Just don't ever buy into these non-believers, that are allowed to roam on a Christian Forum, that the Bible is not the written Word of God. "Yea hath God said?"
Stranger
What is the correct view on genesis
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Just don't ever buy into these non-believers, that are allowed to roam on a Christian Forum, that the Bible is not the written Word of God. "Yea hath God said?"
Stranger
Sure. You know full well. You, the non-believer, I the believer, yet I am the troll? Just because you pretend to put me on ignore doesn't mean you cant see my posts if you are not logged in. So read em and hide.
Neither you or Guiliano believes the Bible is the Word of God. And all yall are trying to do is create that doubt in others. It won't work. Believers believe. Non-believers, like yall, don't. You can't change the Leopards spots.
Stranger
You don't have the right attitude then. You can improve.
Matthew 5:11 Blessed are ye, when men shall revile you, and persecute you, and shall say all manner of evil against you falsely, for my sake.
Go ahead, say I'm not doing for Jesus' sake. But I'm the one who's content.
Luke 6:41 And why beholdest thou the mote that is in thy brother’s eye, but perceivest not the beam that is in thine own eye?
I'm laughing again. Don't you realize I don't take anything you say seriously anymore? I don't care what shnarkle is in your book as if I'd take your word for what he is. I've been known to get along with . . . can you believe it . . . publicans and sinners. I have friends who are atheists. You won't believe it, but a few stopped being atheists. Try it -- try some love for a change. You might enjoy life more.
I'm not concerned about your view of my attitude. Big deal.
(Matt. 5:11) does nothing to show that you believe the Bible is the Word of God. Nothing. Just because you feel persecuted doesn't mean you are persecuted for the right reasons. People in hell feel persecuted also.
Shnarkle is an unbeliever and a coward in my book. That you have friends who are atheists is one thing, that you lean to their beliefs is another. You're right, I don't believe much of what you say. Why should I. You disbelieve the Bible is the Word of God, why should your words mean anything to me?
You're in a long line of people who use 'love' to further their anti-christian beliefs. It may work with some, but it doesn't work with me.
Stranger
What a perverted way to interpret Scripture. It is all about 'love' as you see it. If you don't see the luv, then it's not from God.
You give up, just like your friend shnarkle, when you can no longer step up to the plate. You have failed already in not answering my questions before. Much easier to ignore than to answer.
You will give up after a while and hide behind ignore rather than face the truth.
Stranger
Waiting on him
Well-Known Member
Matthew 26:67-68 KJV
[67] Then did they spit in his face, and buffeted him; and others smote him with the palms of their hands, [68] Saying, Prophesy unto us, thou Christ, Who is he that smote thee?
Tecarta Bible
VictoryinJesus
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It’s not logical an ass should speak. Numbers 22:28-32 And the Lord opened the mouth of the ass, and she said unto Balaam, What have I done unto thee, that thou hast smitten me these three times? [29] And Balaam said unto the ass, Because thou hast mocked me: I would there were a sword in mine hand, for now would I kill thee. [30] And the ass said unto Balaam, Am not I thine ass, upon which thou hast ridden ever since I was thine unto this day? was I ever wont to do so unto thee? And he said, Nay. [31] Then the Lord opened the eyes of Balaam, and he saw the angel of the Lord standing in the way, and his sword drawn in his hand: and he bowed down his head, and fell flat on his face. [32] And the angel of the Lord said unto him, Wherefore hast thou smitten thine ass these three times? behold, I went out to withstand thee, because thy way is perverse before me:
Waiting on him
Well-Known Member
So many Christians view The New Testament rod of correction(sword) as one they’re to wield(the hand of god) never coming to the knowledge of the truth, that, the rod is in the hand of God meant for their correction.
Hebrews 4:12 KJV
[12] For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart.
Tecarta BibleIt’s the spirit of man warring against the spirit of God that’s in need of correction
Matthew 22:36 Master, which is the great commandment in the law?
37 Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
38 This is the first and great commandment.
39 And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
40 On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.
I write you off as a dark soul, one who denies God is Love and all His words in the Scriptures are about Love. You may fool yourself, but I don't think you fool many other people. Please correct yourself.
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Ha, do you think the two men with Balaam saw the angel or heard what the ass said? They didn't. They could see Balaam talking and behaving strangely and thought he was mad.
Balaam was a powerful prophet. That's what made him so dangerous. His powers as a prophet were stronger at night; and apparently he lacked the ability to talk with animals even at night. Suddenly the angel of the LORD opened his spiritual ears and eyes in the daytime, even to the point where he could hear what his ass was thinking or saying. This was meant to reprove him as was making him look ridiculous in front of his two servants; but he persisted on the wrong course. Animals don't have vocal cords. They can't speak the way humans do.
I agree. Does that mean the Living Word of God, or does it mean the Bible? Our Bibles can't read our thoughts -- so it can't be talking about a book. The Living Word can divide even the soul from the spirit -- a book can't do that. Jesus could discern what people were thinking. . . . Can we see it?
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Waiting on him
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Write me off however you like. I never denied the love of God. I don't use the 'luv' of God to reject the inspiration of the Bible, as you do.
Stranger
Jesus said 'It is written'. (Matt. 4:4,7,10)
Jesus said every word in the Law, down to the jot and title, shall be fuflilled. (Matt. 5:17-18)
Note He did not say just the 'luv' passages.
Stranger
"Any" book. The Bible may speak about Jesus; but they are not him. We should not think we can find eternal life by reading the Bible. We have to come to know they mean in reality.
John 5:39 Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me.
They had read their books which spoke of him but didn't recognize him when they saw him. All their reading had been in vain.
