The rise of the Image of the Beast, America corrupted.

[MatthewG]

Boy are you gonna be shocked!

1 Thessalonians 4
16 For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ will rise first.
17 Then we who are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And thus we shall always be with the Lord.

That letter was telling those people at Thessalonica what would happen, if they continued to look and seek him in faith in that day in age. In a certain way, all people die and they are transfered from this earthly realm, to the heavenly realm. It's understandable that today people are very hopeful and expect that they will see Jesus coming through the clouds today, but you'll need to be in Israel or youll just miss out?

Im cool with people believing what they will and sharing what it is according to scripture, however that was not written to me personally. That was written to those who were told to wait and watch, and it's good to be ready to die in my opinion. It's good to be okay with what you decided to do with your life between yourself and God before you go on, and have hope to go be in the Kingdom.

All the best jack, and I enjoy you conversing with me too.

 

[Truthnightmare]

I disagree. He was not speaking to us. In fact, he never once ever spoke to us ever.

I do believe that people are going to see the Lord one day, when they die, but there is no reason to expect Jesus coming in the clouds today.

It's all by Faith, that Jesus had come back as promised and established the Heavenly Jerusalem, I don't have and confirmed writing that says "Jesus came back" every believer who seen him were taken up, and the rest of the families of the generation, going through the tribulation, died by the sword, starved to death, they were eating each other cause Rome cut off the supplies for them, and their city structures were all burned down.

Okay.


I like conversing with you truthnightmare, and thank you for deciding to engage with me. Whatever you believe, it wont change my mind in what has been placed on the foundation of trusting Jesus, and the apostles, and the bride of christ of those in that day, who loved God, and loved others, and they went on the heavenly kingdom which is now established today, and people come in to by faith in God, and that is all good and wonderful.

As I have a moment, I want you to consider the following. Jesus spoke many things, and gave warnings in Matthew 24. But He emphasized the key to understanding what is being spoken.

He gave a direct commandment.

32 Now learn a parable of the fig tree; When his branch is yet tender, and putteth forth leaves, ye know that summer is nigh:

Do you believe you have learned this parable? The understanding of it is paramount to the entire Bible. There is a reason Adam and Eve covered their private areas with fig leaves, there is a reason Jesus cursed the fig tree, it is all connected.

Notice in Jeremiah…
24 The Lord shewed me, and, behold, two baskets of figs were set before the temple of the Lord, after that Nebuchadrezzar king of Babylon had carried away captive Jeconiah the son of Jehoiakim king of Judah, and the princes of Judah, with the carpenters and smiths, from Jerusalem, and had brought them to Babylon.

2 One basket had very good figs, even like the figs that are first ripe: and the other basket had very naughty figs, which could not be eaten, they were so bad.

3 Then said the Lord unto me, What seest thou, Jeremiah? And I said, Figs; the good figs, very good; and the evil, very evil, that cannot be eaten, they are so evil.

And it would seem understanding this parable of the fig tree would surely unlock the truth regarding Matthew 24.

 

[MatthewG]

As I have a moment, I want you to consider the following. Jesus spoke many things, and gave warnings in Matthew 24. But He emphasized the key to understanding what is being spoken.

He gave a direct commandment.

32 Now learn a parable of the fig tree; When his branch is yet tender, and putteth forth leaves, ye know that summer is nigh:

Do you believe you have learned this parable? The understanding of it is paramount to the entire Bible. There is a reason Adam and Eve covered their private areas with fig leaves, there is a reason Jesus cursed the fig tree, it is all connected.

What does it mean to you? The fig tree that Jesus cursed was symbolic of Israel and it's death that would come about because of their choice to go about with idolatry and also to kill the son of God in order to take over the inheritance.

Matthew 21:33-46​

​

New Living Translation​

​

​

Parable of the Evil Farmers​

33 “Now listen to another story. A certain landowner planted a vineyard, built a wall around it, dug a pit for pressing out the grape juice, and built a lookout tower. Then he leased the vineyard to tenant farmers and moved to another country. 34 At the time of the grape harvest, he sent his servants to collect his share of the crop. 35 But the farmers grabbed his servants, beat one, killed one, and stoned another. 36 So the landowner sent a larger group of his servants to collect for him, but the results were the same.
37 “Finally, the owner sent his son, thinking, ‘Surely they will respect my son.’
38 “But when the tenant farmers saw his son coming, they said to one another, ‘Here comes the heir to this estate. Come on, let’s kill him and get the estate for ourselves!’ 39 So they grabbed him, dragged him out of the vineyard, and murdered him.
40 “When the owner of the vineyard returns,” Jesus asked, “what do you think he will do to those farmers?”
41 The religious leaders replied, “He will put the wicked men to a horrible death and lease the vineyard to others who will give him his share of the crop after each harvest.”
42 Then Jesus asked them, “Didn’t you ever read this in the Scriptures?
‘The stone that the builders rejected
has now become the cornerstone.
This is the Lord’s doing,
and it is wonderful to see.’[a]
43 I tell you, the Kingdom of God will be taken away from you and given to a nation that will produce the proper fruit. 44 Anyone who stumbles over that stone will be broken to pieces, and it will crush anyone it falls on.[b]”

