The Day of The Lord, Wrong Timing Applied

[Keraz]

How could one FAIL to see how those 6th Seal events are linked with the 7th Vial events??? Only by DENIAL of those Scriptures AS WRITTEN does your kind of confusion happen.

The timing of those event are ALSO the SAME timing as the 7th Trumpet too!!!

This belief is complete confusion. The Seal, trumpets and bowls are Written as separate events, because that is what they are.
Just because there are similarities, but NOT exact matches, you wrongly combine them.

In that phrase, "... hide us from the face of Him That sitteth on the throne;" is about The Father, but that phrase, "... and from the wrath of the Lamb", is about Lord Jesus. Does that mean at that moment those wicked on earth will SEE The Father sitting upon His throne in HEAVEN? YEAH... most definitely!

The Prophecy about the Sixth Seal does not say people will actually see God on His Throne at that time.

And that is the SAME exact timing of Lord Jesus' future coming too!

You cannot say the Lord's wrath happens at the glorious Return. Then; He merely kills the attacking armies of the 'beast' by the Sword of His Word. they are not burned up, as the carrion eaters feast on the bodies.

 

[Davy]

This belief is complete confusion. The Seal, trumpets and bowls are Written as separate events, because that is what they are.
Just because there are similarities, but NOT exact matches, you wrongly combine them.

Just because that's what the majority thinks, that makes it true? The majority are always... correct, right? No, not right, the majority are often wrong.

It wouldn't matter if there were exact repeats of the same words between those events in Revelation, you still would not believe it, because your preconceived notions have you convinced to how it 'ought' to be.

The Prophecy about the Sixth Seal does not say people will actually see God on His Throne at that time.

Well, yes it is... showing that very thing...

Rev 6:16-17
16 And said to the mountains and rocks, "Fall on us, and hide us from the face of Him That sitteth on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb:
17 For the great day of His wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand?
KJV

On the last day when Jesus comes...

Rev 1:7
7 Behold, He cometh with clouds; and every eye shall see Him, and they also which pierced Him: and all kindreds of the earth shall wail because of Him. Even so, Amen.
KJV

There it is, that SAME event when every eye shall see Christ coming in the clouds, even the wicked will see that. It is pointing to the veil hiding the heavenly dimension being removed at that point of the heavens rolling together like a scroll. Apparently you think that day is just going to be a continuance of this present flesh world like it is now. You will be in for a shock on that day, but you won't be alone in that.

You cannot say the Lord's wrath happens at the glorious Return. Then; He merely kills the attacking armies of the 'beast' by the Sword of His Word. they are not burned up, as the carrion eaters feast on the bodies.

I guess you forgot to read the Zechariah 14 Scripture. And you still don't understand what God's consuming fire is for on that future day of Christ's return.

Peter showed in 2 Peter 3 about previous destructions God did upon the surface of this earth using waters of a flood. But for the next time, to end this present world time, Peter said it will be by God's consuming fire. The object is the same like the previous destructions by God, to wipe man's works off the surface of this earth.

The difference this next time is the removing of the separation between the heavenly dimension and the earthly dimension. When that happens on the "day of the Lord" as written, it is what will cause the 'change' at the twinkling of an eye that Apostle Paul taught for the "last trump" in 1 Corinthians 15. Those in Christ still alive on earth at that moment are not 'caught up' in their flesh bodies, but in their "spiritual body" after the change at the twinkling of an eye. How is it you have missed this, since it is written?

 

[Keraz]

Does the Sixth Seal of Revelation 6:12-17, Happen at the Return of Jesus?

Revelation 7:1-3 After that, [the Sixth seal] I saw four angels holding back the winds. Another angel called to them: Do not punish the earth further until the mark of God is set upon His servants.

If you think that the Sixth Seal happens at the Return, then what are the further punishments referring to? They are obviously the next sequence: the Great Tribulation Trumpet and Bowl punishments.

Beware of the curse in Rev.22:19, if you take away from the Words of this Book, God will take away your share in the Tree of Life.


Isaiah 64:1-11 [Before the Lord’s Day of vengeance and wrath.] Why, Lord do You not tear asunder the heavens and cause the mountains to shake, fires to blaze and water to boil, then Your Name would be known and nations would tremble before You. Lord, look upon Your people, those who strive to do right, do not be angry beyond measure. Isaiah 34:2-4

After the Lord’s Day of vengeance and wrath.

