When did Daniel 7:13-14 happen?

[Marty fox]

If this was Revelation 20:11, then there would no longer even be a heaven or earth. Current reality would not even exist. Direction up or down would not relate to anything. Neither would coming or going. There would not even be time, as this would be outside of creation. The Word already returned all of creation back to God, the ancient of days. Only the Word and God exist at this point. The NHNE would already have happened for those beings created that moved on into the new reality. This would be a scene in eternity, with no relationship to a created reality at all.

I have no idea of what you are talking about I never said that Daniel 7:13 was the same time as Revelation 20:11 it isn’t

I seam to keep getting miss quoted in this thread

 

[Waiting on him]

I have no idea of what you are talking about I never said that Daniel 7:13 was the same time as Revelation 20:11 it isn’t

I seam to keep getting miss quoted in this thread

Some wish to discover truth, some wish to dictate truth.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

Hebrews 10:12-13 confirms the timing of this when Jesus sat down at the right hand of the Father when He presented Himself to the Father as our one time sacrificial Lamb.

this should be enough for you to realize that Dan. 7 has not happened yet!

God the Father is king of heaven, not Jesus! Jesus sat at His right hand and no t on the throne of heaven.

Jesus has not yet taken rule of His kingdom, which will happen when He physically returns to earth. His kingdom lasts for 1,000 years when He gives it bak to His Father as is written in 1 Cor. 15

 

[Marty fox]

this should be enough for you to realize that Dan. 7 has not happened yet!

God the Father is king of heaven, not Jesus! Jesus sat at His right hand and no t on the throne of heaven.

Jesus has not yet taken rule of His kingdom, which will happen when He physically returns to earth. His kingdom lasts for 1,000 years when He gives it bak to His Father as is written in 1 Cor. 15

Jesus says different

John 18:36
Jesus said, “My kingdom is not of this world. If it were, my servants would fight to prevent my arrest by the Jewish leaders. But now my kingdom is from another place.”

Jesus speaks of a current reality

 

[Truth7t7]

this should be enough for you to realize that Dan. 7 has not happened yet!

God the Father is king of heaven, not Jesus! Jesus sat at His right hand and no t on the throne of heaven.

Jesus has not yet taken rule of His kingdom, which will happen when He physically returns to earth. His kingdom lasts for 1,000 years when He gives it bak to His Father as is written in 1 Cor. 15

No such thing as a 1,000 year kingdom on this earth, it's a fabricated fairy tale of man

Jesus returns in fire and final judgment, dissolving this earth by fire (The End)

 

[Marilyn C]

Ancient Greece

"Following the Classical period was the Hellenistic period (323–146 BC), during which Greek culture and power expanded into the Near and Middle East from the death of Alexander until the Roman conquest. Roman Greece is usually counted from the Roman victory over the Corinthians at the Battle of Corinth in 146 BC to the establishment of Byzantium by Constantine as the capital of the Roman Empire in AD 330."

The Kingdom of God/Heaven was established by Christ at His first advent.

During the fourth kingdom, the Roman Empire.

Long ago.

yes history shows that Rome took over from Greece. However Rome could not have trodden down Babylon or the Medes and Persian as that rulership was long gone, judged by God. Thus those 4 beastly kingdom/Federations of Dan. 7 are contemporary to when the Lord sets up His rulership on earth through Israel.

The kingdom/rulership of God was when He made the third heaven. Christ has always been king of Glory, King of Heaven and King of the Ages. All well before He was manifest on earth.

When Jesus ascended to the Father it was then He was made King Priest, (High Priest).

 

[Marilyn C]

The faithful before the cross are saved in the same way as the faithful after the cross

If you read the book of Daniel you will see that he survived the foreign control of Babylon the Medes and the Persians and then in chapter 10 we see that the kingdom of Greece will still come. Rome is never mentioned by Daniel

The book of Daniel is to show that if you stay faithful You will thrive and survive. It also showed that a persecution was coming form Antiochus Epehanies but the faithful would overcome.

Antiochus was the 11th in line but 3 were uprooted before him and he became the 8th king

The book of Daniel is to show that Christ is King of the Ages: He knows, He planned and He will fulfill all His purposes for Israel and the nations as foretold in the prophecies of Daniel.

And if you read further on in God`s word we read of the Romans in Luke 2: 1, revealing God certainly knows who would be the world rulers.

Now God`s word is NOT all about us, but for us to read and learn of God`s purposes through Christ for - the nations, for Israel and finally for the Body of Christ. Get those groups muddled up and God`s word becomes all about US.