Notice in Jeremiah…
24 The Lord shewed me, and, behold, two baskets of figs were set before the temple of the Lord, after that Nebuchadrezzar king of Babylon had carried away captive Jeconiah the son of Jehoiakim king of Judah, and the princes of Judah, with the carpenters and smiths, from Jerusalem, and had brought them to Babylon.

2 One basket had very good figs, even like the figs that are first ripe: and the other basket had very naughty figs, which could not be eaten, they were so bad.

3 Then said the Lord unto me, What seest thou, Jeremiah? And I said, Figs; the good figs, very good; and the evil, very evil, that cannot be eaten, they are so evil.

And it would seem understanding this parable of the fig tree would surely unlock the truth regarding Matthew 24.

What does it mean to you?

 

[Truthnightmare]

What does it mean to you? The fig tree that Jesus cursed was symbolic of Israel and it's death that would come about because of their choice to go about with idolatry and also to kill the son of God in order to take over the inheritance.

Matthew 21:33-46​

​

New Living Translation​

​

​

Parable of the Evil Farmers​

33 “Now listen to another story. A certain landowner planted a vineyard, built a wall around it, dug a pit for pressing out the grape juice, and built a lookout tower. Then he leased the vineyard to tenant farmers and moved to another country. 34 At the time of the grape harvest, he sent his servants to collect his share of the crop. 35 But the farmers grabbed his servants, beat one, killed one, and stoned another. 36 So the landowner sent a larger group of his servants to collect for him, but the results were the same.
37 “Finally, the owner sent his son, thinking, ‘Surely they will respect my son.’
38 “But when the tenant farmers saw his son coming, they said to one another, ‘Here comes the heir to this estate. Come on, let’s kill him and get the estate for ourselves!’ 39 So they grabbed him, dragged him out of the vineyard, and murdered him.
40 “When the owner of the vineyard returns,” Jesus asked, “what do you think he will do to those farmers?”
41 The religious leaders replied, “He will put the wicked men to a horrible death and lease the vineyard to others who will give him his share of the crop after each harvest.”
42 Then Jesus asked them, “Didn’t you ever read this in the Scriptures?
‘The stone that the builders rejected
has now become the cornerstone.
This is the Lord’s doing,
and it is wonderful to see.’[a]
43 I tell you, the Kingdom of God will be taken away from you and given to a nation that will produce the proper fruit. 44 Anyone who stumbles over that stone will be broken to pieces, and it will crush anyone it falls on.[b]”

What does it mean to you?

Gotta give me a moment on this on it covers many things… and I’m hungry

Also, my Bible reads a lot different,

Would it surprise you that the holder of the Copyright of the New International Version Bible also holds the copyright for Hustler magazine - pornography. Rupert Murdock, called "Media's prince of Darkness" by Chicago columnist Mike Royco, owns the copyright & exclusive printing rights on the most sold newer Bible version in the world, the NIV (through Zondervan Publishing House, Grand Rapids Michigan, which he owns). Murdoch also owns the copyright on another Bible version, the Amplified Version. I don’t believe that this will affect our discussion at all, just wanted to throw it out there.

 

[MatthewG]

Gotta give me a moment on this on it covers many things… and I’m hungry

Also, my Bible reads a lot different,

Would it surprise you that the holder of the Copyright of the New International Version Bible also holds the copyright for Hustler magazine - pornography. Rupert Murdock, called "Media's prince of Darkness" by Chicago columnist Mike Royco, owns the copyright & exclusive printing rights on the most sold newer Bible version in the world, the NIV (through Zondervan Publishing House, Grand Rapids Michigan, which he owns). Murdoch also owns the copyright on another Bible version, the Amplified Version. I don’t believe that this will affect our discussion at all, just wanted to throw it out there.

Your right, I have taken time to read all of the gospels in the course of the past 7 years, since 2016. Also had a lot of help from a teacher who pointed out things along the way to also consider. I don't expect you to just get what is being shared with you, however in a sense I do hope it might get you into a desire to at least, be able to use the bible with itself to figure out what is going on.

It doesn't bother me, what a human being does naturally. I am guilty of falling into the snares of porn myself, along with other myriads of other issues. Very thankful for God, and the Lord Jesus Christ. Hope you enjoy your meal.

