What do you think qualifies one to be one of Christ's disciples?

[H. Richard]

H Richard, Hmm, I don't buy that. Last I checked, kindergarteners are not teaching kindergarten class. Universities require PhDs from professors for a reason. How much more should a person be qualified and knowledgeable in the Word of God before becoming a teacher!? The requirement for being an elder is being "able to teach." Moreover, young converts are excluded from such leadership roles so they do not become "puffed up" and "fall into the condemnation of the devil." Those who teach are declared worthy of "double honor" (which indicates a special role and responsibility). The author of Hebrews rebukes his audience that by now they should be able to teach, but still need someone to teach them the basic oracles of God. Also, James says teachers will be judged with greater strictness.

So, clearly those who are teachers are expected to be mature, knowledgeable and Christ-like men who are able to handle the responsibility and dangers of such a privilege.

I think it is a big mistake to take Jesus' direct words to the Apostles just before his passion and try to apply his direction to them to all believers everywhere. He also told them the Holy Spirit would remind them of every thing he said to them. I don't think that promise applies to every Christian.

Im not going to chase after the bait to get into another ridiculous conversation about your views that there are two Gospels and Jesus' message and the message of the 12 Apostles was different and contradictory to the Gospel Paul preached. Its just heresy and I really don't want to beat that dead horse again.

***
As you wish. However I will still be posting my views.

1 Cor 1:26-31
Glory Only in the Lord 26 For you see your calling, brethren, that not many wise according to the flesh, not many mighty, not many noble, are called.
27 But God has chosen the foolish things of the world to put to shame the wise, and God has chosen the weak things of the world to put to shame the things which are mighty;
28 and the base things of the world and the things which are despised God has chosen, and the things which are not, to bring to nothing the things that are,
29 that no flesh should glory in His presence.
30 But of Him you are in Christ Jesus, who became for us wisdom from God — and righteousness and sanctification and redemption —
31 that, as it is written, "He who glories, let him glory in the Lord."
NKJV


As I see it a person must rightly divide the word of God, not mix it all together.

2 Tim 2:14-15 --- Approved and Disapproved Workers
14 Remind them of these things, charging them before the Lord not to strive about words to no profit, to the ruin of the hearers.
15 Be diligent to present yourself approved to God, a worker who does not need to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.
NKJV

But I don't see many dividing anything in scriptures.


.

 

[H. Richard]

That just the point is it not, appointed by Gof, yet so many appoint themsleves.

Qualified by man not by God, look at Saul and what Happened to Him before He found Christ

God doesnt deal in certificates, and one is not required to know the bible. Just Jesus He is teh truth.

mir, if a person would search the scriptures for the word "trust" they would see in the context that God has said do not trust in men and that certainly included the wisdom of men.

1 Cor 1:26-31 - Glory Only in the Lord
26 For you see your calling, brethren, that not many wise according to the flesh, not many mighty, not many noble, are called.
27 But God has chosen the foolish things of the world to put to shame the wise, and God has chosen the weak things of the world to put to shame the things which are mighty;
28 and the base things of the world and the things which are despised God has chosen, and the things which are not, to bring to nothing the things that are,
29 that no flesh should glory in His presence.
30 But of Him you are in Christ Jesus, who became for us wisdom from God — and righteousness and sanctification and redemption —
31 that, as it is written, "He who glories, let him glory in the Lord."
NKJV


Ps 34:22
22 The Lord redeems the soul of His servants, And none of those who trust in Him shall be condemned.
NKJV

Ps 73:28
28 But it is good for me to draw near to God; I have put my trust in the Lord God, That I may declare all Your works.
NKJV

Ps 78:22
22 Because they did not believe in God, And did not trust in His salvation.
NKJV

Ps 125:1
125 Those who trust in the Lord Are like Mount Zion, Which cannot be moved, but abides forever.
NKJV

Ps 146:3
3 Do not put your trust in princes, Nor in a son of man, in whom there is no help.
NKJV

Prov 3:5-6
5 Trust in the Lord with all your heart, And lean not on your own understanding;
6 In all your ways acknowledge Him, And He shall direct your paths.
NKJV

1 Tim 4:9-10
9 This is a faithful saying and worthy of all acceptance.
10 For to this end we both labor and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God, who is the Savior of all men, especially of those who believe.
NKJV

Heb 2:12
12 saying: "I will declare Your name to My brethren; In the midst of the assembly I will sing praise to You."
NKJV

Phil 3:2-3
2 Beware of dogs, beware of evil workers, beware of the mutilation!
3 For we are the circumcision, who worship God in the Spirit, rejoice in Christ Jesus, and have no confidence in the flesh,
NKJV

The religious place their faith and confidence in what they do in religion. They can not see that in the scriptures the religious are the ones that persecuted Jesus and the children of God. If you feel you are an outcast on a forum when you say that only belief, faith, confidence in the work of Jesus on the cross saves a person then you can rest assured that you are a child of God..

