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Where does evil come from...

Discussion in 'Bible Study Forum' started by Behold, Mar 8, 2021.

  1. Behold

    Behold Well-Known Member

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    Evil is not "created"< but it does exist.

    God is THE Creator, but He did not create "evil", in the sense of man's carnal sinning, that is a result of Satan's nature committing deeds.

    Let me explain.

    Consider Lucifer...
    "iniquity was found IN Him".....In Heaven.
    "iniquity" is "sin".......and Lucifer sinned, and the Angel's sinned who followed him.
    Before you were born again, you were a "sinner" because you operated in the nature of the Devil.
    When you were sinning, you were simply functioning as the Devil's nature.
    The Nature of the Devil, is SIN.
    The devil is "fallen", and the sin nature in a person is the "Adamic FALLEN nature".
    See that?
    So.....If you are born again, then you are born OUT of that fallen nature and into God's Nature, which is "a new Creation in Christ".
    This is why you are "ONE with God and Christ". = born again.

    So, did God create "sin" in Heaven?
    Not quite.
    Yet a sinning Being was found there...because of his nature. = fallen.

    Jesus said that Lucifer is : "a murderer from the beginning" and is the "Father of Lies".
    So, to be the Father, is to be= the Creator... To be the beginning of something is to be the creator, in this case.... And so, evil is function and proof of the Satanic nature, and is in fact the "Adamic nature" which is why the Dominion of the LAW defines you as a "SINNER".
    But...once you are born again, you are no longer under the Law's dominion, you are "under GRACE", which is the dominion of the Kingdom of God, and this Dominion redefines you, the born again, as a SAINT.

    Evil exists, because Satan exists.
    Evil is a nature, its the "sin nature"... as found in Lucifer/Satan/The Devil, and passed into us all, from Adam, because of the Fall.
    Thats your EVIL, and that is why you were evil, and that is why you have to be be born again OUT OF THAT EVIL, and into God's HOLY Spirit. = That is "born again"..."One with God"...and "in Christ", and there is no evil there, and no sin ever found.

    Jesus explains "evil" as being a nature, in this verse..>"you are OF your FATHER ..the devil, and the LUSTS of your FATHER= you will Do".
    Who are they? They are all the lost, all those who are not born again. They are literally the Devil's children, and Hell is created for the Devil and his angels, and so, the Devil's children, the Christ Rejectors, will end up with their Father, for all eternity. = Hell then the Lake of Fire.
    The Born again, end up with OUR Father, and that means with God where HE Exists, forever.

    When you were not born again, , you were guilty before God, because of this situation.
    John 3:36.
    But. HALLELUJAH !!.....Jesus has now made you ETERNALLY INNOCENT before God, by becoming your sin and taking all the eternal judgement due you.......upon Himself.
    This is the CROSS, The Blood Atonement.... and this is what it means to be "made righteous", by being given "the Gift of Righteousness", that is "THE GIFT OF SALVATION".

    So....If you are born again, and not just water baptized....then you have become the "gifted" for all eternity.
    =Welcome to being "born again".

    So, see those "lusts". "of your FATHER" in that verse???......That is evil and where it BEGAN, and why it exists.
    Its all due to Satan and his LUSTS which are SIN = EVIL.
    When you perform Satan's nature, as LUST, then you are committing EVIL.
    Thats where it began, and that is why it remains.
     
    Last edited: Mar 8, 2021
  2. FHII

    FHII Well-Known Member

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    Genesis 2:9... Who made and planted the tree of knowledge of good and evil?
     
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  3. Behold

    Behold Well-Known Member

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    The knowledge of "evil", is to have become aware of "sin".

    Till you know what this is, and now to do it, you don't have the Lust of the Devil.

    So, that Tree, was the "KNOWLEDGE OF">........see it?
    That is not the EVIL itself.
    The evil itself was already in the heart and nature of the Devil, as he IS FALLEN.
    Once Adam broke God's command, sin became his Knowledge, and Lust became his Nature.
    Same as the Devil.
     
  4. FHII

    FHII Well-Known Member

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    So.... Who made and/or planted the tree?
     
  5. Behold

    Behold Well-Known Member

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    The Tree is the Tree, but the "knowledge gained", is the thing...

