Tending the Garden

[aspen]

Genesis 2:15

One of the first commandments that God gave Adam was to care for the Earth. As I look around our world today, I see the oceans dying from pollution, forests being cut down, and species of animals going extinct. Recently, evangelicals have come together to acknowledge what Christians have been hesitate to recognize - humans are consuming the Earth's resources at a rapid rate.

I just watched a documentary on the garbage patch in the middle of the Pacific Ocean - I expected to see lots of big trash items to be floating around, but to my surprise, that was not the case. Instead, the water was infused with liquid plastic along with tiny specs of plastics. There was not red or orange colored plastic because the birds and fish are attracted to bright colors. This area of the ocean, which covers about 1/4 of the Pacific region is toxic.

Alberta Canada is extracting oil from sand. One town is contributing most of the greenhouse gases admitted by the entire country. The rivers in the region are poisoned, The Native Canadian tribes in the area are already shows increases in cancer,

Fish stocks will collapse by 2050 at the present rate of commercial fishing. There is no reason to believe that commercial fishing rates will remain at present levels - as our populations increase so does the rate of fishing.

Prophets in the OT were not well liked because they told truths people didn't want to hear - environmental scientists are trying to give us a message that we do not want to hear, as well; we are not taking care of the Earth.

So is there anything that we can do to stop the destruction of our planet? Is this a Christian concern?

 

[7angels]

i don't like to get into this because it causes debate but here are my thoughts on the matter.. no i am not worried about this at all. lately we have had a prophesy concerning what will happen in this country should we not turn back to God. there will be starvation, food trucks will need guards to protect them from being robbed, riots will be a major concern, economy will collapse, and ect. but thank God that no matter how bad things get that his grace will abound even more. it talked of people who had no food put out dishes as if it were time to eat and everyone gather around the table say grace and then food will appear before them where there was no food. also it showed revival like never before. signs miracles and wonders will abound in these times of darkness.

God has already prophesied in revelations what is going to happen. this may be how it will all occurs. according to the word God will take care of his own. why should i worry about things that do not matter to my going to heaven or doing God's will which is to be a harvester or fisher of men and bring them into the kingdom. this worldly life will end soon enough and then i will have a place in eternity. Jesus is my example i try to follow. if it did not concern him then why should it concern me?

 

[Shirley]

Rev. 11:18 tells us that at judgement day God is going to destroy those who destroy the earth. God put man in charge of the earth. I am not into environmentalism but I sure do want to do my part on being a good caretaker of the earth.

 

[aspen]

Is environmentalism not a Christian issue?

 

[prism]

Is environmentalism not a Christian issue?

Not directly. Hearts cleansed by the Blood of Christ is a Christian issue.
The environment is a governmental issue and yet to the extent the Gospel has salted a culture there will be a respect for God's created order.

 

[Foreigner]

Is environmentalism not a Christian issue?

-- Substitute "enviromentalism" with "homosexuality" or "adultery" and you should have your answer.

If you feel that Christians should not speak out against homosexuality when asked because it can "alienate." make people angry,
or make it appear you are judging their actions when we as Christians have no right to, etc. etc. etc....

.....then you really can't expect Christians to speak out to people about their actions harming the environment.

After all, isn't it better just to 'love them' and let them see by our example what is best?

Especially if we may believe it to be immoral, but U.S law says they have the legal right to do it? (drilling, fracking, logging, landfills, offshore oil wells...)




"This area of the ocean, which covers about 1/4 of the Pacific region is toxic." - Aspen

-- No. Not even close.
The ''Pacific Region" stretches from Australia to California, Alaska to Antarctica.

 

[aspen]

Great point Foreigner!

I know it is important for you for me to be consistent! Don't fret....I am not an environmental OR homosexual crusader. I just watched a good documentary on the wreckage we call the ocean and decided to start a thread. It seems to me that we could do a better job of care taking for the planet since God did command us to do so - unlike legislating laws against homosexuals.