You surprised us with awesome things, when You acted the mountains shook.
Now, Your Holy city is ruined and burned by fire, all of Zion is a desolation, all that we treasured has been destroyed. Jeremiah 9:9-11

Although Jerusalem has been destroyed before, there has never been a destruction as described, in fact as virtually all the buildings are built of stone, it will require an extreme event to fulfil these prophecies. Why would the Lord destroy the whole country, including the Third Temple at His Return?

 

[Davy]

Does the Sixth Seal of Revelation 6:12-17, Happen at the Return of Jesus?

Revelation 7:1-3 After that, [the Sixth seal] I saw four angels holding back the winds. Another angel called to them: Do not punish the earth further until the mark of God is set upon His servants.

If you think that the Sixth Seal happens at the Return, then what are the further punishments referring to? They are obviously the next sequence: the Great Tribulation Trumpet and Bowl punishments.

Once again, your are wrongly thinking the order John was given to write the events down is always the order they happen. As far as a sequence like 1 thru 7, yeah, but not necessarily like all 1-7 seals have to happen first, then all 1-7 trumpets have to happen after the seals, and then all 1-7 vials have to happen after the trumpets.

Instead, by events of the end of this world and Christ's coming, the proper order of that is on the 6th Seal, 7th Trumpet, and 7th Vial. So the actual order in Revelation is more like the Seals, Trumpets, and Vials are in PARALLEL.

Further proof that is the actual order of events is with the Signs Jesus gave in His Olivet discourse which directly parallel the Seals of Revelation 6. What was the very last Sign Jesus gave in His Olivet discourse? The Sign of His coming and the end of the world. Jesus actually gave ONLY SEVEN SIGNS of the end in His Olivet discourse. Those Seals, Trumpets, and Vials in Revelation are those SAME 7 SIGNS, just expanded and revealed.

Beware of the curse in Rev.22:19, if you take away from the Words of this Book, God will take away your share in the Tree of Life.

I am not taking away, nor adding to God's Word. I am EXPLAINING God's Word as written. Furthermore, because of how The LORD uses analogy and parable to teach in His Word, how is one going to EXPLAIN those analogies and parables in their simplicity? By how many interpret that Revelation 22:19 curse, like you do, it would be impossible to even attempt... to EXPLAIN Jesus' analogies and parables in His Word! So what you've actually done with misuse of that Revelation 22:19 is to push vanity against God's Word.

Going deeper...

Lord Jesus in Matthew 16 warned His Apostles to beware of the LEAVEN doctrines of men. He showed how all the baskets of many fragments His Apostles gathered up after the miracle of the loaves and fishes, represent MEN'S DOCTRINES ADDED to the full LOAF that went out (representing the pure Word of God). That is one of the main things Jesus rebuked the blind Pharisees for, because they made up their OWN DOCTRINES that went against The Word of God. During the Jew's Babylon captivity, they actually created a philosophical work loosely based on God's Word, called the Babylonian Talmud, which is a collection of supposedly wise saying by Jewish sages. By that they had created many traditions FOREIGN to God's written Word. And Jesus rebuked them for those traditions of men. And that... is what the taking away and adding to warning is about. It is not about staying within Scripture while EXPLAINING it in its simplicity.

Isaiah 64:1-11 [Before the Lord’s Day of vengeance and wrath.] Why, Lord do You not tear asunder the heavens and cause the mountains to shake, fires to blaze and water to boil, then Your Name would be known and nations would tremble before You. Lord, look upon Your people, those who strive to do right, do not be angry beyond measure. Isaiah 34:2-4

After the Lord’s Day of vengeance and wrath.

You surprised us with awesome things, when You acted the mountains shook.
Now, Your Holy city is ruined and burned by fire, all of Zion is a desolation, all that we treasured has been destroyed. Jeremiah 9:9-11

Although Jerusalem has been destroyed before, there has never been a destruction as described, in fact as virtually all the buildings are built of stone, it will require an extreme event to fulfil these prophecies. Why would the Lord destroy the whole country, including the Third Temple at His Return?

To more deeply answer why, you'd have to understand about the 'old world' first, before Satan rebelled.

This present world earth age is temporary, and preserved for destruction by fire. You should have understood that by simply reading 2 Peter 3.