 

[Truthnightmare]

Your right, I have taken time to read all of the gospels in the course of the past 7 years, since 2016. Also had a lot of help from a teacher who pointed out things along the way to also consider. I don't expect you to just get what is being shared with you, however in a sense I do hope it might get you into a desire to at least, be able to use the bible with itself to figure out what is going on.

It doesn't bother me, what a human being does naturally. I am guilty of falling into the snares of porn myself, along with other myriads of other issues. Very thankful for God, and the Lord Jesus Christ. Hope you enjoy your meal.

1 Corinthians 10:13

King James Bible
There hath no temptation taken you but such as is common to man: but God is faithful, who will not suffer you to be tempted above that ye are able; but will with the temptation also make a way to escape, that ye may be able to bear it.

Talk to ya soon… be easy.

 

[MatthewG]

1 Corinthians 10:13

King James Bible
There hath no temptation taken you but such as is common to man: but God is faithful, who will not suffer you to be tempted above that ye are able; but will with the temptation also make a way to escape, that ye may be able to bear it.

Talk to ya soon… be easy.

Thank you for your encouragement, friend.

 

[Truthnightmare]

What does it mean to you? The fig tree that Jesus cursed was symbolic of Israel and it's death that would come about because of their choice to go about with idolatry and also to kill the son of God in order to take over the inheritance.

Matthew 21:33-46​

​

New Living Translation​

​

​

Parable of the Evil Farmers​

33 “Now listen to another story. A certain landowner planted a vineyard, built a wall around it, dug a pit for pressing out the grape juice, and built a lookout tower. Then he leased the vineyard to tenant farmers and moved to another country. 34 At the time of the grape harvest, he sent his servants to collect his share of the crop. 35 But the farmers grabbed his servants, beat one, killed one, and stoned another. 36 So the landowner sent a larger group of his servants to collect for him, but the results were the same.
37 “Finally, the owner sent his son, thinking, ‘Surely they will respect my son.’
38 “But when the tenant farmers saw his son coming, they said to one another, ‘Here comes the heir to this estate. Come on, let’s kill him and get the estate for ourselves!’ 39 So they grabbed him, dragged him out of the vineyard, and murdered him.
40 “When the owner of the vineyard returns,” Jesus asked, “what do you think he will do to those farmers?”
41 The religious leaders replied, “He will put the wicked men to a horrible death and lease the vineyard to others who will give him his share of the crop after each harvest.”
42 Then Jesus asked them, “Didn’t you ever read this in the Scriptures?
‘The stone that the builders rejected
has now become the cornerstone.
This is the Lord’s doing,
and it is wonderful to see.’[a]
43 I tell you, the Kingdom of God will be taken away from you and given to a nation that will produce the proper fruit. 44 Anyone who stumbles over that stone will be broken to pieces, and it will crush anyone it falls on.[b]”

What does it mean to you?

I believe we are in agreement for the most concerning the cursing of the fig tree.

The passages above seem to indicate the Lord has sent prophet after prophet, and they were killed. Surely if the Lord sends His son they will listen. Nope, killed Him to.

I am of the opinion that the parable of the fig tree starts the clock. And I believe it has started, but when and how long is up for debate.

May 14, 1948 when Israel once again became a nation, for that had not happened since Christ's time. Some believe that the generation of the Fig Tree began June 5, 1967 when Israel liberated Jerusalem with the Six Day War, this also had not happened since Christ's time. No matter which is the true start date for the generation of the Fig Tree, we are in it now! below is a brief history of Israel and Jerusalem. You always look to Jerusalem for Biblical prophecies to occur.

Excerpted from the World book Encyclopedia:
Jerusalem is a holy city of Jews, Christians, and Muslims. It is the capital of Israel. In the Arab-Israeli war of 1948, Jerusalem became divided between Israel and the neighboring Arab country of Jordan. Israel held West Jerusalem, and Jordan controlled East Jerusalem. Israel won East Jerusalem in the brief Arab-Israeli war of 1967, and combined it with the western section. West Jerusalem is the modern part of the city. East Jerusalem includes the walled Old City, the site of many ancient holy places. (End of excerpt)

But bare with me, you believe the generation being spoken of began 40 years after Christ spoke these words in Matthew, correct?

Do you believe that everything spoken of in Matthew 24 Mark 13 and Luke 21 has happened? If so, are you confident enough to present historical evidence of each event?

 

[MatthewG]

I believe we are in agreement for the most concerning the cursing of the fig tree.

That is good.

The passages above seem to indicate the Lord has sent prophet after prophet, and they were killed. Surely if the Lord sends His son they will listen. Nope, killed Him to.

Yes.

I am of the opinion that the parable of the fig tree starts the clock. And I believe it has started, but when and how long is up for debate.

