Where is your sin?

[Behold]

​

The immoral Christian needs to find out for themselves if they're being immoral because they aren't saved to begin with or because they've fallen away into willfully sinning because of a 'works don't matter' teaching.

Listen, people who are not saved.....= sin for the same reason that Believer's sin.
Its because sin feels good and its fun to do it.
So, lets not try to sound spiritual, lets instead just be real.

Also, there is no teaching that is "works don't matter".
No REAL Christian teaches this.
You can't find a video or post a sermon, where a Pastor, Minister, Bishop, says that "works dont matter".
What you can find is the truth that to be born again, is All of Christ, and none of Works.
You Can open a NT and find that..."Faith without works", is God's Grace.

But noone teaches that works are not a part of Discipleship.
However everyone who is skilled in correct Spirituality will never teach the Devil's gospel of "works to be saved and to stay saved".

 

[Behold]

All sin comes from not believing what God says.

Yes.

And all sin started with Adam and Eve and that Apple.
This brought the "fall" that is us all, that is resolved by the 2nd Adam who paid in blood, for the sin of the World.

 

[Behold]

Gnostic belief—the flesh doesn't matter and has no bearing on the spirit realm. Easily debunked by the scriptures....

Gnostic theology is that there is no original sin.
So, based on that, gnostics teach that there is no need for a Savior, as there is no sin that needs to be resolved, redeemed.

As i said, the father of this nonsense, (early cultish jewish mysticism) was Valentinus.
A disciple of a disciple whom Paul taught.
Valentinus became theologically flipped by secular godless philosophy, and ended up as what came to be known later as = "gnostic".

This guy almost became a POPE.

You should go and study that, as its quite fascinating.

I could teach all that, but, you should go and find out for yourself.

 

[Ferris Bueller]

Ferris, the old man is already crucified with Christ.
That is wny Paul tells you to "reckon it dead".
See, if it was not already, you could not reckon it Dead.

Paul is not telling you to reckon what is alive, as dead.
He's telling you to exist in your mind of faith as understanding what has happened to your "old man"
Its Crucified with Christ.
Its DEAD.
So, SEE IT THAT WAY.
Thats the idea., as that is the reality.

You're not answering the question. Why does the man in 1 Corinthians 5:5 have to die "so that his spirit may be saved on the Day of the Lord" if it is as you say that the sins of the flesh don't matter because they are crucified and of no account? Paul says in order for this guy to be saved when Jesus comes back he has to die this death, whatever that death is. But you say it isn't necessary for anything whatsoever to happen for this guy in his willful, flagrant sin to be saved and remain saved.

 

[Ferris Bueller]

You Can open a NT and find that..."Faith without works", is God's Grace.

Which "faith without works" is God's grace? The dead faith of James 2:14? Or the faith that justifies apart from works expressed through love (Galatians 5:6)?

But noone teaches that works are not a part of Discipleship.

Of course no one teaches that works are not a part of discipleship. What we are discussing is the Freegrace teaching that works do not mean anything whatsoever in regard to salvation. And that you can even willfully sin and do no works in a denial of Christ in unbelief and be saved when Jesus comes back.

However everyone who is skilled in correct Spirituality will never teach the Devil's gospel of "works to be saved and to stay saved".

I agree. It's not "works to be saved and to stay saved" as if works earn salvation. It's "believing to be saved and to stay saved". That's the argument. Works are simply the evidence that you are believing in God and are saved.

Show me your faith without deeds, and I will show you my faith by my deeds. James 2:18​

Not having the evidence that you are believing in God ultimately means you aren't saved and believing in God to produce that evidence.

8The one who practices sin is of the devil, because the devil has been sinning from the very start. This is why the Son of God was revealed, to destroy the works of the devil.9Anyone born of God refuses to practice sin, because God’s seed abides in him; he cannot go on sinning, because he has been born of God. 10By this the children of God are distinguished from the children of the devil: Anyone who does not practice righteousness is not of God, nor is anyone who does not love his brother. 1 John 3:8-10​

 

[Ferris Bueller]

Gnostic theology is that there is no original sin.
So, based on that, gnostics teach that there is no need for a Savior, as there is no sin that needs to be resolved, redeemed.

As i said, the father of this nonsense, (early cultish jewish mysticism) was Valentinus.
A disciple of a disciple whom Paul taught.
Valentinus became theologically flipped by secular godless philosophy, and ended up as what came to be known later as = "gnostic".

