What is a Cult?

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Danube

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That was kind of my whole point. Many people search diligently for "Laws" to put themselves under... I suppose that they think they are thus pleasing God in some better way.

And it always amazes me to see people who profess to be believers of Jesus, willingly mock those who seek Torah observance by preaching grace AND..... will be the very first to allow themselves to be rinsed by man-made laws (a "legalist" AND unGodly system) or internet forum rules.
But stranger still....the folk who while under "grace" will work to pay for the death of all future generations of their own kith and kin, simply to pander to the invaders whim, fearing being called a "racist" ......online,

Honestly it really is just bizare.
 
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Helen

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Speak for yourself should you otherwise sound like a lawless opinionated Paulanist female vicar.

All Pharassical yeast, and still puffing the bread up once everyone is trying to digest it too!
You brought no scripture with your "world" view. Are you my judge also? Give eachother a pat on the back.

Matthew 10:14

Oh good..so it hit the mark! Good. I think you have thrown your dummy out of your pram. :D
And you obviously think that "everyone" is trying to digest your bread.
I think not.

I got your measure when I saw you being snippy and rude to Blueberry this morning.
 
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Danube

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You obviously have nothing to add to the debate, you admit your vengeful (hence your continuity of wanting to speak quarralsome) and you seek to provoke people to anger by using someone else to start a flippant remark. (perhaps Blueberry is your side kick as he/she had very little to say that was contructive if you look, its almost like an online cult with its favorites ha!
ByeGrace!
 
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Harvest 1874

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Notice, now, that I deliberately did that so that you would prove something all on your own.

In your first post, you stopped short, leaving it looking like the only animals we could eat were just those you listed.

When pushed a little on it, you then went to the chicken.

I could now push a little more, and bring up the sheet that was let down to Peter (applying it both Spiritually and practically) and show that we are no longer under those laws.... or go on into the consideration of others in eating and drinking (or not) on certain days.

There are too many people here still trying to learn what living as a Christian means, so we just cannot let that kind of thing go unchecked.


You might as well learn now that there are about a half dozen of us here who will not let people get away with playing those "Old Law" games.

It should be recalled that all the laws governing what is lawful and what is unlawful to eat only apply to Israel as they were the only ones under the Law Covenant, “…to them were committed the oracles (the Law and Prophets) of God.” (Rom 3:2)

You only have I known of all the families of the earth” (Amos 3:2)

None of these laws have anything to do with the Gentiles.

Per the Word of the Lord to Noah, the rest of mankind in general are permitted to eat just about anything edible viz.

Every moving thing that lives shall be food for you. I have given you all things, even as the green herbs.” Gen 9:3 (Compare with Gen 1:29)
 
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Phoneman777

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It is shocking to see people on this board saying if you claim Christ your Christian. Or if you embrace a salvation message from groups simply because they been around a long time, claim it is from Christ or redefine words to make it work.

So the valid question is what is a cult?

Christ warns us against false Christs, saying many will come and claim to be him. And yet we still see people claiming it is sufficient just to say they believe in Christ, even if it conflicts with the Bible.

The Bible says Christ is the only way to salvation, yet we have groups preaching salvation by works and so-called elect who can forgive your sins in the name of Christ.

Or they have a different god altogether.

How can someone be saved and be a true Christian if they violate these most basic requirements?

Remember, anyone who seeks God the Holy Spirit will lead them to him.

What say you?
Specifically, a "Christian Cult" is an organization which claims to follow Christ but whose teachings and practices deviate from those which Christ taught and demonstrated.
 
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Helen

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LOL Grace, that image made me chuckle LOL It's so juvenile, yet so profound. A picture is truly worth a thousand words!

Sorry I am just having a bad day today...I get annoyed when we get new people who start straight away with correcting people here.
I found him rude. Maybe others thought it was okay.

With seasoned people like yourself. We kinda know where each other are at , and have obviously read each others posts over time.
We either 'engage' or we just ignore each other haha!
Today it just got under my skin...my bad. :oops:

Have a good one....H
 
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Mayflower

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Sorry I am just having a bad day today...I get annoyed when we get new people who start straight away with correcting people here.
I found him rude. Maybe others thought it was okay.

With seasoned people like yourself. We kinda know where each other are at , and have obviously read each others posts over time.
We either 'engage' or we just ignore each other haha!
Today it just got under my skin...my bad. :oops:

Have a good one....H

download.jpeg
 

Jane_Doe22

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Sorry I am just having a bad day today...I get annoyed when we get new people who start straight away with correcting people here.
I found him rude. Maybe others thought it was okay.

