Should Christians Always Be Healed?

[marks]

I've often thought that even though we believe totally in our Salvation we find it much more difficult to have that same degree of faith for healing. And I wonder why.

If we think we are always supposed to be healed and we're not, that may be one reason why.

I assume God can and will give healing when He intends to, and if He doesn't, I'm trusting Him for that too. I know He cares for me in the best way I can be cared for. He knows what He's doing.

I still LOVE that line from Oceans, "Your sovereign hand will be my guide". Trusting that God actually IS managing the circumstances of my life. I'm not invested into any particular outcome, sickness/health, rich/poor, it's all as God wants. For me the joy and the victory is in knowing God is able to do all things, and that He does everything that is good to do.

Much love!

 

[marks]

which is why He chose someone like Lazarus, who was His servant.

The widow's son from Nain, for another. But seriously, you've just moved the goalposts. You've been saying faith to be healed, right? Now you are saying having had prior relationship? I guess this is why you find me aggravating.

I had no thought for God, no prior relationship, no faith or desire for divine intervention, and my choice was to be dead. Having already failed a couple of other times to suicide, I tried it again with a 4X fatal overdose, and God intervened. No faith. No request. No choice. Only God's intention that I would live.

Much love!

 

[Hidden In Him]

I've often thought that even though we believe totally in our Salvation we find it much more difficult to have that same degree of faith for healing. And I wonder why.

Maybe because it takes more faith to believe for what we can see than for what we can't and just have to trust God for. Faith teachers will teach this often, and it's true: When you are believing God for healing, your faith runs up against what it can see in the natural. You keep praying, but your body is still sick, so it can appear like your prayers are not getting answered. But strong faith refuses to give up, based on what it is seeing. It refuses to honor what the circumstances look like but continues to trust God, in spite of what it sees in the natural, and eventually receives answered prayer.

 

[marks]

No. We trust God for what we do know.

Then . . . the Holy Spirit is praying for us concerning those things we do not know, and are not trusting God for, yet the Spirit prays, and the Father hears, for the Spirit prays according to His will.

We are in the hands of One much greater than us and who is mindful of our limitations, remembering we are but dust. Who is sympathetic to our weakness, and cares for us.

Much love!

 

[Enoch111]

I think of the man at the Beautiful Gate.

Perhaps Christ left him there deliberately so that Peter and John would heal him at the appropriate time, and thus the Gospel would move forward after the resurrection of Christ. Jesus knows the end from the beginning, so we should not be surprised.

At the same time we should note that (1) the apostles never made a big deal out of their ability to heal people miraculously and (2) they never once asked for money or donations in this connection (unlike what goes on today). For today, it is "the prayer of faith" of the elders which is supposed to lead to healing (James 5). At the same time, when necessary, genuine miracles of instantaneous healing do occur in connection with the propagation of the Gospel in many lands.

 

[marks]

Likely correct, but this is not an issue of you requesting healing, it was preventing you from destroying yourself, and it is likely that he foresaw the faith you would walk in as a believer and spared you by His will alone. Different matter than actively desiring something from Him in prayer.

Different, yet it doesn't fit.

You've hit the nail on the head. Predestination to be conformed to the image of Jesus. God worked directly, outside of my faith or understanding or desire, to accomplish His purpose. Having foreknown me, He predestined me, and my misguided recklessness with my health was not going to prevent that.

I am still predestined to be conformed to the image of His Son. I feel very certain that God will continue to do what is good for me, even if I don't trust Him for it, even if I'm not aware of it, even if I'm being misguided and reckless. If that good is to heal me, heal me He shall.

Much love!

 

[Hidden In Him]

The widow's son from Nain, for another. But seriously, you've just moved the goalposts. You've been saying faith to be healed, right? Now you are saying having had prior relationship? I guess this is why you find me aggravating.

Not really. Here you are dealing with foreknowledge and the fore-planning of God. In such matters, His will is the primary factor. The same occurred with Job. Job was held captive in that situation because God had determined to use Him to glorify Himself through a man He knew would trust Him no matter what.

I had no thought for God, no prior relationship, no faith or desire for divine intervention, and my choice was to be dead. Having already failed a couple of other times to suicide, I tried it again with a 4X fatal overdose, and God intervened. No faith. No request. No choice. Only God's intention that I would live.

And how do you know someone wasn't or hadn't been prayed for you? How do you know that the Lord didn't see what you would become just like He knew in advance how Job would respond, or what the man at the pool of Bethesda would do, or what any of us will do? He sees us all in advance; that's why he diverted Paul from going into Asia and told Him by the Spirit to go to Thessalonica instead, or why He directed Peter to Cornelius' house. He knows where all of us are, how all of us will react, and what will be the outcomes of our responses to Him when we are eventually met with certain conditions. Your time hadn't come yet, but He spared you because He knew it would.

 

[Hidden In Him]

Perhaps Christ left him there deliberately so that Peter and John would heal him at the appropriate time, and thus the Gospel would move forward after the resurrection of Christ. Jesus knows the end from the beginning, so we should not be surprised.

That's what I've been telling him.

 

[Hidden In Him]

You've hit the nail on the head. Predestination to be conformed to the image of Jesus. God worked directly, outside of my faith or understanding or desire, to accomplish His purpose. Having foreknown me, He predestined me, and my misguided recklessness with my health was not going to prevent that.

Actually no, that's not what I'm saying. All who belong to God are always predestined to be conformed to Christ's image. I'm talking about being predestined for an appointed time for a specific event; a time of visitation as I was referring to in a previous post. Your time for when you would be in the right place to hear about and receive Him had not come yet.