 

[bbyrd009]

"In the beginning was the Bible, and the Bible was with God, and the Bible Was God"

Thats a nonsensical statement.

tell me about it, lol.

 

[bbyrd009]

Ok, so I will just leave you to live happily in the grey where you can make your own rules. Im sure if one of your loved ones was in the Twin Towers when they were ruthlessly attacked, you'd have a different perspective on things. Just remember that the freedom you have to spout such nonsense and ponder your navel in such ridiculous ways came at a price.

yes, the price being that 911 was surely an inside job as following the money, and the billions made in the stock market on very specific puts and calls for that day might attest--oh ya, except your handlers for some reason cannot determine who made all these $Billions, hmm. Fortunately the insurance policies on which the ink had not even dried are less opaque, as are the dancing Israelis whisked out of the country lol.

the price also seems to entail your sons guarding poppy fields, and your handlers seeing the need to expend 60ish Tomahawks at $1.4 million apiece upon people armed basically with rocks lol. Hope your stock went up.

 

[bbyrd009]

1. I feel no need to prove anything to you.
2. So far you have yet to really provide any meaningful response to my scriptural expositions.....other than baffling attempts to throw handfuls of rambling spaghetti against the wall hoping something might stick. You use no Scripture, no context, no history or anything resembling an informed response in your statements.
3. The longer this conversation goes, the more unorthodox and incoherent your responses become (at least in my mind). So, I think I am going to draw this to a close. It doesn't seem like you are trying to have a meaningful exchange. It looks to me like you are just looking for ways to be disagreeable. Im not interested in debating for the sake of debating.

oh please stop lol you would argue with a post, i have wasted hours answering your questions from "why?" that were never any attempt to understand, but rather only refute, and you have already admitted that you cannot entertain any reasoning that does not allow you to hold your own conclusions inviolable.

If you ever present any Scriptural expositions, as i have already asked for, then perhaps i can provide a meaningful response? I have asked at least three times now; where are they? But invariably what has happened here, the ad hominem attacks now, are invariably what happens when one reaches the end of their logical progression, and someone dares disagree with them in any particular.

I must needs ask your forgiveness now, as it slipped my mind that you are not a hypocrite, whereas i can assure you that i am.
Have a nice weekend.

 

[bbyrd009]

Ok, so I will just leave you to live happily in the grey where you can make your own rules....baffling attempts to throw handfuls of rambling spaghetti against the wall hoping something might stick.

funny i thought it was my conclusions that you objected to, but now it appears that i have none. Can you clarify this?

You use no Scripture, no context, no history or anything resembling an informed response in your statements.

shall we do a comparo of the Scripture i have quoted in my responses to you v yours to me? How do you think you might fare in this easily verifiable exchange?

3. The longer this conversation goes, the more unorthodox and incoherent your responses become (at least in my mind). So, I think I am going to draw this to a close. It doesn't seem like you are trying to have a meaningful exchange. It looks to me like you are just looking for ways to be disagreeable. Im not interested in debating for the sake of debating.

12As far as the east is from the west,
so far has He removed
our transgressions from us.q
13As a father has compassion on his children,
so the LORD has compassion on those who fear Him.r
14For He knows what we are made of,
remembering that we are dust.s
15As for man, his days are like grass —
he blooms like a flower of the field;t
16when the wind passes over it, it vanishes,
and its place is no longer known.u, v
17But from eternity to eternity
the LORD’s faithful love is toward those who fear Him,
and His righteousness toward the grandchildrenw
18of those who keep His covenant,
who remember to observe His precepts.x

so by all means you just keep counseling people to ask forgiveness for their sins from some guy you call "father" in a dark closet (who is in league with those accused of being homosexual child molesters, no less) and pretending that you are observing the precepts, ok. I do not condemn you for this. And any time your logical arguments fail you--as they always will--you are free to just change the words in Scripture, as your forefathers were so eager to do.

