Spotting the Heretic

[justbyfaith]

Everyone has indwelling sin according to 1 John 1:8.

I dont.
I have Indwelling Christ.

Because you say that you have no sin, the scripture is clear: that you are deceiving yourself and the truth is not in you. 1 John 1:8.

 

[farouk]

People need to look to the finished work of Christ.

@Waiting on him Hebrews chapters 9 and 10 are very clear indeed about Christ 'once offered'.

 

[FollowHim]

Yes, i believe you do.
Thats true.

To be precise, this is the problem. You can offer a series of ideas, but it is up to the reader to decide for themselves what is applicable. As soon as you start getting personal, it becomes a form of judgementalism. This is a basic reality all teachers and counsellors learn early on. Only when the reader discovers for themselves the truth and how they relate to it, can progress be made.

It is always the problem with dictated ideas, you have to exalt the authority and just accept what they say.
A common symtom is you need to listen to the "right" teacher, or you have been "brain washed" into a certain attitude.
Ironically those who have been brainwashed, look at the rest of the world like they are the true people with insight, while everyone else lives on this delusional plain. You know you have hit the truth, because there are no deluded people, it is different perspectives on ideas or faith or emotional bias. You see the myriad of different insights any one point can have, because none of them threaten ones own position, because it is arrived at freely while considering the other options.

It is why quoting scripture becomes not seeking the truth of God and expositing it, but accepting or rejecting scripture based on preconceived ideas, and if they are contradicted, it is the speaker who is wrong, because scripture could never contradict ones own belief system.

It is why we have theological colleges to study such issues, and test their truth from as many perspectives as possible.

God bless you

 

[marks]

Behold is trying very hard to be a teacher, when he should really be a pupil (which includes learning how to write cogently and with clarity).

I will quote from his OP about "Become a Perfect Disciple of Christ" and show you that he does not understand the difference between justification and sanctification and as a result he is promoting the Hyper-Grace heresy that Christians cannot and do not sin, and therefore do not need to address their present sins. And that is false and misleading. So the one talking about "spotting the heretic" is himself promoting heresy!

QUOTES FROM *BEHOLD'S* OP
"Becoming a perfect Disciple of Christ"

FALLACY #1. JUSTIFICATION = SANCTIFICATION
"And sanctified how? This is how. = 1 Corinthians 1:30. ... ""But of Him you (the Born again) are in Christ Jesus, WHO BECAME FOR US = wisdom from God—and Righteousness and SANCTIFICATION and REDEMPTION". Now see that? See how the verses show you that you are MADE ALL this, by God?= So, that is your Born Again Spirit that is BECOME ALL THAT."
[My comment: the sanctification mentioned here means being set apart by the gift and sealing of the Holy Spirit. It does not mean sinless perfection (which is implied by Behold)]

"You dont work for that, you are already "abiding" there..."
[My comment: all genuine Christians understand that they do NOT work for their salvation. So that is not only a gratuitous remark, it is a straw man argument]

FALLACY #2: "WE THE BORN AGAIN HAVE NO SIN"
"Your born again INNER MAN, that is "seated in heavenly places IN CHRIST" RIGHT NOW>...>and tomorrow...is FINISHED. So, when i say we the born again have no sin, im talking about all THAT ... As that is the REAL ME and YOU..the born again "new creation in CHRIST " REAL ME and YOU. = AS GOD sees US at all times. If you are born again....You are Perfected, Sanctified, Justified, Redeemed and have Eternal Life, AS the "new Creation" in Christ. = the REAL You. So, NOW. Once you see that...lets talk about living Holy.
You can only live HOLY because you SEE that the REAL YOU is already ALL THAT.. "in Christ" as the "new Creation"."
[My comment: The first epistle of John makes it crystal clear that if any Christian claims that he is sinless, he deceives himself and also makes God a liar]

FALLACY # 3: JUSTIFICATION = WALKING IN THE SPIRIT
"Could you live holy enough to ever become all that if you were never MADE Righteous by the Blood of JESUS? A.) NO. So, its in the knowledge of who you are in Christ, that you go about your discipleship, knowing you are already RIGHTEOUS>. Perfected. Sanctified.. "IN CHRIST". And when you SEE THIS... when you truly SEE YOURSELF as GOD has MADE YOU TO BE... the "new Creation".... Then your discipleship will have true spiritual power and true influence. THIS IS "WALKING IN THE SPIRIT". Its what i have shown you in many previous Threads ."
[My comment: The difference between walking in the Spirit and living according to "the flesh" is spelled out in detail in Galatians 5. The issue of justification is not in view. The flesh needs to be crucified, as Paul clearly states]

I don't know if you saw these . . .

