Understanding the 'Little Horn' power of Prophecy in Daniel.

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Jay Ross

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The claim is that the papacy is the Antichrist. So how does the papacy match the above sea beast, and how does the Papacy meet the criteria for being a replacement for Christ on earth? A counterfeit?

There are many "antichrists" operating within the "Church" today. To single out one particular branch of the Church as being the antichrist of these present times is where the problem lies. Many denominations have false teachings which takes peoples' hearts away from worshiping God and as such they are an antichrist within those denominations at this present time.

However, the Antichrist pointed to in the Book of Revelations, is still a distant future Antichrist who is not seen in full until He is released from the bottomless pit just over 1,000 years from now. To claim that the papacy is still going to exist in 1,000 years times is a claim that I would not hang my hat upon.

At Armageddon, when the kings of the earth are judged, the person who holds the role of the papacy will be judged on behalf of the RCC because of the RCC's role in trampling God's Sanctuary and God's earthly hosts and will be imprisoned in the Bottomless pit for 1,000 years.
At the same time the Heavenly hosts will be judged, and they too will be gathered with the judged kings of the earth and also imprisoned in the Bottomless pit for 1,000 years.

The imprisoned kings of the earth are the first to rise up out of the Bottomless pit and they have five months to trouble the people who have chosen not to worship God. After the five-month period of their activity on the face of the earth the judged kings of the earth are not spoken about again in the Book of Revelation. After the kings of the earth the judged heavenly hosts take centre stage in what happens next. The heavenly hosts as Satan, the Beast and the Little Horn, who is also labelled as the False Prophet then begin to do their thing over the time span of the little while period. It is out of the heavenly hosts that the Antichrist will come from to be worshipped. The Antichrist is not found within the judged kings of the earth.

But I have formed this view because I do not believe that the beasts of Daniel 7 influencing the people who chose to live within their respective dominions to manifest the beasts in their actions on the face of the earth, are human at all but are fallen rebelling heavenly hosts.

The Bible when read and understood informs of this. History only tells us when the human manifestation of the four respective beasts are occurring through history.

I believe that many within the RCC still believe that Christ is the Son of God and do not bow down to worship the pope as such or Mary or the many Saints that have been created.

Brakelite, there is within your usual rhetoric in your posts, a displayed hatred of the RCC and the Pope in particular.

I do not hate the SDA people on this forum. I only have a sadness for their disillusionment. This sadness is also expressed for the Pre-trib contingent within the board's members for their errors in what they believe.

Sadly, I am often relegated to the wilderness by many of the board's members because I hold to a very different paradigm to them.

One day we should meet and have a coffee or smoothie and meet face to face.

Goodbye
 
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Brakelite

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@Jay
Hi. You seem to put a lot of emphasis on the 'many antichrists' that John wrote about that were living among the Christians of his day. These were obviously individuals who taught and believed one or more heresies regarding the human or divine nature of Christ. They therefore certainly did meet the criteria for being an antichrist.
However, prophecy gives us much more detail than just one or two points of difference between the truth and error of the nature of Christ. As others have pointed out to you, there is the time factor. There is the political and social milieu of the times. There are certain characteristics of the principle Antichrist that no others could possibly own. This means that yes, there is only one principle Antichrist that John, Paul, Daniel, and others wrote about that was future to them. Those criteria it will be discovered, cannot be met by an individual. One individual could not live long enough to accomplish all that was required. Not even a succession of individuals could do it. But a system set up by a succession of individuals, such as the papacy, could, and did, meet every...single... Aspect of all the criteria that prophecy and scripture demands. One other point. It wasn't only the reformers who had eyes on prophecy looking for the Antichrist. Many of the early church leaders also knew that perhaps even in their lifetime, something or someone was about to come who would disrupt everything and turn Christianity on its head. Of course, their understanding was limited. They would have read where the angel said to Daniel, shut up the book until the time of the end. They could see one or two truths, and thought they were living in the time of the end. But couldn't see the big picture. Here's some quotes...
 

Brakelite

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Tertullian (160-240)
“‘For the mystery of iniquity doth already work; only he who now hinders must hinder, until he be taken out of the way.’ What obstacle is there but the Roman state, the falling away of which, by being scattered into ten kingdoms, shall introduce Antichrist upon (its
own ruins)? ‘And then shall be revealed the wicked one.”

