Stumbling Block verses

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Episkopos

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Any scripture with a spiritual meaning will be misunderstood by the carnal mind.

I do not buy the explainations here given for the blood. If any can explain Isaiah 1:18 and why sin is scarlet, I believe that is integral to a proper understanding.


I think the difference is between blood...and shed blood. These are not the same of course.

I can go to a clinic and get a blood test...a drawing of blood...and yet live through it. No one will accuse the nurse or technician of any sin or crime.

However if I go to the same clinic and someone draws a knife and kills me...that is a crime and a sin. So in both cases blood was drawn or spilled. The difference is between life and death...which only seems like a small difference until one realizes the gravity of the situation.

So our sins are like shed blood...not blood drawn...but blood spilled.

It is like when we drink the blood of Christ. It is a living blood that gives us life. Not spilled blood.

However blood WAS spilled when Jesus died. But that is not the blood that gives us life. That is the payment of our freedom from the power that held us captive to sin. It is blood debt. A life FOR a life. Jesus died for the sins of the whole world.

But to be saved one must partake of the blood of Christ...the life of Christ. That is a life IN a life. Jesus in you. That is a living connection to the flow of blood...the flow of life...into us. It is His life In us...not instead of us. It is akin to a branch drawing the sap out of the vine. But the vine must be living...otherwise there is no sap to sustain life.

The difference is laid out in the torah...

The death of Jesus is a life FOR a life. A redemption from the bondage of sin and death. (Ex. 21:23 in the Hebrew says a life instead of (for) a life)נֶפֶשׁ תַּחַת נָפֶשׁ.
The resurrection of Jesus is a life IN a life. Which is Christ IN you. (Not just Christ FOR you) (Deut. 19:21 in the Hebrew says...a life IN a life)נֶפֶשׁ בְּנֶפֶשׁ
 
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marks

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Interesting thread. Hopefully, any thread such as this would explicitly recognize that it is the Holy Spirit who gives us understanding of truth and guides us into all truth. Also, I believe it's important to recognize that aspects of the truth can defy human logic. This especially applies to dichotomies (seeming contradictions) in the Bible. Of course, truth never contradicts itself, so that's why I stressed "seeming" contradictions.
Absolutely!

Any seeming contradictions show incomplete understanding. Another word that's a red flag for me is "tension" between passages. There is only harmonly.

Much love!
 
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stunnedbygrace

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what do we deserve?



To me it read’s as if you and @CharismaticLady are essentially saying the same thing. As God implemented what accomplishes His purpose and good pleasure. In removing a government (Vessels of destruction)and setting up the New (Vessels of Mercy).

Yes, I can see that. I just balk at the thought that Satan is in control of the earth. I know it appears that way sometimes, but I look at all the bible and stories of where men did their worst or Satan did his worst THROUGH men, and how they or he meant it for evil but God meant it for good. So the worst darkness can do or attempt cannot overcome light.

So I can look at a story like Joseph sold into slavery and I can agree that it was Satan acting through men, but God turned it to good, many people saved in famine. So...I don't see Satan as in control of the earth or in control of my life and its events.
 
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Episkopos

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I have stated that it is not our business to appropriate the spilled blood of Christ. That is a transaction between Power (God's )and powers (principalities). These things are way above our pay grade, so to speak.

Our faith is to be placed in Christ...in His life. His resurrection life. As such we are made alive through the flowing of His blood (life) in our veins.
 

CharismaticLady

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I have stated that it is not our business to appropriate the spilled blood of Christ. That is a transaction between Power (God's )and powers (principalities). These things are way above our pay grade, so to speak.

Our faith is to be placed in Christ...in His life. His resurrection life. As such we are made alive through the flowing of His blood (life) in our veins.

Is there any benefit to "pleading the blood of Jesus," or "power in the blood of Jesus"?
 

CharismaticLady

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The power of the blood is the resurrection life of Jesus. But..."pleading the blood of Jesus"...??? I think that is a church thing...a religious tradition. Can one plead the life of Jesus?

I've heard about it but wasn't raised with it.
 

stunnedbygrace

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So then do you believe in Limited Atonement, that God chooses who will be saved, and who He won't allow to be saved?

