Question no Protestant can answer

[theefaith]

Including its own?

the holy church founded by God cannot have errors Jn 8:32 Jn 16:13

 

[theefaith]

Also Matt 16:18 shall not prevail

 

[Wrangler]

the holy church founded by God cannot have errors

Shocking arrogance through decades of scandals of pedophilia.

Of course people can and do make errors (calling these people ‘the holy church’ does not make them God). Your 2nd error is to not recognize your error. And your 3rd error is to not correct your error with all humility and haste.

 

[BreadOfLife]

Including its own?

That is assuming Jesus is a liar and the Holy Spirit is worthless.

Jesus stated emphatically:
John 16:12-15
“I have much more to tell you, but you cannot bear it now.
But when he comes, the Spirit of truth, he will guide YOU to ALL truth. He will not speak on his own, but he will speak what he hears, and will declare to YOU the things that are coming.
He will glorify me, because he will TAKE from what is MINE and declare it to YOU.
Everything that the Father has is MINE; for this reason I told you that he will TAKE from what is MINE and declare it to YOU.

Under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit, Paul wrote that the Church is:
- The "pillar and foundation of Truth".
- The FULLNESS of Christ (Eph. 1:22-23).

His Church has had and does have wicked people within it - but His Church CANNOT teach error.
It's impossible.

 

[Riverwalker]

WRONG.

In Mark 16:16 - Jesus emphatically states "The one who believes AND is Baptized will be saved."
He doesn't say, "The one who believes will be saved - Oh, and he should get Baptized as well as a 'sign'."

As for John 3:5 - Nicodemus had just finished asking about how a man is born AGAIN.
Jesus responds by saying:
“Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born of water AND the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God.

There's that pesky word, "AND" again.
- In Chapter 1 of John's Gospel, we read about the Baptism of Jesus - and what do we see??
WATER and the SPIRIT.

- In Chapter 2, we read about His first miracle at the Wedding at Cana involving what??
WATER.

- Here in Chapter 3, we see the same Water and Spirit we saw in Chapter 1.

- After His talk with Nicodemus - where does Jesus go with the Apostles??
BAPTIZING.

The first THREE chapters of John's Gospel are literally DRENCHED in the transforming waters of Baptism.
Your anti-Baptism argument is crushed by the weight of Scripture . . .

Jesus said just ONE thing will send you into eternal fire in Mark 16 Unbelief

The Thief on the cross who believed was promised salvation with out being baptized
The whole of Cornelius' house (Acts 10)was saved and speaking in tongues before they ever got baptized

Baptism is wonderful but it does not save....no works save
Ephesians 2: 8 For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God, 9 not of works, lest anyone should boast

 

[BreadOfLife]

Jesus said just ONE thing will send you into eternal fire in Mark 16 Unbelief

The Thief on the cross who believed was promised salvation with out being baptized
The whole of Cornelius' house (Acts 10)was saved and speaking in tongues before they ever got baptized

Baptism is wonderful but it does not save....no works save
Ephesians 2: 8 For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God, 9 not of works, lest anyone should boast

Sorry - but I have to go with Scripture again.
BOTH Jesus (John 3:5, Mark 16:16) and Peter (Acts 2:38-39, 1 Pet. 3:21) state that Baptism SAVES us.

The Thief on the cross and Cornelius were exceptions, as they were BOTH unique cases.

The Thief couldn't be baptized because he was nailed to a cross. He received Baptism of Desire.
In Cornelius's case - he was the very FIRST Gentile recorded as being converted and Baptized.

The NORMATIVE was is described in the following passage:
Acts 19:1-7
While Apollos was at Corinth, Paul passed through the upper country and came to Ephesus. There he found some disciples. And he said to them, "Did you receive the Holy Spirit when you believed?" And they said, "No, we have never even heard that there is a Holy Spirit." And he said, "Into what then were you baptized?" They said, "Into John's baptism." And Paul said, "John baptized with the baptism of repentance, telling the people to believe in the one who was to come after him, that is, Jesus." On hearing this, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus. And when Paul had laid his hands upon them, the Holy Spirit came on them; and they spoke with tongues and prophesied. There were about twelve of them in all.

We see the SAME chain of events with the Ethiopian Eunuch in Acts 8.
NEVER base your doctrinal beliefs on the exception - but the NORM . . .

 

[Wrangler]

That is assuming Jesus is a liar and the Holy Spirit is worthless.

Inflammatory and irrelevant to the point made.

His Church has had and does have wicked people within it - but His Church CANNOT teach error.
It's impossible.

The church and ‘the Church’ denomination you prefer that issues edicts are not the same and neither are equal to God or Jesus in perfection or authority.

 

[BreadOfLife]

Inflammatory and irrelevant to the point made.