Ok.

May 14, 1948 when Israel once again became a nation, for that had not happened since Christ's time. Some believe that the generation of the Fig Tree began June 5, 1967 when Israel liberated Jerusalem with the Six Day War, this also had not happened since Christ's time. No matter which is the true start date for the generation of the Fig Tree, we are in it now! below is a brief history of Israel and Jerusalem. You always look to Jerusalem for Biblical prophecies to occur.

Excerpted from the World book Encyclopedia:
Jerusalem is a holy city of Jews, Christians, and Muslims. It is the capital of Israel. In the Arab-Israeli war of 1948, Jerusalem became divided between Israel and the neighboring Arab country of Jordan. Israel held West Jerusalem, and Jordan controlled East Jerusalem. Israel won East Jerusalem in the brief Arab-Israeli war of 1967, and combined it with the western section. West Jerusalem is the modern part of the city. East Jerusalem includes the walled Old City, the site of many ancient holy places. (End of excerpt)

None of this really has any merit to me personally, ever since the destruction and all the flame of glory of Gods chosen nation was burn down and desolated destroying the temple was all fulfilled within a generation of time.

Today the time is the very last day of ones of life; which is why its good to chose to live wisely in faith, trusting that the holy spirit of God is with you and that the spirit of Christ is also there to help with dying to our fleshly way.

But bare with me, you believe the generation being spoken of began 40 years after Christ spoke these words in Matthew, correct?

Yes.

Do you believe that everything spoken of in Matthew 24 Mark 13 and Luke 21 has happened?

Yes, I blindly believe thay everything was fulfilled as Jesus Christ has promised, which would come upon that generation, and never be so great again.

If so, are you confident enough to present historical evidence of each event?

I am not confident enough to present every historical evidence, other than, Israel fell, as the armies surrounded Jerusalem and a million jewish people were all killed, all the tribes of isreal. As promised also by God to be done to them in the old testament. And those who seen the terrors of all the plagues which were poured out on them, they did not even turn to God at all.

 

[Truthnightmare]

That is good.

Yes.

Ok.

None of this really has any merit to me personally, ever since the destruction and all the flame of glory of Gods chosen nation was burn down and desolated destroying the temple was all fulfilled within a generation of time.

Today the time is the very last day of ones of life; which is why its good to chose to live wisely in faith, trusting that the holy spirit of God is with you and that the spirit of Christ is also there to help with dying to our fleshly way.

Yes.


Yes, I blindly believe thay everything was fulfilled as Jesus Christ has promised, which would come upon that generation, and never be so great again.

I am not confident enough to present every historical evidence, other than, Israel fell, as the armies surrounded Jerusalem and a million jewish people were all killed, all the tribes of isreal. As promised also by God to be done to them in the old testament. And those who seen the terrors of all the plagues which were poured out on them, they did not even turn to God at all.

I disagree, but ultimately thats what people are going to ask of you…

For instance…

31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

When did this happen?

30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.
I reversed the order of verse 30 and 31… notice in verse 30 Jesus returns…

Surely we can agree that this has not happened or we wouldn’t be having this conversation. But my point is if you blindly believe all the events of Matthew 24 have happened then, you must believe all the events of Revelation has happened,, right?

 

[MatthewG]

I disagree, but ultimately thats what people are going to ask of you…

Of course.

For instance…

31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

When did this happen?

When the great tribulation was going and the destruction of Jerusalem was happening. This sounds like me those were watching and waiting for the Lord Jesus Christ to come back.

James 5:2 Be patient, then, brothers and sisters, until the Lord’s coming. See how the farmer waits for the land to yield its valuable crop, patiently waiting for the autumn and spring rains. (Remember Matther 21 for earlier, you gotta take at least Matthew 21 - 24, all together.

30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn,

This would have to be relating to the sign of which the Son of man, had promised that of the things had pertained to what was stated within the context of each gospel, together as a whole offers a great view. And the tribes of Israel, were 12,000 of each 12, and those were the faithful bride of Christ, which hell would not prevail against. They were said to be virgins, and have been kept pure and blameless. However, not every person that was from Abraham and the linage of him, had stayed faithful. The wrath of God was now coming down upon them for their choice of killing the son of God, and that is when the divorcement of the old age was done away with. All of Israels geneology which is only given in the bible, was completely wiped away in which they had up to date in 70AD, all the priesthoods, and all the sacrfices, and the temple which all the 12 tribes had met up which were faith, and did come to worship Yahava the God of Israel. And because of the plagues that would befall upon them, there would be many even with boils on them, and eating each other to stay alive, would not even turn to God, with repentance.

and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

I believe those faithful believers in that day, saw Jesus come as promised, and they were transliterated from this earth, to the heavenly kingdom, and everyone who died after Jesus resurrection, were the first ones to rule with Christ, and those who were transliterated were the last, and however that doesn't mean that more people would not come into the Kingdom, as once the Kingdom of God had been established with the victory of Jesus Christ, who came as promised, and he was seen not spiritually, but psychically, why? Because humans are unable to see spirits because of our flesh.