“On the Resurrection of the Flesh,” chapter 24; Ante-Nicene Fathers, vol. III, p. 563

There is some debate as to whether the ‘falling away’ referred to here is in reference to the empire, or the church. Some say one, some the other, while some would contend that it can apply equally to both. This author contends that the falling away [spoken of by Paul in 2 Thess. 2:3] is in reference to the church, although when considered in reference to the state, it doesn’t do violence to the passage. The falling away of the church transpired when she aspired to political power at the expense of spiritual, thus committing spiritual adultery. (see Revelation 17:2; James 4:4) Either way, Tertullian was certain in his belief that the restrainer was the Roman Empire. That it was pagan Rome itself that inhibited in some way the rise of the antichrist. This was generally accepted throughout the church at that time, and it was common for the church to pray to God that He would keep the Roman power intact in order to keep the antichrist from coming to power in their time. So the consensus among church leaders of that time was that the moment pagan Rome disappeared, the Antichrist would then be free to rule.

Elsewhere, Tertullian states:

“The very end of all things threatening dreadful woes is only retarded by the continued existence of the Roman Empire.”
(“Apology,” chapter 32; Ante-Nicene Fathers, Vol. III, p. 43).

Lactanctius, in the early 4th century wrote:
“The subject itself declares that the fall and ruin of the world will shortly take place; except that while the city of Rome remains, it appears that nothing of this kind is to be feared. But when that capital of the world shall have fallen, and shall have begun to be a street, which the Sibyls say shall come to pass, who can doubt that the end has now arrived to the affairs of men and the whole world? It is that city, that only, which still sustains all things.” (“The Divine Institutes,” book 7, chapter 25; Ante-Nicene Fathers, vol. VII, p. 220).

Cyril of Jerusalem (318-386).

But this aforesaid Antichrist is to come when the times of the Roman empire have been fulfilled and the end of the world is drawing near. There shall rise up together ten kings of the Romans, reigning in different parts perhaps, but all about the same time; but after those, an eleventh, the Antichrist, who by his magic craft will seize upon the Roman power, and of the kings who reigned before him, “three he shall humble” and the remaining seven he shall keep in subjection to himself.”
(Catechetical Lectures,” section 15, on II Thessalonians 2:4; Nicene and Post-Nicene Fathers, vol. VII, p. 108 [New York: The Christian Literature Company, 1895]).

Much could be said about this quote; he also is clearly linking the prophecy of Daniel to the text of Paul’s, agreeing with other eminent writers of his time that out of Rome would evolve ten kings, 3 of whom the antichrist would subdue. When the restrainer, Rome, was to be taken out of the way, and the horns of Daniel 7 arise, the antichrist would be revealed

Ambrose (died 398)
“After the falling or decay of the Roman Empire, Antichrist shall appear.”

(Quoted in, Bishop Thomas Newton, Dissertations on the Prophecies, p. 463)……

Chrysostum (died 407)
“When the Roman Empire is taken out of the way, then he [the Antichrist] shall come. And naturally. For as long as the fear of this empire lasts, no one will willingly exalt himself, but when that is dissolved, he will attack the anarchy, and endeavor to seize upon the government both of man and of God.”
“Homily IV on 2 Thessalonians 2:6-9,” Nicene and Post-Nicene Fathers, vol. XIII, p. 389
[New York: Charles Scribner’s and Sons, 1905]…..

…..and finally Jerome (died 420)
“He that letteth is taken out of the way, and yet we do not realize that Antichrist is near.”
(Letter to Ageruchia, written about 409A. D. Letter 123, section 16; Nicene and Post-Nicene Fathers, vol. VI, p. 236

Jerome’s testimony is interesting, because from his perspective, he had seen and witnessed the fall of Rome, but was yet to see the rise of Antichrist. The reason is that history had not yet revealed who the Antichrist actually was, despite the early beginnings of the church of Rome at that time. The 3 nations had yet to be vanquished: It was this event that would definitively prove the Antichrist’s identity.

I think it would be a good time to quote a Catholic source, the eminent historian Cardinal Manning.

“Now the abandonment of Rome was the liberation of the pontiffs. Whatsoever claims to obedience the emperors may have made, and whatsoever compliance the Pontiff may have yielded, the whole previous relation, anomalous, and annulled again and again by the vices and outrages of the emperors, was finally dissolved by a higher power. The providence of God permitted a succession of irruptions, Gothic, Lombard, and Hungarian, to desolate Italy, and to efface from it every remnant of the empire.
The pontiffs found themselves alone, the sole fountains of order, peace, law, and safety. And from the hour of this providential liberation, when, by a divine intervention, the chains fell off from the hands of the successor of St. Peter, as once before from his own, no sovereign has ever reigned in Rome except the Vicar of Jesus Christ.”
(Henry Edward Manning, The Temporal Power of The Vicar of Jesus Christ, Preface, pp. xxviii, xxix. London: Burns and Lambert, 1862).

