James Was Not Talking about Faith in Jesus Christ for Salvation

[praise_yeshua]

he answer is yes. Faith alone saves. James is asking a silly question.

What saved Abraham?
This us how Abraham was saved,
]You are incorrect about initial salvation.
No one was saved by belief without obedience. Not one example in all the bible teaches this.

You are incorrect about James' teachijg.
James taught salvation comes only by an obedient faith, James 2:14 ; 2:24-26.

James gives us the example of Abraham being saved by faith and obedience to Gods commandments.

James 2:21
Was not Abraham our father justified by works when he offered his son Isaac on the altar?
-23
And the scripture was fulfilled which says, Abraham believed God and it was accounted to him for righteousness. And he was called the friend of God.

James is quoting Genesis 15:6,
And he believed in the Lord and He accounted it to him for righteousness.

Did Abraham become righteous in the eyes of God by doing nothing? Just belief?
No, His faith was justified made perfect because he believed then obeyed God!

Genesis 22:12,
And God said, Do not lay your hand on the Lad, or do anything to him; for now I know that you fear God since you have not withheld your son, your only son from Me.

Abraham's faith was accounted as righteousness because it had obedient works!

Genesis 26:5,
Because Abraham obeyed My voice and kept My charge, My commandments, My statutes, and My laws.

It was an obedient faith that saved Abraham.
If Abraham only believed God but never obeyed Gods commands to leave his homeland.
God would have never said in Genesis 15:6 that Abraham's faith was accounted as righteousness.

Did Abraham do nothing before Genesis 15:6? Just believe?
No, With his faith he obeyed God.

Genesis 12:1-20 obedience not faith only
Genesis 13:1-18 obedience not faith only
Genesis 14:1-24 obedience not faith only

Genesis 15:6 God tells Abraham because of his faith with works of obedience, God accounts his faith as righteousness.

No one is justified or made righteous by God with belief and no obedience ie faith alone.

James 2:19,
You believe there is one God. You do well. Even the demons believe (alone) and tremble.

Abraham didn't offer up his son. Isaac lived.

If you're claiming that the offering of Isaac saved Abraham, then you're being rather silly.... Just like James.

 

[Titus]

Abraham didn't offer up his son. Isaac lived.

If you're claiming that the offering of Isaac saved Abraham, then you're being rather silly.... Just like James.

That is a very silly argument sir,
Now tell me what is the true revelation of God?
How do I know what truth is?

 

[Titus]

Abraham didn't offer up his son. Isaac lived.

If you're claiming that the offering of Isaac saved Abraham, then you're being rather silly.... Just like James.

Are you a "lone wolf"
What I mean is,
Some men think only they understand the truth.
These folks tend to not worship God on Sunday at any church.
Because, " they are all hypocrites "

I am wondering if you attend church services anywhere?

 

[Titus]

Paul didn't preach the book of James.

Paul preached the exact same gospel James preached,

2Thessalonians 1:8
In flaming fire taking vengeance on those who do not know God, and on those who do not obey the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ.

Paul never taught faith only saves!
Paul taught an obedient faith is what saves.

Faith alone salvation is salvation by disobedience.

 

[praise_yeshua]

That is a very silly argument sir,
Now tell me what is the true revelation of God?
How do I know what truth is?

How is it silly. Abraham didn't give anything other than faith in his offering of Isaac.

Faith alone.

 

[Titus]

How is it silly. Abraham didn't give anything other than faith in his offering of Isaac.

Faith alone.

Really?
You believe Abraham did not obey Gods commandment?
Genesis 22:1-3.

Did Abraham do nothing only believe?

Are you going to teach me the true word of God.
PM me let's have a private study.

YOU MAKE A HUGE CLAIM LIKE THE CANON IS MAN MADE!
I strongly want to know if I have been deceived by men!

 

[praise_yeshua]

Are you a "lone wolf"
What I mean is,
Some men think only they understand the truth.
These folks tend to not worship God on Sunday at any church.
Because, " they are all hypocrites "

I am wondering if you attend church services anywhere?

No. Not everybody is a hypocritic. I do well with others until I have to correct what they say. People generally don't like being corrected.

I don't ALLOW anyone to believe for me..... I'm like those at Berea.

Act 17:11 These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so.

Satan is afraid of the Truth. He doesn't like to be questioned.

Those that serve Christ don't mind being questioned.

 

[praise_yeshua]

Really?
You believe Abraham did not obey Gods commandment?
Genesis 22:1-3.

