Sound Words

[charity]

'Hold fast the form of sound words,
which thou hast heard of me,
in faith and love
which is in Christ Jesus.'
(2 Timothy 1:13)

Hello there,

I am conscious that my faith is under trial. Not my faith in Christ, as my Saviour and Lord, but the 'form of sound words' which comprise it. It has come through seeking to defend Scripture with someone who has interpreted what is written in quite a different way to myself, and in doing so challenged my own understanding.

* The foundation of faith is solid and unshakeable, for it is Christ Himself, and the work He has accomplished. It is what I have built upon that foundation that is being questioned.

* What is 'the form of sound words' which we, like Timothy, have heard from the pen of Paul, which we are to 'hold fast'? Please join your thoughts on this to mine.

Thank you
In Christ Jesus
Chris

 

[quietthinker]

Yes, what we have built upon it!
Let’s make sure it’s not straw. A testing time will come for all and when it does come and our proudly built construction totters and falls, will our faith in the unshakeable be shaken also?

 

[MatthewG]

Reminds me of the chapter in Hebrews which talks about shaking things down to the ground and only the things that are not shaken remain.

Which have not read it in a while myself because lately have gotten really lazy on reading the scriptures like use to which by my own choice of course. If God is able to shake things that means men/womens thoughts, or even understandings can be shaken down, but what is can not be moved for certain is that of our standing on the foundation of having faith in the Lord Yeshua. Who has taken away our sins, and given us new life by the grace of God which is not of our works but instead our trust in walking with faith and trust towards God and having love for God and others.

Wonderances of what are some of the challenges you face yourself @charity come to mind from with-in me.

You all take care and have a good day what an awesome day today is for certain to just remember of how good and loving our Father in heaven truly is and how he gives good things, a giver of Good things, and not bad. Praise be to our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ. Take care.

 

[An Apologetic Sheepdog]

I am conscious that my faith is under trial. Not my faith in Christ, as my Saviour and Lord, but the 'form of sound words' which comprise it. It has come through seeking to defend Scripture with someone who has interpreted what is written in quite a different way to myself, and in doing so challenged my own understanding.

I might offer you a different perspective (not saying or implying your read is incorrect) which may help you out a bit.

It can be a teaching tool to make you realize that "your" understanding is what may need the changing. ( which will eventually strengthen your faith and service)

That's a possibility- not an evaluation of your post.
I can speak from experience that many views on scripture are based on a preponderance of information (some even questionable) and require much in depth study to get to the nitty gritty and many others are "correct" but have various conditions and other qualifiers attached which may alter the meaning in a specific context.

And that's not even considering normal translational errors or influencing doctrines and such.

My advice would be to first make sure you can shore up your own "understanding" with as much factual information as you can get they view the "adverse viewpoint" with the same level of discernment. You may even find both are wrong or other conditional definition.

* What is 'the form of sound words' which we, like Timothy, have heard from the pen of Paul, which we are to 'hold fast'? Please join your thoughts on this to mine.

A different modern translation in context with the way we talk today could be:

Hold tightly to good solid information ( presuming to be properly vetted and accurate on proper authority) as I said ( Paul as the authority attesting to the validity of his words)….

 

[GRACE ambassador]

'Hold fast the form of sound words,
which thou hast heard of me,
in faith and love
which is in Christ Jesus.'
(2 Timothy 1:13)

Hello there,

I am conscious that my faith is under trial. Not my faith in Christ, as my Saviour and Lord, but the 'form of sound words' which comprise it. It has come through seeking to defend Scripture with someone who has interpreted what is written in quite a different way to myself, and in doing so challenged my own understanding.

* The foundation of faith is solid and unshakeable, for it is Christ Himself, and the work He has accomplished. It is what I have built upon that foundation that is being questioned.

* What is 'the form of sound words' which we, like Timothy, have heard from the pen of Paul, which we are to 'hold fast'? Please join your thoughts on this to mine.

Thank you
In Christ Jesus
Chris

Precious friend, Chris, I believe the "sound words" are All of What Christ Gave Paul, from heaven, found Written In Romans - Philemon, KJB! * After all, What Saith The Scripture?:

"Consider what I say; and The LORD Give thee understanding in all things."
(2 Timothy 2:7 cp Colossians 2:2 KJB!) Many, I fear, haven't the foggiest idea of:

God's Revelation Of HIS Mystery (Romans 16:25), Directly Addressed To us, Today.

* Romans – Philemon {KJB!} = God's GRACE/PEACE Love Letters Directly TO us Today, For: Consolation, Comfort,Edification, Enjoyment, Encouragement, And spiritual Building Up Of All The BLOOD-Washed "members ( saints!" ) In
The Body Of CHRIST!, HIS Church, Seated In Heaven! {Start here, but
remember: "ALL Scripture Is Profitable For our learning!"}

This Revelation of God's Mystery have been my "sound words" for many years, Amen?

Chris E

 

[charity]

'Hold fast the form of sound words,
which Thou hast heard of me,
in faith and love which is in Christ Jesus.'
(2 Timothy 1:13)

@GRACE ambassador
@An Apologetic Sheepdog
@MatthewG
@quietthinker

Hello there,

Thank you all for your encouragement and advice, it is appreciated.