Manning has clearly given an excellent summary of history which directly correlates with the prophecies of Daniel and Paul. While attributing the fall of Rome to God and the rise of the papacy to Him also, Manning seems oblivious to the fact that he is revealing the perfect fulfilment of the prophecy of Paul and Daniel. That when Rome fell, the ten nations arose, three were subdued, and the ultimate victor was the papacy! It was the papacy itself that the empire of Rome was restraining. It was the papacy that arose after the establishment of the ten horns. It was the papacy that had a major role in the subjugation of the 3 horns because being Arian in belief they were directly opposed to the rule of the pontiffs. It will be the papacy that will still be here at the second coming, when Paul says she will be destroyed by the “brightness of His coming”. Therefore it is the papacy which perfectly fulfils the criteria demanded of it in order to be identified as the Antichrist. And that my friends are precisely the reasons all non-Roman Bible commentators from the time of the 6th century on were almost unanimous in identifying the papacy as the man of sin. The power who entered the church (the temple of God) and by claiming the power to forgive sin, and shut out of heaven whom he will, and claiming universal spiritual and temporal authority over all the earth, thus claiming the prerogatives of God, “opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, showing himself that he is God.”
 
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Brakelite

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Isa 14:12-14 How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! how art thou cut down to the ground, that didst weaken the nations! For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God; and I will also sit upon the mount of congregation, in the uttermost parts of the north; I will ascend above the heights of the clouds;
I will be like the Most High.
Here we have a revelation into the heart and mind of Satan. We are here given insight into his most cherished ambition; to be like God, therefore to receive the worship, adoration and fidelity of his subjects. If anyone has any doubt as to whether Satan still cherishes this particular ambition, one need look no further than the temptation of Christ in order to confirm this. Satan offered Jesus all the kingdoms of the earth and their glory, if only Jesus would fall down and worship him. Imagine, the Creator worshipping His creation!!! Although Satan failed in that particular exercise, he has not failed when it comes to enticing man to worship him. I am not speaking here of those who are involved in the occult, or in Satanic rites. No, no. I am speaking of people who consider themselves Christians, those who sincerely believe and are convinced they are worshipping God. Allow me to explain.Satan already has the fidelity and loyalty of those in the world, whether they are aware of that or not. And because they are already his, his attention is directed more toward those who have decided, or are in the process or danger of deciding, against him. The church is the particular focus of the arch deceiver, especially in these last days.Re 12:17 And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.Satan can not enter the church of course and introduce himself and make a polite request that the congregation worship him. He knows that will not work; we know that will not work; such an attempt would be met with a less than favourable response. Therefore, in order to gain the advantage over those who believe in God, he must use deception. The apostle Paul alluded to this very thing when he wrote:
2 Thess. 2:3-10. Let no man deceive you by any means; for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition; who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, showing himself that he is God. Remember ye not, that when I was with you, I told you of these things? And now ye know what with-holdeth, that he might be revealed in his time. For the mystery of iniquity doth already work; only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way. And then shall that wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the Spirit of His mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of His coming.
Reading to this point, and comparing these verses with the one quoted from Isaiah above, one would be forgiven for thinking that Satan has competition. Someone else vying for the top spot adoration of man. But let us read further;…..

Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders, and with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish, because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved.

“Whose coming is after the working of Satan!!?” Not competition, but his own child! Here is Satan’s baby. Here is that creation of his which enters the church (the temple of God is the church in the NT) and in his place accepts man’s worship by proclaiming himself God, but it is in fact Satan who receives the ultimate glory.

Satan could not himself enter the church, but he could very easily use someone else to do that for him, and through him, receive the worship he desires. By misrepresenting God, and introducing a counterfeit God and a counterfeit religion to worship that God, Satan has deceived millions. Allow me to make a point regarding deception, using counterfeit money as an example. People are not deceived into believing that it is acceptable in the eyes of the authorities to use counterfeit money. The deception operates by way of blinding the people that it is a counterfeit. It is fake, but they believe it to be real. It is the same with religion. Satan would deceive very few into thinking that it is acceptable to God for man to worship Satan. But he has had resounding success in deceiving many into thinking and believing they are worshipping God, when in fact they are worshipping Satan. (See Revelation 13:4)

How does this work? Jesus explained it very clearly throughout His ministry, warning us repeatedly of false Christs and false prophets. Important to notice that if there be a false Christ then his followers must surely be false Christians. The expression ‘antichrist’ means that precisely; “one who stands in the place of Christ”. Therefore the followers of antichrist must also be professing Christians, the antichrist being the counterfeit of the true Christ, and his followers deceived into believing they are worshipping the true.

Jesus alluded to this very thing here;

Matt. 15:9. But in vain do they worship Me, teaching for commandments the doctrines of men.

Notice here that Jesus was not saying these people were not worshipping, they were just not worshipping Him!