And by understanding that 2 Peter 3 chapter, you should have then understood this present world earth age in relation to the previous one when Satan was perfect in his ways, and then also the future world earth age to come with Christ's future return, and then into God's Eternity. Once that is understood, then what's the big deal about God's consuming fire ending this present world? He's simply going to use HIS FIRE this next time, instead of waters like He did before. In Hebrews 12, Paul shows that God is going to tremble this old earth 'once more', and relates that to the time of His consuming fire. So when did God first tremble this old earth?

I do wish that more brethren could understand these differences between the heavenly dimension order and our earthly dimension. Too many are wrapped up in their flesh with not understanding how God's consuming fire is going to end this present flesh world, and in the world to come we will no longer live in flesh vehicles...

1 Cor 6:13
13 Meats for the belly, and the belly for meats: but God shall destroy both it and them. Now the body is not for fornication, but for the Lord; and the Lord for the body.
KJV

 

[Keraz]

Once again, your are wrongly thinking the order John was given to write the events down is always the order they happen.

Most other Prophecy is out of the order that it will happen.
But not the 7 Seals, 7 Trumpets and the 7 Bowls. There are in order and making them to be parallel, is just confusion.

The first 5 Seals were opened at Jesus' Ascension to heaven and the final Bowl happens at His Return. Revelation 16:16-18

This present world earth age is temporary, and preserved for destruction by fire.

That does not happen until the end of the Millennium. Revelation 21:1

 

[Davy]

Most other Prophecy is out of the order that it will happen.
But not the 7 Seals, 7 Trumpets and the 7 Bowls. There are in order and making them to be parallel, is just confusion.

I did not say the Seals were out of order, nor did I say the Trumpets were out of order, nor did I say the Vials are out of order. The Seals are in sequence with each other, the Trumpets are in sequence with each other (especially the last 3 trumpets which each have a Woe attached to them), and the Vials are in sequence with each other.

But the order you're thinking, like all the Seals must happen first, and then all the Trumpets happen next, and then all the Vials happen last, that is not the order the events happen. That is the order that John was given to write them down, and is all you are seeing, but they do not occur like that.

The events of the 6th Seal occur in PARALLEL with the 7th Trumpet, and in PARALLEL with the 7th Vial. The period of silence associated with the 7th Seal is actually a 'selah', to show completeness of the prophecies. Once one begins to focus on the actual 'event' types instead number order, then this understanding begins to be shown.

 

[Keraz]

Revelation is written in a linear chronological fashion, with sections that flash back to insert a new character or theme into the previous timeline. That new flashback section then ends back at the point when the last section ended, and occasionally continues on forward a bit further in time. Then the next section will flash back again to insert another theme or some important information and end back where the previous section ended.

On occasion, the text in a linear chronological section will point to a future event, but the timeline will stay where it is. Usually when this happens words will be used like “In the days of the voice of the seventh angel”, or “and the holy city shall they tread under foot forty and two months”. These situations always include either an event that hasn’t happened yet (as the text explains when the event happens later), or the text includes a large gap of time.

The Seals, Trumpets and Bowls are all different events, They will happen in the sequence given.
I totally reject any conflation or shuffling of them.

 

[Davy]

Revelation is written in a linear chronological fashion, with sections that flash back to insert a new character or theme into the previous timeline. That new flashback section then ends back at the point when the last section ended, and occasionally continues on forward a bit further in time. Then the next section will flash back again to insert another theme or some important information and end back where the previous section ended.

Christ's Book of Revelation is written in the same style as The Old Testament prophets. Not that many brethren take time to study those OT prophets, so they don't recognize how a single verse can cover one span of time, and then in the very next verse the timeline may move backwards, or way forward. Once it is understood how that is, then one begins to learn to key on the actual 'event' types and their order, instead of thinking like, 'well, this chapter happens first, and then this next chapter, and then this next chapter, in that order'. Same thing within a chapter too, wrongly thinking, 'well, this verse happens first, then this next verse, and so on.' It is natural for us to WANT to think that is how God's written Word is always written, because that is how we were educated in public school, trained to think chapters in a book follow a strict sequence. That's not always true with God's written Word, and Revelation and the OT prophets especially.

Now with the last 3 Trumpets in Revelation, Lord Jesus made sure we know those 3 Trumpets are in a hard sequence, because attached with them are 3 Woes. So each of the last 3 Trumpets represent time periods leading up to His coming, with His coming on the last one, the 7th Trumpet - 3rd Woe. So there's your anchor in Christ's Revelation leading up to His future return and end of this world on that 7th Trumpet - 3rd Woe. By that we know... that events mentioned prior to that 7th Trumpet - 3rd Woe, it means it's the "great tribulation" time (6th Trumpet - 2nd Woe). And the time before that on the 5th Trumpet - 1st Woe is a time in prep just prior to the start of the "great tribulation".