 

[covenantee]

yes history shows that Rome took over from Greece. However Rome could not have trodden down Babylon or the Medes and Persian as that rulership was long gone, judged by God. Thus those 4 beastly kingdom/Federations of Dan. 7 are contemporary to when the Lord sets up His rulership on earth through Israel.

The kingdom/rulership of God was when He made the third heaven. Christ has always been king of Glory, King of Heaven and King of the Ages. All well before He was manifest on earth.

When Jesus ascended to the Father it was then He was made King Priest, (High Priest).

Nothing in Daniel 7 specifies that Rome would trod down Babylon or the Medo-Persians. We know from history that it conquered Greece, as well as various kingdoms during the time of the Roman Empire.

Hebrews 2:17
Wherefore in all things it behoved him to be made like unto his brethren, that he might be a merciful and faithful high priest in things pertaining to God, to make reconciliation for the sins of the people.

Jesus was already High Priest here on earth, making reconciliation for the sins of the people at Calvary.

He could not make that reconciliation unless He was already High Priest.

 

[Marilyn C]

Nothing in Daniel 7 asserts that Rome would trod down Babylon or the Medo-Persians. We know from history that it conquered Greece, as well as various kingdoms during the time of the Roman Empire.

Hebrews 2:17
Wherefore in all things it behoved him to be made like unto his brethren, that he might be a merciful and faithful high priest in things pertaining to God, to make reconciliation for the sins of the people.

Jesus was already High Priest here on earth, making reconciliation for the sins of the people at Calvary.

If people believe that the terrifying beastly kingdom is Rome then it is shown that that beast treads down the other beasts. (Dan. 7: 7) Which then shows that it can`t be Rome for the first two beasts (their rulership) would not around in Rome`s time.

Yes we believe that Jesus is the Highpriest, however it was not until He ascended to the Father with His `own blood,` (as it were) to present Himself before the presence of the Father. (Heb. 9: 24)

Also IF He were on earth He would NOT be a priest. `For if He were on earth he would not be a priest, since there are priest who offer gift according to the law.` (Heb. 8: 4)

 

[covenantee]

If people believe that the terrifying beastly kingdom is Rome then it is shown that that beast treads down the other beasts. (Dan. 7: 7) Which then shows that it can`t be Rome for the first two beasts (their rulership) would not around in Rome`s time.

Yes we believe that Jesus is the Highpriest, however it was not until He ascended to the Father with His `own blood,` (as it were) to present Himself before the presence of the Father. (Heb. 9: 24)

Also IF He were on earth He would NOT be a priest. `For if He were on earth he would not be a priest, since there are priest who offer gift according to the law.` (Heb. 8: 4)

Daniel 7:7 says nothing about Rome treading down other beasts. It simply says that it was diverse from the beasts which were before it, which it was.

Hebrews 8:4
NASB
Now if He were on earth, He would not be a priest at all, since there are those who offer the gifts according to the Law;
AMPC
If then He were still living on earth, He would not be a priest at all, for there are [already priests] who offer the gifts in accordance with the Law.

The writer of Hebrews is referring to the post-Calvary time ("still living"), when he wrote.

Christ was High Priest before Calvary.

He could not have made reconciliation for sins at Calvary unless He was already High Priest.

 

[Marty fox]

The book of Daniel is to show that Christ is King of the Ages: He knows, He planned and He will fulfill all His purposes for Israel and the nations as foretold in the prophecies of Daniel.

And if you read further on in God`s word we read of the Romans in Luke 2: 1, revealing God certainly knows who would be the world rulers.

Now God`s word is NOT all about us, but for us to read and learn of God`s purposes through Christ for - the nations, for Israel and finally for the Body of Christ. Get those groups muddled up and God`s word becomes all about US.

Or it was about God judging Israel and preserving the faithful.

It was also about the future (at that time) deserving persecution of Israel during the time of the Maccabees but also a promise that the faithful would persevere.

 

[Marilyn C]

Daniel 7:7 says nothing about Rome treading down other beasts. It simply says that it was diverse from the beasts which were before it, which it was.

Hebrews 8:4
NASB
Now if He were on earth, He would not be a priest at all, since there are those who offer the gifts according to the Law;
AMPC
If then He were still living on earth, He would not be a priest at all, for there are [already priests] who offer the gifts in accordance with the Law.

The writer of Hebrews is referring to the post-Calvary time ("still living"), when he wrote.