Most would be also familiar with the following;
Matthew 7:21-23 Not every one that saith unto Me Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of My Father in heaven. Many will say to Me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? And in thy name done many wonderful works? And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from Me, ye that work iniquity.
Now if Jesus didn’t know them, it would be fairly safe to conclude that they didn’t know Him. They were doing all manner of religious stuff, including one would presume worship, but it certainly wasn’t Jesus they were worshipping, even though they believed it was, and when they came face to face with Him, called Him Lord!!!!
So who was it they were worshipping? Let us look at

Romans 6:16 Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey…
According to this text, we are servants to whoever we obey. Regardless of our profession, it is in our acts that define who we worship. As Jesus said, in vain do they worship Him, when they obey the commandments of men which override the commandments and doctrines of God. And later, as we just saw, only those who do the will of the Father will be entering the kingdom of heaven. How eternally important is doctrine! How essential it is to understand truth!!! How critical it is that we be absolutely assured that what teachings we follow are based on sound Biblical truth rather than the teachings, interpretations, or traditions of man.
Doctrine is an integral part of worship. Jesus is here telling us that the creator of the doctrine is the object of our worship, regardless of the intent, sincere or otherwise, of the worshipper. It is through false doctrine that Satan has deceived millions into believing they are worshipping God when in fact they are worshipping him.
 
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Brakelite

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It is through false teaching...doctrines that are the invention of Satan and taught by man, that Satan has established his counterfeit God, and his counterfeit religion of worshipping that god.The book of Revelation reveals this to us clearly. The true things of God have Satanic counterparts. There is a false trinity; the dragon, sea-beast (antichrist) and false prophet. This false trinity has a false message (Revel 16:13) – a counterfeit of the true 3 angels messages, the everlasting gospel, of Revel. 14:6-12. The false trinity is associated with a false city, Babylon. This city, like the New Jerusalem, has a river, and is called ‘great’. (18:10). The antichrist himself is a counterfeit Christ. Jesus proclaimed His threefold ministry in Matthew 12:6,41,42. He proclaimed Himself as the ultimate Priest, Prophet, and King, and rightly so. However, there is an entity living upon the earth as we speak who also claims, falsely, these very same prerogatives, and claims them to be his universal right. By claiming to be the sole arbiter and interpreter of scripture, by claiming the power to forgive sin, by claiming universal authority in religious matters, (thus subverting Christ’s ministry of High priest); by claiming the power to change God’s times and laws,and claiming the sole right to speak upon the earth as God’s representative, and claiming the right to judge who does or does not enter the kingdom of God, (thus subverting role as Prophet), by claiming the right and seeking secular authority over all the earth, (thus subverting Christ’s role as King) the Catholic Church has indeed “opposed and exalted himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped, so that he as God sits in the temple of God, (the church), showing himself that he is God.” The messages themselves also have parallels. Both the true and the false are designed to gather people together to their makers; the false to Satan,(Revel. 16:14), the true to Jesus (Revel. 14:7). Both are also designed to go to all mankind (Revel 14:6; 16:14.) It is no coincidence that the true message, that of Revel. 14:6-12, is focused on worshipping God, the Creator of all things. Right throughout the book of Revelation, we are confronted by worship. In particular we see in Rev. 13 several references to the deceptive practices of the antichrist and the false prophet, through whom Satan deceives the whole world, resulting in false worship. In contrast, the true worshippers are described as those who keep God’s commandments. (Revel. 12: 17; 14:12.) See how neatly all this falls in with Jesus's declaration that those who enter heaven must be obeying God, doing the will of the Father. Elsewhere Jesus said “If ye love Me, keep My commandments.”
With this in mind, and remembering Romans 6:16, the big question is, and the one we must all ask ourselves if we are to have any assurance of eternal life, is, whose commandments are they which I am surrendered to? Who am I obeying? Many hold the word of God as the authority in religious matters. Others, a combination of scripture and tradition, and others, the church. Many churches today don’t even teach doctrine any more, as they think because it tends to divide, then they must avoid it. Mega churches have been built on this premise. If they don’t study doctrine however how can they discern the real from the false? Doctrine matters. Our eternal destiny hinges on our correct understanding of Biblical truth. Of course the RCC teaches that they have the inherent right to decide what true doctrine is and what is false, by referring to the traditions handed down from the church fathers. Many of those traditions however, are in direct contradiction to the revealed word of God as shown in scripture. Truth is progressive. It builds on foundations already established, but nowhere must it contradict what God has previously been pleased to reveal to His people through His word. An example of one surrendering to false teaching and suffering as a result is found in 1 Kings 13:1-34. Believing the lie brought to him by a false prophet did not excuse the unnamed man of God from Judea for his disobedience.The teachings of churches, ecclesiastical institutions such as seminaries and Bible colleges, or church councils be they great or small, are valid only in as much as they agree with scripture. All else is vain.

