The Bride

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amadeus

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Only two,since the Garden,you belong to one,Tree of Life or the other tree whom is satan
But if only those who have overcome may eat of the Tree of Life would this mean that all who have not yet completely overcome belong to satan?

"He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches; To him that overcometh will I give to eat of the tree of life, which is in the midst of the paradise of God." Rev 2:7
 

larry2

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Show me Jesus in the flesh in the OT.
Melchizedek
Melchizedek in the Old Testament is spelled as Melchisedec in the New Testament.

Jesus was not Melchisedec, His priesthood was after the order of Melchisedec; in other words it was the same type of priesthood. That priesthood of Melchisedec didn't have a beginning of days; there is no record of his birth or death, and no family history was needed such as with the Aaronic priesthood requiring they be a Levite. There was no ending of days for Melchisedec's priesthood such as the 20 year duration of the Aaronic priesthood. Melchisedec was a king, and Jesus is a king; the earthly kingdom of Jerusalem was not the heavenly Jerusalem.

Hebrews 7:3 says Melchisedec was "made like unto the Son of God;" abideth a priest continually. Why would Melchisedec have to be made like unto the Son of God if He was the Son of God? We also are changed from glory to glory into the image of Christ, and our lives like unto the Son of God has no end.
 

n2thelight

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But if only those who have overcome may eat of the Tree of Life would this mean that all who have not yet completely overcome belong to satan?

"He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches; To him that overcometh will I give to eat of the tree of life, which is in the midst of the paradise of God." Rev 2:7

Yep
 

n2thelight

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Melchizedek in the Old Testament is spelled as Melchisedec in the New Testament.

Jesus was not Melchisedec, His priesthood was after the order of Melchisedec; in other words it was the same type of priesthood. That priesthood of Melchisedec didn't have a beginning of days; there is no record of his birth or death, and no family history was needed such as with the Aaronic priesthood requiring they be a Levite. There was no ending of days for Melchisedec's priesthood such as the 20 year duration of the Aaronic priesthood. Melchisedec was a king, and Jesus is a king; the earthly kingdom of Jerusalem was not the heavenly Jerusalem.

Hebrews 7:3 says Melchisedec was "made like unto the Son of God;" abideth a priest continually. Why would Melchisedec have to be made like unto the Son of God if He was the Son of God? We also are changed from glory to glory into the image of Christ, and our lives like unto the Son of God has no end.

Hebrews 7:1 "For this Melchisedec, king of Salem, priest of the Most High God, who met Abraham returning from the slaughter of the kings, and blessed him;"

"Salem" in the Hebrew tongue means "peace". Melchisedec was without a beginning, and there is no end to His life. He is supernatural. Genesis 14 gives us the record of Abraham going to battle with the kings of Sodom and Gomorrah, and three other kings, against Chedorlaomer, as well as kings that were his allies. Abraham joined with these men of Sodom because the people of Chedorlaomer and their allies had war and over ran Sodom and the cities surrounding it. Chedorlaomer took many people captive, in which Lot, Abraham's nephew and his family were part of the captives.

Ref. Genesis 14: Chedolaomer - 3540 Kedorla` omer (ked-or-law-o'-mer); of foreign origin; Kedorlaomer, an early Persian king: KJV-- Chedorlaomer.

After the battle there were many spoils from the lands that Abraham and his allied armies had conquered, and when the kings of Sodom and Gomorrah and their allies divided up the spoils of the battle, Abraham wanted nothing except that which was lots in the first place.

Genesis 14:16 "And he brought back all the goods, and also brought again his brother Lot, and his goods, and the women also, and the people."

Genesis 14:17 "And the king of Sodom went out to me him after his return from the slaughter of Chedorlaomer, and of the kings that were with him, at the valley of Shaveh, which is the king's dale."

Genesis 14:18 "(And Melchizedek king of Salem brought forth bread and wine: and he was the priest of the MOST HIGH GOD."

Genesis 14:19 "And He blessed him, and said, "Blessed be Abram of the MOST HIGH GOD, Possessor of heaven and earth."

Hebrews 7:2 "To whom also Abraham gave a tenth part of all: first being by interpretation king of righteousness, and after that also king of Salem, which is, King of peace;"

"A tenth part of all" is the "tithe", and this word comes from the Hebrew tongue.

Genesis 14:20 "And blessed be the MOST HIGH GOD, Which hath delivered thine enemies into thy hand." And he gave Him tithes of all.)"