This guy almost became a POPE.

You should go and study that, as its quite fascinating.

I could teach all that, but, you should go and find out for yourself.

"...Gnosticism... First, it espouses a dualism regarding spirit and matter. Gnostics assert that matter is inherently evil and spirit is good. As a result of this presupposition, Gnostics believe anything done in the body, even the grossest sin, has no meaning because real life exists in the spirit realm only."

What is Christian Gnosticism? | GotQuestions.org​

I'm not saying you are a Gnostic. I'm saying you hold a Gnostic belief regarding the corruption of the body and the incorruptible purity of the Spirit.

 

[Behold]

You're not answering the question. Why does the man in 1 Corinthians 5:5 have to die "so that his spirit may be saved on the Day of the Lord" if it is as you say that the sins of the flesh don't matter because they are crucified and of no account? Paul says in order for this guy to be saved when Jesus comes back he has to die this death, whatever that death is. But you say it isn't necessary for anything whatsoever to happen for this guy in his willful, flagrant sin to be saved and remain saved.

That's an interesting verse.

Notice... "that his spirit may be saved"..

Well, if you are born again, your spirit is already "One with God and Christ".
It can't become more SAVED then to be joined to God's .
Dont you agree ????.
So, if this boy's spirit is NOT saved,,YET.......then what does that tell you?

Also, notice....>"the Day of the Lord"...

This happens after the Rapture of the Bride of Christ.

The "Day of the Lord", is explained in 2nd Thess 1:8:9.... That is the Wrath OF God poured out as Jesus "taking Vengeance on all those who do not obey the Gospel". = Christ Rejectors.

Now, Paul and the other Apostles thought that Jesus was coming back in their time.
They did not know He was coming back 2000+ yrs later, so, sometimes they speak in a verse that is them thinking that Jesus is about to come back, then.

So, you have a boy whose "spirit" is not "saved", and Paul is addressing this in the context of Christ coming back to take vengeance on UNBELIEVERS.

Now, you do the math.
I think you can figure it out.

 

[Behold]

. It's "believing to be saved and to stay saved". That's the

Listen, believing is a one time event, that is FAITH = that is "accepted", by God.

God accepts your FAITH, the moment you have it, the very first time, and this "faith, is """"counted as RIGHTEOUSNESS".....right THEN.<
Its right THEN, that you are born again as, THe Righteousness of God "IN CHRIST".

So, that is who you are, if you are born again.
This is not a process, Ferris.
ITs a BIRTH.
It happens once........God accepted ....ACCEPTED your "faith", once, = proven by being born again.

Its a one time BIRTH.
You are birthed INTO = the Spirit of God, by the Spirit of God, and have BECOME....= THE Righteousness of God, in Christ.

This is who the born again, have BECOME.
Its not a process.
Its a SPIRITUAL BIRTH.

Happens once......BORN AGAIN.

There is no end to a SPIRITUAL BIRTH.

God did it.
Its DONE.

You dont hold unto a birth.
You EXIST AS BEING BORN AGAIN.


See it?

 

[Behold]

" I'm saying you hold a Gnostic belief regarding the corruption of the body and the incorruptible purity of the Spirit.​

​

That's horse-feathers.
Its baloney stated as nonsense.

Listen, gnostics do not believe in "Original Sin".
Get that in your head.
Gnostics do not believe in SIN.... that it exists. This is why they do not accept a Cross, or a Savior, as they do not believe that its necessary.
As why have "forgiveness of Sin" is there is no such thing.

Sharpen up a little bit, Ferris.
Stop being dull of understanding, dull of hearing.
Write less nonsense and listen more careuflly.

 

[Ferris Bueller]

Listen, gnostics do not believe in "Original Sin".
Get that in your head.

That's just one belief among all the variants of Gnostic beliefs. A simple Google search shows us all the various strains of Gnostic beliefs. We're talking about the Gnostic belief that you endorse, that the flesh does not matter to the spirit in any way shape or form for the Christian. As I've shown, that is easily debunked by the scriptures.

 

[Ferris Bueller]

Listen, believing is a one time event, that is FAITH = that is "accepted", by God.

God accepts your FAITH, the moment you have it, the very first time, and this "faith, is """"counted as RIGHTEOUSNESS".....right THEN.<
Its right THEN, that you are born again as, THe Righteousness of God "IN CHRIST".