Not irrelevant at ALL.
It addresses YOUR remark perfectly.

The church and ‘the Church’ denomination you prefer that issues edicts are not the same and neither are equal to God or Jesus in perfection or authority.

The Catholic Church has been here since the FIRST century - which is proven by History and doctrine.

Ummmmmm, how long has YOUR sect been around?
500 years?
150?
25?

I think we know which one goes back to the Apostles . . .

 

[amigo de christo]

The catholic church probably was already forming in the first century . I cant argue with bread of life on that .
cause even paul warned how men would come in and lead folks astray , desiring the pre eminence , JUST as the RCC has done for years .
Rest assured peter had no part or lott in the creation of that machine . True lambs cling to Christ
and we love reading those letters in that bible .

 

[quietthinker]

the holy church founded by God cannot have errors Jn 8:32 Jn 16:13

convincing oneself doesn't require evidence.

 

[amigo de christo]

the holy church founded by God cannot have errors Jn 8:32 Jn 16:13

That is why you all are misled . cause even paul said HE ought to be tested .
No man is infallible . but you all took the bait on that one .
NO wonder they have your heart and mind , you actually think they cannot mislead you . And yet , by grace , i see the dire grave dangers
within many of their doctrines . But since you believe they are in the seat of Christ and Peter , you all just learned to take them at their word .
THAT was a deadly and dangerous mistake to do my friend . ALL men must be tested , ME , YOU , ANYONE .
Dont just take the party line that your church IS THE CHURCH . Jehovas say the same thing , mormons too
and so on . NO . Test and always test all men and dont take any man for granted . You are in dire danger my friend .
I feel so sad for you my friend . You are loved my friend , but in dire grave danger . ITS WhY i plea with you , to flee that place .

 

[amigo de christo]

convincing oneself doesn't require evidence.

True that is my friend . For even if i could show a man a forest , yet if his mind is made up
he will simply turn and tell me , That is in no way a forest , Its billions of trees . Ponder that one for a bit .

 

[quietthinker]

the nature of delusion is that one manipulates to support it.

 

[Wrangler]

The Catholic Church has been here since the FIRST century

Irrelevant. Read and understand how 1 Corinthians 11:3 applies to the corrupt institution known as the RCC.

 

[quietthinker]

Judas was good at manipulation....but in the end it bites
We could also take Lucifer as a case in point.....1/3 of perfect beings thought he was credible

 

[quietthinker]

Irrelevant. Read and understand how 1 Corinthians 11:3 applies to the corrupt institution known as the RCC.

arguing with delusion is taking the bait....frustration its result

 

[Wrangler]

Dont just take the party line that your church IS THE CHURCH . Jehovas say the same thing , mormons too
and so on . NO . Test and always test all men and dont take any man for granted . You are in dire danger my friend .
I feel so sad for you my friend . You are loved my friend , but in dire grave danger . ITS WhY i plea with you , to flee that place

People in the cult do not realize it.

 

[Riverwalker]

Sorry - but I have to go with Scripture again.
BOTH Jesus (John 3:5, Mark 16:16) and Peter (Acts 2:38-39, 1 Pet. 3:21) state that Baptism SAVES us.

The Thief on the cross and Cornelius were exceptions, as they were BOTH unique cases.

Please share with me the place where God says, " Thall Shall Do this...unless of course you arre the exception"

You have shown your desire to honor the traditions of men over the word of God.

 

[BreadOfLife]

Please share with me the place where God says, " Thall Shall Do this...unless of course you arre the exception"

You have shown your desire to honor the traditions of men over the word of God.

God doesn't HAVE to make that statement for TWO reasons:
1. Because God doesn't have to declare to YOU when He makes a decision. It is evident in His Word.
2. Because He told the leaders of His Church that WHATEVER THEY bind or loose on earth will also be bound and loosed in Heaven (Matt. 16:19, Matt. 18:15-18) - and that the Church is God's mouthpiece on earth (Luke 10:16).

In other words, when His Church makes an informed decision based on Scripture - it has already been ordained in Heaven.

 

[Riverwalker]

God doesn't HAVE to make that statement for TWO reasons:
1. Because God doesn't have to declare to YOU when He makes a decision. It is evident in His Word.
2. Because He told the leaders of His Church that WHATEVER THEY bind or loose on earth will also be bound and loosed in Heaven (Matt. 16:19, Matt. 18:15-18) - and that the Church is God's mouthpiece on earth (Luke 10:16).

In other words, when His Church makes an informed decision based on Scripture - it has already been ordained in Heaven.

If God did not make the statement that exceptions to the Rules HE set (not man) Then you cannot make that statement
You seem to think you are leading from authority here. The Only authority is the bible, the WHOLE Bible