James and you both referenced the offering of Isaac as if it involved "work". It didn't. Abraham didn't give his Son. God did. God alone is to be praised. Not Abraham. That is what you WANT....

To be praised.

Are you going to teach me the true word of God.
PM me let's have a private study.

YOU MAKE A HUGE CLAIM LIKE THE CANON IS MAN MADE!
I strongly want to know if I have been deceived by men!

I have nothing to hide. I'm fine with dealing with this in public.

I told you to start a thread on the canon if you really want to know. I will participate. Many websites will not allow such a discussion. I don't know if it is acceptable here. Bible.org once had one of the BEST forums on the internet and they shut it down because of the canonical discussions taking place on the forum. They first banned the topic, removed all the content, and then eventually shutdown the forum.

 

[praise_yeshua]

Paul preached the exact same gospel James preached,

2Thessalonians 1:8
In flaming fire taking vengeance on those who do not know God, and on those who do not obey the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ.

Paul never taught faith only saves!

Rom 4:7 Saying, Blessed are they whose iniquities are forgiven, and whose sins are covered.
Rom 4:8 Blessed is the man to whom the Lord will not impute sin.

David murdered Uriah and by the "law of God" should have been killed. The only reason he wasn't condemned is because of his position.

Make an application.

Abraham lied multiple times. Lied so much in fact that God has to intervene and stop Sarah from being soiled. Abraham would have let another man take his wife.....

All this talk of "obedience".... is nonsense. We are rebels in our very nature. We continue to sin after being imparted Righteousness.

James ignored this and preached nonsense. That is what you're doing. You're ignoring your own sinfulness and pretending you're being obedient. Sure. You might "obey" once in a while. THEN.... you sin AGAIN. This happens over and over in a "saved" person's life. You're pretending to be something you're not.

Paul taught an obedient faith is what saves.

Being obedient to the call of the Gospel takes no work on the part of the person believing. They are TRUSTING... another. Jesus Christ.

 

[Titus]

No. Not everybody is a hypocritic. I do well with others until I have to correct what they say. People generally don't like being corrected.

I don't ALLOW anyone to believe for me..... I'm like those at Berea.

Act 17:11 These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so.

Satan is afraid of the Truth. He doesn't like to be questioned.

Those that serve Christ don't mind being questioned.

Good,
where do you worship?

 

[Titus]

Rom 4:7 Saying, Blessed are they whose iniquities are forgiven, and whose sins are covered.
Rom 4:8 Blessed is the man to whom the Lord will not impute sin.

David murdered Uriah and by the "law of God" should have been killed. The only reason he wasn't condemned is because of his position.

Make an application.

Abraham lied multiple times. Lied so much in fact that God has to intervene and stop Sarah from being soiled. Abraham would have let another man take his wife.....

All this talk of "obedience".... is nonsense. We are rebels in our very nature. We continue to sin after being imparted Righteousness.

James ignored this and preached nonsense. That is what you're doing. You're ignoring your own sinfulness and pretending you're being obedient. Sure. You might "obey" once in a while. THEN.... you sin AGAIN. This happens over and over in a "saved" person's life. You're pretending to be something you're not.



Being obedient to the call of the Gospel takes no work on the part of the person believing. They are TRUSTING... another. Jesus Christ.

The real problem with trying to study with you is, you're a mind reader.
I say nothing of being perfectly sinless,
And you tell me that I think I'm perfectly sinless.

Where did I define obedience as being perfectly sinless?
It is very difficult to take you seriously

 

[praise_yeshua]

Good,
where do you worship?

Many places.

Joh 4:23 But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeketh such to worship him.
Joh 4:24 God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.

If you want me to name a "club" in my area that I'm a member of, I can't name one.

The body of Christ is larger than just YOUR FEW you choose to assembly with. That is what people like you do. You keep looking until you find one you like.

Notice how Jesus destroyed that nonsense in John 4. Read it several times......

I don't have to come to YOUR "mountain" to worship God. I have direct access.

Why don't you get your "Pastor" on here to discuss this. I would rather talk to the person who is believing for you..... I don't particularly enjoy talking to "parrots"....

 

[praise_yeshua]

The real problem with trying to study with you is, you're a mind reader.
I say nothing of being perfectly sinless,
And you tell me that I think I'm perfectly sinless.

Where did I define obedience as being perfectly sinless?
It is very difficult to take you seriously

The problem with you is... you're ignoring your own demands.