I think something becomes Scripture only after it's written in our hearts. If it's not in our hearts, it's still words on a page.
Deuteronomy 6:6 And these words, which I command thee this day, shall be in thine heart:
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VictoryinJesus
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I don’t know since I wasn’t there. God can make the dead come to life. He can open or shut a womb. Point is God takes that which illogical and makes it perfectly logical. Of course you are free to take out whatever you like. For me... it was alarming in no matter how many times God says a thing; man gets the final say what stays and what goes when it doesn’t suit man. No matter how many verses says a thing it doesn’t matter...they all are riddled with errors. I struggled with it because, yes, it caused me to question once man can call error: where does it end? Unless I’ve misunderstood this isn’t the first in our conversation...you’ve questioned Paul in assuming you are more right and Paul less right where you don’t understand. His word cast down vain imaginations but if there is nothing but errors then man can just right off whatever man doesn’t like as an error. I’m the one with the problem since what I’ve learned here is; there is a very fine line between being respectful to others and not being so closed minded that you won’t hear another’s opinions and allowing others to rule and dominate your thoughts. Once you and snarkle began laughter and bantering back and forth about others who want to believe things that are not logical...it was insulting. The more you claimed the persecuted card, the more insulting it became. The more love was mentioned, the less I saw it. Something I need to deal with and ask Him why? People get Ridiculed everyday for the things of God others say can not possibly be logical. Again, I fully see it is my problem in needing tougher skin or less of it: something I need to work on with Him.
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The Bible is the written Word of God. Jesus is the living Word of God.
Concerning (John 5:39), the problem wasn't that the Scriptures were not the Word of God. The problem was that they rejected Jesus whom the Scriptures spoke of. Your problem is you reject the Scriptures as the Word of God, and so use them to create another jesus. A jesus in your image.
The Bible is the Word of God period, no matter who reads it.
Stranger
Maybe I discussed that passage from Paul; if so, I don't remember. All too often people read something, imagine they know what it means, and then never question themselves about it again. I read a passage that seems to say Jesus rode two animals and scratch my head -- that's the picture I'm imagining. When I read a passage that says one, again I scratch my head. Is it one or two? I could imagine God says it's both. Then I cling to that when one or the other needs to cast down.
While there are "added" passages in the Bible, most of what look like contradictions can be explained. Things can be sorted out.
I brought up the matter of Jeconiah and how none of his sons would sit on the throne of David. No one had an answer for how Jesus could be descended from him. I think I found a very good answer. I didn't come up with myself but found it by searching. I "imagined" something when reading that passage and "forgot" something else. When I found the answer, I realized I had "imagined" something -- thinking I knew what that passage meant when I did not.
I think there is a good explanation too on why Matthew omits three generations. (I don't have an explanation yet for the other one he omits.) If someone is "imagining" that Matthew is concerned only with a list fleshly ancestors of Jesus, the whole thing falls apart. Joseph was not his father according to the flesh since Mary was a virgin. People who say they believe the Bible is the "literal" truth are apt to read that list and think it means earthly things -- how men had sons after the flesh. If I can admit that perhaps my imagination was wrong with thinking it a list of how men had sex with their wives to produce sons, maybe I can come to the spiritual meaning, the real truth. The clues are there -- it should be impossible to believe what some believe. When the Bible says things that seem absurd or impossible, that is often a clue to give those passages a spiritual meaning.
I can tell you what I believe about those if you like. You're free to accept or reject my explanations, but I don't think it's safe to look at that list and say, "It looks absurd, but it must be true" without seeking an explanation. It does look absurd. It is absurd if we don't find what it means spiritually but want to insist on giving it the physical meaning in our imagination. Indeed it is false in historical terms, but it's true in spiritual terms. People reduce it to a meaningless list of people without any spiritual meaning, disobeying Paul:
Titus 3:9 But avoid foolish questions, and genealogies, and contentions, and strivings about the law; for they are unprofitable and vain.
I think the explanation about Jeconiah is beautiful. It explained for me why he was on that list. Should I give it? At first glance, it looks impossible since he was told none of his offspring would sit on the throne of David and then we're told in Matthew he was an ancestor of Jesus. What we "imagine" about those passages could be wrong; and I say people are too apt to think their imaginations are right and then they can embrace contradictions and absurdities. That's why I object to people who call themselves "literalists" -- they think the first meaning that appears in their minds must be right.
Waiting on him
Well-Known Member
I think the heart is involved some way or another. Moses and David were shepherds -- and their sheep had to trust them. If Jesus is our shepherd, we have to trust him in our hearts.
Let me take up the matter of Jeconiah now who was meant to be a shepherd for God's people and wasn't.
Jeconiah was wicked. He was not the "seed of David" except in the physical sense. His heart was corrupt, and God passed judgment. What that passage doesn't tell us however is that he repented after being carried off in captivity in Babylon. (I don't even know if that's in the Bible; but I know the Jews say he repented.) The curse got removed; and there is a clue when the word signet is used again:
Haggai 2:23 In that day, saith the Lord of hosts, will I take thee, O Zerubbabel, my servant, the son of Shealtiel, saith the Lord, and will make thee as a signet: for I have chosen thee, saith the Lord of hosts.
When Jeconiah repented, he became again a son of David spiritually as well as in the flesh; and his son was a son of David too in both ways.
Remember the Jews who said they were children of Abraham and Jesus said they weren't?
The three kings omitted by Matthew were also wicked, not true sons of David spiritually. I love the story about Jeconiah since it shows that curses aren't eternal. People always have the chance to change. When I first read the passage in Jeremiah, I mistakenly thought the curse was eternal, forgetting the Mercy of God.
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