The reformers were discovering truths hidden and obscured for centuries by the church. Being progressive, truth took some time to come to the light. Several hundred years in fact, and several denominations later. Sadly, the former reformers' followers denounced the new teachings that the Holy Spirit was bringing to light through later reformers, and the churches that were founded on the reformers stagnated and never grew. Today, the reformation goes on. We must always be ready and willing to receive new light regarding truth, but only inasmuch as it agrees with scripture.

So why was it that the reformers were willing to risk so much in their denunciation of the papal church? Truth. They came to a point in their lives when error was no longer to be tolerated. The word of God, the Bible, became the foundation of faith and practice, and although the whole truth had not yet been revealed to them, they were willing to risk their lives in defence of what light they had.
 
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covenantee

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Tertullian (160-240)
“‘For the mystery of iniquity doth already work; only he who now hinders must hinder, until he be taken out of the way.’ What obstacle is there but the Roman state, the falling away of which, by being scattered into ten kingdoms, shall introduce Antichrist upon (its
own ruins)? ‘And then shall be revealed the wicked one.”

“On the Resurrection of the Flesh,” chapter 24; Ante-Nicene Fathers, vol. III, p. 563

There is some debate as to whether the ‘falling away’ referred to here is in reference to the empire, or the church. Some say one, some the other, while some would contend that it can apply equally to both. This author contends that the falling away [spoken of by Paul in 2 Thess. 2:3] is in reference to the church, although when considered in reference to the state, it doesn’t do violence to the passage. The falling away of the church transpired when she aspired to political power at the expense of spiritual, thus committing spiritual adultery. (see Revelation 17:2; James 4:4) Either way, Tertullian was certain in his belief that the restrainer was the Roman Empire. That it was pagan Rome itself that inhibited in some way the rise of the antichrist. This was generally accepted throughout the church at that time, and it was common for the church to pray to God that He would keep the Roman power intact in order to keep the antichrist from coming to power in their time. So the consensus among church leaders of that time was that the moment pagan Rome disappeared, the Antichrist would then be free to rule.

Elsewhere, Tertullian states:

“The very end of all things threatening dreadful woes is only retarded by the continued existence of the Roman Empire.”
(“Apology,” chapter 32; Ante-Nicene Fathers, Vol. III, p. 43).

Lactanctius, in the early 4th century wrote:
“The subject itself declares that the fall and ruin of the world will shortly take place; except that while the city of Rome remains, it appears that nothing of this kind is to be feared. But when that capital of the world shall have fallen, and shall have begun to be a street, which the Sibyls say shall come to pass, who can doubt that the end has now arrived to the affairs of men and the whole world? It is that city, that only, which still sustains all things.” (“The Divine Institutes,” book 7, chapter 25; Ante-Nicene Fathers, vol. VII, p. 220).

Cyril of Jerusalem (318-386).

But this aforesaid Antichrist is to come when the times of the Roman empire have been fulfilled and the end of the world is drawing near. There shall rise up together ten kings of the Romans, reigning in different parts perhaps, but all about the same time; but after those, an eleventh, the Antichrist, who by his magic craft will seize upon the Roman power, and of the kings who reigned before him, “three he shall humble” and the remaining seven he shall keep in subjection to himself.”
(Catechetical Lectures,” section 15, on II Thessalonians 2:4; Nicene and Post-Nicene Fathers, vol. VII, p. 108 [New York: The Christian Literature Company, 1895]).

Much could be said about this quote; he also is clearly linking the prophecy of Daniel to the text of Paul’s, agreeing with other eminent writers of his time that out of Rome would evolve ten kings, 3 of whom the antichrist would subdue. When the restrainer, Rome, was to be taken out of the way, and the horns of Daniel 7 arise, the antichrist would be revealed

Ambrose (died 398)
“After the falling or decay of the Roman Empire, Antichrist shall appear.”

(Quoted in, Bishop Thomas Newton, Dissertations on the Prophecies, p. 463)……

Chrysostum (died 407)
“When the Roman Empire is taken out of the way, then he [the Antichrist] shall come. And naturally. For as long as the fear of this empire lasts, no one will willingly exalt himself, but when that is dissolved, he will attack the anarchy, and endeavor to seize upon the government both of man and of God.”
“Homily IV on 2 Thessalonians 2:6-9,” Nicene and Post-Nicene Fathers, vol. XIII, p. 389
[New York: Charles Scribner’s and Sons, 1905]…..

