• Welcome to Christian Forums, a Christian Forum that recognizes that all Christians are a work in progress.

    You will need to register to be able to join in fellowship with Christians all over the world.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!

Behold

Well-Known Member
Apr 11, 2020
15,224
6,249
113
Netanya or Pensacola
Faith
Christian
Country
Israel
“Therefore, beloved, knowing beforehand, beware lest being led away with the error of the lawless, you fall from your own steadfastness.” (2 Peter 3:17)

When you believe that YOU are responsible for holiness, then you have committed the very act that your verse defines.
Do you see yourself yet?
 

Michiah-Imla

Well-Known Member
Oct 24, 2020
6,142
3,277
113
Northeast USA
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
When you believe that YOU are responsible for holiness

God gives the lost sinner holiness upon the lost sinner repenting and believing the gospel.

Now the former lost sinner is responsible for this:

“Therefore girding up the loins of your mind, being sober, perfectly hope for the grace being brought to you at the revelation of Jesus Christ, as obedient children, not fashioning yourselves according to the former lusts in your ignorance, but according to the Holy One who has called you, you also become holy in all conduct, because it is written, "Be holy, for I am holy."” (1 Peter 1:13-16)
 

theefaith

Well-Known Member
Aug 25, 2020
20,070
1,354
113
63
Dallas
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
Yes, but you omitted the key to identifying a cult:

1. THEY ALL REJECT THE FACT THAT JESUS IS GOD (the deity of Christ)

2. THEY ALL REJECT THE FACT THAT THE TRIUNE GODHEAD CONSISTS OF THE FATHER, THE SON, AND THE HOLY SPIRIT (the Holy Trinity)

As a result they cannot possibly have a proper understanding of salvation.

that’s why Christ founded a church to teach and sanctify all men! Matt 28:19
 

theefaith

Well-Known Member
Aug 25, 2020
20,070
1,354
113
63
Dallas
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
Heb 1:8 But unto the Son he saith, Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever: a sceptre of righteousness is the sceptre of thy kingdom.
 

EloyCraft

Active Member
Mar 17, 2022
553
170
43
63
Az
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
@Behold

If in the end I am saved will it matter that I say " I knew it! Or I say " I didn't know that"?

If I'm not saved will it be because I failed to be certain that I was?


In my view,



It's making something that Isn't a matter of salvation into what salvation hinges on on.
 

mailmandan

Well-Known Member
Feb 24, 2020
4,443
4,727
113
The Midwest
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
-
CULTS.... the definition...when related to RELIGION, and specifically to CHRISTianity, .... would be defined spiritually, based on their theology, regarding one thing essentially.

1.) The DOCTRINE of Salvation, or, Soteriology., and did they get it right or did they get it wrong.

Reader.....See that one doctrine, that one Theology?
Cults, all of them, get it wrong. They all believe one thing that defines their entire church, denomination, membership, as a CULT as it relates to CHRISTianity.

What is that one thing?
Cults/Heretics : do not believe that GOD, through Christ....... maintains their salvation for eternity, and a sub-cult believes that WATER BAPTISM is what saves you.

All "chrisitan" cults deny that Salvation is Eternal.
All "christian" cults deny that Salvation is only based on CHRIST.
All "christian" Cults deny that Salvation is all of God and none of you.

Ive writted about a dozen related Threads on this Forum and on nearly all Christian forums, that detail what a DARK LIGHT, is all about.
Ive also a few entittled : "How to Spot a HERETIC", or similar.

And always, its the same ID. Its the same Revelation, its the same Trademark that defines them, their cult, and proves that the devil is behind it all.

See, the devil wants one thing. He wants you, me, all of us, in HELL, and then the Lake of Fire .
Well, he can't have that if we are born again, so, he has a plan for us. He wants to have us become deceived in our FAITH, so that our faith shifts from Jesus, to SELF.......... Keeping self saved. Working to try to stay saved.
See that? That is to become "Fallen from GRACE", as Paul defines it., and that is the ruined/subverted/broken faith that the DEVIL wants you to own.
He has his people selling it.
Believe it.