 

[Keraz]

Christ's Book of Revelation is written in the same style as The Old Testament prophets. Not that many brethren take time to study those OT prophets, so they don't recognize how a single verse can cover one span of time, and then in the very next verse the timeline may move backwards, or way forward. Once it is understood how that is, then one begins to learn to key on the actual 'event' types and their order, instead of thinking like, 'well, this chapter happens first, and then this next chapter, and then this next chapter, in that order'. Same thing within a chapter too, wrongly thinking, 'well, this verse happens first, then this next verse, and so on.' It is natural for us to WANT to think that is how God's written Word is always written, because that is how we were educated in public school, trained to think chapters in a book follow a strict sequence. That's not always true with God's written Word, and Revelation and the OT prophets especially.

This I agree with.
Keep in mind too; that God has placed a spirit of misunderstanding onto those who accept mans teachings. Matthew 11:25

Now with the last 3 Trumpets in Revelation, Lord Jesus made sure we know those 3 Trumpets are in a hard sequence, because attached with them are 3 Woes. So each of the last 3 Trumpets represent time periods leading up to His coming, with His coming on the last one, the 7th Trumpet - 3rd Woe. So there's your anchor in Christ's Revelation leading up to His future return and end of this world on that 7th Trumpet - 3rd Woe. By that we know... that events mentioned prior to that 7th Trumpet - 3rd Woe, it means it's the "great tribulation" time (6th Trumpet - 2nd Woe). And the time before that on the 5th Trumpet - 1st Woe is a time in prep just prior to the start of the "great tribulation"

Incomprehensible, all error and confusion!
It is plain that the world does NOT end at the 7th Trumpet and Jesus does NOT Return then. The 7 Bowls, culmination with the battle of Armageddon, marks the end of this world as we know it, as Jesus will then be King of Kings and Lord of Lords for the next thousand years.

 

[Truth7t7]

Incomprehensible, all error and confusion!
It is plain that the world does NOT end at the 7th Trumpet and Jesus does NOT Return then. The 7 Bowls, culmination with the battle of Armageddon, marks the end of this world as we know it, as Jesus will then be King of Kings and Lord of Lords for the next thousand years.

Of course the 7th Trump is (The Second Coming) and (Final Judgement) "The End"!

Revelation 11:15-18KJV
15 And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever.
16 And the four and twenty elders, which sat before God on their seats, fell upon their faces, and worshipped God,
17 Saying, We give thee thanks, O Lord God Almighty, which art, and wast, and art to come; because thou hast taken to thee thy great power, and hast reigned.
18 And the nations were angry, and thy wrath is come, and the time of the dead, that they should be judged, and that thou shouldest give reward unto thy servants the prophets, and to the saints, and them that fear thy name, small and great; and shouldest destroy them which destroy the earth.

 

[Keraz]

Of course the 7th Trump is (The Second Coming) and (Final Judgement) "The End"!

Revelation 11:15-18KJV
15 And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever.
16 And the four and twenty elders, which sat before God on their seats, fell upon their faces, and worshipped God,
17 Saying, We give thee thanks, O Lord God Almighty, which art, and wast, and art to come; because thou hast taken to thee thy great power, and hast reigned.
18 And the nations were angry, and thy wrath is come, and the time of the dead, that they should be judged, and that thou shouldest give reward unto thy servants the prophets, and to the saints, and them that fear thy name, small and great; and shouldest destroy them which destroy the earth.

So then; according to you - all the rest of Revelation is after Jesus Returns?

Such a idea is obviously not right, Jesus Returns at the Seventh Bowl, Revelation 16:16-17 and Revelation 19:11, NOT before then.
What is said in Revelation 11:15-18 is Prophecy, set to happen later. Proved that the final Judgment does not happen until Jesus has reigned on earth for a thousand years. Revelation 20:11-15

Your determination to have the earth destroyed when Jesus Returns, is error and does not comply with scripture or logical common sense.

 

[Davy]

Incomprehensible, all error and confusion!
It is plain that the world does NOT end at the 7th Trumpet and Jesus does NOT Return then. The 7 Bowls, culmination with the battle of Armageddon, marks the end of this world as we know it, as Jesus will then be King of Kings and Lord of Lords for the next thousand years.

