The Inquisitions

[epostle1]

mjrhealth,"The great city" is symbolically called Sodom, a reference to Jerusalem, symbolically called "Sodom" in the Old Testament (cf. Is. 1:10; Ezek. 16:1–3, 46–56). We also know Jerusalem is the "the great city" of Revelation 11:8 because the verse says it was "where [the] Lord was crucified."

Revelation consistently speaks as if there were only one "great city" ("the great city"), suggesting that the great city of 11:8 is the same as the great city mentioned in the other seven texts—Babylon. Additional evidence for the identity of the two is the fact that both are symbolically named after great Old Testament enemies of the faith: Sodom, Egypt, and Babylon.

This suggests that Babylon the great may be Jerusalem, not Rome. Many Protestant and Catholic commentators have adopted this interpretation. On the other hand, early Church Fathers often referred to Rome as "Babylon," but every references was to pagan Rome, which martyred Christians. Hunting the Whore of Babylon | Catholic Answers BofL is correct, and I would add that persecution of Christians was not confined to one city.

Sick, twisted brain damaged funnymentalists cannot, or will not, tell the difference between pagan Rome and Christian Rome.

Extreme blind prejudice causes brain damage. They can't read and they can't think for themselves.

 

[Triumph1300]

Sick, twisted brain damaged funnymentalists cannot, or will not, tell the difference between pagan Rome and Christian Rome.

Extreme blind prejudice causes brain damage. They can't read and they can't think for themselves.

It's not hard to figure who's behind this tone of conversation.

 

[mjrhealth]

Sick, twisted brain damaged funnymentalists cannot, or will not, tell the difference between pagan Rome and Christian Rome.

I suppose its a bit like some cant tell the difference between teh Lords church and mens religions, big difference

 

[bbyrd009]

God wont forget what teh "churches" of this world have done, and they will not be forgiven.

yes, they are forgiven, bc i forgive them wadr.

 

[Helen]

"There but for the grace of God go I."

 

[Marymog]

Using these two sources, and any others submitted, I hope to get the facts of this "tormented phase in the history of the Church" (per Pope John Paul 11)(from CERC).

(1)This is a link to the Catholic Education Resource Center (CERC): Status: Inquisition in the Catholic Church
(2)Henry Charles Lea, The History of the Inquisition of the Middle Ages.

Ephesians 6:12
For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places.

From the CERC article: "...religious heresies were considered a kind of political treason."

"To remedy the disorganized response to heresy, Pope Gregory IX (1227-41) took on the task of bringing the investigation of heresy under the discipline of the Holy See. What we term the Inquisition is simply the ecclesiastical tribunal with specially appointed judges (inquisitors) answerable to both the local bishop and the pope, whose task it was to investigate charges of heresy in a systematic and fair way."


So, there were 3 "phases" of the Inquisition: Ecclesiastical Inquisition, Spanish Inquisition and Roman Inquisition.

Questions about torture, imprisonment, burning heretics, effect on family and friends of the heretic, and other punishments, such as wearing crosses for life, pilgrimages, forced into a crusade, floggings etc. are all appropriate in this discussion.

Hi Tabletalk,

Is this discussion about the inquisitions conducted by the Catholic Church only or is this discussion open to all the Christian Inquisition's throughout history?

Curious Mary

 

[Marymog]

Again, The Vatican (which did not exist until 1928)....

Thank you.

I thought you were wrong when you made that statement however I researched it and found out you were right.

I learned that the name Vatican City was first used in the Lateran Treaty (1929) which established the modern city-state. The name is taken from Vatican Hill, the geographic location of the state.

Thank you for that history lesson.

Mary

 

[junobet]

Hi Tabletalk,

Is this discussion about the inquisitions conducted by the Catholic Church only or is this discussion open to all the Christian Inquisition's throughout history?

Curious Mary

Hardly anybody in this thread seems to realize that back then there was no Catholic church on the one hand and Protestant churches on the other. The Medieval Inquisition is our shared history. And of course once Protestantism came up, we were just as prone to burn people on the stake as our Catholic brethren were.