"Melchizedec" [in the Greek is spelt "Melchisedec] is the priest of the "MOST HIGH GOD", and is also called "the King of Righteousness, the King of Peace [Salem] and the One deserving of the tithe."

Hebrews 7:3 "Without father, without mother, without descent, having neither beginning of days, nor end of life; but made like unto the Son of God; abideth a priest continually."

Our Heavenly Father is not natural, but He is a supernatural entity. He had no pedigree showing His authority, he just showed up before Abraham, yet Abraham knew Him, and that the tithe was deserving to Him.

Melchisedec was made like the Son of God, Jesus Christ. Remember this giving of the tithe took place almost two thousand years before the birth of Jesus, from the womb of the Virgin Mary. The reason that Melchisedec looked like the Son of God, was that He was the Son of God. This should not be a problem of understanding that this King of peace and righteousness was Christ, because there is only one that will fit this description in the entire Bible.
 
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charity

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Hebrews 7:1 "For this Melchisedec, king of Salem, priest of the Most High God, who met Abraham returning from the slaughter of the kings, and blessed him;"

"Salem" in the Hebrew tongue means "peace". Melchisedec was without a beginning, and there is no end to His life. He is supernatural. Genesis 14 gives us the record of Abraham going to battle with the kings of Sodom and Gomorrah, and three other kings, against Chedorlaomer, as well as kings that were his allies. Abraham joined with these men of Sodom because the people of Chedorlaomer and their allies had war and over ran Sodom and the cities surrounding it. Chedorlaomer took many people captive, in which Lot, Abraham's nephew and his family were part of the captives.

Ref. Genesis 14: Chedolaomer - 3540 Kedorla` omer (ked-or-law-o'-mer); of foreign origin; Kedorlaomer, an early Persian king: KJV-- Chedorlaomer.

After the battle there were many spoils from the lands that Abraham and his allied armies had conquered, and when the kings of Sodom and Gomorrah and their allies divided up the spoils of the battle, Abraham wanted nothing except that which was lots in the first place.

Genesis 14:16 "And he brought back all the goods, and also brought again his brother Lot, and his goods, and the women also, and the people."

Genesis 14:17 "And the king of Sodom went out to me him after his return from the slaughter of Chedorlaomer, and of the kings that were with him, at the valley of Shaveh, which is the king's dale."

Genesis 14:18 "(And Melchizedek king of Salem brought forth bread and wine: and he was the priest of the MOST HIGH GOD."

Genesis 14:19 "And He blessed him, and said, "Blessed be Abram of the MOST HIGH GOD, Possessor of heaven and earth."

Hebrews 7:2 "To whom also Abraham gave a tenth part of all: first being by interpretation king of righteousness, and after that also king of Salem, which is, King of peace;"

"A tenth part of all" is the "tithe", and this word comes from the Hebrew tongue.

Genesis 14:20 "And blessed be the MOST HIGH GOD, Which hath delivered thine enemies into thy hand." And he gave Him tithes of all.)"

"Melchizedec" [in the Greek is spelt "Melchisedec] is the priest of the "MOST HIGH GOD", and is also called "the King of Righteousness, the King of Peace [Salem] and the One deserving of the tithe."

Hebrews 7:3 "Without father, without mother, without descent, having neither beginning of days, nor end of life; but made like unto the Son of God; abideth a priest continually."

Our Heavenly Father is not natural, but He is a supernatural entity. He had no pedigree showing His authority, he just showed up before Abraham, yet Abraham knew Him, and that the tithe was deserving to Him.

Melchisedec was made like the Son of God, Jesus Christ. Remember this giving of the tithe took place almost two thousand years before the birth of Jesus, from the womb of the Virgin Mary. The reason that Melchisedec looked like the Son of God, was that He was the Son of God. This should not be a problem of understanding that this King of peace and righteousness was Christ, because there is only one that will fit this description in the entire Bible.
'For this Melchisedec, king of Salem,
.. priest of the most high God,
.... who met Abraham returning from the slaughter of the kings,
...... and blessed him;
To whom also Abraham gave a tenth part of all;
.. first being by interpretation King of righteousness,
.... and after that also King of Salem, which is, King of peace;
...... Without father, without mother, without descent,
........ having neither beginning of days, nor end of life;
.......... but
made like unto the Son of God;
............ abideth a priest continually.
Now consider how great
this man was,
unto whom even the patriarch Abraham gave the tenth of the spoils.'

(Hebrews 7:1-4)

Hello @in2thelight.