    Its the Knowledge of Good and Evil, that is to become aware.
    Post Adamic Fall.....You can teach this as "age of accountability", and you would not be wrong, as that is a way to understand when a person is no longer a "child" and now God sees them as able to be a Christ Rejector, or not to be a Christ Rejector.
    Babies who die, all go to heaven, because they dont have yet the mental capacity to partake of the "knowledge of good and (vs) evil)"

    See, before Adam fell, he didnt have this Knowledge....
    What he had was FREE WILL. And God tested it, by saying......(paraphrase)....dont use your freewill to reject my command and do what i said not to do..
    And when Adam did that, then the KNOWLEDGE of Sin, which is Evil, became His mind of corruption (the flesh) )(the fallen man), and that is Spiritual Death.
    And from this "fallen" or "Lost" situation, we must be BORN AGAIN, to be returned to Spiritual fellowship with God, as Adam had it before he FELL.

    When God told Adam he would die......if he broke God's requirement, God was speaking of 3 Deaths
    = 3.

    Satan, the first "bible corrector" said....."hath God said"....come now, is that really what the "original" teaches........

    Here are the 3 Deaths.

    1.) Physical Death
    2.) Spiritual Death
    3.) The "Second Death". "outer Darkness".

    So, that is the END RESULT of having the "knowledge" of Good and Evil, that came from disobedience.
     
  6. Michiah-Imla

    Michiah-Imla Well-Known Member

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    1 Corinthians 8:2
    And if any man think that he knoweth any thing, he knoweth nothing yet as he ought to know.

    I’d rather focus on doing the things that please God and leave things like this where they belong; in the unknown.

    1 Corinthians 13:12
    For now we see through a glass, darkly

    Psalm 131:1
    [1] ...neither do I exercise myself in great matters, or in things too high for me.
     
  7. Ronald Nolette

    Ronald Nolette Well-Known Member

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    YOu like long OP's!

    But iniquity was found in Satans heart! God created angels and men with free will. But as many theologians said, free will requires a test to be proven. Satan s test was to endure passing on the praise of th euniverse to teh Throne of God. He was the anointed cherub. The fourth most powerful being in the universe.

    Adam and Eve had also the power of contrary choice and they also fell.

    God did not create evil, but knew it would happen given how He created angels and men, and He allowed it according to His counsel and will.
     
  8. VictoryinJesus

    VictoryinJesus Well-Known Member

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    good question (Imo). Makes me at least consider Matthew 15:13-14 But he answered and said, Every plant, which my heavenly Father hath not planted, shall be rooted up. [14] Let them alone: they be blind leaders of the blind. And if the blind lead the blind, both shall fall into the ditch.

    Ecclesiastes 3:1-3 To every thing there is a season, and a time to every purpose under the heaven: [2] A time to be born, and a time to die; a time to plant, and a time to pluck up that which is planted; [3] A time to kill, and a time to heal; a time to break down, and a time to build up;

    Yet also, Jeremiah 42:9-10 And said unto them, Thus saith the Lord, the God of Israel, unto whom ye sent me to present your supplication before him; [10] If ye will still abide in this land, then will I build you, and not pull you down, and I will plant you, and not pluck you up: for I repent me of the evil that I have done unto you.


    Tecarta Bible
     
  9. marks

    marks Well-Known Member

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    For me, it's a simple question. Anytime anyone anywhere chooses anything outside of God's desire, that is evil.

    Choosing to eat from the tree was the beginning of evil in humanity.

    Much love!
     
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  10. marks

    marks Well-Known Member

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    Something else has occurred to me regarding Satan's fall. Angels were created to be servants to man. Angel were created before man. Perhaps Satan's first sin was envy, when he realized mankind - these little mud-people - were going to be above him?

    Much love!
     
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  11. FHII

    FHII Well-Known Member

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    Ok... One more time: this time I will make it a fill in the blank answer:

    ________ created and planted the tree of knowledge of Good and evil.

    After you fill in the blank, we can discuss whether evil was created.
     
  12. Kermos

    Kermos Active Member

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    Well, you said you created a thread for me in your post Calvinism vs. Arminianism, so I visited your thread here.

    The original post that you created directly contradicts the Word of God which God had me proclaim to you in the other thread, so I post it here, and then I am done with this new thread of yours.

    The Word of God says "I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I YHWH do all these things" (Isaiah 45:7).

    That word "evil" in English is "ra" in Hebrew, and we find "ra" in "tree of the knowledge of good and evil" in Genesis 2:17.

    This means that God says that God creates evil. Your opening statement contains deceit.
     
