France (2013)
15) New Zealand (2013)
16) Uruguay (2013)
17) Luxembourg (2014)
18) Scotland (2014)
19) Finland: (signed 2015, effective 2017)
20) Ireland: (2015)
21) United States: (2015)<-------1290 Days------->Sun/Moon
21) United States: (2015)<-------1290 Days------->EofW
What you are seeing here is evidence of a feat that could not be accomplished my a mere mortal man. This is the little horn, the stern faced king, rising up to the place of God's Sanctuary, the Man of Sin taking his seat in the Temple of God and claiming to BE God.
This is the composite beast rising from the many nations and peoples and tongues.
They voted the evil thing in, now watch as wrath falls on the sons of disobedience.
COVID-19
Because of the signs that the Dragon is given the power to do on behalf of, or in the presence of the first beast, he will cause the people to set up an IMAGE of the beast that WAS wounded by the sword and yet now lives.
Hint: Daniel's beast from the middle ages is not the identical version we are facing now.
I might have about a 1 in 100 chance of explaining this to a historicist, or an SDA, but you must know therefore and understand that God cannot be constrained by what man calls "exegesis", or so called rules of interpretation. But you must also understand, or at least have the ability to consider, that the United States is not the second beast that rises from the earth, the United States IS the earth that DID help the woman from Revelation 12 after the conclusion of 1260 years of Papal persecution. The bad news is that it's the same earth from Revelation 13 that the second beast has risen from and he is our end time Antichrist.
Just because the "beasts" of Daniel were nations, does not force the beasts of Revelation to be the same. Does anyone think that the beast that ascends from the bottomless pit that makes war on and kills the two witnesses is a nation or country? It's not. He's not. It's an individual. He's the angel KING of the abyss, Satan. In this example, Satan is the beast that ascends out of the bottomless pit and goes to his destruction, fire lake.
"The beast that you saw was,
and is not, and is about to rise from the bottomless pit and go to destruction.
and is not, and is about to rise from the bottomless pit and go to destruction.
I usually get in trouble when I say the Antichrist is here now, he's just waiting to be revealed.
So check out this video from a very smart secular guy. He was on the team that invented the mRNA style of vaccines. Many other smart people have also noticed how an entity has apparently taken over the world by a form of mass hypnosis.
Mass Formation Psychosis.
Crowd Psychosis.
The precursors for mass formation psychosis.
Because of the signs he is given the power to do.
Now think about what happened when the virus broke out.
The WORLD obsessed over this virus.
The entire population gets focused on one thing.
He will cause the people to set up an image of the beast that was wounded by the sword and yet lives.
There were a lot of signs that there was an intentional component here.
Because of the signs.
We are sitting in a situation here in which we have been actively managed PSYCHOLOGICALLY.
By some ENTITY who has financial benefit or POWER.
And then leaders step in to seize this moment.
The Dragon gives his power and his throne and his great authority to the members of the composite beast.
The crowd can see no evil, they can hear no evil, they can speak no evil,
And those leaders can say anything.
It does not have to be true and the crowd will believe it.
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I disagree, (The Beast) of Revelation chapter 13 will be a human man, King or Ruler, of Jewish/Hebrew decent
Cannot see the trees because of the forest of lies around the understanding of God's revealed truth.
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A direct personal attack calling my understanding of Gods words "Lies" a false claim
Jesus Is The Lord
When you understand the entities of the beasts, then perhaps you will understand the statement I have made and why the lies exist to hide the true identities of the beasts.
My understanding is that the beasts of Daniel 7 are wicked fallen heavenly hosts, i.e. angels, that are able to influence humans to manifest the dominate characteristic of all of the respective beasts so that each of the respective beasts appear to rise up out of the sea of humanity.
The beasts exist within God's heaven and their spiritual abilities to directly influence people to live within their respective dominions for a time which enables us to see the powers of the respective beasts within our domain on earth. It is because the beasts are able to manifest in different people, people groups, kingdoms and empires over different time periods that we are able to see the rise and fall of the various manifestations of the beasts over time.
When the "beasts", i.e. the fallen angels, are imprisoned for a time in the Bottomless Pit such that their influence over people is removed in our near future, that we will be able to more clearly understand this fact from the scriptures.
Now since you believe that your understanding is infallible, it really does not matter what I say or suggest, you will take offense because I do not accept your understanding as being in any way true, since you believe that you have this revelation from God's word and as such it must be true.
Have a good day now
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