Spotting the Heretic

[RogerDC]

Being treated as an enemy of the OSAS folks is a very shocking thing, and it hurts when treated as such. After going to a Reformed Baptist Church, not knowing they were reformed at that point, then learning from the pastor himself that he is a 5 point Calvinist. I told him that I was not and could not believe that way. Oh boy was i treated very, very cold and not just by him but especially his wife who saw herself as more of a "Puritan" (her words) she never once said hello back to me, I was shunned by many and since they did not know me personally, what else would have made them be that way other than my beliefs? That was my first and (hopefully) the only bad experience I ever had with a Church and it was a shock to my to my spirit to be treated that way. Very hurtful and confusing to me.
It is a sad thing knowing The Father is looking down on his kids fighting with each other all the time. It makes me think of how moms can get overwhelmed when her kids fight and argue all the time, haha!

Thank you for the reply,
nancy

Jesus prayed for unity amongst his followers, but Protestantism is a madhouse of conflicting doctrinal opinions that can lead to all sorts of distress.

Meanwhile, over at the Catholic Church, things are much more peaceful, as Catholics rely on the Church to decide what is doctrine. Independent opinions of individuals or factions mean nothing. The (Catholic) Church is the "pillar and foundation of the truth" (1Tim 3:15) and is the "fullness" of Christ (Eph 1:22-23), which means her doctrines cannot be wrong and she cannot teach error.

 

[justbyfaith]

Jesus prayed for unity amongst his followers, but Protestantism is a madhouse of conflicting doctrinal opinions that can lead to all sorts of distress.

Meanwhile, over at the Catholic Church, things are much more peaceful, as Catholics rely on the Church to decide what is doctrine. Independent opinions of individuals or factions mean nothing. The (Catholic) Church is the "pillar and foundation of the truth" (1Tim 3:15) and is the "fullness" of Christ (Eph 1:22-23), which means her doctrines cannot be wrong and she cannot teach error.

The Bible is the ultimate authority; and if the Catholic Church teaches what is contrary to the word (such as burning incense to the queen of heaven), it is in error.

Mary is not a co-redeemer with Christ in any sense of what the word teaches.

In fact, the Bible teaches that there is only one mediator between God and man...the Man Christ Jesus (1 Timothy 2:5).

So then, Mary and the saints do not serve as mediators in any sense of what the word teaches.

You can only come to the Father though Jesus Christ, John 14:6. He is the way.

 

[RogerDC]

The Bible is the ultimate authority

Scripture says the Church is the "pillar and foundation of the truth" (1Tim 3:15) and is the "fullness" of Christ (Eph 1:22-23).

Where does scripture say the Bible is the "pillar and foundation of the truth"?
Where does scripture say the Bible is the "fullness" of Christ?

(And I haven't even got to Eph 4 yet.)

 

[justbyfaith]

Scripture says the Church is the "pillar and foundation of the truth" (1Tim 3:15) and is the "fullness" of Christ (Eph 1:22-23).

Where does scripture say the Bible is the "pillar and foundation of the truth"?
Where does scripture say the Bible is the "fullness" of Christ?

(And I haven't even got to Eph 4 yet.)

Scripture teaches that it is the ultimate authority in 2 Timothy 3:15-17.

Psalms 138:2 also has a bearing on this subject.

 

[RogerDC]

In fact, the Bible teaches that there is only one mediator between God and man...the Man Christ Jesus (1 Timothy 2:5).

That's true, but Mary is not a mediator between God and man - she is a mediator between THE MAN Christ Jesus and mankind - ie, man to man, not God to man.

 

[justbyfaith]

That's true, but Mary is not a mediator between God and man - she is a mediator between THE MAN Christ Jesus and mankind - ie, man to man, not God to man.

Do you now not believe that Jesus is God (I thought that it was Catholic doctrine that He is)?

If Mary is mediator between Jesus and man, she is mediator between God and man, therefore.

 

[justbyfaith]

1 Tim 3:15 also, to some degree, is referring to the building where the saints assemble to meet in the Lord.

 

[justbyfaith]

Scripture says the Church is the "pillar and foundation of the truth" (1Tim 3:15) and is the "fullness" of Christ (Eph 1:22-23).

Where does scripture say the Bible is the "pillar and foundation of the truth"?
Where does scripture say the Bible is the "fullness" of Christ?

(And I haven't even got to Eph 4 yet.)

Since there are those who do not subscribe to Catholicism and yet do believe in Jesus Christ unto salvation (and therefore are members of His church), I would say that the church is not the Catholic Church as a hierarchy any more; but consists of all those who believe in Jesus Christ.