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  13. Enoch111

    Enoch111 Well-Known Member

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    Lucifer (probably the most beautiful and prominent angel in Heaven) did NOT have a fallen nature before he rebelled against God. However, he did have free will to either obey or disobey God. Adam and Eve did not have fallen natures before they disobeyed God. But they also had freewill. And in both cases they chose to do what was evil. Only after that did they acquire fallen natures.
    On the surface this suggests that God creates evil. But the Bible clearly states that GOD IS LIGHT, AND IN HIM IS NO DARKESS AT ALL. Therefore we need to carefully examine the Hebrew word ra to see what else it means.

    Strong's Concordance
    ra': adversity
    Original Word: רַע
    Part of Speech: Adjective; noun masculine; noun feminine
    Transliteration: ra'
    Phonetic Spelling: (rah)
    Definition: bad, evil


    This needs to be further clarified through BDB's lexicon:
    1 evil, distress, adversity: יָרֵא רַע fear evil Psalm 23:4; Zephaniah 3:15; בּוֺרֵא רָ֑ע Isaiah 45:7 (of God), הביא רע Isaiah 31:2; מתאננים רַע Numbers 11:1

    So when God brings distress upon people through adversities and calamities (natural disasters), it is indeed evil since there is death an destruction when there is an earthquake or a volcanic eruption. But God has absolutely nothing to do with sinful wickedness and evil committed by evildoers.
     
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  14. Behold

    Behold Well-Known Member

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    Evil is not created.
    It exists because Satan exists.

    The Knowledge of Good and Evil, is not the creation of Evil.
    Its simply the understanding of what this means.
     
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  15. FHII

    FHII Well-Known Member

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    Ok. I get it: you aren't going to answer the question.
     
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  16. Behold

    Behold Well-Known Member

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    If i explain this to you a 3rd time, do you think it will do you any good?

    Lets try it.
    God causes Correction, and this correction is given the title, "evil"., but that is not the same as causing SIN, which is EVIL in a different sense.

    Next.
    God created the Tree of Good and Evil....but that is the Knowledge of it........which is not the same as EVIL being Created.

    So, when YOU teach or accuse God of creating EVIL, then you are accusing God Himself of creating Rape, Murder, Hate, Lust, Deceit, Pornography, Incest, and all other forums of SIN.

    Do not accuse God of creating SIN, which is the EVIL that you are referring to, because you don't understand what you are talking about.
     
  17. VictoryinJesus

    VictoryinJesus Well-Known Member

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    not to derail the thread but if the above is so...who came up with the images of a creature so deformed and evil ...and one scary looking monster?
     
  18. Behold

    Behold Well-Known Member

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    I can teach you, but i can't understand it for you.

    If you can't understand the difference between the Knowledge of Evil, which is the TREE, and doing EVIL, then, how can we pursue this conversation, beyond where your comprehension is blocked?
     
  19. Behold

    Behold Well-Known Member

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    Lucifer in fact did have a fallen nature before He sinned.
    Had he not, then he would not have sinned.
    See, its the doing that is the sin, not the temptation.
    Lucifer was , as Christ said...>"a murderer from the BEGINNING"...

    This means from the moment he fell into sin as a nature.

    He was not created as a sinner.
    But he fell into this nature, when he LUSTED for God's authority and pursued it.
    So, once he crossed the line from temptation to determination, he FELL.
    That was the beginning of "sin", and that nature in him, is the fallen nature of all unbelievers.
    Jesus said we must be born again OUT of that situation, and into a different Spirituality, = "One with God"...born again.
    If not, we die and go to hell, where all of these sin natures, never born again, exist.
     
  20. VictoryinJesus

    VictoryinJesus Well-Known Member

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    Speaking of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil...Romans 1:28-31 And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a reprobate mind, to do those things which are not convenient; [29] Being filled with all unrighteousness, fornication, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, debate, deceit, malignity; whisperers, [30] Backbiters, haters of God, despiteful, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents, [31] Without understanding, covenantbreakers, without natural affection, implacable, unmerciful:

    “Its all due to Satan and his LUSTS which are SIN = EVIL.” James 1:12-17 Blessed is the man that endureth temptation: for when he is tried, he shall receive the crown of life, which the Lord hath promised to them that love him. [13] Let no man say when he is tempted, I am tempted of God: for God cannot be tempted with evil, neither tempteth he any man: [14] But every man is tempted, when he is drawn away of his own lust, and enticed. [15] Then when lust hath conceived, it bringeth forth sin: and sin, when it is finished, bringeth forth death. [16] Do not err, my beloved brethren. [17] Every good gift and every perfect gift is from above, and cometh down from the Father of lights, with whom is no variableness, neither shadow of turning.
     
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