* @larry2 in reply#82 was correct. Melchizedec was Christ in antitype only.

* He was an historic figure, named on tablets from that period, a king called Ebedtob succeeded him. He is recorded as saying on three occasions, 'not my father, not my mother installed me in this place but the Mighty King', compare Hebrews 7:1-4) ie., he did not inherit by succession, but by the gift and 'the arm of the Mighty King' (the deity).

* He was a righteous king: -
in History (Gen.14),
in Prophecy (Psa. 110) and
in Fulfillment (Heb.7).

In Christ Jesus
Chris

Ref: Bible Marginal notes
 
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charity

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Hi brother, The bride is of the Church, and not all qualify.

Php 3:8 Yea doubtless, and I count all things but loss for the excellency of the knowledge of Christ Jesus my Lord: for whom I have suffered the loss of all things, and do count them but dung, that I may win Christ,

Rev 19:7 Let us be glad and rejoice, and give honour to him: for the marriage of the Lamb is come, and His wife hath made herself ready.

Rev 19:8 And to her was granted that she should be arrayed in fine linen, clean and white: for the fine linen is the righteousness of saints. (righteous acts, or deeds.)

Hello @larry2,

With respect, I have a problem with this larry. For what 'church' (or assembly) are you referring to here?

* Israel is spoken of in Acts 7:38, as, 'the church (or assembly) in the wilderness'. The church of the Acts period is a called-out company too. However, you quote Philippians 3:8, which, along with Ephesians, Colossians, 1 & 2 Timothy and Titus, refer to the company formed following the laying aside of Israel in unbelief (temporarily) at the end of the Acts period, namely, the Church which is the Body of Christ, of which He is the head; and they are most certainly not 'the Bride', having been identified as, 'the Body of Christ'. God does not mix His metaphors.

* The destination of the hope of the Church which is His Body, the fullness of Him that filleth all in all, is not in the New Jerusalem but in heavenly places in Christ Jesus.

* The Church which is the Body of Chris
t is also not the subject of the book of Revelation, so the two references you give from that book have no relation to that company.

* 'The Bride' come from within Israel, they are like Abraham, who looked for a city, whose Builder and Maker is God. Overcomers of faith in their generations, and who are faithful unto death during the tribulation period. These people earn their place in the New Jerusalem by not counting their lives dear but being willing to lay them down to gain a better resurrection (see Hebrews 11)

In Christ Jesus
Chris
 
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VictoryinJesus

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@charity

I’m still struggling with how you separate the church from Israel.

Ephesians 2:15-18
[15] Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace; [16] And that he might reconcile both unto God in one body by the cross, having slain the enmity thereby: [17] And came and preached peace to you which were afar off, and to them that were nigh. [18] For through him we both have access by one Spirit unto the Father.

Who is the “both” that have access by one Spirit? Who are the two joined making “peace”?
 

VictoryinJesus

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Show me Jesus in the flesh in the OT.

Is that even possible? 1 John 3:5
[5] And ye know that he was manifested to take away our sins; and in him is no sin.

John 1:14
[14] And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.

The word was made flesh. And we beheld His glory. Made “Flesh” is key there...but the Lord (Christ/Spirit) was always there in the OT, hidden in plain sight even as He walked through a crowd of Pharisees gnashing their teeth as invisible to them, yet seen.

Judges 16:2-3
[2] And it was told the Gazites, saying, Samson is come hither. And they compassed him in, and laid wait for him all night in the gate of the city, and were quiet all the night, saying, In the morning, when it is day, we shall kill him. [3] And Samson lay till midnight, and arose at midnight, and took the doors of the gate of the city, and the two posts, and went away with them, bar and all, and put them upon his shoulders, and carried them up to the top of an hill that is before Hebron.
 

amadeus

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Amadeus said: But if only those who have overcome may eat of the Tree of Life would this mean that all who have not yet completely overcome belong to satan?

"He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches; To him that overcometh will I give to eat of the tree of life, which is in the midst of the paradise of God." Rev 2:7

Simple as that, huh? Maybe this is the problem people have with identifying who satan is and where he came from...
 

charity

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@charity

I’m still struggling with how you separate the church from Israel.

Ephesians 2:15-18
[15] Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace; [16] And that he might reconcile both unto God in one body by the cross, having slain the enmity thereby: [17] And came and preached peace to you which were afar off, and to them that were nigh. [18] For through him we both have access by one Spirit unto the Father.

Who is the “both” that have access by one Spirit? Who are the two joined making “peace”?

