The Unsaved Man Does Not Need To “Stop Sinning”

[Lambano]

I don’t know which balls you dropped, but if you hear me talk and come away with the understanding that I have said it’s the flames for you, then at the very least, you’ve dropped the ball of “promises to hope for in trust.”

Sorry, sorry, sorry. I see a general trend here of those who are of the opinion that believers are not being pushed hard enough to turn faith into something else (often including cleaner cups). Backed up by the threat of flames. Even your friend has said as much. It was not fair of me to include you into that broader category. Please accept my humble apologies.

 

[michaelvpardo]

Nor can the Saved man ( ever hear about the “ Sins of Omission?” ) without Grace and plenty of it we are both helpless and hopeless .....it’s best that you find some of that Grace ....obtain it by Resting in the Gospel Of Grace—- 1Cor15:1-4

You're reading things into my post which aren't there. Use caution lest you be guilty of bearing false witness as so many here constantly do. God is not mocked.

 

[Bob Carabbio]

Sin is bad....everybody should stop doing it.....notice Jesus nor anybody else in the Bible ever said to “ stop sinning to BE SAVED!”.......How does one GET SAVED? Easy......Do God's Will. What would that be? “ BELIEVE on the One that He sent”...... end of story... ( if you want to give it a “ kick start” , simply believe the True means of Salvation that Jesus revealed to Paul.........you will find it in 1Cor15:1-4 )

Of course there's WORLD OF DIFFERENCE between "Belief" (mental assent), and Biblical FAITH (which must possess "substance" and be an "EVIDENCE" of what you don't see). "Mental assent" has neither attribute. And according to Eph 2:8,9, FAITH is GIFTED by God (Rom 10:17).

James is essentially a "Litmus test" by which you can determine if what you CALL "Faith" - really IS Biblical Faith, and not just "Religious mind games"/Activity.

 

[michaelvpardo]

Sorry, sorry, sorry. I see a general trend here of those who are of the opinion that believers are not being pushed hard enough to turn faith into something else (often including cleaner cups). Backed up by the threat of flames. Even your friend has said as much. It was not fair of me to include you into that broader category. Please accept my humble apologies.

You can't avoid legalism in these forums, nor the competitive nature of the flesh. Paul, when he was still known as Saul, was a self righteous religious zealot, and don't imagine that such zeal simply disappeared after his confrontation by the risen christ on the road to Damascus.
The biggest struggle of the "religious " is accepting the fact that their religion earns no merit with God in salvation and can only earn reward if done in Him (as works done by God through them.)

Then Jesus answered and said to them, “Most assuredly, I say to you, the Son can do nothing of Himself, but what He sees the Father do; for whatever He does, the Son also does in like manner. John 5:19

“I am the vine, you are the branches. He who abides in Me, and I in him, bears much fruit; for without Me you can do nothing. John 15:5

Sometimes we get caught up in argument with one determined legalist and forget the general public nature of the discussion, sometimes we're engaged with multiple legalists determined to "correct" us or just slandering us with accusations or innuendo. At such times even a well meant comment can be received as a personal attack. Such moments are the success of the legalists on the forums. It seems that their goal is less edification than self aggrandizement.

When you take a stand, some wait anxiously for you to fall, while others do everything to try to trip you up. If that sounds like the scribes, Pharisees, and Herodians that persisted in "testing" the Lord until they condemned Him to death, that would be because self righteousness is a murderer, confident in itself and condemning of others.

 

[Lambano]

Just because you have not yet seen what you hope for does not mean you will not. If you are growing in trust, you are doing the one thing necessary. It’s what He asks for. It’s a race of trust. So race to win.

Ah, the paradox of unanswered prayer. Continuing to ask in faith, while continuing to trust even after not receiving what you asked for a long time. And knowing the answer could be "no".

 

[GEN2REV]

Sin is bad....everybody should stop doing it.....notice Jesus nor anybody else in the Bible ever said to “ stop sinning to BE SAVED!”.......How does one GET SAVED? Easy......Do God's Will. What would that be? “ BELIEVE on the One that He sent”...... end of story... ( if you want to give it a “ kick start” , simply believe the True means of Salvation that Jesus revealed to Paul.........you will find it in 1Cor15:1-4 )

You, and the majority of the clique on all Christian forums, are Hyper-Grace.

What is Hyper-Grace?

Got Questions says:
"The term hyper-grace has been used to describe a new wave of teaching that emphasizes the grace of God to the exclusion of other vital teachings such as repentance and confession of sin. Hyper-grace teachers maintain that all sin, past, present, and future, has already been forgiven, so there is no need for a believer to ever confess it. Hyper-grace teaching says that, when God looks at us, He sees only a holy and righteous people. The conclusion of hyper-grace teaching is that we are not bound by Jesus’ teaching, even as we are not under the Law; that believers are not responsible for their sin; and that anyone who disagrees is a pharisaical legalist. In short, hyper-grace teachers “pervert the grace of our God into a license for immorality” (Jude 1:4) and flirt with antinomianism."
What is hyper-grace? | GotQuestions.org

Hyper-Grace churches and teachers are the leaders of the damned!

They are the steam engine of the train headed straight to hell!

 

[GEN2REV]

I know he who began a good work will complete it until ressurection day.

Every single one of God's promises is conditional.

You and all your buddies here refuse to accept any conditions on your salvation because you are Spiritually Entitled. A spiritual spoiled brat in other words.

You believe you need not lift a finger for your salvation and you're already as holy as you'll ever be.