I reversed the order of verse 30 and 31… notice in verse 30 Jesus returns…

Absolutely.

Surely we can agree that this has not happened or we wouldn’t be having this conversation.

I would faithfully believe that Jesus was not a liar, nor was the apostles to the people then who were watching and waiting for the Lord Jesus Christ to come save them from a terrible time, which is all recorded of course, with in context of revelation, and other sources of history which was given to you prior.

But my point is if you blindly believe all the events of Matthew 24 have happened then, you must believe all the events of Revelation has happened,, right?

I believe everything has been made new as promised in Revelation 21, and 22. With all the events of Revelation 1, - 20, having been fulfilled because of the promise of God, to be able to reconcile the world to himself, by the divorcement of Israel, in 70AD and the demolishing of everything that had in complete desolation, and a million jews dead, which to me signifies all the tribes of Israel were dead. Jesus came and got the bride, and the kingdom of God has been established today, and people come into it by faith.

 

[Jack]

I think it make sense that those who don't believe in a literal "Mark of the Beast" will be among those who accept it. Maybe we can pull some out of the fire!

 

[Truthnightmare]

I believe everything has been made new as promised in Revelation 21, and 22. With all the events of Revelation 1, - 20, having been fulfilled because of the promise of God, to be able to reconcile the world to himself, by the divorcement of Israel, in 70AD and the demolishing of everything that had in complete desolation, and a million jews dead, which to me signifies all the tribes of Israel were dead.

Yes the Roman General Titus did destroy Jerusalem, but not all of it. Christ said..

And Jesus said unto them, “See ye not all these things? Verily I say unto you, there shall not be left here one stone upon another that shall not be thrown down.”

To this day there are still stones on stones because the wailing wall or parts of it still remain.

But I can assure you that all of Israel is not dead.
I’m actually discussing this now.

In the book of King Chp 12 the twelve tribes were about to go to war with each other. The Lord would not have this…


The Southern Kingdom:
Consisted of two of the tribes (Judah and Benjamin) and were called Judahwith their capital in Jerusalem.

Judah punished:
Because of idolatry, God also punished Judah, and the Two Tribe Southern Kingdom Judah was taken into captivity by the Babylonians. In 477 B.C.* Nebuchadnezzar took Jerusalem and destroyed the Temple of God (the same location of the Temple Mount in modern Israel).

The Northern Kingdom:
Consisting of the other Ten Tribes were called Israel and their capital was at Samaria.

Israel punished:
Because of idolatry, God punished Israel, and The Ten Tribe Israel nation was taken into captivity by the Assyrians and Israel became a province of Assyria in 611 B.C.* and the people Israel dropped out of the Biblical narrative and profane history as well for the most part. They became not a people (lo-ammi).

This is my belief, after a three years siege and the final fall of Samaria with it's becoming of an Assyrian Province in 611 B.C. (722 B.C. by profane history), Israel ceased to be and dropped out of history.

But Israel (the Ten Lost Tribes) were never lost to God, they migrated North over the Caucasus Mountains (where we get our word 'Caucasian' from) and settled Europe, eventually populating Scotland, Ireland, Britain, Iceland, and ultimately crossing westward over the seas and established the Americas.

Question for ya… If you believe Israel is dead, how would you explain these prophecies?

1. Israel to be great and mighty nation. Gen. 12:2; 18:18; Deut. 4:7,8.

2. Israel to have multitudinous seed. Gen. 13:16; 15:5; 22:17; 24:60; 26:4, 24; 28:3, 14; 32:12; 49:22; Isa. 10:22; Hos. 1:10; Zech. 10:7,8.

3. Israel to spread abroad to the West, East, North and South. Gen. 28:14; Isa. 42:5, 6.

4. Israel to have a new home. 2nd Sam. 7:10; 1st Chron. 17:9.

5. Israel's home to be north-west of Palestine. Isa. 49:12; Jer. 3:18.

6. Israel to live in islands and coasts of the earth. Isa. 41:1; 49:1-3; 51:5; Jer. 31:7-10.

7. Israel to become a company of nations. Gen. 17:4-6, 15,16; 35:11; 48:19; Eph. 2:12.

8. Israel to have a Davidic King (a perpetual monarchy within Israel). 2nd Sam. 7:13,19; 1st Chron. 22:10; 2nd Chron. 13:5; Psa. 89:20, 37; Eze. 37:24; Jer. 33:17, 21, 26.