Christ was High Priest before Calvary.

He could not have made reconciliation for sins at Calvary unless He was already High Priest.

`After this i saw in the night visions, and behold, a fourth beast, dreadful and terrible, exceedingly strong. it had huge iron teeth; it was devouring, breaking in pieces, and trampling the residue with its feet.` (Dan. 7: 7)

Obviously it can`t be Rome doing this.

`This hope we have as an anchor of the soul, both sure and steadfast, and which enters the inner part behind the veil, where the forerunner has entered for us, even Jesus, having become High priest for ever according to the order of Melchizedek.` (Heb. 6: 19 & 20)

 

[Marilyn C]

Or it was about God judging Israel and preserving the faithful.

It was also about the future (at that time) deserving persecution of Israel during the time of the Maccabees but also a promise that the faithful would persevere.

And that is part of the timeline of God`s purposes which as yet have not come to fulfillment.

 

[covenantee]

Obviously it can`t be Rome doing this.

It certainly was Rome. That is a graphic description of the way in which the Roman Empire conquered and annihilated all of its adversaries during the centuries of its domination.

`This hope we have as an anchor of the soul, both sure and steadfast, and which enters the inner part behind the veil, where the forerunner has entered for us, even Jesus, having become High priest for ever according to the order of Melchizedek.` (Heb. 6: 19 & 20)

Yes, and it was only as High Priest already that He could have entered the inner part behind the veil. Thanks for that Scripture.

 

[Timtofly]

I have no idea of what you are talking about I never said that Daniel 7:13 was the same time as Revelation 20:11 it isn’t

I seam to keep getting miss quoted in this thread

So how about Genesis 1:1? They are about to create reality, and get things started.

 

[Marilyn C]

It certainly was Rome. That is a graphic description of the way in which the Roman Empire conquered and annihilated all of its adversaries during the centuries of its domination.



Yes, and it was only as High Priest already that He could have entered the inner part behind the veil. Thanks for that Scripture.

yes Rome certainly did that but not to Babylon and Medes and Persian rulers if you are looking to those 4 beasts to be historic.

Christ only became High priest when He fulfilled all the requirements of the justice of God. How could Christ intercede before He had made Himself the sacrifice and then present Himself in the heavenly Holy of Holies, the Father`s very presence?

 

[covenantee]

yes Rome certainly did that but not to Babylon and Medes and Persian rulers if you are looking to those 4 beasts to be historic.

There is no Scripture saying that Rome would do anything to the Babylonians or Medo-Persians.

Christ only became High priest when He fulfilled all the requirements of the justice of God.

Scripture?

Christ could not enter behind the veil unless He was already High Priest.
Christ could not make reconciliation for sins unless He was already High Priest.

 

[Marilyn C]

There is no Scripture saying that Rome would do anything to the Babylonians or Medo-Persians.



Scripture?

Christ could not enter behind the veil unless He was already High Priest.
Christ could not make reconciliation for sins unless He was already High Priest.

Hi covenantee,

Well we are having a very interesting discussion on two topics. I appreciate it as we both have to look into God`s word with what we believe and also check out what the other is saying.

Let me ask you - `Do you see Dan. 7`s beasts as historic or contemporary?

Next - We would both agree that Jesus was appointed High Priest by the Father, (Ps. 110: 4, Heb. 7: 21) however when Jesus was on earth He had not as yet fulfilled the requirements of the pure life and His sacrifice. However when He did that He was then able to go before the Father as High priest.

 

[covenantee]

Hi covenantee,

Well we are having a very interesting discussion on two topics. I appreciate it as we both have to look into God`s word with what we believe and also check out what the other is saying.

Let me ask you - `Do you see Dan. 7`s beasts as historic or contemporary?

Next - We would both agree that Jesus was appointed High Priest by the Father, (Ps. 110: 4, Heb. 7: 21) however when Jesus was on earth He had not as yet fulfilled the requirements of the pure life and His sacrifice. However when He did that He was then able to go before the Father as High priest.

Hi Marilyn,

Daniel's beasts are historical. This is affirmed by most recognized Christian exegetes before the 19th century.

Under the Old Covenant, only the high priest alone could enter behind the veil to make annual reconciliation for the sins of the people. Christ fulfilled and satisfied these once and for all for us at Calvary. He would not have been qualified to do so without already being High Priest.

 

[Marty fox]

So how about Genesis 1:1? They are about to create reality, and get things started.

???? Sorry but I have no idea what your saying or asking me