If you are not interested in the subject, feel free to move on.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Pacific_Garbage_Patch

 

[Foreigner]

And as I said, your "documentary" has put forth incorrect information.

One-forth of the pacific region is not 'toxic.' not even close

Don't suppose you could give the name of the documentory and/or who put it together?

Probably not. Guess we are stuck with the incredible truths of "some documentary."

 

[aspen]

And as I said, your "documentary" has put forth incorrect information.

One-forth of the pacific region is not 'toxic.' not even close

Don't suppose you could give the name of the documentory and/or who put it together?

Probably not. Guess we are stuck with the incredible truths of "some documentary."

I think the documentary said that the garbage patch was the size of two states of Texas which was stretched out across the Pacific Ocean from Japan to California, based on tides and wind.

I found the documentary on utube ........I am going to have to think about the name of it.

 

[prism]

U-Tube? It has it's own pollution issues :blink:

 

[Hollyrock]

Is environmentalism not a Christian issue?

Environmentalism is absolutely a Christian issue, just as politics and lots of other life issues are Christian issues.

 

[HammerStone]

Aspen, have you ever heard of Creation Care? http://http://creationcare.org/

I'm more of the mind that this is a symptom as opposed to a major theological problem. For example, I think if the average person cared more about others in the manner Jesus instructed us, then litter becomes a much smaller problem. I feel I'm somewhat unique in my stance in that I'm receptive in trying to treat the environment better than the average person, but at the same time, I don't believe in turning the ecosystem into its own god. I think eco green can become near as much of a god as money green.

 

[Vashti]

Environmentalism is absolutely a Christian issue, just as politics and lots of other life issues are Christian issues.

Did Jesus coming up on politics?
If we have kingdom wich is not of this world, therefore, the policy of this world applies to Christians?

According to me the Church should not be mixed into politics, and Christians should stop at civic duties fulfilled, such as elections, etc. (render to Caesar the things that are Caesar's..)

I personally did not understand those Christians, involved in politics, in other words, involved in matters of this world - do you think of them they "seek the things that are above"?

I know the arguments for the benefit of matters of this world - like "we live with here", etc
I'm not interested in politics, nor the clashes mighty of this world. I trust that God controls everything and it's not my issue which magnate quickly devour other magnate...

 

[Foreigner]

Individual responsibility is something to be encouraged. Collective (translation: more massive government involvement) is not.

How many farms have gone dry negatively affecting our food supply because of our friend the snail darter?

And then there is the small matter of prophecy....

A layman can see that End Of Times prophecies are coming to pass.

There is no need for long-term environmental plans that will take years to come to fruition.

No matter what man does, global famine and severe food shortages are predicted.

“The first angel sounded: And hail and fire followed, mingled with blood, and they were thrown to the earth. And a third of the trees were burned up, and all green grass was burned up.” Revelation 8:7

“Then the second angel sounded: And something like a great mountain burning with fire was thrown into the sea, and a third of the sea became blood. And a third of the living creatures in the sea died, and a third of the ships were destroyed.” Revelation 8:8,9

“Then the third angel sounded: And a great star fell from heaven, burning like a torch, and it fell on a third of the rivers and on the springs of water. The name of the star is Wormwood. A third of the waters became wormwood, and many men died from the water, because it was made bitter.” Revelation 8:10,11

And THEN the real destruction begins.

These events are going to happen NO MATTER WHAT Christians and non-Christians do about the environment.

The focus now (more than ever) should be the saving of souls.

 

[aspen]

Individual responsibility is something to be encouraged. Collective (translation: more massive government involvement) is not.

How many farms have gone dry negatively affecting our food supply because of our friend the snail darter?

How many farms were saved because of government involvement in the Dust Bowl Era?

And then there is the small matter of prophecy....

A layman can see that End Of Times prophecies are coming to pass.