You require obedience and you're not obedient yourself.

Why are YOU not obedient. I haven't demanded you be obedient to anything other than having faith in the Gospel.

You're the one with all the requirements.

 

[praise_yeshua]

The real problem with trying to study with you is, you're a mind reader.
I say nothing of being perfectly sinless,
And you tell me that I think I'm perfectly sinless.

Where did I define obedience as being perfectly sinless?
It is very difficult to take you seriously

1. When you sin, what work do you bring to atone for your sin?
2. If you believe all you have to do is ask God to forgive you, then what WORK is involved in such a request?

 

[Titus]

Many places.

Joh 4:23 But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeketh such to worship him.
Joh 4:24 God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.

If you want me to name a "club" in my area that I'm a member of, I can't name one.

The body of Christ is larger than just YOUR FEW you choose to assembly with. That is what people like you do. You keep looking until you find one you like.

Notice how Jesus destroyed that nonsense in John 4. Read it several times......

I don't have to come to YOUR "mountain" to worship God. I have direct access.

Why don't you get your "Pastor" on here to discuss this. I would rather talk to the person who is believing for you..... I don't particularly enjoy talking to "parrots"....

I figured you were a "lone wolf" didn't I!

Hebrews 10:25,
Not forsaking the assembling of ourselves together as is the manner of some, but exhorting one another and so much the more as you see the day approaching.

 

[Titus]

The problem with you is... you're ignoring your own demands.

You require obedience and you're not obedient yourself.

Why are YOU not obedient. I haven't demanded you be obedient to anything other than having faith in the Gospel.

You're the one with all the requirements.

I've lost interest in any discussion with you, other than what is truth? How do we know the truth?
PM me. Let's do a private study together

 

[praise_yeshua]

I figured you were a "lone wolf" didn't I!

That is what your pastor has taught you. I'm not alone. Jesus Christ is with me. My audience is larger the cheerleaders you have down at your assembly. Your "puppet master/pastor" definitely has you under control. I mean seriously... KJVOism? KJOVism among Freewill Baptists is rare. I bet he uses that to his advantage too.....

If I told you I was going to "such and such" church, all you would do is attack that church. You're grasping at "straws"....

Tell me, why are you not a "lone wolf" when you've separated yourself from the rest of God's little children????

Jud 1:19 These be they who separate themselves, sensual, having not the Spirit.

Hebrews 10:25,
Not forsaking the assembling of ourselves together as is the manner of some, but exhorting one another and so much the more as you see the day approaching.

"after the manner of some is"... is very broad. I don't separate myself from Christians. That is why I'm here. I fellowship with all those who name the name of Christ.

 

[Titus]

That is what your pastor has taught you. I'm not alone. Jesus Christ is with me. My audience is larger the cheerleaders you have down at your assembly. Your "puppet master/pastor" definitely has you under control. I mean seriously... KJVOism? KJOVism among Freewill Baptists is rare. I bet he uses that too his advantage too.....

If I told you I was going to "such and such" church, all you would do is attack that church. You're grasping at "straws"....

Tell me, why are you not a "lone wolf" when you've separated yourself from the rest of God's little children????

Jud 1:19 These be they who separate themselves, sensual, having not the Spirit.



"after the manner of some is"... is very broad. I don't separate myself from Christians. That is why I'm here. I fellowship with all those who name the name of Christ.

You are one angry man

 

[praise_yeshua]

I've lost interest in any discussion with you, other than what is truth? How do we know the truth?
PM me. Let's do a private study together

No. We can have a public discussion.

I've ran into those like you before. You're one of them people that don't want others to really see your weaknesses. I've had "pastors" privately agree with me and then from the "pulpit" preach against what they said they believed to me.....

It is all about "pretense" for you. You can't admit that you've been wrong "publically". If you did, then it would mean that the lie you told others about "God calling you" wouldn't mean anything.

 

[praise_yeshua]

You are one angry man

Not at all. I was angry when I first saw how I was being manipulated after I got saved but that was 30 plus years ago now. I care about others who are being manipulated. Those like yourself. I care about those who manipulated me. I tried to get them to see the Truth.

They had too much baggage to embrace the Truth. Too many friends to please. Too many charter church members to please. Too many deacons to please.

Ironically..... I was ultimately rejected for doing exactly what they told me to do. Study...... and I have. For very long time.

What they really meant, "Study, but NEVER contradict me".....