I shall soak myself in those blessed epistles, especially Roman's 5:12-8:39, and those epistles written following the revelation of God to Paul concerning the Church which is His Body:- Ephesians, Philippians, Colossians, 1 & 2 Timothy, Titus and Philemon. Not forgetting those earlier epistles of course which have so much to offer, as does all of God's word: but it is the 'form of sound words' which Paul says, 'Thou hast heard of me' which I want to 'hold fast'; for it is this word that is under attack (see OP).

* The content of Paul's ministry prior to his imprisonment is summed up by him in his words to the Ephesians elders in Acts 20:- '... repentance toward God, and faith toward our Lord Jesus Christ' (v.21), 'to testify the gospel of the grace of God' (v.24), 'preaching the kingdom of God' (v25). In fact he had, 'not shunned to declare unto' them 'all the counsel of God' (v.27). Yes, Paul had declared unto them all the council of God that he had himself received to that date: But there was more to come; which as 'The Lord's Prisoner', he was to receive and make known (Ephesians 3:6-7; Colossians 1:25-28). Yet sadly he would say to Timothy later, having made it known by word of mouth and by writing, that 'all they which are in Asia be turned away from me'.

* Paul's prison ministry concerns the fellowship of the Mystery made known by the risen Christ to Paul only: which unlike 'the mystery of Christ' made known to all the apostles, had been 'hid in God' since the world began (Ephesians 3:9): So it was not 'searchable' in either the Old Testament Scriptures; the writing of Paul written prior to these later epistles; the gospels; or the other writings of the New Testament. Yet Timothy had received all of these truths from Paul, and is being exhorted to 'hold them fast'.

* The Berean spirit of receiving the word with all readiness of mind, but searching the scriptures daily to see if what was heard was true (Acts 17:11), was not possible with this further truth: because it had not been the subject of the Old Testament prophets, as the mystery of Christ had been: and could possibly have been a stumbling block to many: possibly contributed to 'all in Asia' turning away from Paul following it's reception.

* With the departure of Israel into the blindness of unbelief this revelation of God given to Paul was vital for the Church which remained: for salvation had been sent to the Gentiles (Acts 28:28), and Christ was 'in' or 'among' them, their hope of glory. These later epistles of Paul contain the knowledge of the fellowship of this mystery, it's hope, it's blessings, it's inheritance etc., Yes, vital truth, which must be held fast.

'Unto me,
.. Who am less than the least of all saints,
.... is this grace given,
...... that I should preach among the Gentiles
........ the unsearchable riches of Christ;
And to make all men see
.. what is the fellowship of the mystery,
.... which from the beginning of the world
...... hath been hid in God,
........ Who created all things by Jesus Christ:
To the intent that now
.. unto the principalities and powers in heavenly places
.... might be known by the church
......the manifold wisdom of God,'
(Eph 3:8-10)

Thank you
In Christ Jesus
Chris

 

[MatthewG]

Hello Charity;

Some understandings of the mystery of Christ must come from and by the spirit. There will be people that come along the way with different insights on how they see scripture; and if it is not contradictory and away from - the value of love -, it could be an insight to a mystery never known about Christ to a person who did not know in the first place.

Of course also the benefit of understanding on the Revelation of Jesus - would be of great use to a person as well; in my personal opinion.

Thank you too and you and others have a great day off to work here in just a few more minutes.

 

[charity]

Hello Charity;

Some understandings of the mystery of Christ must come from and by the spirit. There will be people that come along the way with different insights on how they see scripture; and if it is not contradictory and away from - the value of love -, it could be an insight to a mystery never known about Christ to a person who did not know in the first place.

Of course also the benefit of understanding on the Revelation of Jesus - would be of great use to a person as well; in my personal opinion.

Thank you too and you and others have a great day off to work here in just a few more minutes.

Thank you,MatthewG,

Your words remind me of the prayer of Ephesians chapter one, I will quote it from verse 15-23:-

'Wherefore I also,
.. after I heard of your faith in the Lord Jesus,
.... and love unto all the saints,
...... Cease not to give thanks for you,
........ making mention of you in my prayers;
That the God of our Lord Jesus Christ,
.. the Father of glory,
.... may give unto you the spirit of wisdom and revelation
...... in the knowledge of Him:
The eyes of your understanding being enlightened;
.. that ye may know what is the hope of His calling,
.... and what the riches of the glory of His inheritance in the saints,
And what is the exceeding greatness of His power to us-ward who believe,
.. according to the working of His mighty power,
.... Which He wrought in Christ,
...... when He raised Him from the dead,
........ and set Him at His own right hand in the heavenly places,
.......... Far above all principality, and power,
............ and might, and dominion, and every name that is named,
.............. not only in this world,
................ but also in that which is to come:
And hath put all things under His feet,
.. and gave Him to be the head over all things to the church,
.... Which is His body,
...... the fulness of Him that filleth all in all.'

Praise God!