With seasoned people like yourself. We kinda know where each other are at , and have obviously read each others posts over time.
We either 'engage' or we just ignore each other haha!
Today it just got under my skin...my bad. :oops:

Have a good one....H
*hugs for Grace* Sorry you're having a bad day.
 

Phoneman777

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Sorry I am just having a bad day today...I get annoyed when we get new people who start straight away with correcting people here.
I found him rude. Maybe others thought it was okay.

With seasoned people like yourself. We kinda know where each other are at , and have obviously read each others posts over time.
We either 'engage' or we just ignore each other haha!
Today it just got under my skin...my bad. :oops:

Have a good one....H
I hadn't really reviewed yall's conversation, I just saw the picture and laughed!
 
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brakelite

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That hasn't changed. The problem is when people measure health and well being in terms of a robust body and a comfortable life. God on the other hand, calls health and well-being a pure heart and a righteous way of life:
When I read through the gospels, I see a pattern in the way Jesus ministered. He healed the people physically, then spoke to them of spiritual matters, then on a couple of occasions, fed them physically after. God cares about the whole person...and very few, who are distracted by their obesity, cancer, poor general health, diabetes etc which can all be brought about through poor unregulated diet, are of a mind to discern spiritual matters in their fullest import. Physical well being contributes greatly to spiritual well being. It makes no sense whatever that the same God and Manufacturer of these complicated human engines would cease to worry about how we operated them. Many of us look after our vehicles with more care than we do our own bodies. Would you put sugar in your petrol tank? Oil in your radiator? Concrete in your tyres? Why insist that God doesn't care anymore that you poison your own body with polluted, arsenic and mercury filled shellfish? Are we to simply pray "God bless this lobster" and all the poisons disappear?
Now I am not advocating a return to all the laws and requirements of the entire Mosaic law as it seems Danube is espousing. However, I think some good common sense can prevail if we simply trust and take God at His word when He says, "this shall not be food for you".
 
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brakelite

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I do often wonder how anyone can uphold "the spirit of the law", without "upholding the letter"? Can you successfully accomplish one without the other? Can you actually uphold the letter of the sixth commandment without bothering to refrain from cutting someone's throat? Can you uphold the "spirit" of the dietary laws for example, at the same time as quaffing down inordinate amounts of unhealthy sugar filled doughnuts with no control over appetite whatsoever...or continue to poison oneself with the mercury and other minerals that crustaceans are designed to suck out the world's oceans? Sometimes I think the reference often used …"spirit of the law" is merely an excuse to deliberately continue to disobey the letter.
 

Enoch111

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Sometimes I think the reference often used …"spirit of the law" is merely an excuse to deliberately continue to disobey the letter.
There are some who continue to harp on a conflict between the letter and the spirit of the Law, but they forget the context in which that teaching was given.

It is the Pharisees (primarily) who were meticulous in following the letter of the Law, and had gone to an extreme with their oral traditions. At the same time their hearts were unconverted, impure, and wicked. Thus they had completely ignored the spirit of the law, which insists on internal righteousness, not external rituals.
 
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CoreIssue

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There are some who continue to harp on a conflict between the letter and the spirit of the Law, but they forget the context in which that teaching was given.

It is the Pharisees (primarily) who were meticulous in following the letter of the Law, and had gone to an extreme with their oral traditions. At the same time their hearts were unconverted, impure, and wicked. Thus they had completely ignored the spirit of the law, which insists on internal righteousness, not external rituals.

To think of it another way the law says you cannot murder someone but the intent is the unjustified taking of a life. Therefore self-defense, war in a police action are not murder.

The intent killing has different outcomes even though one person took the life of another.
 

icxn

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...Now I am not advocating a return to all the laws and requirements of the entire Mosaic law as it seems Danube is espousing. However, I think some good common sense can prevail if we simply trust and take God at His word when He says, "this shall not be food for you".
There are a few counter arguments that I could offer, to show that a healthy diet has no moral value, but then I remembered the following story and that changed my mind. Perhaps God accepts the food sacrifices that you offer Him on account of your good intentions; It will be a mistake for me to argue against that. Forgive me.

Quote:
In Egypt, in whose ancient Christian past there had once been many grand monasteries, there once lived a monk who befriended an uneducated and simple peasant farmer. One day this peasant said to the monk, “I too respect God who created this world! Every evening I pour out a bowl of goat’s milk and leave it out under a palm tree. In the evening God comes and drinks up my milk! He is very fond of it! There’s never once been a time when even a drop of milk is left in the bowl.”

