What to do when you are beyond repentance?

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batheltler01

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@batheltler01,

I think that your aim here is to set yourself forth as an example of one who has fallen away, in order to combat the doctrine that we cannot fall away if we have a living and saving faith in Jesus Christ.

I did this at one time in my life. I thought that OSAS was so deplorable that I was willing to lose my salvation (in the public sense, although not in reality) in order to prove that it was false.

Fact of the matter is, that if your conversion was genuine, your salvation is secure no matter what you are feeling.

If you end up actually departing from the Lord in a concise way so that there is a clear and evident separation from the faith spoken of in 1 Corinthians 15:1-4; if you depart from the faith entirely; then I would say that you never were a true believer but maybe only thought you were.

But from your testimony I would say that it seems to me that you have been a genuine believer.

Therefore I would say that you are simply experiencing a season of being in the wilderness as a believer.


I think you may be right about me trying to set myself as an example. I'm not sure what further use I can be to the kingdom other than to be a physical representation of the reality of falling away. I'm not even sure if this can be useful to other believers but I don't see anything else to be done.

I have two questions, though, for anyone who would be willing to answer this:
1. What can I do in this state for the glory of Christ?
2. I don't want to depart from the faith but I feel that it is inevitable. If it is, truly, inevitable what then should I do?

Also, I want to honestly thank you and everyone else who has spoken into this situation for your willingness to talk to me though this time. I've been really up and down, out of it and emotional throughout the last 2 years. So thanks for your heart.
 

Waiting on him

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I think you may be right about me trying to set myself as an example. I'm not sure what further use I can be to the kingdom other than to be a physical representation of the reality of falling away. I'm not even sure if this can be useful to other believers but I don't see anything else to be done.

I have two questions, though, for anyone who would be willing to answer this:
1. What can I do in this state for the glory of Christ?
2. I don't want to depart from the faith but I feel that it is inevitable. If it is, truly, inevitable what then should I do?

Also, I want to honestly thank you and everyone else who has spoken into this situation for your willingness to talk to me though this time. I've been really up and down, out of it and emotional throughout the last 2 years. So thanks for your heart.
Be content the word abase means to be depressed = answer to question 1

Be content is the answer to question # 2
 

farouk

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I think you may be right about me trying to set myself as an example. I'm not sure what further use I can be to the kingdom other than to be a physical representation of the reality of falling away. I'm not even sure if this can be useful to other believers but I don't see anything else to be done.

I have two questions, though, for anyone who would be willing to answer this:
1. What can I do in this state for the glory of Christ?
2. I don't want to depart from the faith but I feel that it is inevitable. If it is, truly, inevitable what then should I do?

Also, I want to honestly thank you and everyone else who has spoken into this situation for your willingness to talk to me though this time. I've been really up and down, out of it and emotional throughout the last 2 years. So thanks for your heart.
Romans 2 is a great chapter to read on the subject of repentance. It can be a real blessing read.
 

illini1959

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It's actually quite strange. When this started 2 years ago and I felt the Spirit leave, I immediately forgot almost everything about my life with Christ and who God was. All my spiritual knowledge and experiences with the Lord out the window in a moment. All I can remember is bits of conversations I had with lost people and false converts in college where I was sharing my testimony. I'll try to remember as much as I can but it's like trying to remember a dream.

Hello again, first I apologize for the delay in my reply. I don't really post on weekends. I appreciate you taking the time to reply to my question and I did read your link, which helped.

Second, realizing we can't judge one another's heart, between your post here and the link you provided it seems like you had a genuine conversion - the second time. This being the case I can tell you with every confidence that the Spirit did not leave you. We are sealed:

Ephesians 1:13-14 "In him you also, when you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation, and believed in him, were sealed with the promised Holy Spirit, who is the guarantee of our inheritance until we acquire possession of it, to the praise of his glory."

I believe someone else also told you that nothing! can take us out of His hands. Nothing.