Hello there, @VictoryinJesus,

In the Church which is the Body of Christ, which is the fullness of Him 'that filleth all in all', individual believers from Israel and the nations are formed into One Body, in Christ, and there is total equality and perfect unity in the Head, which is Christ. The verse you quote from Ephesians emphasises this; for it is written by Paul following the revelation given to him while in prison in Rome, and which he makes known in those later epistles, as God's Steward of this glorious calling.

Praise God!

But that was not so during the Acts period, at that time Israel came 'first', having a prior position.

In Christ Jesus
our risen and glorified
Saviour, Lord and Head.
Chris
 
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VictoryinJesus

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Hello there, @VictoryinJesus,

In the Church which is the Body of Christ, which is the fullness of Him 'that filleth all in all', individual believers from Israel and the nations are formed into One Body, in Christ, and there is total equality and perfect unity in the Head, which is Christ. The verse you quote from Ephesians emphasises this for it is written by Paul following the revelation given to him while in prison in Rome, and which he makes known in those later epistles, as God's Steward of this glorious calling.

Praise God!

But that was not so during the Acts period, at that time Israel came 'first', having a prior position.

In Christ Jesus
our risen and glorified
Saviour, Lord and Head.
Chris

So you do believe there is one body?
 

larry2

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With respect, I have a problem with this larry. For what 'church' (or assembly) are you referring to here?
Hi Sister Charity, and thank you for your kind response. I pray I am able to give you reason for what I believe, and the hope within me. 1Pet 3:15.

The portion of the One body of Christ contains believers that are not only saved, but like Paul determined to win Christ (Php 3:8); they make themselves ready by their righteous deeds according to Rev 19:7-8.
Are there any of the Church that enter tribulation instead? Rev 7:9 After this I beheld, and, lo, a great multitude, which no man could number, of all nations, and kindreds, and people, and tongues, stood before the throne, and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, and palms in their hands;


A very abbreviated review contains those of the Church arriving at different times to God’s throne. E.g., Rev 4:4 (24 elders), Rev 4:6 (4 beasts), Rev 7:9 & Rev 7:14 (Great multitude, and lastly Rev 14:1. (144,000) And I looked, and, lo, a Lamb stood on the mount Sion (heavenly Jerusalem Heb 12:22), and with him an hundred forty and four thousand, having his Father's name written in their foreheads. Rev 14:3 redeemed from the earth.
the Church which is the Body of Christ, of which He is the head; and they are most certainly not 'the Bride', having been identified as, 'the Body of Christ'. God does not mix His metaphors.
I’m not completely sure what you mean in mixing metaphors. Do they relate to God’s judgment of the Church we read of in Revelation Chapters 2 & 3? It is there we see only two of the seven portions of the One Church commended, and they are Philadelphia & Smyrna in Rev 2:10 & Rev 3:10. As pertaining to being in the bride versus another portion of the One body of Christ. There is so much more, but I’ll await you response prior to proceeding.
Blessings in Christ Jesus.
 

n2thelight

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'For this Melchisedec, king of Salem,
.. priest of the most high God,
.... who met Abraham returning from the slaughter of the kings,
...... and blessed him;
To whom also Abraham gave a tenth part of all;
.. first being by interpretation King of righteousness,
.... and after that also King of Salem, which is, King of peace;
...... Without father, without mother, without descent,
........ having neither beginning of days, nor end of life;
.......... but
made like unto the Son of God;
............ abideth a priest continually.
Now consider how great
this man was,
unto whom even the patriarch Abraham gave the tenth of the spoils.'

(Hebrews 7:1-4)

Hello @in2thelight.

* @larry2 in reply#82 was correct. Melchizedec was Christ in antitype only.

* He was an historic figure, named on tablets from that period, a king called Ebedtob succeeded him. He is recorded as saying on three occasions, 'not my father, not my mother installed me in this place but the Mighty King', compare Hebrews 7:1-4) ie., he did not inherit by succession, but by the gift and 'the arm of the Mighty King' (the deity).

* He was a righteous king: -
in History (Gen.14),
in Prophecy (Psa. 110) and
in Fulfillment (Heb.7).

In Christ Jesus
Chris

Ref: Bible Marginal notes

Hebrews 7:3 "Without father, without mother, without descent, having neither beginning of days, nor end of life; but made like unto the Son of God; abideth a priest continually."

Who can this be but Christ?
 