Hearing these words, the monk could not help smiling. He kindly and logically explained to his friend that God doesn’t need a bowl of goat’s milk. But the peasant so stubbornly insisted that he was right that the monk then suggested that the next night they secretly watch to see what happened after the bowl of milk was left under the palm tree.

No sooner said than done. When night fell, the monk and the peasant hid themselves some distance from the tree, and soon in the moonlight they saw how a little fox crept up to the bowl and lapped up all the milk till the bowl was empty.

“Indeed!” the peasant sighed disappointingly. “Now I can see that it wasn’t God!”

The monk tried to comfort the peasant and explained that God is a spirit, that God is something completely beyond our poor ability to comprehend in our world, and that people comprehend His presence each in their own unique way. But the peasant merely stood hanging his head sadly. Then he wept and went back home to his hovel.

The monk also went back to his cell, but when he got there he was amazed to see an angel blocking his path. Utterly terrified, the monk fell to his knees, but the angel said to him:

“That simple fellow had neither education nor wisdom nor book-learning enough to be able to comprehend God otherwise. Then you with your wisdom and book learning took away what little he had! You will say that doubtless you reasoned correctly. But there’s one thing that you don’t know, oh learned man: God, seeing the sincerity and true heart of this good peasant, every night sent the little fox to that palm tree to comfort him and accept his sacrifice.”
 
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brakelite

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There are a few counter arguments that I could offer, to show that a healthy diet has no moral value
Now that is debatable. Self murder, regardless of the time it takes, through an addiction to tobacco, ice, heroin, coke and perhaps even coffee...does it not contravene the 6th commandment? And having an addiction itself surely is covetous? Is not control over one's appetite a fruit of the Spirit?
Science informs us that crustaceans such as lobster, crab, mussels, kina etc are inherently useful for processing the poisons and contaminants that proliferate in our oceans. When we eat a lobster, regardless of how tasty a morsel they no doubt are, we are partaking of elements detrimental to our well being, harmful to our overall health. Now while I agree that ingesting something doesn't morally corrupt anyone, by doing so without regard to their composition are we not disregarding the Manufacturers explicit instructions on how these fabulous machines are to be treated and respected? Can we not invalidate the warranty by doing so? We come to God so often when we need repairs...and expect it despite the fact we are harming ourselves by our own actions and thinking we can eat anything so long as God "blesses it".
Eating anything offered in modern restaurants and expecting God to intervene by removing the bad stuff before we eat is akin to those idiots who have snakes in the churches on account of Paul's experience in Melita.
 
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brakelite

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With all the above said, don't misunderstand me and have me trying to impose dietary laws on everyone. All I am trying to point out is that when God gave such laws, they weren't given as a burden or as an arbitrary religious restriction. There were good solid health reasons for God to stipulate what was good for food, and what wasn't. The big myth surrounding all of this is the thought that unclean meat is unclean food. That is not the case. No where in scripture is there any mention or suggestion that any food is unclean. If a beast, bird, reptile, fish or bug was taught by God as being unclean, what God was in effect saying, was that is not food. Clean meat is food.....unclean meat is not food. In other words, according to God, pork is not food. Now you can eat it of course, no-one can stop you from making your own decisions. And I used to before I became vegetarian. And I loved it. As I also loved lobster and oysters. But when God showed me that for optimum health and vitality, He has given us fairly explicit guidelines, then I was inclined to follow His lead. The rest is up to you. On this matter at least, modern science is on God's side, and agrees with the Bible.
 
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brakelite

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There are some who continue to harp on a conflict between the letter and the spirit of the Law, but they forget the context in which that teaching was given.

It is the Pharisees (primarily) who were meticulous in following the letter of the Law, and had gone to an extreme with their oral traditions. At the same time their hearts were unconverted, impure, and wicked. Thus they had completely ignored the spirit of the law, which insists on internal righteousness, not external rituals.
Yes, that is very true. One specific example of this was with their treatment of the Sabbath...and today is pursued vigorously by modern extreme Jews in Israel...no driving cars...turning on power for heating etc etc. After they came back from Babylon, their determination to not be under and future curse became an obsession...and they ended up being occupied by Rome anyway. They placed many unnecessary strictures on the Sabbath that it became impossible to honor the day as God intended. It was those strictures that Jesus sought to expose by deliberately healing on the Sabbath. Jesus was never attempting to get rid of the Sabbath, just revealing the right way to treat it. He never "broke the Sabbath" commandment, but broke the commandment away from Phariseeism.
 
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