I grew up in a Christian household. One day when I was around 5 we got home from church one day and my dad took me in his room and asked me if I had ever asked Jesus into my heart. I responded with a no. I wasn't aware that I needed to. My dad, in a round-about way, communicated that if I didn't I would go to hell and be separated from God as well as them. So as any 5 year old would do in that situation, I agreed to accept Jesus and prayed a prayer with my dad. Went before the church and got baptized. Thought I was all set. Except that there was no life change. No change in heart or desire. No hatred of sin and yearning to know Christ more.

The fact that you recognize this says volumes, in a good way.

A few years later we moved to a new city and a new church. When I was 10 I went to a youth conference with the youth group. It was a few days long, I recall. I remember the next to last day the speaker came out and said something to the effect of, "I had a sermon planned out but I feel the Spirit leading me to read out of Matthew." So he read out of Matthew and talked about what he was reading. He spoke specifically about the crucifixion, as I recall. I remember the Lord convicting me of sin in that moment. It became real. But I was confused because I fully believed that I was already a Christian. I remember having a deep sense of the reality that I did not actually know God at that time and that I needed to respond by going up front during the invitation. That invitation seemed to go on foreeeeeever. Eventually I decided to respond but it was difficult to even get up. Like my body was heavy. Like there were bricks on me. Eventually, I stood up, the weight dissipated and I went up front and spoke to some guy about becoming a Christian.

Oppression. Even then. I agree with your dr. - you already have an amazing testimony.

And that was that. Nothing flashy or emotional. But I'm confided I was a believer because there was a clear change in my life and desires afterwards. I really did want to know Christ more deeply after that. I really hated sin and experienced conviction. I desired to submit my life to Christ and serve him. And even through the backsliding that occurred throughout my childhood, teen years and college years, the Lord always brought me back to him through repentance and I found new growth and a restored relationship. So that's it.

Very rarely is conversion flashy or emotional. Faith isn't about feeling, it's about believing in what you can't see. 2 Corinthians 5:7 is one of my go-to verses - "For we walk by faith, not by sight." Or feelings....

Unfortunately, that is not longer the case for me. I have reverted back to a state of lostness. If you are interested in reading that account, I'll leave a link below to it.

Loss of Salvation? : TrueChristian

I don't believe you've 'reverted' back to a state of lostness because, as I said above, you can't lose what God promised. The Holy Spirit doesn't jump in and out of us.

But...

If satan can't have you for hell, he will try to render your faith useless. Believers can't be possessed but they can - and very often are - oppressed. It's likely that's you.

There is a battle plan.

Another go-to verse I use is James 4:7 "Submit yourselves therefore to God. Resist the devil, and he will flee from you."

If at all possible read Ephesians 6 - or if you can't bring yourself to read BibleGateway has an audio feature. Set it to Eph 6 and let someone else do the reading for you and you just listen.

Put on that full armor. Satan does not want you to do this. That's when James comes in - submit to God and resist. Resist and he will flee from you - not 'he might' - he will. He HAS to.

It's good to pray and cry out to God as you've been doing, but also it's important sometimes to just stand firm. At least 15 times in the bible - 10 in the NT - are the words 'stand firm' used. The battle is ultimately God's. Stand firm.

The other thing important to remember is the devil is the father of lies. He's a lying liar who lies. He wants you to feel there is NO forgiveness for your sins, that you're useless, worthless, no good to God and there's NO way He'll forgive you let alone save you. Lies all lies.

God LOVES you. That is the truth. Jesus died for YOU while you were YET A SINNER. Me, too. Knowing I would continue to sin, He died for me.

I will be praying for you. I pray a lot, and I pray warfare prayer all the time; God's called me to intercede years ago. If you know anyone at all - doesn't have to be a pastor but someone you know without a doubt to be a believer - you need serious hands on prayer if possible. I know there are people on these boards who've said they're praying, too so take heart. The name of Jesus knows no distance - it's the power of the Name and we don't have to be right there with you.