All Cults and all Heretics teach a Salvation Doctrine that OMITS God's Grace and inserts, "self effort" "Works" "commandment keeping" and "law"... and in some cases Water Baptism.
It other words all religious "christian" cults, REPLACE the BLOOD OF JESUS and the CROSS OF CHRIST, which is the BLOOD ATONEMENT...= with SELF EFFORT.

Thats LEGALSIM, and that is the Hallmark of a "christian" cult., which is the Devil's religion that is almed to subvert real Christianity.
People in cults unanimously pervert the gospel by teaching works salvation and instead of truly promoting Christ, cultists exploit Christ in order to promote themselves and their false religion.
 

Desire Of All Nations

Well-Known Member
Jun 23, 2021
748
408
63
Troy
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
The original followers of Christ were viewed by the mainstream religions of the day as a cult as well because their beliefs conflicted with the traditions of the lawless religions around them, so stamping that "cult" label on people doesn't have the kind of power that Protestants want it to have. As Peter said in his epistle, the true followers of Christ are always going to be looked at as strange by deceived people in this world because they're not floating downstream with the rest of the dead fish.

God said that His people are to a light in this world and show forth His praise, and a true follower of His cannot do that while possessing the same kind of contempt for the truth that this world and its man-made religions do. A true follower of Christ cannot help but promote the same doctrines that Christ taught when He walked this earth as a human being because He lives in them.

I make 0 apologizes for believing God and the authority of scripture over the traditions of Catholicism and Protestantism. If anything, whoever believes the doctrines of those religions should be apologizing for being exceptionally ignorant, arrogant, shameless, and presumptuous enough to promote false doctrines about God being a trinity, false gospels about Christ supposedly abolishing His Father's laws, and false doctrines about Mary being a sinless Mediator who didn't need a Savior.
 

Enoch111

Well-Known Member
May 27, 2018
17,688
15,996
113
Alberta
Faith
Christian
Country
Canada
..to promote false doctrines about God being a trinity...
Since the doctrine of the Trinity is one of the fundamental doctrines of Christianity, you have exposed yourself as a cultist right there. Only the cultists reject the deity of Christ and the Holy Trinity.
 

theefaith

Well-Known Member
Aug 25, 2020
20,070
1,354
113
63
Dallas
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
The original followers of Christ were viewed by the mainstream religions of the day as a cult as well because their beliefs conflicted with the traditions of the lawless religions around them, so stamping that "cult" label on people doesn't have the kind of power that Protestants want it to have. As Peter said in his epistle, the true followers of Christ are always going to be looked at as strange by deceived people in this world because they're not floating downstream with the rest of the dead fish.

God said that His people are to a light in this world and show forth His praise, and a true follower of His cannot do that while possessing the same kind of contempt for the truth that this world and its man-made religions do. A true follower of Christ cannot help but promote the same doctrines that Christ taught when He walked this earth as a human being because He lives in them.

I make 0 apologizes for believing God and the authority of scripture over the traditions of Catholicism and Protestantism. If anything, whoever believes the doctrines of those religions should be apologizing for being exceptionally ignorant, arrogant, shameless, and presumptuous enough to promote false doctrines about God being a trinity, false gospels about Christ supposedly abolishing His Father's laws, and false doctrines about Mary being a sinless Mediator who didn't need a Savior.

who has authority from Christ to govern the church?
Teach all men?
Sanctify all men?
 

EloyCraft

Active Member
Mar 17, 2022
553
170
43
63
Az
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
Where does the Bible say that
This is a tradition of men and an obstacle to the knowledge of Jesus found in Scriptures.
To believe that the truths of Faith require an expression so top layer that 'where' ' say' are boundaries between what's true or not true. Is a limitation that if believed prevents the depth of the Word from being known to whoever believes you. If someone is putting a limitation to the expression of truth and claims beyond this boundary there is no truth. A boundary like where does the Bible say that? That's a boundary that blinds you. I oppose that tradition of men that imposes it's blinding dogma on others. Dogma that prevents the bible reader from seeing Jesus in His Word even 'where' you 'say' truths of Faith don't exist.
 