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Enoch111

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Hebrews 7:3 "Without father, without mother, without descent, having neither beginning of days, nor end of life; but made like unto the Son of God; abideth a priest continually."

Who can this be but Christ?
Very true. Just as Christ appeared as either a man, or the Angel of the LORD, or "the Word", before His incarnation, He appeared to Abraham as Melchizedek. The "order of Melchizedek" is divine. He arrives on the scene, and simply disappears without a trace. It is significant that he offered bread and wine to Abraham, thus signifying how the Lord's Supper would be constituted. That He was greater than Abraham is signified by the offering of the tenth of the spoils to Melchizedek.
 

farouk

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Yes indeed it is alarming that even though Christians have God's Word in their hands, many choose to either distort what God says or ignore it. And when people are wilfully blind, seeing they will not see, and hearing they will not hear.

Tampering with God's Word and God's truth began in Eden. Both Satan and Eve distorted the Word, and as a result the human race and the universe paid a heavy price. Of course, Adam is primarily held responsible, since he failed to do what he had been appointed to do.
Yes, indeed!

Whole subjects such as the Lord Jesus' and Paul's clear statements about divorce/remarriage, for example, are often glossed over by those who claim to be keen, Bible based evangelicals.
 

CoreIssue

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Elohim and Christ. Same Spirit.
Servant and Master. Same Spirit.
So will God have two Brides?I think not,the Church is the Bride and God has promised to re-marry Israel
God is a singular unity of three distinct individuals, father, son and holy spirit. Each is God and altogether all are God. Just like the soldier is army and all soldiers together are army.

Israel is the wife of the first person of the trinity. The second person of the Trinity took on flesh(Jesus). The bride is with Jesus, Israel with the father.
 
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charity

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Hi Sister Charity, and thank you for your kind response. I pray I am able to give you reason for what I believe, and the hope within me. 1Pet 3:15.

The portion of the One body of Christ contains believers that are not only saved, but like Paul determined to win Christ (Php 3:8); ... they make themselves ready by their righteous deeds according to Rev 19:7-8.

Are there any of the Church that enter tribulation instead? Rev 7:9:-

A very abbreviated review contains those of the Church arriving at different times to God’s throne. E.g.,
Rev 4:4 (24 elders), Rev 4:6 (4 beasts), Rev 7:9 & Rev 7:14 (Great multitude) and lastly Rev 14:1. (144,000)
And I looked, and, lo, a Lamb stood on the mount Sion (heavenly Jerusalem Heb 12:22), and with him an hundred forty and four thousand, having his Father's name written in their foreheads. Rev 14:3 redeemed from the earth.

I’m not completely sure what you mean in mixing metaphors.
Do they relate to God’s judgment of the Church we read of in Revelation Chapters 2 & 3?
It is there we see only two of the seven portions of the One Church commended, and they are Philadelphia & Smyrna in Rev 2:10 & Rev 3:10.
As pertaining to being in the bride versus another portion of the One body of Christ.
There is so much more, but I’ll await you response prior to proceeding.
Blessings in Christ Jesus
.

Hello @larry2,

Thank you for responding. I agree that Paul strove to attain the added 'prize' associated with the high calling of God, in Christ Jesus. (Phil 3:14), but we differ in regard to our understanding of it, it would seem, Larry.

* I don't believe that the Church which is the Body of Christ is the subject of the book of Revelation.

* 'The Bride', which is the subject of this thread, and of Revelation 21, is the New Jerusalem which is described as 'a bride adorned for her husband'; i.e., It represents and contains 'the bride of the Lamb'. The Bride is 'of' Israel. It is a 'heavenly' calling, and is spoken of as such in Hebrews 3:1, of which certain believing Israelites were partakers. Among whom were those also of the Old Testament saints, such as Abraham of course.

'Wherefore, holy brethren, partakers of the heavenly calling,
consider the Apostle and High Priest of our profession, Christ Jesus;'

* They were, 'strangers and pilgrims,' having here, 'no continuing city', but looked for one to come, Genesis 23:4, 1 Peter 2:11, Hebrews 11:13-16, Hebrews 11:10. The Holy City which came down out of heaven from God, will be the 'better country', and 'the city' for which the Old Testament saints who held that heavenly calling looked. 'The elect remnant' also. Then there are 'The Overcomers' of the great tribulation, who reign with Christ during the millennial reign and the Twelve Apostles of the Christ who were promised that high honour in Matt. 29:28.

* The church is part of the Bridegroom, not the Bride.

Thank you.
In Christ Jesus
Chris

 
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