Feel free to message me anytime. I am lifting you up, asking God to tie the hands and bind every enemy, to deliver you in the name of Jesus. I have a family member deep into sexual sin, I understand how strong that is. However - He Who is in you is greater than he who is in the world!! Remember that.

Keep us posted. God bless and be with you.
 
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farouk

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So I made a post some time ago looking for wisdom about whether my sin had killed me spiritually.

If you care to read the post, here it is:
Has my sin killed me spiritually? Loss of salvation


I have come to determine with a great level of certainty that my heart has hardened past the point of repentance due to continued sin. I feel no brokenness or conviction over my sin nor do I have the desires of the Lord anymore. I find no ability to turn away from sin from a heart level like I once did. All that I am left with is severe fear of my future condemnation. As I read Hebrews, I see that my life now matches up perfectly with Hebrews 6:4, as well as Hebrews 10:26. I have spent time consulting with my pastor and other believing friends. They seem to believe that I am still a believer, but I sincerely disagree. I think they are coming around though.

As I have come to the conclusion that I am beyond repentance, my question is what is the best thing for me to do next. I cannot spend my life walking in apostasy creating greater condemnation for myself upon my death. Life is too much to live apart from Christ. There is no meaning to life other than Christ and there is no joy apart from him. I cannot continue with life apart from Christ. However, I see no other way to handle the situation other than suicide. Does anyone have any better suggestions or wisdom to give?

I know some of you may land in a more reformed camp like I once did, but there is no denial that someone can become like those mentioned in Hebrews. I have become one. What then do I do now?
Keep cherishing and trusting the promises of Scripture, instead of being introspective.
 

Windmillcharge

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I have two questions, though, for anyone who would be willing to answer this:
1. What can I do in this state for the glory of Christ?
2. I don't want to depart from the faith but I feel that it is inevitable. If it is, truly, inevitable what then should I do?

You could repent of the arogance that says I know what God wants of me.
If you truely want to bring glory to Christ you will serve him as his creature.

You claim your deoparture from Christianity is inevitable, again that is arogance saying you know better than God.
What do you do, seek God.
 
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Davy

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So I made a post some time ago looking for wisdom about whether my sin had killed me spiritually.

If you care to read the post, here it is:
Has my sin killed me spiritually? Loss of salvation


I have come to determine with a great level of certainty that my heart has hardened past the point of repentance due to continued sin. I feel no brokenness or conviction over my sin nor do I have the desires of the Lord anymore. I find no ability to turn away from sin from a heart level like I once did. All that I am left with is severe fear of my future condemnation. As I read Hebrews, I see that my life now matches up perfectly with Hebrews 6:4, as well as Hebrews 10:26. I have spent time consulting with my pastor and other believing friends. They seem to believe that I am still a believer, but I sincerely disagree. I think they are coming around though.

As I have come to the conclusion that I am beyond repentance, my question is what is the best thing for me to do next. I cannot spend my life walking in apostasy creating greater condemnation for myself upon my death. Life is too much to live apart from Christ. There is no meaning to life other than Christ and there is no joy apart from him. I cannot continue with life apart from Christ. However, I see no other way to handle the situation other than suicide. Does anyone have any better suggestions or wisdom to give?

I know some of you may land in a more reformed camp like I once did, but there is no denial that someone can become like those mentioned in Hebrews. I have become one. What then do I do now?

TROLL!
 

aspen

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So I made a post some time ago looking for wisdom about whether my sin had killed me spiritually.

If you care to read the post, here it is:
Has my sin killed me spiritually? Loss of salvation

Love. If you love perfectly you will not sin
I have come to determine with a great level of certainty that my heart has hardened past the point of repentance due to continued sin. I feel no brokenness or conviction over my sin nor do I have the desires of the Lord anymore. I find no ability to turn away from sin from a heart level like I once did. All that I am left with is severe fear of my future condemnation. As I read Hebrews, I see that my life now matches up perfectly with Hebrews 6:4, as well as Hebrews 10:26. I have spent time consulting with my pastor and other believing friends. They seem to believe that I am still a believer, but I sincerely disagree. I think they are coming around though.