Last edited:

Ernest T. Bass

Well-Known Member
Jan 14, 2014
1,845
616
113
out in the woods
If you don't believe as the OP you're a cult
If you don't believe as the OP you're Satan's minister
If you don't believe as the OP you're a legalist

It's why words as legalist are uselsss and meaningless for people define these words anyway they want to define them and often times define these words in ways contrary to the Bible.
 

Behold

Well-Known Member
Apr 11, 2020
15,224
6,249
113
Netanya or Pensacola
Faith
Christian
Country
Israel
If you don't believe as the OP you're a cult
If you don't believe as the OP you're Satan's minister
If you don't believe as the OP you're a legalist

It's why words as legalist are uselsss and meaningless for people define these words anyway they want to define them and often times define these words in ways contrary to the Bible.

What you meant to say is... .if you are a person who believes that Jesus does not keep you saved, then you are a Legalist.

A Legalist, is defined by Paul as "fallen from Grace", and depending on the level of the deception, and how aggressive this deceived person is to preach WORKS WORKS WORKS, and COMMANDMENT Keeping...... is how Paul Paul evaluated them as Devil Driven Heretics.

See the issue with a legalist is that the more they are become self righteous, the farther they are away from the Cross.
Eventually this person becomes Anti-Cross, according to what they teach and believe.
The darker the darkness becomes in them, defines their level of "anti Cross" Anti- Grace", spiritual darkness.

The worst of these, are like rabid dogs on forums, endlessly screeching about......"OSAS" "OSAS !!!!!!!!!!!!!

They obsess on this, because they are so far removed from God's Grace that their self righteousness drives them like maniacs.
Many Christian forums became so infected with these spiritual psychopaths, that they had to do this..
"NO THREADS or POSTS about OSAS" are allowed on this Forum. = "you will be BANNED".
The Owner and MODS had to do this, to try to get some control back on the Forum as these people just get CRAZY, and TROLL and keep STRIFE GOING AND GOING as they are addicted to their fleshly carnality, and just keep on doing it.

Paul defined them as different levels of darkness.

"Fallen From Grace"

"Bewithced"

"In the Flesh".

Galatians 1:8

"enemies of the Cross"

"Titus 3"... "get them out of your Church.


Jesus defined them as having an inner darkness as their LIGHT.
In other words, ... they are so deceived regarding the Grace of God, that the truth in them, is such spiritual darkness, that its Anti-Grace and Anti-Cross, and anti-John 14:6

Luke 11:35
 
Last edited:

Ernest T. Bass

Well-Known Member
Jan 14, 2014
1,845
616
113
out in the woods
What you meant to say is... .if you are a person who believes that Jesus does not keep you saved, then you are a Legalist.

A Legalist, is defined by Paul as "fallen from Grace", and depending on the level of the deception, and how aggressive this deceived person is to preach WORKS WORKS WORKS, and COMMANDMENT Keeping...... is how Paul Paul evaluated them as Devil Driven Heretics.

See the issue with a legalist is that the more they are become self righteous, the farther they are away from the Cross.
Eventually this person becomes Anti-Cross, according to what they teach and believe.
The darker the darkness becomes in them, defines their level of "anti Cross" Anti- Grace", spiritual darkness.

The worst of these, are like rabid dogs on forums, endlessly screeching about......"OSAS" "OSAS !!!!!!!!!!!!!

They obsess on this, because they are so far removed from God's Grace that their self righteousness drives them like maniacs.
Many Christian forums became so infected with these spiritual psychopaths, that they had to do this..
"NO THREADS or POSTS about OSAS" are allowed on this Forum. = "you will be BANNED".
The Owner and MODS had to do this, to try to get some control back on the Forum as these people just get CRAZY, and TROLL and keep STRIFE GOING AND GOING as they are addicted to their flesh and just keep on doing it.

Paul defined them as different levels of darkness.