 

[Marymog]

Hardly anybody in this thread seems to realize that back then there was no Catholic church on the one hand and Protestant churches on the other. The Medieval Inquisition is our shared history. And of course once Protestantism came up, we were just as prone to burn people on the stake as our Catholic brethren were.

Hi junobet,

According to your understanding: When was the Medieval Inquisition? (what years)

 

[junobet]

Hi junobet,

According to your understanding: When was the Medieval Inquisition? (what years)

12th and 13th century + Spanish Inquisition (late 15th century) - also before the rise of Protestantism, thus also our shared history.

For more detail a lazy link: Medieval Inquisition - Wikipedia

 

[Marymog]

12th and 13th century + Spanish Inquisition (late 15th century) - also before the rise of Protestantism, thus also our shared history.

Thank you.

According to you when was the Catholic Church established?

Curious Mary

 

[junobet]

Thank you.

According to you when was the Catholic Church established?

Curious Mary

Tricky question, the answer of which would depend very much on what you mean by "Catholic Church". All churches, that are in existence now, probably started with Pentecost.

 

[Marymog]

Tricky question, the answer of which would depend very much on what you mean by "Catholic Church". All churches, that are in existence now, probably started with Pentecost.

Sorry junobet. Marymog isn't playing your game. My children did this to me when they were young.

You can't make the statement "back then there was no Catholic church" and then put the burden of proof on ME. It is not a matter of what Marymog means by catholic church. YOU are the one who made the statement!!! I didn't make that statement. It's a matter of what YOU mean by the catholic church.

Back up YOUR statement with either facts OR opinion.

Respectfully, Mary

 

[junobet]

Sorry junobet. Marymog isn't playing your game. My children did this to me when they were young.

You can't make the statement "back then there was no Catholic church" and then put the burden of proof on ME. It is not a matter of what Marymog means by catholic church. YOU are the one who made the statement!!! I didn't make that statement. It's a matter of what YOU mean by the catholic church.

Back up YOUR statement with either facts OR opinion.

Respectfully, Mary

The church is like a tree with many branches. The branch that you are sitting on grew out of the great shism that was finalized in 1054. The branch that I'm sitting on grew out of your branch in 1517. Does that answer your question? And why are you asking if I may ask?

 

[Triumph1300]

Here's a good description:

The first church, its growth, doctrine, and practices, were recorded for us in the New Testament.

Jesus, as well as His apostles, foretold that false teachers would arise, and indeed it is apparent from some of the New Testament epistles that these apostles had to fight against false teachers early on.

Having a pedigree of apostolic succession or being able to trace a church's roots back to the "first church" is nowhere in Scripture given as a test for being the true church.

What is given is repeated comparisons between what false teachers teach and what the first church taught, as recorded in Scripture.

Whether a church is the "true church" or not is determined by comparing its teachings and practices to that of the New Testament church, as recorded in Scripture.

 

[tabletalk]

Hi Tabletalk,

Is this discussion about the inquisitions conducted by the Catholic Church only or is this discussion open to all the Christian Inquisition's throughout history?

Curious Mary

Please go after those Anglicans, Lutherans, Puritans and whatever Church burned heretics. I think the Catholic Church started it, though.

Serious Bob

 

[epostle1]

Here's a good description:

The first church, its growth, doctrine, and practices, were recorded for us in the New Testament.

Jesus, as well as His apostles, foretold that false teachers would arise, and indeed it is apparent from some of the New Testament epistles that these apostles had to fight against false teachers early on.

Having a pedigree of apostolic succession or being able to trace a church's roots back to the "first church" is nowhere in Scripture given as a test for being the true church.

What is given is repeated comparisons between what false teachers teach and what the first church taught, as recorded in Scripture.

Whether a church is the "true church" or not is determined by comparing its teachings and practices to that of the New Testament church, as recorded in Scripture.

"As recorded in Scripture" makes scripture alone the sole rule of faith, which is nowhere found in scripture. The BIBLICAL and HISTORICAL rule of faith is Scripture, Tradition and Teaching Authority, all working in harmony and one is not over the other. To say we have scripture to begin with without Tradition and Teaching Authority is plain denial of the facts. That is another discussion.