 

[marks]

Perhaps Christ left him there deliberately so that Peter and John would heal him at the appropriate time, and thus the Gospel would move forward after the resurrection of Christ. Jesus knows the end from the beginning, so we should not be surprised.

Nor would I be surprised, just to imagine for a moment . . . Jesus healed everyone who asked, so I'm figuring the fellow didn't ask. Maybe rejected the whole idea, I don't know. But then there he is, Jesus is gone, and he's still crippled, and let's face facts! I know most these people walking by me every day, and I KNOW a lot of them had a lot of things wrong and they all say Jesus healed them! He healed them all, and not me!! What a blow it!! Why Why Why Why didn't I ASK?????

OH Well!! It's over, He's gone, I'm still a cripple! Well, these guys look OK, they were with Him, maybe they'll give me some money anyway! "We don't have any money!" Oh well. "but we'll give you what we do have . . ."

Much love!

 

[Hidden In Him]

Then . . . the Holy Spirit is praying for us concerning those things we do not know, and are not trusting God for, yet the Spirit prays, and the Father hears, for the Spirit prays according to His will.

Ah. Now here is an excellent point. Yes, the Spirit knows the hearts and minds, but that means both our heart and the heart and will of the Father. This means He will interpret our situation and pray the Father's will over it, having acute knowledge of both. This is why praying in tongues is so valuable. We don't have to know the will of God consciously, or even be fully conscious of what it is that WE truly need. The Spirit knows both, and will pray both unto the Father.

 

[Hidden In Him]

@marks. I gotta check out for awhile; some company coming. But I'll try and catch up later.

God bless, and good discussion as always.
- H

 

[Lambano]

Christians are not always healed, so why are we asking whether they should be?

Sorry, but this is an emotional subject for me due to personal reasons involving unanswered prayers.

 

[marks]

And how do you know someone wasn't or hadn't been prayed for you?

That is not your own faith.

Much love!

 

[marks]

Christians are not always healed, so why are we asking whether they should be?

Sorry, but this is an emotional subject for me due to personal reasons involving unanswered prayers.

That's an excellent question! What is the intended fruit?

Much love!

 

[marks]

Actually no, that's not what I'm saying. All who belong to God are always predestined to be conformed to Christ's image. I'm talking about being predestined for an appointed time for a specific event; a time of visitation as I was referring to in a previous post. Your time for when you would be in the right place to hear about and receive Him had not come yet.

OK, cool, let's just keep Jesus in the driver's seat.

That time of visitation is a certain thing though, not like our various "encounters with God" during the course of our lives.

I believe it refers to a time when God provides His "oversight" to our lives as a whole, that is, showing us what we look like to Him, the day we are judged by Him.

Much love!

 

[Hidden In Him]

Actually, before I head out, one other thing that came to mind. Daniel too was praying to know what would become of Jerusalem and the people of God, in advance of the angel coming and revealing to him the prophecy of Israel's future. This is evidence again of the Spirit of God praying through us in conjunction with God's will:

10 A hand touched me and set me trembling on my hands and knees. 11 He said, "Daniel, you who are highly esteemed, consider carefully the words I am about to speak to you, and stand up, for I have now been sent to you." And when he said this to me, I stood up trembling. 12 Then he continued, "Do not be afraid, Daniel. Since the first day that you set your mind to gain understanding and to humble yourself before your God, your words were heard, and I have come in response to them.

I don't think Daniel received those prophesies simply because he wanted to know. I think he wanted to know because the Spirit was leading him to ask about it, in keeping with the will of God to show him what would become of his nation at the end of days. It was man's will working in conjunction with God's will to bring about the desired result at the proper time, as ordained by God in His infinite wisdom.

 

[amadeus]

Ah. Now here is an excellent point. Yes, the Spirit knows the hearts and minds, but that means both our heart and the heart and will of the Father. This means He will interpret our situation and pray the Father's will over it, having acute knowledge of both. This is why praying in tongues is so valuable. We don't have to know the will of God consciously, or even be fully conscious of what it is that WE truly need. The Spirit knows both, and will pray both unto the Father.

Seeing the Spirit as the Blood is also helpful. People need to both drink his Blood and eat his flesh. The flesh is unquickened Word we consume when we read our Bibles. In us, by the Holy Spirit, if we are not quenching the Spirit, that flesh is quickened within us becoming the Living Word of God.

If a person does not have a proper balance of the two, he may go off in a tangent away from God's perfect will for him.

"Then Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except ye eat the flesh of the Son of man, and drink his blood, ye have no life in you.
Whoso eateth my flesh, and drinketh my blood, hath eternal life; and I will raise him up at the last day.
For my flesh is meat indeed, and my blood is drink indeed." John 6:53-55

 

[marks]

Maybe because it takes more faith to believe for what we can see than for what we can't and just have to trust God for. Faith teachers will teach this often, and it's true: When you are believing God for healing, your faith runs up against what it can see in the natural. You keep praying, but your body is still sick, so it can appear like your prayers are not getting answered. But strong faith refuses to give up, based on what it is seeing, however. It refuses to honor what the circumstances look like but continues to trust God, in spite of what it sees in the natural, and eventually receives answered prayer.

I think the strongest faith is in knowing that God is controlling whatever is happening. That when we ask for healing, and we do not see healing, we know something better is coming.

Much love!

 

[Cassandra]

The OT was diffrent than what we have now, Elisha did not have Jesus taking his sickness, nor the stripes of Jesus, nor was he redeemed from the curse of the law as we are today.

The OT folks surely were under Christ's blood, forward looking. The Lamb was slain from the foundation of the world. The sacrifices were just symbols pointing to Christ.

How about Timothy? 1 Timothy 5:23, KJV: "Drink no longer water, but use a little wine for thy stomach's sake and thine often infirmities."