"Fallen From Grace"

"Bewithced"

"In the Flesh".

Galatians 1:8

"enemies of the Cross"

"Titus 3"... "get them out of your Church.


Jesus defined them as having an inner darkness as their LIGHT.
In other words, ... they are so deceived regarding the Grace of God, that the truth in them, is such spiritual darkness, that its Anti-Grace and Anti-Cross, and anti-John 14:6

Luke 11:35
You define words how you want to define words. More specifically if one does not beleive as you do then you call them cultist. You define people accriding to your opinions, nothing more.
 

Pearl

Well-Known Member
Staff member
Encounter Team
Apr 9, 2019
11,342
17,178
113
Lancashire
Faith
Christian
Country
United Kingdom
I would say that a cult makes a good stab at appearing to be true Church, Christians, followers of Jesus - but something, somewhere is 'off' and even though the fake looks very much like the real thing, those who really are the real thing can tell the difference.
 
  • Like
Reactions: mailmandan

Behold

Well-Known Member
Apr 11, 2020
15,224
6,249
113
Netanya or Pensacola
Faith
Christian
Country
Israel
You define words how you want to define words. More specifically if one does not beleive as you do then you call them cultist.

Paul defines them, actually.
HE defines them as "fallen from Grace".
READ Galatians if you get a chance, Earnest T. Bass.

What i do, at times, is teach believers how to recognize them.., as once you can the you know what you are dealing with, and this protect the new believers and the weak believers from these heretics who will destroy their faith.

You start here, if you want to find a dark light, a LEGALIST, a HERETIC.

= Just find out if they believe they can "lose their salvation"...

See, if you believe you can lose your Salvation, then you do not trust in Christ to keep you saved.
And if you dont believe that Jesus keeps you SAVED = then WHAT DOES?
Who does?
What is left once Christ has been rejected?

What keep you saved then, Earnest T Bass ? ????????????
What does keep you saved THEN, ONCE you dont Believe that the Cross of Christ and the Blood of Jesus, keeps you saved.

Answer?

YOU.
Its YOU.
You believe that YOU keep you saved, and that is impossible, as ONLY JESUS SAVES.

But, the legalist, the heretic, the anti-cross TITUS 3:10 person with their SELF RIGHTEOUS LIST of "do's and dont's" that they are WORKING to KEEP DOING = to try to STAY SAVED....
See that person?
These people ruin the faith of real believers.
They RUIN Christian forums.
They ruin Churches.

See that?
See that PERSON and their LIST?

Look here...

1.) Water Baptism
2.) Commandment keeping
3.) enduring to the end
4.) confessing sin
5.) trying to be like Christ


See all those?
I can list 20 more that a SELF SAVER is trying to DO, to STAY SAVED, because they DO NOT BELIEVE THAT JESUS KEEPS THEM SAVED.
THEY ARE "fallen from Grace"
'in the flesh"
"bewitched"
"carnally minded"
 
  • Like
Reactions: Pearl

Titus

Well-Known Member
Feb 5, 2022
1,783
500
83
Midwest
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
What you meant to say is... .if you are a person who believes that Jesus does not keep you saved, then you are a Legalist
God never stops loving us. God never breaks His promises.
It is not a matter of Jesus keeping us saved.
It is a matter of the saved choosing to stay faithfull to God or to lose faith and leave Him.

In Behold's religion there is no freewill. Once God saves us, God takes away our free moral agency.

We can no longer choose to seperate ourselves from Jesus.

Behold has already taught that even an atheist will be in heaven if he was a former believer.
So, in Behold's religion, even unbelievers will be saved.
I can say this because this is exactly what Behold has already told me.

Behold needs to give the Bible verse that teaches unbelievers will be in heaven.
I'm still waiting for him to give the verse. It's been a long wait.

Conclusion:
According to Behold God takes away the freewill of believers.
They can no longer choose to be seperated from God.
Even if a former believer becomes an atheist,
Behold teaches the unbelieving former believer will be forced against their own will to serve God for eternity because God takes away man's freewill when they believe in Jesus.
The result according to Behold is unbelievers will be saved in heaven.

