We must be born again to be God's kingdom.

[Joyful]

So again you use the tactic of straw-man argument...then you malign me again.

Honestly I have been patient and kind with our discussion thus far. Your comment "I know you don't want the whole truth to be revealed. Your tactic is obvious that you want the whole truth to be silenced" is an attack and a defamation of my character.

You are technically violating the forum rules of flaming and goading...

Please consider this a warning without the point...

All I am doing is revealing all Jesus' teachings which most of you disregarding. This is how perverted gospel is being spread and misrepresenting Jesus to the world..

My posts and threads are all about being faithful to Jesus for salvation.

Jesus is righteous and godly and Holy. And Jesus commands us to imitate Him. He does not condone lip serving. Jesus is not hypocrite nor play favoritism.

If you think revealing all what Jesus command is flaming and goading, then so be it.

good day.

 

[Joyful]

Everyone,

Jesus commands His followers this: "Go therefore, make disciples of all nations... teachings them to obey everything I have commanded you."

Obeying or following His teachings are must for His followers.

OSAS teaches that you don't have to be faithful or keeping the commands is not requirement for salvation. It is simply against Jesus' word so it is anti-Christ teachings.

All Jesus teachings or commands are in the books of Matthew, Mark, Luke and John.

If you are interested in Jesus' teachings, it is all in those four books. His teachings are not hard to understand but it is hard to follow because in order to be His followers, we have to forsake our worldly way of mentality or practice to His ways. And His ways are super high standards.

Most of us are not willing to change to His high standards. That's why there are doctrines to appeal to the world which is not of Jesus.

blessings.

 

[justaname]

I already asked you if you are OSAS and why the secret? I don't blame you for not coming out because it is deceptive teaching.

You have been refusing to accept Jesus' command of being faithful to Him for salvation. That is OSAS teaching, dear.

Name the post where where I refused to accept Jesus' command of being faithful please.

Also if you refuse to answer my questions why am I obligated to answer yours?

 

[Joyful]

Finally about the OP,

Born again is simply changing our worldly or wicked way of living to Jesus' way.

I quoted some of it in the OP.

Jesus says to take up the cross daily and follow Him. It is not easy to do it.

If you are seeking cheap or easy salvation, there is no such thing.

 

[Joyful]

Name the post where where I refused to accept Jesus' command of being faithful please.

I am summarizing your questions and comments.

You have been questioning my posts, that's why I came to this conclusion.

All I am doing is showing that obeying Jesus' commands is requirement for salvation. No Jesus' followers should question about it.

Do you have problem with OSAS teaching?

 

[Joyful]

Jesus' teachings are not honored by most churches by saying obeying the la is done away with it because Jesus paied for our sins.

Jesus said in many ways to keep His commands.

Jesus teachings are the law for His followers.

It is absurd to claim it is not necessary to obey His law for salvation.

But that's what OSAS teaches.

Jesus says "if you love Me, keep My commands."

He also says sin no more.

There are many, many similar teachings of Jesus like those.

Jesus' word or teachings should be exalted, not dismissed.

blessings.

 

[justaname]

I am summarizing your questions and comments.

You have been questioning my posts, that's why I came to this conclusion.

All I am doing is showing that obeying Jesus' commands is requirement for salvation. No Jesus' followers should question about it.

Do you have problem with OSAS teaching?

Can you point to a specific question I asked to make you come to that conclusion?

 

[ATP]

Can you point to a specific question I asked to make you come to that conclusion?

What Joyful is confused with is that the commandments in the NT works off of grace, in which they are not the ten commandments spoken of in the OT.

The NT is not referring to the commandments of men or the law. It is about the injunctions of faith, love, and obedience. John and the other apostles never use "the law" to express the rule of Christian obedience: he uses it as the Mosaic law. The NT works off of Grace Salvation, not works. In the NT Jesus already died and had been resurrected, thus pouring out His Grace and Holy Spirit at Pentecost.

Gal 5:6 NIV For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision nor uncircumcision has any value. The only thing that counts is faith expressing itself through love.

 

[Bible_Gazer]

Wouldn't that make God a liar and contradictory though.
Scripture says once we believe we have eternal life.
Maybe Rev 2 is not referring to individual salvation, rather the pride of the church.

Lucifer fell because of pride too..Rev 2:5 NIV Consider how far you have fallen! Repent and do the things you did at first. If you do not repent, I will come to you and remove your lampstand from its place.

It is referring to their salvation he told them to repent.
That church belong to Jesus and he threaten to leave them.

When ever a person except Jesus into their life, do you think Jesus's intention in his words is that they will serve him the rest of their life with a
honest true heart and go all the way in obeying in righteousness to be an overcomer ?
Then they would have eternal life abiding within them forever from the start.
Then those scriptures you gave would be right for those he gives eternal life to, a believer that believe what he says to do is included in their belief.


I believe in once save always save as long as they stay in righteousness.

 

[Barrd]

I understand that OSAS is a very tempting doctrine. I realize that it is comforting to think that you can indulge in any sin that you like, with no consequences.
And I know that you have dozens of verses that seem to agree with this notion.
The problem is that there are many, many other verses that do not.
It's no good trying to twist them to make them fit. It's tempting, I'm sure, but it is not reality.
God is more than a philosophy, and faith in Him is more than just a doctrine. God is very real. God sustains everything, including our very lives, by His power. If He were to decide to remove that power, we'd all die. God's power over us is complete. We have "free will" because He allows us to have free will....He didn't have to, He chose to.