With that, you have fallen into the trap of thinking all the trumpets must happen before the vials happen. Only the final 7th Vial represents the last day when Jesus comes. And that is the timing of the 7th trumpet also, and is why the Revelation 11:15 verse says right then all the kingdoms of this world become those of The Father and His Christ.

 

[Earburner]

When Jesus Returns, He does not destroy anything, other that the attacking armies at Armageddon. The replacement of the present earth does not happen until after the Millennium. Revelation 21:1-7

.
First in foremost, our salvation and our redemption is a two stage process. We are first spiritually resurrected with Christ by being born again, and then upon His physical and Glorious appearance from Heaven, we are bodily resurrected into the likeness of His immortality. Romans 6:5-6, Galatians 2:20.

Both Revelation 21:1-7 and 2 Thessalonians 1:7-11 are revealed to us by the Holy Spirit. Therefore both are going to have the same interpretation. The words/meaning of the Lord are not divided, nor do they oppose themselves. This earth will be totally destroyed, and all the unsaved along with it.

Just exactly what ARE the New heavens and the New earth? Let's start by first thinking outside of the religious box of religion.

All here can agree that Jesus bodily Ascended into Heaven, yet for 2000+ years, Jesus has not needed or required anything of this global earth, nor that of another global earth to come.
Since He requires no sustenance from a global earth, WHY is it that we think and believe that we shall need one??
WE WON'T.

In regards to Revelation 21:1-5, let's look at it spiritually.
In the NH&NE, the question is HOW shall the LORD God the Father and the Lord Jesus Christ DWELL among His people?
1. Will it be Them dwelling with the saved on a new global earth....again?
2. Or will it be Them dwelling with-in His New creatures, we who shall be resurrected into the likeness of Christ's immortality of His NEW Life?
2 Cor. 4[6] For God, who commanded the light to shine out of darkness, hath shined in our hearts, to give the light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Jesus Christ.
[7] But we have this treasure [God's Holy Spirit] in earthen vessels [our mortal bodies], that the excellency of the power may be of God, and not of us.

So, where is Jesus now? The scriptures below are threefold in meaning:
John.12[26] If any man serve me, let him follow me; and where I am, there shall also my servant be: if any man serve me, him will my Father honour.
John.14[3] And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again, and receive you unto myself; that where I am, there ye may be also.
John.17[24] Father, I will that they also, whom thou hast given me, be with me where I am; that they may behold my glory, which thou hast given me: for thou lovedst me before the foundation of the world.

So then, how are we to "follow" Jesus?
Ans. By spiritually "taking part"/participating in His Resurrection, who is Himself the First!
John 14:18, Romans 6:6, Colossians 1:18, Galatians 2:20, Revelation 20:6.

Edit: and so, back to Revelation 21:1-2.
What happened to the old heaven and global earth?
[1] And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea.

What did John see of a New Heaven and earth?
[2] And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven.....
Where did the holy city descend to? It doesn't say.
Why?
We are to know that the new Jerusalem of itself is The New earth, who are WE, in which God desires to dwell, and that Jesus Himself is now our New Heaven.


I have many more KJV scriptures to support this thinking.

 

[Keraz]

With that, you have fallen into the trap of thinking all the trumpets must happen before the vials happen

It is not a trap to believe the Bible sequence of events, as Written.
The Seventh Trumpet, Revelation 11:15-19, is clearly just an announcement, made in heaven as stated; of the soon to come; Return of Jesus to reign over the earth for the next thousand years.

I have many more KJV scriptures to support this thinking.

Your ideas of a Spiritual existence after Jesus Returns, simply does not comply with what the Prophets tell us.
Immortality cannot be conferred on anyone until they face the Judgment of God. Revelation 20:11-15

 

[Earburner]

It is not a trap to believe the Bible sequence of events, as Written.
The Seventh Trumpet, Revelation 11:15-19, is clearly just an announcement, made in heaven as stated; of the soon to come; Return of Jesus to reign over the earth for the next thousand years.