9. Israel to colonize and spread abroad. Gen. 28:14; 49:22; Deut. 32:8; 33:17; Psa. 2:8; Isa. 26:15; 27:6; 54:2; Zech. 10:8,9.

10. Israel to colonize the desolate place of the earth. Isa. 35:1; 43:19, 20; 49:8; 54:3; 58:11, 12.

11. Israel to lose a colony, then expand, demanding more room. Isa. 49:19, 20.

12. Israel to have all the land needed. Deut. 32:8.

13. Israel to be the first among the nations. Gen. 27:29; 28:13; Jer. 31:7.

14. Israel to continue as a nation forever. 2nd Sam. 7:16, 24, 29; 1st Chron. 17:22-27; Jer. 31:35-37.

15. Israel's home to be invincible to outside forces. 2nd Sam. 7:10; Isa. 41:11-14.

16. Israel to be undefeatable - defended by God. Num. 24:8, 9; Isa. 15-17; Micah 5:8, 9.

17. Israel to be God's instrument in destroying evil. Jer. 51:20; 51:19-24; Dan. 2:34, 35.

18. Israel to have a land of great mineral wealth. Gen. 49:25, 26; Deut. 8:9; 33:15-19.

19. Israel to have a land of great agricultural wealth. Gen. 27:28; Deut. 8:7, 9; 28:11; 33:13, 14, 28.

20. Israel to be rich by trading. Isa. 60:5-11; 61:6.

21. Israel to be envied and feared by all nations. Deut. 2:25; 4:8; 28:10; Isa. 43:4; 60:10, 12; Micah 7:16, 17; Jer. 33:9.

22. Israel to lend to other nations, borrowing of none. Deut. 15:6; 28.12.

23. Israel to have a new name. Isa. 62:2; 65:15; Hos. 2:17.

24. Israel to have a new language. Isa. 28:11 (The Bible, by means of which God speaks now to Israel, is English not Hebrew).

25. Israel to possess the gates of his enemies. Gen. 22:17.

26. Israel to find the aborigines diminishing before them. Deut. 33:17; Isa. 60:12.

27. Israel to have control of the seas. Deut. 33:19; Num. 24:7; Psa. 89:25; Isa. 60:5 (F. Fenton translates this last, "when rolls up to you all the wealth of the sea". That could not be unless Israel controlled it).

28. Israel to have a new religion (New Covenant.) Heb. 8:10-13; 9:17; Matt. 10:5-7; Luke 1:77; 2:32; 22:20; John 11:49-52; Gal. 3:13.

29. Israel to lose all trace of her lineage. Isa. 42:16-19; Hos. 1:9, 10; 2:6; Rom. 11:25.

30. Israel to keep Sabbath forever (one day in seven set aside). Ex. 31:13, 16, 17; Isa. 58:13, 14.

31. Israel to be called the sons of God (i.e., accept Christianity). Hos. 1:10-11.

32. Israel to be a people saved by the Lord. Deut. 33:27-29; Isa. 41:8-14; 43:1-8;44:1-3;49:25, 26; 52:1-12; 55:3-10, 13; Jer. 46:27, 28; Eze. 34:10-16; Hos. 2:23; 13:9-14; 14:4, 6.

33. Israel to be the custodians of the Oracles (Scriptures) of God. Psa. 147:19, 21; Isa. 59-21.

34. Israel to carry the Gospel to all the world. Gen. 28:14; Isa. 43:10-12 (witnesses), 21; Micah 5:7.

35. Israel to be kind to the poor and set slaves free. Deut. 15:7, 11; Psa. 72:4; Isa. 42:7; 49:9; 58:6.

36. Israel to be the heir of the world. Rom. 4:13.

37. Israel to be God's Glory. Isa. 46:13; 49:3; 60:1, 2.

38. Israel to possess God's Holy Spirit as well as His Word. Isa. 44:3; 59:21; Hagg. 2:5.

39. Israel to be God's Heritage, formed by God, forever. Deut. 4:20; 7:6; 14:2; 2nd Sam. 7:23; 1st Kings 8:51, 53; Isa. 43:21; 54:5-10; Hos. 2:19, 23; Joel 2:27; Micah 7:14 -18.

40. Israel is the nation appointed to bring glory to God. Isa. 41:8-16; 43:10, 21; 44:23; 49:3.​

 

[Jack]

Why aren't the Israel wannabees in Israel? Too scary?

 

[Truthnightmare]

Why aren't the Israel wannabees in Israel? Too scary?

What is a Israel wannabe? Even the Israelites were not always in the land of Israel.

 

[Jack]

What is a Israel wannabe? Even the Israelites were not always in the land of Israel.

They are now.