As I have come to the conclusion that I am beyond repentance, my question is what is the best thing for me to do next. I cannot spend my life walking in apostasy creating greater condemnation for myself upon my death. Life is too much to live apart from Christ. There is no meaning to life other than Christ and there is no joy apart from him. I cannot continue with life apart from Christ. However, I see no other way to handle the situation other than suicide. Does anyone have any better suggestions or wisdom to give?

I know some of you may land in a more reformed camp like I once did, but there is no denial that someone can become like those mentioned in Hebrews. I have become one. What then do I do now?
 

aspen

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With my will I am constantly trying to push back into relationship with the Lord. I know that only in him is there true joy and satisfaction. Psalm 16:11. But my heart feels like a stone in my chest and I can't honestly say I desire repentance. It doesn't seem to desire anything. But I want to keep pushing into Christ. Can I still be a Christian and be this way?
I'm finding myself feeling extremely condemned and fearful of that condemnation. As I examine myself I see how my heart and mind have changed completely. However, when I allow myself to be sure that I am still a Christian, I find that I have much less of a desire to pursue Christ. He seems less important. This ought not be and hasn't been in the past. I feel like I'm only able to fear my condemnation but not desire to be in relationship with Christ. I've asked the Lord to change my heart and help me desire and love him again, but nothing is changing. I know I haven't willingly, consciously said that I do not want a relationship with the Lord, but it very much seems like, from the state of my heart, that the I am beyond repentance.

this is the human condition. Don’t give up the fight! The only way you lose the race is to give into selfish living
 
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The wind

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So I made a post some time ago looking for wisdom about whether my sin had killed me spiritually.

If you care to read the post, here it is:
Has my sin killed me spiritually? Loss of salvation


I have come to determine with a great level of certainty that my heart has hardened past the point of repentance due to continued sin. I feel no brokenness or conviction over my sin nor do I have the desires of the Lord anymore. I find no ability to turn away from sin from a heart level like I once did. All that I am left with is severe fear of my future condemnation. As I read Hebrews, I see that my life now matches up perfectly with Hebrews 6:4, as well as Hebrews 10:26. I have spent time consulting with my pastor and other believing friends. They seem to believe that I am still a believer, but I sincerely disagree. I think they are coming around though.

As I have come to the conclusion that I am beyond repentance, my question is what is the best thing for me to do next. I cannot spend my life walking in apostasy creating greater condemnation for myself upon my death. Life is too much to live apart from Christ. There is no meaning to life other than Christ and there is no joy apart from him. I cannot continue with life apart from Christ. However, I see no other way to handle the situation other than suicide. Does anyone have any better suggestions or wisdom to give?

I know some of you may land in a more reformed camp like I once did, but there is no denial that someone can become like those mentioned in Hebrews. I have become one. What then do I do now?


The reality is that the falling away has happened already: and there was 666 that fell away. These are they that truly believed and were baptized into the body of Christ by God's anointed with the holy Spirit. Then being in the holy temple of God they defiled it with the works of man: these are they that have not received the holy Ghost.
 

aspen

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The reality is that the falling away has happened already: and there was 666 that fell away. These are they that truly believed and were baptized into the body of Christ by God's anointed with the holy Spirit. Then being in the holy temple of God they defiled it with the works of man: these are they that have not received the holy Ghost.

verse?
 

Steve Owen

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So I made a post some time ago looking for wisdom about whether my sin had killed me spiritually.