Your ideas of a Spiritual existence after Jesus Returns, simply does not comply with what the Prophets tell us.
Immortality cannot be conferred on anyone until they face the Judgment of God. Revelation 20:11-15

By the Amillennial view, Revelation 20:11-15 has been in process (KJV John 3:18) since Pentecost, and will culminate as shown in 2 Thessalonians 1:7-11, Revelation 20:7-11.
Immortality for us, who are born again, shall be immediate upon that Glorious day of the Lord's return from Heaven in flaming fire.
KJV Luke 17:28-30, 1 Corinthians 15:50-55 reveals that it's a simultaneous event of salvation/redemption for the Saints, and destruction for all the unsaved.

 

[Keraz]

By the Amillennial view,

AMilleniumism is so obviously, patently wrong, that for me to discuss these issues with you, is useless.
Perhaps you could provide the prophecy that say Jesus will Return in fire. Revelation 19:11-21 doesn't say that. Those Prophesies which say the Lord will come in fire, do not refer to the glorious Return of Jesus and His reign over the earth for the next thousand years.
They refer to the terrible Sixth Seal worldwide disaster, years before Jesus returns.

 

[Earburner]

Your ideas of a Spiritual existence after Jesus Returns, simply does not comply with what the Prophets tell us.
Immortality cannot be conferred on anyone until they face the Judgment of God. Revelation 20:11-15

The Prophets were unable to discern of what should take place and when, in the three appearances/comings of the Lord Jesus.

That should not be difficult to comprehend, because in each of His three comings, there were/are specific things to take place.
1. By the Spirit of His Father in the likeness of our flesh, as the Lamb of God, being the sacrifice for us, as well as for the Father.
2. By the Spirit of His Father and Himself, as the Holy Spirit, the seal and surety of our salvation.
3. By the Immortal Glory of Himself in flaming fire, as our Redeemer, but taking vengeance on all who do not know God, and who do not obey the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ.

We must hear God's meanings of His own thoughts through the voice of the Prophets, for when we do, then we will know what has already taken place, and that which still remains to be fulfilled.

 

[Earburner]

AMilleniumism is so obviously, patently wrong, that for me to discuss these issues with you, is useless.
Perhaps you could provide the prophecy that say Jesus will Return in fire. Revelation 19:11-21 doesn't say that. Those Prophesies which say the Lord will come in fire, do not refer to the glorious Return of Jesus and His reign over the earth for the next thousand years.
They refer to the terrible Sixth Seal worldwide disaster, years before Jesus returns.

Your understanding of eschatology is mostly filtered and driven by the literal words of the book of Revelation, in a consecutive order.

God does not think like a man, in straight line thinking. Isaiah 55:8-9.
From the realm of God's Eternity, He thinks in the past, present and future all at the same time.
By the natural mind of ourselves, we cannot think like Him. That is WHY we must "have the Mind of Christ" (His Holy Spirit). Only by His Spirit (Zechariah 4:6, John 16:13) can we know HOW and WHEN the words of the prophets have been fulfilled, and those that are still remaining to be fulfilled.

As I have said, the prophets had no understanding or discernment of God's thoughts, through the words that they spoke. The results of their writings is a whirlwind of figurative words, blending the three comings of Jesus together, as if His coming was to be only once. Today, we know differently, or at least we should.

I am not here contending as to which Millennial view is correct. I only know that we are still in the Age of God's Grace, and by the Spirit of the Lord Jesus (Romans 8:8-9), we best know that we are "one" of His, and NOT "none of His".

To this day, Jesus still does not know the Day of His Glorious return. So then, how could the prophets discern anything beyond His first coming in the flesh, never mind His second coming in the Spirit, and then His third coming in Immortality?
John 16:13, 1 Corinthians 2:14-16.
No, it is we who now needs His discernment.

 

[Earburner]

They refer to the terrible Sixth Seal worldwide disaster, years before Jesus returns.

We are in it now, ever since Covid-19 and the Global operation of getting "stung" with hypodermic needles. And now we are all staring at the prophetic "four" angels bound in the Euphrates, should something disastrous happen with the Nuclear Power plant in Ukraine, which is just above it.
It's interesting to notice that there are only the "four" countries of Turkey, Syria, Iraq and Iran, that border the Euphrates at some point.
What will they of the world do in that area, should there be a Nuclear disaster in the Ukraine, and the river Euphrates etc. becomes contaminated?

 

[Keraz]

We are in it now,

The Sixth Seal commences with dramatic cosmic signs.
Not happened yet.

The rest of your last 3 posts, are just useless opinion. Jesus does NOT Return to destroy the word, but to reign over it. Revelation 20:1-6