Yes. But my answer can't be looked at apart from God being able to see the end of every man from the beginning. Since He can already see the end of every man and I can't, it seems cruel to my nonomniscient mind for Him to say He makes some vessels for destruction or that He loves one man but hates another.
 
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CharismaticLady

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Yes. But my answer can't be looked at apart from God being able to see the end of every man from the beginning. Since He can already see the end of every man and I can't, it seems cruel to my nonomniscient mind for Him to say He makes some vessels for destruction.

But wouldn't that be exactly what is happening if you also believe in irresistible grace he gives some, but not others?
 

stunnedbygrace

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What I'm trying to say is...if something God has said seems unkind, unloving or unfair to me, it's usually because I'm forgetting a certain attribute of God that He has but I don't.
 

Nancy

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Not sure what you mean by irresistible grace.

Irresistible grace is the "I" in the Calvinists acronym T.U.L.I.P.-simply means that we have no choice and are compelled or even forced to believe in/on Him...takes away "choice". People come to The Lord for many reasons and, if they are humble and open about their sin, it should not matter "how" one comes to Him...some kicking and screaming, others brought up in the Faith, others...fear.
V.I.J. could probably explain this better...
 

Nancy

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BTW- I do not subscribe to this...

I - Irresistible Grace

The fourth Biblical truth in the five points of Calvinism teaches that God's grace to save a person cannot be resisted. Grace is God's free and unmerited power to save a person from his sins which would otherwise lead us to hell. Grace brings him to heaven who naturally would end in eternal hell.

That grace is irresistible. That means that if God gives grace to you, there is nothing in the world that you can do to resist it and thwart God's intention to take you to heaven. The certainty of salvation for God's elect is seen in John 6:37 where Jesus says: "All that the Father hath given me shall come to me..." There is no doubt that they will be saved. Verse 44 says that those who come to God come because God draws them. Not our will, but God's will is first and powerful.

Now, some ridicule this truth of the Bible and say that it makes man go to heaven against his will. "He kicks and screams all the way to heaven." But that is not how the Bible presents God's grace. God makes His people "willing in the day of His power" Psalm 110:3. For a wonderful illustration of that truth, just consider the converted Apostle Paul. "By the grace of God' he was what he was (I Corinthians 15:10). And immediately after his conversion he said willingly, "Lord, what wilt thou have me to do?" Acts 9:6. That surely was not against his will.

God's grace is sweet and irresistible. He makes us love it and want nothing else. He is as irresistible to us as a husband to his newly-wed bride. Come with us and hear God's wonderful grace proclaimed in Christ any Lord's Day.
 

stunnedbygrace

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What does the "I" stand for in T.U.L.I.P.

The "L" is limited atonement, so I thought you would know.

No, sorry, I don't know. I've briefly heard the silly bickering over limited atonement but I guess I never stuck around for the I!
 
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GISMYS_7

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Satan loves to plant seeds of doubt concerning God's eternal living Word!
 

VictoryinJesus

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The power of the blood is the resurrection life of Jesus.

Makes me think of He has given power to become the Son’s of God. 1 Corinthians 15:49 And as we have borne the image of the earthy, we shall also bear the image of the heavenly.

to deny or refuse the power to bear the image of the heavenly..is frightening. or pushing it off way out after dead and buried when “dead and buried” with Him is Now that His Life (the heavenly image) might be manifested. Deny the power to become the Sons of God, and the power to become the Sons of God will deny you. Even worse teaching others to deny the power to become the Sons of God. (John 16:12-15).

Then tangled (in man’s doctrines)is the “image of the heavenly” which men try to force is the image of the corruptible respect of persons in “limited atonement”. How much God IS not a respecter of persons: Matthew 5:45 That ye may be the children of your Father which is in heaven: for he maketh his sun to rise on the evil and on the good, and sendeth rain on the just and on the unjust.


vessels fitted for destruction and wrath is the natural man whom can not receive the things of God. We have all borne the image of the natural. some think they were never natural or under wrath but even Paul said they all were and had their time of conversation in past in the world, running with them.
 
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