Spotting the Heretic #632
Spotting the Heretic #633
Spotting the Heretic #634

 

[Josho]

I think we have all spotted the heretic here.

Spotting the heretic sounds a bit like the modern day version of bird watching.

Oh wow see that bird over there, what species is it? Is it the heretic species?

 

[marks]

Spotting the heretic sounds a bit like the modern day version of bird watching.

Oh wow see that bird over there, what species is it? Is it the heretic species?

Where's Waldo?

 

[Waiting on him]

Spotting the heretic sounds a bit like the modern day version of bird watching.

Oh wow see that bird over there, what species is it? Is it the heretic species?

Depends, does he have a guilty conscience.

 

[Waiting on him]

You know Luther walked around for some time with rocks in his shoes the way I understand it. Once he began reading the word of God and stop taking for granted everything he was being told was by the supposed authorities was absolute truth he stumbled upon the verse,

The just shall live by faith.

Habakkuk 2:4 KJV
Behold, his soul which is lifted up is not upright in him: but the just shall live by his faith.

Who's faith?

 

[Episkopos]

Spotting the heretic sounds a bit like the modern day version of bird watching.

Oh wow see that bird over there, what species is it? Is it the heretic species?

Trainspotting?

 

[RogerDC]

But Jesus is God. So in mediating between Jesus and man, she would be mediating between God and man.

You're right, it ain't rocket science.

But Jesus is eternally a man - that allows Mary to mediate between us and Jesus - man to man. It's a simple concept that even you could understand, but you don't want to accept it because it's too "Catholic".

 

[RogerDC]

It seems to me to be what it is saying here.

1Ti 3:15, But if I tarry long, that thou mayest know how thou oughtest to behave thyself in the house of God, which is the church of the living God, the pillar and ground of the truth.

That's right up there with the most pathetic interpretations of scripture I've ever come across. I'm embarrassed for you. Little wonder you don't understand the rest of scripture. You're clueless.

Do you think the "house of Israel" in Jer 5:11 refers to a literal house or building?
Is Jesus a literal rock or cornerstone?

 

[RogerDC]

Spotting the heretic sounds a bit like the modern day version of bird watching.

Oh wow see that bird over there, what species is it? Is it the heretic species?

I think it's meant to be another of Behold's attempts at comedy. His posts are all very amusing and entertaining.

 

[RogerDC]

Depends, does he have a guilty conscience.

Don't know, but he's not short on pride.

 

[RogerDC]

See my many Threads.
They can help you.

So funny!

 

[justbyfaith]

But Jesus is eternally a man - that allows Mary to mediate between us and Jesus - man to man. It's a simple concept that even you could understand, but you don't want to accept it because it's too "Catholic".

There is one mediator between God and man...and Jesus is God. Therefore Mary doesn't mediate between us and Jesus. She would be a mediator between God and man.

 

[RogerDC]

There is one mediator between God and man...and Jesus is God. Therefore Mary doesn't mediate between us and Jesus. She would be a mediator between God and man.

Find an adult and let them explain it to you.

 

[justbyfaith]

That's right up there with the most pathetic interpretations of scripture I've ever come across. I'm embarrassed for you. Little wonder you don't understand the rest of scripture. You're clueless.

Do you think the "house of Israel" in Jer 5:11 refers to a literal house or building?
Is Jesus a literal rock or cornerstone?

This is how you deal with things you can't deal with? Ridiculing your opponent by saying that he is unable to interpret scripture.

It is a valid interpretation. Yours may be too.

But a house is a house.

In the days of the early church, the church used to meet in houses.

When the saints meet in a house, it becomes the house of God...because it is housing members of the body of Christ....and Christ is God.

 

[justbyfaith]

Find an adult and let them explain it to you.

More ridiculing...

The fact that Jesus is a Man does not negate the fact that He is God.

But I see that you are digging in your heels because you are unwilling to give up your Catholic doctrines.

 

[RogerDC]

.
Paul teaches that to stop this carnal Christianity, you are to REST in the understanding of God's Grace that frees you from trying to "live right" by self effort.

So what does a believer do when tempted to sin? Are you saying a believer should not use "self effort" to resist the temptation to sin?
How does a believer resist sin without using using his free will?

 

[marks]

that allows Mary to mediate between us and Jesus

I never seem to get over this concept, that some think we need a mediator between me and Jesus, when Jesus Himself IS our mediator.