""Catholic" is not the name of a denomination. No one can pin the tail on the Church and say, "that's the Catholic Church" because "Catholic" is one of four divine characteristics that all Christians share in varying degrees. Some have more of one than others: One, Holy, Catholic or Universal, and Apostolic.

"Catholic" is strongly inferred in scripture.
CATHOLIC comes from the Greek word Katholikos, which was later Latinized into Catholicus.

It means 'Universal', which in itself means, 'of or relating to, or affecting the entire world and ALL peoples therein'. It means, ALL encompassing, comprehensibly broad, general, and containing ALL that is neccessary. In summation, it means ALL people in ALL places, having ALL that is necessary, and for ALL time.

It is inferred in Matthew 28:19-20,
"Go, therefore and make disciples of ALL nations...teaching them to observe ALL that I have commanded you; And behold, I am with you ALL days, even unto the consummation of the world."
That is a statement of Universality, Katholicos, Catholicus, Catholic.
CATHOLIC comes from the Greek word Katholikos, which was later Latinized into Catholicus. (not to be confused with the falsehoods of Universalism)

Rom. 1:8….and you belong to that Church whose faith St. Paul describes as being "proclaimed (KATAnggeletai) in the whole universe (en HOLO to kosmo)”

Acts 9:31 "So the church throughout all Judea and Galilee and Sama'ria had peace and was built up; and walking in the fear of the Lord and in the comfort of the Holy Spirit it was multiplied."

There the words "church throughout all" is translated from the Greek words "Ecclesia kata holis" But it was after Ignatius that the term Catholic Church became used more and more to designate the true church.

Thus the word KATAHOLOS or Catholic in English originated from Scriptures - Romans 1:8 and Acts 9.
St. Ignatius, 3rd bishop of Antioch, trained by St. John the Apostle, oldest known usage of "Catholic" outside the Bible, writes:
"Where the Bishop appears, there let the people be, just as where Jesus Christ is, there is the Catholic Church."
St. Ignatius of Antioch's letter to the Smyrneans, paragraph 8, of 106 A.D., full context here
Undoubtedly the word was in use before the time of this writing. He is describing a divine quality, not a denomination.

Written records of the term "CATHOLIC" describing a character of the Christian Church:
Martyrdom of St. Polycarp 155AD;
Clement of Alexandria, Stromateis 202AD;
Cyprian, Unity of the Catholic Church 251AD;
Cyprian, Letter to Florentius, 254AD

"Christian is my name, and Catholic my surname. The one designates me, while the other makes me specific. Thus am I attested and set apart... When we are called Catholics it is by this appellation that our people are kept apart from any heretical name."
Saint Pacian of Barcelona, Letter to Sympronian, 375 A.D.

Final note: Sources on the Inquisition dated before 1960 are obsolete and misleading, and are still being used by hostile anti-Catholics.

 

[Truth]

"As recorded in Scripture" makes scripture alone the sole rule of faith, which is nowhere found in scripture. The BIBLICAL and HISTORICAL rule of faith is Scripture, Tradition and Teaching Authority, all working in harmony and one is not over the other. To say we have scripture to begin with without Tradition and Teaching Authority is plain denial of the facts. That is another discussion.

""Catholic" is not the name of a denomination. No one can pin the tail on the Church and say, "that's the Catholic Church" because "Catholic" is one of four divine characteristics that all Christians share in varying degrees. Some have more of one than others: One, Holy, Catholic or Universal, and Apostolic.

"Catholic" is strongly inferred in scripture.
CATHOLIC comes from the Greek word Katholikos, which was later Latinized into Catholicus.

It means 'Universal', which in itself means, 'of or relating to, or affecting the entire world and ALL peoples therein'. It means, ALL encompassing, comprehensibly broad, general, and containing ALL that is neccessary. In summation, it means ALL people in ALL places, having ALL that is necessary, and for ALL time.

