Paul and Faith Alone…

[bbyrd009]

Israel is not no more, scattered maybe, but certainly still in existence

they ceased to exist as a nation, is the point

 

[mjrhealth]

they ceased to exist as a nation, is the point

Only for a time.

Heb 8:8 For finding fault with them, he saith, Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah:
Heb 8:9 Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day when I took them by the hand to lead them out of the land of Egypt; because they continued not in my covenant, and I regarded them not, saith the Lord.
Heb 8:10 For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, saith the Lord; I will put my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people:

 

[mjrhealth]

not yours maybe, but the Book assures me it is mine, in the vv you do not want to discuss i guess. You might as easily frame the Jews as having been separated for the purpose of punishing them, see, taking into account what became of the Israelites in "The Promised Land." Their nation was scattered, and Israel is no more, except as Living Stones now. And this is all in Scripture, too

Eph 2:11 Wherefore remember, that ye being in time past Gentiles in the flesh, who are called Uncircumcision by that which is called the Circumcision in the flesh made by hands;
Eph 2:12 That at that time ye were without Christ, being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers from the covenants of promise, having no hope, and without God in the world:

it is not yours never was.

 

[bbyrd009]

Only for a time.

Heb 8:8 For finding fault with them, he saith, Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah:
Heb 8:9 Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day when I took them by the hand to lead them out of the land of Egypt; because they continued not in my covenant, and I regarded them not, saith the Lord.
Heb 8:10 For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, saith the Lord; I will put my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people:

cool, now just back up to where Gentiles were grafted in--if Hebrew diaspora (into the Gentile nations) was not hint enough, and add a little "there are no Jew or Gentile in the kingdom," top off with some "gee, the Law is Holy, and even the Bible is not Holy, hmm."

imo

 

[bbyrd009]

Eph 2:11 Wherefore remember, that ye being in time past Gentiles in the flesh, who are called Uncircumcision by that which is called the Circumcision in the flesh made by hands;
Eph 2:12 That at that time ye were without Christ, being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers from the covenants of promise, having no hope, and without God in the world:

it is not yours never was.

do you really want me to goto Ephesians 2 and point out the vv you are skipping, mjr? Bc i can do that ok, if you need me to.

14For He is our peace, who made both groups one and tore down the dividing wall of hostility. In His flesh,

have a nice day, mjr

 

[mjrhealth]

have a nice day, mjr

I will at least I now know why you are a stickler for the law. ans as i said its still not for you, you came to Christ by grace through faith, there is no other way.

 

[bbyrd009]

I will at least I now know why you are a stickler for the law. ans as i said its still not for you, you came to Christ by grace through faith, there is no other way.

oh, i would not pretend to declare that i am in Christ, ok, leave that for the professors imo. I try my best, and sometimes i get it right. Fwiw i was Mr Lawless for half my life, ok, and i understand why you reject the law. The law is inadequate. The law is abused. But the law is also Holy, which i did not even know when we started talking. I am Anarchist, yet i would surely drive anyone reading this nuts with how closely i obey the speed limit when i am called on to travel (drive, to you), and etc.

Grace is built upon the law; no law, no grace. The formula is below, which i won't bother explaining the connection from law to sin, assuming you already got that

Where sin abounds, grace abounds the more


you cannot have grace without law

 

[GodsGrace]

Anyone that comes to Christ has to acknowledge that they are sinful, right???? Isn't that repentance?

No HR.
Knowing you are sinful does NOT mean you also repent of it.
The way repent is used today, it means "to be sorry for".
Most people who commit sin are not sorry for their sin.
So they do not repent and change their ways.

 

[mjrhealth]

oh, i would not pretend to declare that i am in Christ, ok, leave that for the professors imo. I try my best, and sometimes i get it right. Fwiw i was Mr Lawless for half my life, ok, and i understand why you reject the law. The law is inadequate. The law is abused. But the law is also Holy, which i did not even know when we started talking. I am Anarchist, yet i would surely drive anyone reading this nuts with how closely i obey the speed limit when i am called on to travel (drive, to you), and etc.

Grace is built upon the law; no law, no grace. The formula is below, which i won't bother explaining the connection from law to sin, assuming you already got that

Where sin abounds, grace abounds the more


you cannot have grace without law

No really, yet you can have love without the law, love needs no law, as for grace, when you sin against someone, its not the "law" you are breaking. you are sinning against God and guess what, its grace that forgives you, its always being love and grace, God is love, Jesus came full of grace, not the law.

PS never ever said I reject the law, as you said it is good, but it is not for those who are in Christ, like it says

Gal_5:4 Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law; ye are fallen from grace.

now if you bother to read rom5:20, it says where sin abounded, grace did much more abound. There will always be sin, with or without the law, and i guarantee you break the law everyday, because it all about the mind

Mat 5:27 Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, Thou shalt not commit adultery:
Mat 5:28 But I say unto you, That whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart.

its that simple to break teh law, only a fleeting though, no diff to saying"hang him" you have just commited murder in your heart.

 

[GodsGrace]

I was reading the intro to Galations in my Ryrie Bible the other day and in it he says, "Man is too weak to accomplish self-salvation of self-sanctifcation. … Paul's answer was to proclaim justification by faith plus nothing."