 

[Truthnightmare]

They are now.

You have the right to believe as such, I however don’t.

 

[Jack]

You have the right to believe as such, I however don’t.

And I have a map that shows Israel in the Land of the Bible. They're back to stay.

 

[Truthnightmare]

And I have a map that shows Israel in the Land of the Bible. They're back to stay.

I’m not sure I understand.. the Israelites were in many places according to the Bible. It seems like
anyone can go to the land of Israel and
put on a yarmulke, and Americans would believe they’re related to Moses.

 

[MatthewG]

Yes the Roman General Titus did destroy Jerusalem, but not all of it. Christ said..

I believe all of it was destroyed.

And Jesus said unto them, “See ye not all these things? Verily I say unto you, there shall not be left here one stone upon another that shall not be thrown down.”

To this day there are still stones on stones because the wailing wall or parts of it still remain.

I dont believe that wailing wall is any part of Jerusalem which is standing there, and believe it something of Roman origin.

But I can assure you that all of Israel is not dead.

No, the Heavenly Jerusalem is intact, and people come in to it through faith in believing that God is, and seek him diligently.

I’m actually discussing this now.

In the book of King Chp 12 the twelve tribes were about to go to war with each other. The Lord would not have this…

Okay, that is cool.

The Southern Kingdom:
Consisted of two of the tribes (Judah and Benjamin) and were called Judahwith their capital in Jerusalem.


The Northern Kingdom:
Consisting of the other Ten Tribes were called Israel and their capital was at Samaria.

There is a person here who taught me a little bit about these two differences. What is interesting though, is that annually all twelve tribes that were of the faithful, looking to go and be in the temple to worship and sacrifice to God, even in 70AD, there would also be gentiles, but also every one whom was given heritage (aside from the Levites who were given priesthood) where given land, even though they had split like this.

This is my belief, after a three years siege and the final fall of Samaria with it's becoming of an Assyrian Province in 611 B.C. (722 B.C. by profane history), Israel ceased to be and dropped out of history.

Okay. What book of the bible, are you referencing?

But Israel (the Ten Lost Tribes) were never lost to God,

I believe no tribe was lost to God at all. If they all were lost they all would not have been mentioned by John in Revelation,

they migrated North over the Caucasus Mountains (where we get our word 'Caucasian' from) and settled Europe, eventually populating Scotland, Ireland, Britain, Iceland, and ultimately crossing westward over the seas and established the Americas

I do not believe this is true. Its a personal belief that anyone who was of the 12 tribes of Israel, which basically the "Nation of Israel", and it seems that God divorced the material nation by destroying them as promised, having the people killed off by justifying the wrath of God upon those who struck down his son. That is why I am do not believe "bloodlines" or "geneaology" of saying "Oh I am a Jew" is really an intellectually honest thing to do. Because all the Jewish people were done away with then and there, though there would have been thoughts who may have been mixed, with other nations, and still be under the Jewish religious ways.

I am by no means, an anti-semite, and hope the best of Israel as a country, all the way, today, as well as the other countries across the world. In the bible it is said to pray for all people, even your enemies who are out to harm you.

Question for ya… If you believe Israel is dead, how would you explain these prophecies?

1. Israel to be great and mighty nation. Gen. 12:2; 18:18; Deut. 4:7,8.

2. Israel to have multitudinous seed. Gen. 13:16; 15:5; 22:17; 24:60; 26:4, 24; 28:3, 14; 32:12; 49:22; Isa. 10:22; Hos. 1:10; Zech. 10:7,8.

3. Israel to spread abroad to the West, East, North and South. Gen. 28:14; Isa. 42:5, 6.

4. Israel to have a new home. 2nd Sam. 7:10; 1st Chron. 17:9.

5. Israel's home to be north-west of Palestine. Isa. 49:12; Jer. 3:18.

6. Israel to live in islands and coasts of the earth. Isa. 41:1; 49:1-3; 51:5; Jer. 31:7-10.

7. Israel to become a company of nations. Gen. 17:4-6, 15,16; 35:11; 48:19; Eph. 2:12.

8. Israel to have a Davidic King (a perpetual monarchy within Israel). 2nd Sam. 7:13,19; 1st Chron. 22:10; 2nd Chron. 13:5; Psa. 89:20, 37; Eze. 37:24; Jer. 33:17, 21, 26.

9. Israel to colonize and spread abroad. Gen. 28:14; 49:22; Deut. 32:8; 33:17; Psa. 2:8; Isa. 26:15; 27:6; 54:2; Zech. 10:8,9.