Well, you got part of that right, for sure.
Revelation 22:11

God will complete our process of sanctification and we will be saved after our physical death IF we remain within His Commandments and follow the Ways of Christ.

That's how it works, son.

It's YOU who doesn't know the book of John.

"Every branch IN ME that beareth not fruit, He (the Father) taketh away ...
... If a man abide not in Me (in My Commandments and My Ways), he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast them into the fire and they are burned."
John 15:2
John 15:6

 

[GEN2REV]

We don’t clean ourselves up,and then invite Him in....We invite Him In and HE does the cleaning up.....

Can we not invite Him in AND clean ourselves up, utilizing His help?

It's kinda the commitment that proves our sincerity.

The idea that we say "Hey, God I'll be a Christian if you come on over here and clean up this mess." and then just drop our heap of a messed up life in His lap and go right back to what we were doing and don't change a thing ... is sincerely laughable.

But that's what most Christians do. You're right.

 

[stunnedbygrace]

Sorry, sorry, sorry. I see a general trend here of those who are of the opinion that believers are not being pushed hard enough to turn faith into something else (often including cleaner cups). Backed up by the threat of flames. Even your friend has said as much. It was not fair of me to include you into that broader category. Please accept my humble apologies.

I know it looks like that is being said. It looks to you like self effort is what you are being pushed to. But really, the man is saying more grace is available to us here and now even though we aren’t taught this is so. You have to determine what a man is talking about. Then, you have to determine if the man is talking about something he has actually experienced or if he’s just rattling on in weakness. If you are being encouraged to more trust, that’s good. If you aren’t, just set the man aside. At least for now. Either that or question him to see if he even HAS the answers for the questions you have. I happen to know this certain man does, and if you understand me after you question me, you should know, this man taught me a lot of what I know and kicked down a lot of the doors holding me back. He taught me, with scripture, that God makes a place for holy men and ALSO for righteous men. He taught me to stay humble and honest and that if I did, I would be safe. So either question him or leave him alone for now, but I, for one, am very grateful God gave him to me. I’m so grateful that I’m in tears of gratitude to God as I type.

 

[Pearl]

There is saying: 'Leopards can't change their spots' and it's like that for sinners - only god can change a person and make them a new creation. We have to be willing to let him work in us but we can't do it for ourselves however hard we try.

 

[Lambano]

I know it looks like that is being said. It looks to you like self effort is what you are being pushed to. But really, the man is saying more grace is available to us here and now even though we aren’t taught this is so. You have to determine what a man is talking about. Then, you have to determine if the man is talking about something he has actually experienced or if he’s just rattling on in weakness. If you are being encouraged to more trust, that’s good. If you aren’t, just set the man aside. At least for now. Either that or question him to see if he even HAS the answers for the questions you have. I happen to know this certain man does, and if you understand me after you question me, you should know, this man taught me a lot of what I know and kicked down a lot of the doors holding me back. He taught me, with scripture, that God makes a place for holy men and ALSO for righteous men. He taught me to stay humble and honest and that if I did, I would be safe. So either question him or leave him alone for now, but I, for one, am very grateful God gave him to me. I’m so grateful that I’m in tears of gratitude to God as I type.

Understood.

 

[marks]

It’s power to us and for us. The power to escape our three enemies - the world, the flesh and the devil, and to have power over them so they can no longer control and batter us by appealing to our passions, will, emotions.

Grace is God's favor. The power is Christ. God gives us grace in forgiving our sins, and gives us Christ freeing us from our sins.

Much love!

 

[marks]

You also know my understanding that the "will do it" part may be deferred post-resurrection. While it is highly desirable that addictions, besetting sins, and such be healed in this life (and praise God, sometimes they are), we have to continue to trust (I have to continue to trust), even when we don't see evidence of healing coming. I know you disagree with me on this point, but I think you know why I have to trust this. And why I encourage others who also don't see healing coming to trust also and not become discouraged.

"My grace is sufficient for you." (2 Corinthians 12:9)

"Now faith is the assurance of things hoped for, the conviction of things not seen." (Hebrews 11:1)

"If we have hoped in Christ in this life only, we are of all men most to be pitied." (1 Corinthians 15:19)

Maybe it's too fine a disctinction for some to see, but in fact we DO walk by faith, not sight.

Much love!

 

[marks]

Nor can the Saved man ( ever hear about the “ Sins of Omission?” ) without Grace and plenty of it we are both helpless and hopeless .....it’s best that you find some of that Grace ....obtain it by Resting in the Gospel Of Grace—- 1Cor15:1-4

If we are real about it . . . every moment that we are not filled with love for God, and love for others, this is sin. Some people only consider their short list of things they don't like in themselves, or someone else, that's sin. Sin is anything the flesh does apart from faith in God.

Much love!

 

[marks]

if the man is talking about something he has actually experienced or if he’s just rattling on in weakness.

Rather, if what he's talking about is actually Biblical. Experience is so very often misunderstood. And it's subjective. All things compared to Scripture.

Much love!

 

[marks]

Bitter and sweet are not to flow from the same source.

 

[stunnedbygrace]

Rather, if what he's talking about is actually Biblical.

It certainly is.
Men just don’t like to listen to ALL the words of Jesus. Some of them seem bitter to them.

 

[stunnedbygrace]

Bitter and sweet are not to flow from the same source.

Perhaps the problem is your palate.

 

[marks]

Perhaps the problem is your palate.

Perhaps the problem is the spigot.

 

[marks]

It certainly is.

So say we all!