If you care to read the post, here it is:
Has my sin killed me spiritually? Loss of salvation


I have come to determine with a great level of certainty that my heart has hardened past the point of repentance due to continued sin. I feel no brokenness or conviction over my sin nor do I have the desires of the Lord anymore. I find no ability to turn away from sin from a heart level like I once did. All that I am left with is severe fear of my future condemnation. As I read Hebrews, I see that my life now matches up perfectly with Hebrews 6:4, as well as Hebrews 10:26. I have spent time consulting with my pastor and other believing friends. They seem to believe that I am still a believer, but I sincerely disagree. I think they are coming around though.

As I have come to the conclusion that I am beyond repentance, my question is what is the best thing for me to do next. I cannot spend my life walking in apostasy creating greater condemnation for myself upon my death. Life is too much to live apart from Christ. There is no meaning to life other than Christ and there is no joy apart from him. I cannot continue with life apart from Christ. However, I see no other way to handle the situation other than suicide. Does anyone have any better suggestions or wisdom to give?

I know some of you may land in a more reformed camp like I once did, but there is no denial that someone can become like those mentioned in Hebrews. I have become one. What then do I do now?
It is Satan insinuating that you are beyond repentance. 'If we confess our sins, He is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.' I see no qualification there. The only unforgivable sin is impenitence, so stop worrying about your feelings, repent and pray. 'The one who comes to Me [in genuine repentance and faith] I will by no means cast out.' If you are worried about hell, you still have faith in God or you wouldn't be worried.
 
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Davy

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I don't understand. Are you saying I'm trolling?

Pretty much. Your words lack sincerity. If you really 'wanted' to believe on Jesus Christ as your Saviour, and follow His commandments, then you would do it, and not doubt. Your doubt reveals your insincerity.

James 1:5-8
5 If any of you lack wisdom, let him ask of God, That giveth to all men liberally, and upbraideth not; and it shall be given him.

6 But let him ask in faith, nothing wavering. For he that wavereth is like a wave of the sea driven with the wind and tossed.

7 For let not that man think that he shall receive any thing of the Lord.

8 A double minded man is unstable in all his ways.
KJV
 

batheltler01

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Pretty much. Your words lack sincerity. If you really 'wanted' to believe on Jesus Christ as your Saviour, and follow His commandments, then you would do it, and not doubt. Your doubt reveals your insincerity.

James 1:5-8
5 If any of you lack wisdom, let him ask of God, That giveth to all men liberally, and upbraideth not; and it shall be given him.

6 But let him ask in faith, nothing wavering. For he that wavereth is like a wave of the sea driven with the wind and tossed.

7 For let not that man think that he shall receive any thing of the Lord.

8 A double minded man is unstable in all his ways.
KJV

There are few things I have been more sincere about in my life. I wish I was trolling...
Unfortunately, I can't produce Holy Spirit wrought faith out of my flesh. But think what you will.
 

Helen

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There are few things I have been more sincere about in my life. I wish I was trolling...
Unfortunately, I can't produce Holy Spirit wrought faith out of my flesh. But think what you will.


I don't believe one bit that you are beyond repentance.
If you were then you wouldn't care as much.
There is still something within you that wants God...He know that, and He will meet you. ✟
 
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batheltler01

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I don't believe one bit that you are beyond repentance.
If you were then you wouldn't care as much.
There is still something within you that wants God...He know that, and He will meet you. ✟

How do I find that deep repentance again? I've pursued Christ in his word and through prayer to no avail. I don't know what to do.
 

farouk

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How do I find that deep repentance again? I've pursued Christ in his word and through prayer to no avail. I don't know what to do.
Keep pursuing the reading of Scripture in a trusting way, seeing the Saviour there in all His glory... Philippians 2; Ephesians 2; Psalm 46; are great passages.
 

Jay Ross

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How do I find that deep repentance again? I've pursued Christ in his word and through prayer to no avail. I don't know what to do.

Because Abraham believe, it was counted towards him as righteous. The same is true about believing in God/Jesus, it requires us to believe first in God/Jesus' promises of salvation, then salvation will come as a small quite voice from the throne room of God guiding us into His righteous.

Shalom