…..and finally Jerome (died 420)
“He that letteth is taken out of the way, and yet we do not realize that Antichrist is near.”
(Letter to Ageruchia, written about 409A. D. Letter 123, section 16; Nicene and Post-Nicene Fathers, vol. VI, p. 236

Jerome’s testimony is interesting, because from his perspective, he had seen and witnessed the fall of Rome, but was yet to see the rise of Antichrist. The reason is that history had not yet revealed who the Antichrist actually was, despite the early beginnings of the church of Rome at that time. The 3 nations had yet to be vanquished: It was this event that would definitively prove the Antichrist’s identity.

I think it would be a good time to quote a Catholic source, the eminent historian Cardinal Manning.

“Now the abandonment of Rome was the liberation of the pontiffs. Whatsoever claims to obedience the emperors may have made, and whatsoever compliance the Pontiff may have yielded, the whole previous relation, anomalous, and annulled again and again by the vices and outrages of the emperors, was finally dissolved by a higher power. The providence of God permitted a succession of irruptions, Gothic, Lombard, and Hungarian, to desolate Italy, and to efface from it every remnant of the empire.
The pontiffs found themselves alone, the sole fountains of order, peace, law, and safety. And from the hour of this providential liberation, when, by a divine intervention, the chains fell off from the hands of the successor of St. Peter, as once before from his own, no sovereign has ever reigned in Rome except the Vicar of Jesus Christ.”
(Henry Edward Manning, The Temporal Power of The Vicar of Jesus Christ, Preface, pp. xxviii, xxix. London: Burns and Lambert, 1862).

Manning has clearly given an excellent summary of history which directly correlates with the prophecies of Daniel and Paul. While attributing the fall of Rome to God and the rise of the papacy to Him also, Manning seems oblivious to the fact that he is revealing the perfect fulfilment of the prophecy of Paul and Daniel. That when Rome fell, the ten nations arose, three were subdued, and the ultimate victor was the papacy! It was the papacy itself that the empire of Rome was restraining. It was the papacy that arose after the establishment of the ten horns. It was the papacy that had a major role in the subjugation of the 3 horns because being Arian in belief they were directly opposed to the rule of the pontiffs. It will be the papacy that will still be here at the second coming, when Paul says she will be destroyed by the “brightness of His coming”. Therefore it is the papacy which perfectly fulfils the criteria demanded of it in order to be identified as the Antichrist. And that my friends are precisely the reasons all non-Roman Bible commentators from the time of the 6th century on were almost unanimous in identifying the papacy as the man of sin. The power who entered the church (the temple of God) and by claiming the power to forgive sin, and shut out of heaven whom he will, and claiming universal spiritual and temporal authority over all the earth, thus claiming the prerogatives of God, “opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, showing himself that he is God.”
JR disbelieves:
  1. All the names which in the Scripture are applied to Christ, by virtue of which it is established that He is over the church, all the same names are applied to the Pope.” Robert Cardinal Bellarmine, De Conciliorum Auctoriatate (On the Authority of the Councils) Bk 2, chap. 17
  2. “The pope is of so great dignity and so exalted that he is not mere man, but as it were God, and the vicar of God. He is the divine monarch and supreme emperor, and king of kings. Hence the pope is crowned with a triple crown, as King of heaven and of earth and of the lower regions.” Lucius Ferraris, Prompta Bibliotheca, vol.6, art. “Papa II”
  3. “We hold upon this earth the place of God Almighty.” Pope Leo XIII, in an encyclical letter dated June 20, 1894, The Great Encyclical Letters of Leo XIII, p. 304.
His disbelief is deliberate and intentional.

But it is necessary in order to contort Scripture and history to align with his ideology.
 

Jay Ross

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@Jay
Hi. You seem to put a lot of emphasis on the 'many antichrists' that John wrote about that were living among the Christians of his day. These were obviously individuals who taught and believed one or more heresies regarding the human or divine nature of Christ. They therefore certainly did meet the criteria for being an antichrist.
However, prophecy gives us much more detail than just one or two points of difference between the truth and error of the nature of Christ. As others have pointed out to you, there is the time factor. There is the political and social milieu of the times. There are certain characteristics of the principle Antichrist that no others could possibly own. This means that yes, there is only one principle Antichrist that John, Paul, Daniel, and others wrote about that was future to them. Those criteria it will be discovered, cannot be met by an individual. One individual could not live long enough to accomplish all that was required. Not even a succession of individuals could do it. But a system set up by a succession of individuals, such as the papacy, could, and did, meet every...single...

Somewhere in your multiple post dissertation, your words stopped, and plagiarism took over without you acknowledging the source from which you cut and posted into posts under your name.

It seems that you have quoted the SDA Sunday School teachings on the subject of the Little Horn and the beasts.

So why was it that the reformers were willing to risk so much in their denunciation of the papal church? Truth. They came to a point in their lives when error was no longer to be tolerated. The word of God, the Bible, became the foundation of faith and practice, and although the whole truth had not yet been revealed to them, they were willing to risk their lives in defence of what light they had.