This is not misrepresentation, this is what Behold has already taught me.

Nowhere does the Bible teach this false doctrine of Beholds.
Notice Peter's Faith in Jesus,

Matthew 16:15-16,
-He said to them, But who do you say that I am?
-Simon Peter answered and said, You are the Christ, the Son of the living God,
-Jesus answered and said unto him, Blessed are you, Simon Bar-Jonah, for flesh and blood has not revealed this to you, but My Father who is in heaven.

20 -Then He commanded His disciples that they should tell no one that He was Jesus the Christ.

Peter has confessed his faith to Christ.
According to Behold's salvation doctrine, faith alone, Peter is saved.

We will see later in Peter's life that he and the other disciples loose their faith in Jesus.

Mark 16:10-12 ; 13-14
-She went and told those who had been with Jesus, as they mourned and wept.
-And when they heard that He was alive and had been seen by her, they did not believe.

12 -After that Jesus appeared in another form to two of them as they walked and went into the country.
-And they went and told it to the rest, but they did not believe them either.
-Later Jesus appeared to the eleven as they sat at the table; and Jesus rebuked their unbelief and hardness of heart, because they did not believe those who had seen Him after He had risen.

Behold teaches that once saved you cannot loose your salvation even if you loose your faith just as Peter and the other disciples.

Therefore it must be true that if Behold is correct, Peter was saved when he lost his faith in Jesus.
But notice Jesus rebuked Peter!!! Jesus said he had a heart that was hardened!

Question: If Peter had died before his faith in Christ had returned, would he have been saved?
Believers in God can walk away and become unbelievers as I have proven.
Behold has unbelievers going to heaven if they believe just once in their lives.

Therefore Behold must give book, chapter and verse where an unbeliever will be in heaven?

Revelation 21:8
-But the cowardly, unbelieving, abominable, murderers, sexually immoral, sorcerers, idolaters, and all liars shall have their part in the lake which burns with fire and brimstone, which is the second death.
 
  • Like
Reactions: MatthewG

Behold

Well-Known Member
Apr 11, 2020
15,224
6,249
113
Netanya or Pensacola
Faith
Christian
Country
Israel
It is not a matter of Jesus keeping us saved.

Have you noticed that Devil deceived heretics are unable to give Jesus The Christ all the Credit due Him, alone, for their Salvation?
Notice it.

Listen,
God as Christ on the Cross, is Jesus keeping you saved, ONCE this Blood Atonement is applied to you, and you become Born again.

2 Corinthians 5:19
 
  • Like
Reactions: Pearl

Titus

Well-Known Member
Feb 5, 2022
1,783
500
83
Midwest
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
Have you noticed that Devil deceived heretics are unable to give Jesus The Christ all the Credit due Him, alone, for their Salvation?
Notice it.

Listen,
God as Christ on the Cross, is Jesus keeping you saved, ONCE this Blood Atonement is applied to you, and you become Born again.

2 Corinthians 5:19
Give an answer to your false doctrine that unbelievers will be in heaven.
You claim NOTHING can seperate a believer from eternal life, even losing faith.

Of course Jesus is our only hope of salvation, that is why we must continue to believe in Him.
You are the guilty one Behold, you teach one does not have to keep believing keep trusting that Jesus alone can save us. You teach those who have no faith in Jesus i.e. former believers will be in heaven.
Now give Bible verses to prove your false teaching, Behold. Revelation 21:8.
 

Pearl

Well-Known Member
Staff member
Encounter Team
Apr 9, 2019
11,342
17,178
113
Lancashire
Faith
Christian
Country
United Kingdom
Have you noticed that Devil deceived heretics are unable to give Jesus The Christ all the Credit due Him, alone, for their Salvation?
Notice it.

Listen,
God as Christ on the Cross, is Jesus keeping you saved, ONCE this Blood Atonement is applied to you, and you become Born again.

2 Corinthians 5:19
So many people on this site do not know the truth of the full gospel. Keep preaching.