 

[RogerDC]

The Bible is the ultimate authority

Eph 4:4-14 says it is the Church leads the believers to "unity ... the knowledge of the Son of God, to a perfect man, to the measure of the stature of the fullness of Christ" ... not to mention, infallible doctrine. These things being so, how can you then claim that your personal interpretation the Bible has authority over the Church?

 

[RogerDC]

1 Tim 3:15 also, to some degree, is referring to the building where the saints assemble to meet in the Lord.

Good grief. This is surely a joke - no one could possibly be that clueless! I love your sense of humour!

 

[RogerDC]

Do you now not believe that Jesus is God (I thought that it was Catholic doctrine that He is)?

If Mary is mediator between Jesus and man, she is mediator between God and man, therefore.

The very verse you quoted - 1Tim 2:5 - says "the MAN Christ Jesus"! Jesus is both God and MAN - this means Mary mediates on our behalf, not directly to
God, but to "the MAN, Christ Jesus", who is also her biological son - for eternity. Come on, it ain't rocket science.

 

[justbyfaith]

The very verse you quoted - 1Tim 2:5 - says "the MAN Christ Jesus"! Jesus is both God and MAN - this means Mary mediates on our behalf, not directly to
God, but to "the MAN, Christ Jesus", who is also her biological son - for eternity. Come on, it ain't rocket science.

But Jesus is God. So in mediating between Jesus and man, she would be mediating between God and man.

You're right, it ain't rocket science.

 

[justbyfaith]

Eph 4:4-14 says it is the Church leads the believers to "unity ... the knowledge of the Son of God, to a perfect man, to the measure of the stature of the fullness of Christ" ... not to mention, infallible doctrine. These things being so, how can you then claim that your personal interpretation the Bible has authority over the Church?

Since there are those who do not subscribe to Catholicism and yet do believe in Jesus Christ unto salvation (and therefore are members of His church), I would say that the church is not the Catholic Church as a hierarchy any more; but consists of all those who believe in Jesus Christ.

 

[justbyfaith]

Good grief. This is surely a joke - no one could possibly be that clueless! I love your sense of humour!

It seems to me to be what it is saying here.

1Ti 3:15, But if I tarry long, that thou mayest know how thou oughtest to behave thyself in the house of God, which is the church of the living God, the pillar and ground of the truth.

 

[FollowHim]

A heretic has a problem. His targets cannot be happy and secure, victorious and growing. That would mean the heretic is wrong, fundamentally flawed.

It was a strange reality, someone who could not rejoice with me. Equally we cannot be equals but blind ignorant folk who need this new teacher to show the way. If we have truth and can see reality, light in the darkness, that must be a lie, because the new teachers role is not essential.

So they are strident, rebuking, self possessed of their status, authority and knowledge. It is not a sharing, or encouragement, just accept and listen, or dismissed and knocked down.

Jesus invited people, got alongside, empathised, listened, opened doors, healed, forgave, and lead those who would follow. The base is the believer and helping them walk, very different. God bless you

 

[Behold]

I see you are upset by my faith. What do I hold that is a challenge to you? Is it perhaps those of faith who disagree with your conclusions. I think this strikes fear in you, you could be wrong, and you have gone so far there is no turning back. And that is the problem. No restraint or seeing in every relationship has the risk of failure, in which love proves the conqueror. God bless you

See my many Threads.
They can help you.

 

[Behold]

Everyone has indwelling sin according to 1 John 1:8. .

I dont.
I have Indwelling Christ.

 

[Behold]

A heretic has a problem.

Thats true.
The problem is Galatians 1:8

 

[FollowHim]

See my many Threads.
They can help you.

I think this is the point, I do not need your help and it appears you believe I do.
It reminds me of the salesman who believes he is so good at selling he will sell anything to anyone, even if they do not need it.
There is a great reality in Christ, we have communion through the Holy Spirit with Him.
Our role one to another as the body of Christ is to encourage and bless each other, and if there is obvious sin, to pray and counsel those who have fallen into evils deceptive grip. And these sins are normally obvious to see. As soon as people start to talk about sin like it is ever present and complicated, like walking in the flesh or walking in the Spirit, while ignoring adultery, theft, slander, anger, covetousness, dishonouring ones parents, it is clear what is going on.

Our walk is called to be full of holiness and grace, based on the foundation we have in Christ. The confusion often comes because people do not understand empathy and culture mean we feel and see what the world sees, but we are different and choose another way. Too easily people condemn themselves over learnt empathy rather than their chosen path. So we can see an attractive woman, offering herself, but then see the fallen sinner within who is compromising and selling themselves for financial gain, while losing their soul and heart in sexual abuse.

To be aware of our responses and our realities is part of walking in the light, it is the choice to walk in the Spirit and not the flesh that defines who we are in Him. God bless you

 

[Behold]

I think this is the point, I do not need your help and it appears you believe I do.

Yes, i believe you do.
Thats true.