Pretend that you fear God, even as you state that you are not a hypocrite, and your pov must not be questioned; i understand. Pretend that you know "its place;" people are eager to agree! Overlook the hundred questions that i have asked that might suggest a better understanding, and belittle them if it suits you.

But don't miss that when all of your logical arguments have failed, and all of your questions asked from why are not producing the usual results--which is demonstrably "you, being worshipped"--that you must make a choice then, as you have done. It must be done your way, you have made this quite plain.

 

[bbyrd009]

 

[bbyrd009]

 

[bbyrd009]

lol

 

[bbyrd009]

 

[bbyrd009]

Ok, so I will just leave you to live happily in the grey where you can make your own rules. Im sure if one of your loved ones was in the Twin Towers when they were ruthlessly attacked, you'd have a different perspective on things. Just remember that the freedom you have to spout such nonsense and ponder your navel in such ridiculous ways came at a price.

"now we see the violence inherent in the system."

 

[bbyrd009]

When you post with a "quote" please indicate who you are quoting just as I have above. PLEASE

sorry about that, i know it makes it easier to track back, i will do my best there

 

[bbyrd009]

Im sure if one of your loved ones was in the Twin Towers when they were ruthlessly attacked, you'd have a different perspective on things. Just remember that the freedom you have to spout such nonsense and ponder your navel in such ridiculous ways came at a price.

"Woe to those who pose
and don't knows, and rely on men for their security" etcetc

i can dig up the verses if you like, poseur.

 

[Wormwood]

That just the point is it not, appointed by Gof, yet so many appoint themsleves.

Qualified by man not by God, look at Saul and what Happened to Him before He found Christ

God doesnt deal in certificates, and one is not required to know the bible. Just Jesus He is teh truth.

Well, Saul's "Bible" was spending 3 years in the desert learning directly from Jesus....so yeah, that's kinda a "certificate." SO I guess if you get to have three years of direct revelation from Jesus, you don't need your Bible. Otherwise, you point is invalid.

 

[Wormwood]

funny i thought it was my conclusions that you objected to, but now it appears that i have none. Can you clarify this?

I do object to your conclusions. It is just that your "conclusions" are based on nonsense. You readily admit to rejecting logic and now you are doing nothing but spouting ridiculous propaganda. Im not interested in debating your conspiracy theories. Find another sucker.

 

[mjrhealth]

Well, Saul's "Bible" was spending 3 years in the desert learning directly from Jesus....so yeah, that's kinda a "certificate." SO I guess if you get to have three years of direct revelation from Jesus, you don't need your Bible. Otherwise, you point is invalid.

Bible is a book, Jesus is not a book.

Go to bible college you learn teh bible and become qualified by man to teach the bible, Jesus never came to teach teh bible.

Luk 4:18 The Spirit of the Lord is upon me, because he hath anointed me to preach the gospel to the poor; he hath sent me to heal the brokenhearted, to preach deliverance to the captives, and recovering of sight to the blind, to set at liberty them that are bruised,
Luk 4:19 To preach the acceptable year of the Lord.

And even teh disciples

Joh 6:68 Then Simon Peter answered him, Lord, to whom shall we go? thou hast the words of eternal life.

There is no life in the bible only tells us of teh one who

Joh 6:63 It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.

Its teh reason why teh wise Virgins have lamps filled with Oil.

Mat 19:14 But Jesus said, Suffer little children, and forbid them not, to come unto me: for of such is the kingdom of heaven.

Its where every christian should be , sitting at Hid feet learning from Him

Joh 6:35 And Jesus said unto them, I am the bread of life: he that cometh to me shall never hunger; and he that believeth on me shall never thirst.

But teh foolish Virgins wont and dont, and they will not be reafy.

There is a reason why you dont hear much about Teachers and prophets after our Lords Birth

Joh 15:26 But when the Comforter is come, whom I will send unto you from the Father, even the Spirit of truth, which proceedeth from the Father, he shall testify of me:
Joh 15:27 And ye also shall bear witness, because ye have been with me from the beginning.

He is out witness

and

Act 2:17 And it shall come to pass in the last days, saith God, I will pour out of my Spirit upon all flesh: and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, and your young men shall see visions, and your old men shall dream dreams:
Act 2:18 And on my servants and on my handmaidens I will pour out in those days of my Spirit; and they shall prophesy:

God , Jesus dont need teachers nor prophets any more He has given us one..