There is no need for long-term environmental plans that will take years to come to fruition.

No matter what man does, global famine and severe food shortages are predicted.

“The first angel sounded: And hail and fire followed, mingled with blood, and they were thrown to the earth. And a third of the trees were burned up, and all green grass was burned up.” Revelation 8:7

“Then the second angel sounded: And something like a great mountain burning with fire was thrown into the sea, and a third of the sea became blood. And a third of the living creatures in the sea died, and a third of the ships were destroyed.” Revelation 8:8,9

“Then the third angel sounded: And a great star fell from heaven, burning like a torch, and it fell on a third of the rivers and on the springs of water. The name of the star is Wormwood. A third of the waters became wormwood, and many men died from the water, because it was made bitter.” Revelation 8:10,11

Wow!! So now that we have used up the Earth's resources and believe it is all going to be destroyed anyway.....may as well throw in the towel! Hope your kids, kids aren't going to need it. Too bad you cannot ask the Medieval Europeans who lived through the plague or the Millerites about how quickly the end of the world was going to happen.

And THEN the real destruction begins.

These events are going to happen NO MATTER WHAT Christians and non-Christians do about the environment.

The focus now (more than ever) should be the saving of souls.

So, how many souls have you saved, Foreigner? I thought that was Christ's job.....

Aspen, have you ever heard of Creation Care? http://http://creationcare.org/

I'm more of the mind that this is a symptom as opposed to a major theological problem. For example, I think if the average person cared more about others in the manner Jesus instructed us, then litter becomes a much smaller problem. I feel I'm somewhat unique in my stance in that I'm receptive in trying to treat the environment better than the average person, but at the same time, I don't believe in turning the ecosystem into its own god. I think eco green can become near as much of a god as money green.

Thanks for the link.

 

[Foreigner]

How many farms were saved because of government involvement in the Dust Bowl Era?

-- The government had neither the fore-knowledge, technology, infrastructure or money to deal with that issue.
But even if they had, the only option would be to tap into the large aquifer under the central U.S. The shear size and length of the drought would have likely led to a dangerous depletion of that aquifer.

Translation: Government involvement THEN would likely have caused severe issues that we would still be encountering today.

Glad I could help.

Wow!! So now that we have used up the Earth's resources and believe it is all going to be destroyed anyway.....may as well throw in the towel! Hope your kids, kids aren't going to need it. Too bad you cannot ask the Medieval Europeans who lived through the plague or the Millerites about how quickly the end of the world was going to happen.

-- LOL honestly Aspen. Your are such a drama queen. :lol:
Encouraging personal responsibility but not supporting governments pooling hundreds of billions of dollars a year to funnel to countries that have neither the ability or accountability to address the vast, vast majority of envirionmental issues is hardly "throwing in the towel."

CNN's Anderson Cooper reported that one of the UN's own report states that - at the earliest - it could take one to two decades for the programs suggested to have even a 'minimal impact, if at all."

Sorry to interject facts here, but one of us had to...


As far as prophecy goes. I am stunned by your lack of interest and understanding. No, really....

So, how many souls have you saved, Foreigner? I thought that was Christ's job.....

-- Selective Linguistic Ignorance is the last resort of someone plagued with the inability to support their opinions.
Thanks for being consistent.






.

 

[aspen]

-- The government had neither the fore-knowledge, technology, infrastructure or money to deal with that issue.
But even if they had, the only option would be to tap into the large aquifer under the central U.S. The shear size and length of the drought would have likely led to a dangerous depletion of that aquifer.

Translation: Government involvement THEN would likely have caused severe issues that we would still be encountering today.

Glad I could help.

You only help me see that you do not know your history.

"In 1937, the federal government began an aggressive campaign to encourage Dust Bowlers to adopt planting and plowing methods that conserved the soil. The government paid the reluctant farmers a dollar an acre to practice one of the new methods. By 1938, the massive conservation effort had reduced the amount of blowing soil by 65 percent."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dust_Bowl

-- LOL honestly Aspen. Your are such a drama queen. :lol:

I am glad you recognize my passion!