It is inferred in Matthew 28:19-20,
"Go, therefore and make disciples of ALL nations...teaching them to observe ALL that I have commanded you; And behold, I am with you ALL days, even unto the consummation of the world."
That is a statement of Universality, Katholicos, Catholicus, Catholic.
CATHOLIC comes from the Greek word Katholikos, which was later Latinized into Catholicus. (not to be confused with the falsehoods of Universalism)

Rom. 1:8….and you belong to that Church whose faith St. Paul describes as being "proclaimed (KATAnggeletai) in the whole universe (en HOLO to kosmo)”

Acts 9:31 "So the church throughout all Judea and Galilee and Sama'ria had peace and was built up; and walking in the fear of the Lord and in the comfort of the Holy Spirit it was multiplied."

There the words "church throughout all" is translated from the Greek words "Ecclesia kata holis" But it was after Ignatius that the term Catholic Church became used more and more to designate the true church.

Thus the word KATAHOLOS or Catholic in English originated from Scriptures - Romans 1:8 and Acts 9.
St. Ignatius, 3rd bishop of Antioch, trained by St. John the Apostle, oldest known usage of "Catholic" outside the Bible, writes:
"Where the Bishop appears, there let the people be, just as where Jesus Christ is, there is the Catholic Church."
St. Ignatius of Antioch's letter to the Smyrneans, paragraph 8, of 106 A.D., full context here
Undoubtedly the word was in use before the time of this writing. He is describing a divine quality, not a denomination.

Written records of the term "CATHOLIC" describing a character of the Christian Church:
Martyrdom of St. Polycarp 155AD;
Clement of Alexandria, Stromateis 202AD;
Cyprian, Unity of the Catholic Church 251AD;
Cyprian, Letter to Florentius, 254AD

"Christian is my name, and Catholic my surname. The one designates me, while the other makes me specific. Thus am I attested and set apart... When we are called Catholics it is by this appellation that our people are kept apart from any heretical name."
Saint Pacian of Barcelona, Letter to Sympronian, 375 A.D.

Final note: Sources on the Inquisition dated before 1960 are obsolete and misleading, and are still being used by hostile anti-Catholics.

Can you tell me Who changed the Sabbath, from what God had instituted with the Hebrew's, which are depicted in the 10 Commandments, into Sunday as the Day of Worship to the God of Our Savior, And why. Most Importantly from Scripture, and then also Historically!

 

[mjrhealth]

yes, they are forgiven, bc i forgive them wadr.

Rev 6:9 And when he had opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of them that were slain for the word of God, and for the testimony which they held:
Rev 6:10 And they cried with a loud voice, saying, How long, O Lord, holy and true, dost thou not judge and avenge our blood on them that dwell on the earth?
Rev 6:11 And white robes were given unto every one of them; and it was said unto them, that they should rest yet for a little season, until their fellowservants also and their brethren, that should be killed as they were, should be fulfilled.

God will not forgive them , they who blasphemed His Holy name, who did injustices to the saints and children of God in His name, who led men into prison and kept them from His son, teh world is filled with "men of God" who have already sealed there own fate.

Mar 9:42 And whosoever shall offend one of these little ones that believe in me, it is better for him that a millstone were hanged about his neck, and he were cast into the sea.

Rev 18:4 And I heard another voice from heaven, saying, Come out of her, my people, that ye be not partakers of her sins, and that ye receive not of her plagues.
Rev 18:5 For her sins have reached unto heaven, and God hath remembered her iniquities.
Rev 18:6 Reward her even as she rewarded you, and double unto her double according to her works: in the cup which she hath filled fill to her double.
Rev 18:7 How much she hath glorified herself, and lived deliciously, so much torment and sorrow give her: for she saith in her heart, I sit a queen, and am no widow, and shall see no sorrow.
Rev 18:8 Therefore shall her plagues come in one day, death, and mourning, and famine; and she shall be utterly burned with fire: for strong is the Lord God who judgeth her.
Rev 18:9 And the kings of the earth, who have committed fornication and lived deliciously with her, shall bewail her, and lament for her, when they shall see the smoke of her burning,

her day is coming

 

[Radrook]

Jesus never instructed his followers to persecute others in the way that became typical of the Inquisition. The ones who must bear the full responsibility for foisting that idea on the flock are the religious leaders who were far more familiar with the scriptures than the common people. That is why many consider such a period as the great falling away from Christiaity or the apostasy that was foretold.