That is far from what he preached! In Acts 26:20 Paul says, "But I showed first to them of Damascus [and everywhere he preached]… that they should repent and turn to God, and do works meet of repentance." In Acts 17:30 he was even more forceful. "And the times of this ignorance [of God] God winked at; but now has commanded all men every where to repent." Putting it into the correct order, Paul said in Acts 21:20, "Testifying to both the Jews and also to the Greeks, REPENTANCE toward God, and FAITH toward our Lord Jesus Christ."

So to put it very bluntly, if you have faith alone, your faith is in the gospel and in the Bible but not "toward Christ." And many folks do have faith in the gospel and in the Bible — that they are the true teachings .. the very breath .. of God. But they think that, b/c they have faith in the Bible and the gospel, they are "elect" or saved.

To which I would say, "O foolish Galations, who has bewitched you that you should not obey the truth…?" Well, I think we know now who, right?

skypair

This is a wonderful post.
If only all the osas'ers out there could get a grasp on this.
I do want to say that Paul is right in that Justification is achieved ONLY by faith in God.

But if we are to endure till the end and receive out reward, which is heaven, then we go on to sanctification. And here is where we cooperate with God in doing our good deeds, which are required by God.
1 Peter 1:9

 

[GodsGrace]

There is a difference between confession and repentance. We confess all the time letting God know that we know we have sinned and asking for His help to correct the problem. We also are asking for His mercy on the earthly consequences of the sin until He gives us the strength to overcome the sin.

When we repent, we tell God that we are determined, at this time, to quit the sin. There's a whole list of steps in 2Cor 7:11 that will help us to quit that sin including being careful not to fall again .. clearing ourselves of the temptations that usually cause us to fall .. indignation with the sin that it held us for so long, etc.

The repentance that leads to salvation is the change of mind when we believe AND the change of heart that brings us to repentance from our own "thoughts and ways" and into obeying God.

skypair

 

[bbyrd009]

whosoever of you are justified by the law

"whosoever of you call the cops when you seek justice for yourself, instead of doing what the Bible says."

 

[mjrhealth]

"whosoever of you call the cops when you seek justice for yourself, instead of doing what the Bible says."

Would rather do what Jesus said, Love

Mat 22:37 Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
Mat 22:38 This is the first and great commandment.
Mat 22:39 And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
Mat 22:40 On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.

than you have no need for a law.

And when the cop pulls you over, guess who pays teh fine for you breaking teh law... You.

 

[bbyrd009]

than you have no need for a law.

those are laws, but once again i see that we are debating the personal need for laws v the law being applied to you/one

And when the cop pulls you over, guess who pays teh fine for you breaking teh law... You.

ok, so let's do another loop around i guess lol

 

[mjrhealth]

Why you have chosen teh law, that is your choice, you know teh consequences of your choice. We will never be perfect in our selves, and the law made no one perfect, killed a lot of people, even to this day, but never saved anyone. Like it says

Rom_8:1 There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.

so choose, give up the works of teh flesh there is no righteousness earned from it, None.

 

[bbyrd009]

No really, yet you can have love without the law, love needs no law, as for grace, when you sin against someone, its not the "law" you are breaking.

i beg to differ, that is exactly what you are doing, and you are just demonstrating further that you do not understand the relationship laid out in "where sin abounds..."

 

[bbyrd009]

PS never ever said I reject the law, as you said it is good, but it is not for those who are in Christ, like it says

Gal_5:4 Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law; ye are fallen from grace.

so iow you still do not understand the relationship, nor what "justified by the law" means, and you will redirect all attempts to confront these, too. i would post the Scriptures you are violating again, but you would just ignore them or paper over then again, i guess. So have it your way then, grace in Chaos lol

 

[mjrhealth]

so iow you still do not understand the relationship, nor what "justified by the law" means, and you will redirect all attempts to confront these, too. i would post the Scriptures you are violating again, but you would just ignore them or paper over then again, i guess. So have it your way then, grace in Chaos lol

Oh I do fully understand, I also see where you come from. As I said before, if there was no law, would you be killing stealing etc etc. Love needs no law. And again, like teh man who says he keeps teh law, but cannot yet every time he breaks it he demands grace, or, im fine with the law till I mess up". Seeing so many lawyers who insist we keep the law, even tell us it is easy yet can never explain how they do it. None keep the law, not one Jesus was teh only one who ever could and teh only one who ever will, thats why it says.

Rev 5:3 And no man in heaven, nor in earth, neither under the earth, was able to open the book, neither to look thereon.
Rev 5:4 And I wept much, because no man was found worthy to open and to read the book, neither to look thereon.
Rev 5:5 And one of the elders saith unto me, Weep not: behold, the Lion of the tribe of Juda, the Root of David, hath prevailed to open the book, and to loose the seven seals thereof.

YEs you will insist on the law till judgement day than you will want to run as far from it as you can.

 

[bbyrd009]

As I said before, if there was no law, would you be killing stealing etc etc. Love needs no law.

so you say, but then how would you learn to love your enemies, and to bless those who curse you? You intimate that you would just naturally take to this concept, even unto death?

 

[bbyrd009]

And again, like teh man who says he keeps teh law, but cannot yet every time he breaks it he demands grace, or, im fine with the law till I mess up

well, you're covering too broad a range of situations to really even comment on now, sorry. When's the last time you heard someone state that they kept the law perfectly? i never have! And i dunno about "demanding grace," or "i'm fine with the law til i mess up?" you would have to give a more specific example i guess sorry