Aunty Jane
Well-Known Member
Peter gave us a clue here.....he called Noah "a preacher of righteousness" which means that the flood did not strike the people "unaware"...it struck them 'unprepared', because they dismissed his preaching and ignored his warning.Jesus is contrasting his parousia with the days of Noah. It (the flood) came unaware and swept them all away except for Noah and his family. So tell me Jane, as a JW, you believe (or should believe) that Jesus' parousia began in 1914. If that is true, who has been "swept away"?
2 Peter 2:5-6...
"Certainly God did not refrain from punishing the angels who sinned, but threw them into Tarʹta·rus, putting them in chains of dense darkness to be reserved for judgment. 5 And he did not refrain from punishing an ancient world, but kept Noah, a preacher of righteousness, safe with seven others when he brought a flood upon a world of ungodly people. 6 And by reducing the cities of Sodʹom and Go·morʹrah to ashes, he condemned them, setting a pattern for ungodly people of things to come."
Do you not think the people knew why Noah was building such a large structure in the middle of a cleared field?
Do you think he never told them what he was building and why? Why did they ridicule him and ignore him?
What did Peter say about "the last days" of this present world system?
2 Peter 3:3-7....
"First of all know this, that in the last days ridiculers will come with their ridicule, proceeding according to their own desires 4 and saying: “Where is this promised presence of his? Why, from the day our forefathers fell asleep in death, all things are continuing exactly as they were from creation’s beginning.”
5 For they deliberately ignore this fact, that long ago there were heavens and an earth standing firmly out of water and in the midst of water by the word of God; 6 and that by those means the world of that time suffered destruction when it was flooded with water. 7 But by the same word the heavens and the earth that now exist are reserved for fire and are being kept until the day of judgment and of destruction of the ungodly people."
Peter also spoke of Jesus when he 'preached to the spirits in prison'......'when God was waiting patiently in Noah's day while the ark was being constructed'.....look how he connected the waters of our baptism to the time period when Noah was constructing the ark.....when he and his family would be rescued through the water.
"He [Jesus] was put to death in the flesh but made alive in the spirit. 19 And in this state he went and preached to the spirits in prison, 20 who had formerly been disobedient when God was patiently waiting in Noah’s day, while the ark was being constructed, in which a few people, that is, eight souls, were carried safely through the water.
21 Baptism, which corresponds to this, is also now saving you (not by the removing of the filth of the flesh, but by the request to God for a good conscience), through the resurrection of Jesus Christ. 22 He is at God’s right hand, for he went to heaven, and angels and authorities and powers were made subject to him."
We are in a similar period now while God is waiting to command Jesus to end another "world" of wickedness.
It is this world that is going to end....and the Kingdom ("the new heavens") will then rule the "new earth" of redeemed ones. (2 Peter 3:13)
During the 1,000 years of the Kingdom's rule, the survivors of Armageddon will educate the resurrected ones in God's ways, and all humanity will be brought back to the sinless condition that Adam and his wife once enjoyed.
Go back to Matthew 25:31-33, where Jesus spoke of the "sheep and the goats".So you have "the elect" and "those who believe as they do." I assume they are not "elect." So, you believe there are two distinct classes or believers currently on the earth, "Elect" and the "non-Elect"? Can you show me from scriptures where it teaches two classes of Christians being developed now? Thanks.
“When the Son of man comes in his glory, and all the angels with him, then he will sit down on his glorious throne. 32 All the nations will be gathered before him, and he will separate people one from another, just as a shepherd separates the sheep from the goats. 33 And he will put the sheep on his right hand, but the goats on his left.
The arrival is part of the "parousia".....this is when Jesus begins his reign. When the "sign" he gave was fulfilled. (Matt 24:3-14)
It is when the separating begins, and is carried out all through "the last days" so that this judgment period corresponds with the days of Noah.
It is because the people "take no notice" that they are denied access to the kingdom. It is not that they received no notice......but like the days of Noah, the messengers are not taken seriously and so are ignored.
Jesus says to the sheep....."‘Truly I say to you, to the extent that you did it to one of the least of these my brothers, you did it to me.’"
So, what did he say about the sheep that qualified them for life? They supported his "brothers"....so these supporters were not Christ's "brothers" themselves.
He says to the goats...."‘Truly I say to you, to the extent that you did not do it to one of these least ones, you did not do it to me.’ 46 These will depart into everlasting cutting-off, but the righteous ones into everlasting life."
The "goats" fail to render assistance to Christ's "brothers" and would forfeit life, being sent to the place "reserved" for the devil and his hordes. So who are Christ’s "brothers"...? They are "sons of God" by "adoption", which makes them "brothers" of Christ....his elect. (Romans 8:15; Gal 4:1-7)
There are two judgments...one for this world, and one at the end of the thousand years in the new world......only then will God grant everlasting life to the ones who remained faithful.Well, we agree on this, except for one word you used, "final". While I agree that it will be THE FINAL TEST, it is THE ONLY TEST mankind will experienced. As all through this Gospel Age, since the formation of the Church, THE ELECT, they are the ONLY ones being tried and tested. These are the only ones God is dealing with, as members of the Body of Christ. When this body is complete, then, and only then, will the Lord deal with the world of mankind. That is what the Kingdom reign is for. Mankind will be taught the ways of the Lord. They will learn what the Heavenly Father has done for them through Christ Jesus via the ransom.
Rev 20:4...
"And I saw thrones, and those who sat on them were given authority to judge. Yes, I saw the souls of those executed for the witness they gave about Jesus and for speaking about God, and those who had not worshipped the wild beast or its image and had not received the mark on their forehead and on their hand. And they came to life and ruled as kings with the Christ for 1,000 years."
This is the elect....the ones who, at the end of this present world system, have not received the mark of the beast or its image, and who are taken to heaven (came to life) by being transformed "in the twinkling of an eye" to join their brothers who are already there. They were resurrected when Christ came to power....when his "parousia" began. These last remaining ones are resurrected at the end of the last days.
John goes on to say....."(The rest of the dead did not come to life until the thousand years were ended.")
Only after the final test at the end of the thousand years will the dead "come to life" in the way God first intended....to live forever in paradise on this earth.
I believe you have the timing wrong.....as the scriptures explain. But you are entitled to believe as you wish.It is during this period that the sheep from the goats are separated.
And THIS is what makes sense to me!
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