That being said, God has all authority over us, and we have none at all but what He allows us to have. This is not a "teaching" this is raw fact. If you do not understand this, then you don't truly believe in God at all.

 

[ATP]

When ever a person except Jesus into their life, do you think Jesus's intention in his words is that they will serve him the rest of their life with a
honest true heart and go all the way in obeying in righteousness to be an overcomer ?

That's actually not how scripture defines "overcomer". Overcoming is through belief only..

1 John 5:4-5 NIV for everyone born of God overcomes the world. This is the victory that has overcome the world, even our faith. 5Who is it that overcomes the world? Only the one who believes that Jesus is the Son of God.

 

[ATP]

I understand that OSAS is a very tempting doctrine. I realize that it is comforting to think that you can indulge in any sin that you like, with no consequences.

OSAS doesn't believe that. You have made up things we supposedly believe. Assuming.

 

[Barrd]

Justaname, I'm not going to argue with you about whether or not I am a teacher. I am what I am...if you see me as a self-proclaimed teacher, so be it. If you think that what I am expressing here are just my opinions, that's just fine.
Like I said, you do not have to listen to me. You can just brush me aside as another old crackpot who doesn't have a clue what she's talking about. I won't lose any sleep over it.

But I will continue to say, with my dying breath...you must repent. You will not get into heaven if you deliberately sin, believing yourself to have everlasting life just because you made a claim to believe in Jesus Christ. If you truly did believe in Jesus Christ, you would believe the words He said to you...not just the ones you liked, but all of them. You would, for instance, love your enemies...yes, all of them. You would give to those who asked you, without expecting anything in return. You would obey His commands, because He said "if you love Me, obey My commands." And if...or no, I should say when...when you mess up...because we all "mess up"....it will make you sad because you disappointed Him, and you will repent. If you will not repent, you are showing that you really do not love Him at all....what you love is your flesh.

Is that just my opinion? If you say so. Or, in His words- "thou sayest"

By the way, I'm not saying that Justaname does or doesn't do these things. I don't know you any more than you know me. For all I know, you may be a very devout Christian.
You may be like that publican who would not raise so much as his eyes toward heaven, but who beat on his breast, crying "God be merciful to me, a sinner".
I hope that is true, for then, you will go down justified to your place.

 

[Barrd]

That's actually not how scripture defines "overcomer". Overcoming is through belief only..

1 John 5:4-5 NIV for everyone born of God overcomes the world. This is the victory that has overcome the world, even our faith. 5Who is it that overcomes the world? Only the one who believes that Jesus is the Son of God.

What does it mean to be "born of God"?

 

[ATP]

What does it mean to be "born of God"?

The one who believes is born of God. Rom 10:9 NIV. What are we believing in Barrd?

 

[ATP]

In a nutshell, we are not born again unless we keep the commands of God through Jesus Christ.

Incorrect. Becoming born again is through believing. What are we believing in Joyful?

1 John 5:4-5 NIV for everyone born of God overcomes the world. This is the victory that has overcome the world, even our faith. 5Who is it that overcomes the world? Only the one who believes that Jesus is the Son of God.

 

[Joyful]

It is just amazing that so many have no problem about disobeying Jesus' teachings.

OSAS teachings are sound sweet but it will not get anyone to heaven or to be saved because it teaches against Jesus' word of being faithful to His teachings.

Jesus says this too:

17) John 14:12
Very truly I tell you, whoever believes in me will do the works I have been doing, and they will do even greater things than these, because I am going to the Father.

You have to dismiss or disregard tons of Jesus' word to justify OSAS teaching.

I will start another thread about Jesus' word that against OSAS teaching.

 

[Joyful]

Incorrect. Becoming born again is through believing. What are we believing in Joyful?

1 John 5:4-5 NIV for everyone born of God overcomes the world. This is the victory that has overcome the world, even our faith. 5Who is it that overcomes the world? Only the one who believes that Jesus is the Son of God.

ATP, you have been dismissing too many of Jesus' word.

It is just shame, dear.

 

[Barrd]

The one who believes is born of God. Rom 10:9 NIV. What are we believing in Barrd?

Well, I don't know about you, but what I'm believing in is the power of the Holy Spirit to work in me, conforming my sinful character to be like His sinless character.
I don't expect this to happen in a minute. I figure it's going to take a lifetime.
Meantime, sin is still sin, and if I sin, I believe with all of my mind, all of my heart, and all of my strength, that I must repent of that sin, and ask for God's strength to help me to overcome that sin in myself. I know I cannot do it by myself, and I also know that my adversary, the devil, is just waiting for me to fall.
I am believing in Jesus Christ, Who said "take up thy cross and follow Me" and Who said "the road to destruction is broad and well traveled".

 

[ATP]

Well, I don't know about you, but what I'm believing in is the power of the Holy Spirit to work in me, conforming my sinful character to be like His sinless character.
I don't expect this to happen in a minute. I figure it's going to take a lifetime.
Meantime, sin is still sin, and if I sin, I believe with all of my mind, all of my heart, and all of my strength, that I must repent of that sin, and ask for God's strength to help me to overcome that sin in myself. I know I cannot do it by myself, and I also know that my adversary, the devil, is just waiting for me to fall.
I am believing in Jesus Christ, Who said "take up thy cross and follow Me" and Who said "the road to destruction is broad and well traveled".

Wrong answer. Would you like to try again.