Encouraging personal responsibility but not supporting governments pooling hundreds of billions of dollars a year to funnel to countries that have neither the ability or accountability to address the vast, vast majority of environmental issues is hardly "throwing in the towel."

It is going to take more than 'personal responsibility' at this point. But, instead of adopting serious restrictions on fossil fuel use and restructuring our power grid, our politicians are already fighting over control of the new ocean that is going to appear at the top of the world.

CNN's Anderson Cooper reported that one of the UN's own report states that - at the earliest - it could take one to two decades for the programs suggested to have even a 'minimal impact, if at all."

Wow - we better get started!

Sorry to interject facts here, but one of us had to...

As far as prophecy goes. I am stunned by your lack of interest and understanding. No, really....

Why? You understand Catholic eschatology by now, I hope....I am just waiting for Jesus to return. And I am concerned about the environment, while I am waiting.

-- Selective Linguistic Ignorance is the last resort of someone plagued with the inability to support their opinions.
Thanks for being consistent.

I am disappointed that you are being consistently rude. It bores me when you have nothing to write, but insults.

 

[Foreigner]

I am disappointed that you are being consistently rude. It bores me when you have nothing to write, but insults.

Glad for the opportunity to help:

My post from yesterday (01/08) at 5:53pm was sincere, supported, not directed at any person and not antagonistic in any way.

Your unsolicited over-the-top response was anything but:

"Wow!! So now that we have used up the Earth's resources and believe it is all going to be destroyed anyway.....may as well throw in the towel! Hope your kids, kids aren't going to need it. Too bad you cannot ask the Medieval Europeans who lived through the plague or the Millerites about how quickly the end of the world was going to happen." - Aspen

-- No rudeness there, huh?

And then this little sarcastic gem:

"So, how many souls have you saved, Foreigner? I thought that was Christ's job....." - Aspen

-- Being intentionally obtuse to get this dig in, but that isn't rude, either......right?


These unprompted statements were directed at me, when I directed none of my post at you.
(But even if every single solitary word had been, there was nothing as sarcastic or impolite in it to justify this response from you.)


You say these things and then want to complain about.....someone ELSE.being rude?


Honest Aspen, even you should be able to recognize your hypocrisy here.

 

[aspen]

Glad for the opportunity to help:

My post from yesterday (01/08) at 5:53pm was sincere, supported, not directed at any person and not antagonistic in any way.

Your unsolicited over-the-top response was anything but:

"Wow!! So now that we have used up the Earth's resources and believe it is all going to be destroyed anyway.....may as well throw in the towel! Hope your kids, kids aren't going to need it. Too bad you cannot ask the Medieval Europeans who lived through the plague or the Millerites about how quickly the end of the world was going to happen." - Aspen

-- No rudeness there, huh?

And then this little sarcastic gem:

"So, how many souls have you saved, Foreigner? I thought that was Christ's job....." - Aspen

-- Being intentionally obtuse to get this dig in, but that isn't rude, either......right?


These unprompted statements were directed at me, when I directed none of my post at you.
(But even if every single solitary word had been, there was nothing as sarcastic or impolite in it to justify this response from you.)


You say these things and then want to complain about.....someone ELSE.being rude?


Honest Aspen, even you should be able to recognize your hypocrisy here.

Hypocrisy? Wouldn't I have to claim to be sarcasm or 'rudeness' free in order to be called a hypocrite?

Aren't you simply avoiding the fact that the government played a large role in improving soil conditions during the Dust Bowl?

 

[Foreigner]

Hypocrisy? Wouldn't I have to claim to be sarcasm or 'rudeness' free in order to be called a hypocrite?

-- No. Just be rude and sarcastic and then accuse and criticize someone else for it.
As I clearly chronicled you doing in my last post.