It seems that today we have a fresh need to establish God's truth with respect to Daniel 2's statue prophecy and the Beast prophecies in Daniel 7 and 8.

Why were the heavenly hosts being Judged in heaven? Because though their influences over people groups, kingdoms, nations and empires, they were responsible for causing the trampling of God's Sanctuary and His Earthly Hosts, over a period of some 2,300 years, which will end, in my humble opinion, in around 20 years' time.

Now I have stopped my reliance on Biblical commentaries to bring understanding and now rely on what God is revealing to me through His written words in the Bible, often just from the original texts that I have access to.

Brakelite your plagiarism of someone else's writing without being prepared to acknowledge the source of the documents that you quoted speaks volumes as to the unreliability of the information that you have provided, even though they original source documents were correctly quoted.

Also, your usual "fact" inclusions in your posts were missing as well.

Shalom.
 

Jay Ross

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JR disbelieves:
  1. All the names which in the Scripture are applied to Christ, by virtue of which it is established that He is over the church, all the same names are applied to the Pope.” Robert Cardinal Bellarmine, De Conciliorum Auctoriatate (On the Authority of the Councils) Bk 2, chap. 17
  2. “The pope is of so great dignity and so exalted that he is not mere man, but as it were God, and the vicar of God. He is the divine monarch and supreme emperor, and king of kings. Hence the pope is crowned with a triple crown, as King of heaven and of earth and of the lower regions.” Lucius Ferraris, Prompta Bibliotheca, vol.6, art. “Papa II”
  3. “We hold upon this earth the place of God Almighty.” Pope Leo XIII, in an encyclical letter dated June 20, 1894, The Great Encyclical Letters of Leo XIII, p. 304.
His disbelief is deliberate and intentional.

But it is necessary in order to contort Scripture and history to align with his ideology.

Sadly, you are presenting as facts, things that I have never stated, on this forum. This is a false argument that speaks volumes as to the basic errors in scriptural understanding that you support.

Thanks for posting to show the lies that you will resort too, to win an argument.

Goodbye
 
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covenantee

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Sadly, you are presenting as facts, things that I have never stated, on this forum. This is a false argument that speaks volumes as to the basic errors in scriptural understanding that you support.

Thanks for posting to show the lies that you will resort too, to win an argument.

Goodbye
Do you not believe that the apostate papacy has made those claims about itself?

The attribution follows each claim.
 

Phoneman777

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Not in the one verse where currently there were many antichrists but a singular AC was yet to come.

Car and cars aren't interchangeable.
It is you, not John, who makes the distinction between "currently regular evil antichrists" and "future super evil antichrist man".

John is simply saying the evil that the people were told is coming has already arrived - and then goes on to describe the false ideas they preach...which are precisely what the papacy preaches, which is why for over 300 solid years, the Protestant world identified the papacy as the "antichrist/beast/man of sin/whore of Babylon/little horn of prophecy.
They aren't. You have created this fallacy so you can deny a singular AC and insert an organization instead. Classic eisegesis driven by doctrinal bias.
The Jesuits created the false idea of a "future one-man antichrist" in order to conceal from public view the papacy as being the fulfilment of the prophesied antichrist, which idea was unknown to the world before Protestant Historicism began attacking the antichrist in Rome.

The most effective soldier in any army isn't the bravest or most cunning in the ranks, but the incompetent fool on the other side who ignorantly aids and abbeds the very enemy that wants him destroyed.
Don't falsely accuse people of being part of a denomination they aren't a part of. Do you want to be accused of being a Jesuit because you accept their teachings about what the mark is?
I call it like I see it. You are a Jesuit Futurist who passionately defends the papacy's guilt of being antichrist, despite being shown time and time again the Biblical evidence which condemns it as such.
 

Phoneman777

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Sadly, you are presenting as facts, things that I have never stated, on this forum. This is a false argument that speaks volumes as to the basic errors in scriptural understanding that you support.

Thanks for posting to show the lies that you will resort too, to win an argument.

Goodbye
To accuse others of "false argument" while arguing that Babylon would be rebuilt despite God's word to the contrary is about as incredible as AOC arguing that $174,000/year isn't enough pay.
 

Phoneman777

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To those reading this is a partial definition. It's the "anti" that can mean in place of but it also can mean opposed to.

1Jn 2:18 Little children, it is the last time: and as ye have heard that antichrist shall come, even now are there many antichrists; whereby we know that it is the last time.