Mat 11:28 Come unto me, all ye that labour and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest.
Mat 11:29 Take my yoke upon you, and learn of me; for I am meek and lowly in heart: and ye shall find rest unto your souls.
Mat 11:30 For my yoke is easy, and my burden is light.

The bible has nothing on Jesus. If that is what teh people want, they will not be ready

 

[tabletalk]

Bible is a book, Jesus is not a book.

Go to bible college you learn teh bible and become qualified by man to teach the bible, Jesus never came to teach teh bible.

Luk 4:18 The Spirit of the Lord is upon me, because he hath anointed me to preach the gospel to the poor; he hath sent me to heal the brokenhearted, to preach deliverance to the captives, and recovering of sight to the blind, to set at liberty them that are bruised,
Luk 4:19 To preach the acceptable year of the Lord.

And even teh disciples

Joh 6:68 Then Simon Peter answered him, Lord, to whom shall we go? thou hast the words of eternal life.

There is no life in the bible only tells us of teh one who

Joh 6:63 It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.

Its teh reason why teh wise Virgins have lamps filled with Oil.

Mat 19:14 But Jesus said, Suffer little children, and forbid them not, to come unto me: for of such is the kingdom of heaven.

Its where every christian should be , sitting at Hid feet learning from Him

Joh 6:35 And Jesus said unto them, I am the bread of life: he that cometh to me shall never hunger; and he that believeth on me shall never thirst.

But teh foolish Virgins wont and dont, and they will not be reafy.

There is a reason why you dont hear much about Teachers and prophets after our Lords Birth

Joh 15:26 But when the Comforter is come, whom I will send unto you from the Father, even the Spirit of truth, which proceedeth from the Father, he shall testify of me:
Joh 15:27 And ye also shall bear witness, because ye have been with me from the beginning.

He is out witness

and

Act 2:17 And it shall come to pass in the last days, saith God, I will pour out of my Spirit upon all flesh: and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, and your young men shall see visions, and your old men shall dream dreams:
Act 2:18 And on my servants and on my handmaidens I will pour out in those days of my Spirit; and they shall prophesy:

God , Jesus dont need teachers nor prophets any more He has given us one..

Mat 11:28 Come unto me, all ye that labour and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest.
Mat 11:29 Take my yoke upon you, and learn of me; for I am meek and lowly in heart: and ye shall find rest unto your souls.
Mat 11:30 For my yoke is easy, and my burden is light.

The bible has nothing on Jesus. If that is what teh people want, they will not be ready

You said: "Bible is a book, Jesus is not a book."

The Bible is a book of words. Jesus is the Word of God.

John 1, "1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God."
" 14 And the Word became flesh and dwelt among us, and we beheld His glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father, full of grace and truth."

Hebrews 4:12, "For the word of God is living and powerful, and sharper than any two-edged sword, piercing even to the division of soul and spirit, and of joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart."

And you said: "the Bible has nothing on Jesus."

The Bible has everything God wants us to know about Him. You keep quoting words from the Bible, but rejecting the Bible (the book of the Word of God).
What am I missing here? Do you love the Word of God (Jesus), but hate the Bible?

 

[bbyrd009]

I do object to your conclusions. It is just that your "conclusions" are based on nonsense. You readily admit to rejecting logic and now you are doing nothing but spouting ridiculous propaganda. Im not interested in debating your conspiracy theories. Find another sucker.

ah, i see. Ok then i have just not spoken it very well, and i do not mean to reject logic entirely, ok? You are not going to forget how to think logically. The premise is that the Book was written dialectically, and it is entirely up to you whether that is considered "propaganda" or not, and "ridiculous" might only be revealed after that has been determined for oneself.

(You might see here that i am {graciously} ignoring that you quite obviously are interested in debating my "conspiracy theories," or else why bother posting again? Is it to get in the characterizations of "nonsense, spouting, ridiculous, propaganda, conspiracy theories, sucker," et al? Maybe? And please note that i am not suggesting you accept any of my conclusions, ok, i'm not even sure what conclusions you think i have reached? But you certainly are not being asked to believe them)(nonsense better than sense, hmm, where have i read that before...)

 

[bbyrd009]

Well, Saul's "Bible" was spending 3 years in the desert learning directly from Jesus....so yeah, that's kinda a "certificate." SO I guess if you get to have three years of direct revelation from Jesus, you don't need your Bible. Otherwise, you point is invalid.

is there a reference for this learning of Paul's, directly from Jesus? Even anecdotal? other than the one passage in Scripture, i mean? ty

 

[bbyrd009]