10. Israel to colonize the desolate place of the earth. Isa. 35:1; 43:19, 20; 49:8; 54:3; 58:11, 12.

11. Israel to lose a colony, then expand, demanding more room. Isa. 49:19, 20.

12. Israel to have all the land needed. Deut. 32:8.

13. Israel to be the first among the nations. Gen. 27:29; 28:13; Jer. 31:7.

14. Israel to continue as a nation forever. 2nd Sam. 7:16, 24, 29; 1st Chron. 17:22-27; Jer. 31:35-37.

15. Israel's home to be invincible to outside forces. 2nd Sam. 7:10; Isa. 41:11-14.

16. Israel to be undefeatable - defended by God. Num. 24:8, 9; Isa. 15-17; Micah 5:8, 9.

17. Israel to be God's instrument in destroying evil. Jer. 51:20; 51:19-24; Dan. 2:34, 35.

18. Israel to have a land of great mineral wealth. Gen. 49:25, 26; Deut. 8:9; 33:15-19.

19. Israel to have a land of great agricultural wealth. Gen. 27:28; Deut. 8:7, 9; 28:11; 33:13, 14, 28.

20. Israel to be rich by trading. Isa. 60:5-11; 61:6.

21. Israel to be envied and feared by all nations. Deut. 2:25; 4:8; 28:10; Isa. 43:4; 60:10, 12; Micah 7:16, 17; Jer. 33:9.

22. Israel to lend to other nations, borrowing of none. Deut. 15:6; 28.12.

23. Israel to have a new name. Isa. 62:2; 65:15; Hos. 2:17.

24. Israel to have a new language. Isa. 28:11 (The Bible, by means of which God speaks now to Israel, is English not Hebrew).

25. Israel to possess the gates of his enemies. Gen. 22:17.

26. Israel to find the aborigines diminishing before them. Deut. 33:17; Isa. 60:12.

27. Israel to have control of the seas. Deut. 33:19; Num. 24:7; Psa. 89:25; Isa. 60:5 (F. Fenton translates this last, "when rolls up to you all the wealth of the sea". That could not be unless Israel controlled it).

28. Israel to have a new religion (New Covenant.) Heb. 8:10-13; 9:17; Matt. 10:5-7; Luke 1:77; 2:32; 22:20; John 11:49-52; Gal. 3:13.

29. Israel to lose all trace of her lineage. Isa. 42:16-19; Hos. 1:9, 10; 2:6; Rom. 11:25.

30. Israel to keep Sabbath forever (one day in seven set aside). Ex. 31:13, 16, 17; Isa. 58:13, 14.

31. Israel to be called the sons of God (i.e., accept Christianity). Hos. 1:10-11.

32. Israel to be a people saved by the Lord. Deut. 33:27-29; Isa. 41:8-14; 43:1-8;44:1-3;49:25, 26; 52:1-12; 55:3-10, 13; Jer. 46:27, 28; Eze. 34:10-16; Hos. 2:23; 13:9-14; 14:4, 6.

33. Israel to be the custodians of the Oracles (Scriptures) of God. Psa. 147:19, 21; Isa. 59-21.

34. Israel to carry the Gospel to all the world. Gen. 28:14; Isa. 43:10-12 (witnesses), 21; Micah 5:7.

35. Israel to be kind to the poor and set slaves free. Deut. 15:7, 11; Psa. 72:4; Isa. 42:7; 49:9; 58:6.

36. Israel to be the heir of the world. Rom. 4:13.

37. Israel to be God's Glory. Isa. 46:13; 49:3; 60:1, 2.

38. Israel to possess God's Holy Spirit as well as His Word. Isa. 44:3; 59:21; Hagg. 2:5.

39. Israel to be God's Heritage, formed by God, forever. Deut. 4:20; 7:6; 14:2; 2nd Sam. 7:23; 1st Kings 8:51, 53; Isa. 43:21; 54:5-10; Hos. 2:19, 23; Joel 2:27; Micah 7:14 -18.

40. Israel is the nation appointed to bring glory to God. Isa. 41:8-16; 43:10, 21; 44:23; 49:3.​

There is a material Israel, and then their is those who are of isrrael spiritually. While you have a great challenge for me, it would be impossible to answer your question on just a short jist, as you know that. Where did you get this list, or did you make it yourself to study? Which Israel is being spoken about and of?

God divorced Material Israel, that is why we disagree, are you someone who believe that Israel is still active now, and who are all of the 12 tribes which were from Israels are they still alive in active on earth? I do not believe so, with them being taken away, and those who were remaining on earth suffered under the wrath of God, which was promisd to come about upon them. Everything revolves around the spiritual, and not so much the material things.

The Old Testament, speaks many things about Jesus as well.

John 5:39-40​

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New International Version​

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39 You study[a] the Scriptures diligently because you think that in them you have eternal life. These are the very Scriptures that testify about me, 40 yet you refuse to come to me to have life.