G500
ἀντίχριστος
antichristos
an-tee'-khris-tos
From G473 and G5547; an opponent of the Messiah: - antichrist.
Total KJV occurrences: 5


G473
ἀντί
anti
an-tee'
A primary particle; opposite, that is, instead or because of (rarely in addition to): - for, in the room of. Often used in composition to denote contrast, requital, substitution, correspondence, etc.
Total KJV occurrences: 22


G473
ἀντί
anti
Thayer Definition:
1) over against, opposite to, before
2) for, instead of, in place of (something)

2a) instead of
2b) for
2c) for that, because
2d) wherefore, for this cause
Part of Speech: preposition
A Related Word by Thayer’s/Strong’s Number: a primary particle
Thanks for clarifying that ONE WHO THINKS THEY TAKE THE PLACE OF GOD ALMIGHTY IS "OPPOSED TO" GOD.

Really, how else would we have known?
 

Phoneman777

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Goodbye troll
You misspelled "gatekeeper of truth".

Look to the papacy in Rome for the troll, who's confident all Jesuit Futurists will pay his "Mark" toll...or else.
 
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ewq1938

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Was slain (13:3)

Resurrected (13:3)


No. Not slain nor resurrected. Was wounded, and there would have been a death but the wound was healed. The head spoken about is a mountain anyways not a person. This was a symbolic wound that healed in a symbolic way.
 

ewq1938

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I call it like I see it. You are a Jesuit Futurist who passionately defends the papacy's guilt of being antichrist, despite being shown time and time again the Biblical evidence which condemns it as such.


You are a verbal tyrant and may God punish you for it. Goodbye.
 

Douggg

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The little horn in Daniel 7 and 8 emerges as the first stage of the person who goes through 5 stages on the way to his demise. The little horn person is not the Pope, nor office of the Pope.

Those five stages are...

1, the little horn - leader over ten EU leaders.
2. the prince who shall come - into the middle east following the Gog/Magog event.
3. the Antichrist -anointed the King of Israel, thought-to-be messiah of the Jews.
4. the revealed man of sin - revealed not to be the messiah of the Jews. End of his Antichrist stage, phony King of Israel.
5. the beast-king - brought back to life after being killed. Becomes dictator of the EU, kingdom of the beast-king.
 

Phoneman777

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You are a verbal tyrant and may God punish you for it. Goodbye.
Because I spit nothing but facts?

Jesuit Futurism was unknown to the world before the 16th century, and was thought up as a countermeasure to Protestant Historicism which was tearing the papacy apart!

A "beast" is a kingdom, not a singular man as you claim. The "man of sin" is no more refers to a "singular man" than does Paul's "man of God" which he says is to "perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works".

If you don't like being called a Jesuit Futurist, then stop promoting Jesuit Futurism, deal?
 

Hobie

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JR disbelieves:
  1. All the names which in the Scripture are applied to Christ, by virtue of which it is established that He is over the church, all the same names are applied to the Pope.” Robert Cardinal Bellarmine, De Conciliorum Auctoriatate (On the Authority of the Councils) Bk 2, chap. 17
  2. “The pope is of so great dignity and so exalted that he is not mere man, but as it were God, and the vicar of God. He is the divine monarch and supreme emperor, and king of kings. Hence the pope is crowned with a triple crown, as King of heaven and of earth and of the lower regions.” Lucius Ferraris, Prompta Bibliotheca, vol.6, art. “Papa II”
  3. “We hold upon this earth the place of God Almighty.” Pope Leo XIII, in an encyclical letter dated June 20, 1894, The Great Encyclical Letters of Leo XIII, p. 304.
His disbelief is deliberate and intentional.

But it is necessary in order to contort Scripture and history to align with his ideology.
Thats what many are doing today, twisting and interpreting the truth of Gods Word, to fit the devils deceptions much as at the start..

Genesis 3:1-4
1 Now the serpent was more subtle than any beast of the field which the Lord God had made. And he said unto the woman, “Yea, hath God said, ‘Ye shall not eat of every tree of the garden’?”
2 And the woman said unto the serpent, “We may eat of the fruit of the trees of the garden,
3 but of the fruit of the tree which is in the midst of the garden, God hath said, ‘Ye shall not eat of it, neither shall ye touch it,lest ye die.’”
4 And the serpent said unto the woman, “Ye shall not surely die;
 

Illuminator

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You misspelled "gatekeeper of truth".

Look to the papacy in Rome for the troll, who's confident all Jesuit Futurists will pay his "Mark" toll...or else.
You are an amateur anti-Catholic. If you want to really offend Catholics, I suggest you dress up as a transvestite and defile a funeral.

At the end of the spectrum of extreme anti-Catholics, the Satanic Black Mass makes your bigotry child's play.
Why is it always us?

Do you approve of vandalism and the burning down of Catholic churches? You should tell your doctor how you feel about the Catholic Church, he has medications that can help you.