So, that is who you are, if you are born again.
This is not a process, Ferris.
ITs a BIRTH.
It happens once........God accepted ....ACCEPTED your "faith", once, = proven by being born again.

Its a one time BIRTH.
You are birthed INTO = the Spirit of God, by the Spirit of God, and have BECOME....= THE Righteousness of God, in Christ.

This is who the born again, have BECOME.
Its not a process.
Its a SPIRITUAL BIRTH.

Happens once......BORN AGAIN.

There is no end to a SPIRITUAL BIRTH.

God did it.
Its DONE.

You dont hold unto a birth.
You EXIST AS BEING BORN AGAIN.


See it?

I think you should drop back to the original OSAS teaching that says the one who stops believing didn't really believe in the first place. That's a much safer and more reasonable stance then this ridiculous claim that a Christ rejecting unbeliever is somehow born again.

 

[Ferris Bueller]

Also, notice....>"the Day of the Lord"...

This happens after the Rapture of the Bride of Christ.

The "Day of the Lord", is explained in 2nd Thess 1:8:9.... That is the Wrath OF God poured out as Jesus "taking Vengeance on all those who do not obey the Gospel". = Christ Rejectors.

You mean like the Christ rejecting born again person you claim exists?

 

[Ferris Bueller]

Notice... "that his spirit may be saved"..

Well, if you are born again, your spirit is already "One with God and Christ".
It can't become more SAVED then to be joined to God's .
Dont you agree ????.
So, if this boy's spirit is NOT saved,,YET.......then what does that tell you?

It tells me you and others need to stop using 1 Corinthians 5 as evidence a believer can willfully sin in unbelief and he will be saved no matter what when Jesus comes back because salvation is not by works and you can't lose your salvation. I'm not addressing the matter of whether you can lose your salvation or not. I'm addressing your theologies' error in using the passage to defend a believer's willful sin. As you are now acknowledging, this sinner is not saved. It has no application to a believing person. If the person was believing in Christ he wouldn't be living in willful sin (1 John 3:8-9). He has to either have never been born again in the first place, or returned to unbelief (take your pick, doesn't matter) to be living in willful sin. The point is, he's an unbeliever, and all unbelievers go to the lake of fire when Jesus returns. They can not enter into the kingdom of heaven, contrary to your assertion that they can as long as they are born again. What an absurd claim.....Christ rejecters who are born again.....Christ rejecters entering into the kingdom of God. Totally ridiculous.

 

[Behold]

. They can not enter into the kingdom of heaven, contrary to your assertion that they can as long as they are born again. What an absurd claim.....Christ rejecters who are born again.....Christ rejecters entering into the kingdom of God. Totally ridiculous.

The Kingdom of Heaven, is a Physical Kingdom.
The Kingdom of GOD, is a Spiritual Kingdom.

If you are to exist in the Kingdom of God, you "must be born again" into it.

 

[Ferris Bueller]

The Kingdom of Heaven, is a Physical Kingdom.
The Kingdom of GOD, is a Spiritual Kingdom.

The kingdom of heaven and the kingdom of God are one and the same thing in scripture.

If you are to exist in the Kingdom of God, you "must be born again" into it.

Well, at least we agree on that much, lol.

Your changed life is what shows if have been born again into the kingdom of God/heaven. Ultimately, if you do not have that evidence it means you are not born again.

1 John 3:9-10
9No one who is born of God will continue to sin, because God’s seed remains in them; they cannot go on sinning, because they have been born of God.
10This is how we know who the children of God are and who the children of the devil are: Anyone who does not do what is right is not God’s child, nor is anyone who does not love their brother and sister.​

 

[marks]

Our sins are gone, and our eternal life is both transcendant and forever!

Much love!

 

[Ferris Bueller]

Our sins are gone, and our eternal life is both transcendant and forever!

Much love!

23Let us hold unswervingly to the hope we profess, for he who promised is faithful. Hebrews 10:23

14We have come to share in Christ, if indeed we hold our original conviction firmly to the very end. Hebrews 3:14

 

[marks]

23Let us hold unswervingly to the hope we profess, for he who promised is faithful. Hebrews 10:23

14We have come to share in Christ, if indeed we hold our original conviction firmly to the very end. Hebrews 3:14

Good passages!

This second one tends to be misunderstood a lot, I find. It is so often though as showing a salvation which remains conditional, uncertain, and has caused a lot of grief in various ways! People who think that God is being fickle with them, that even though God says there is no more condemnation, well, they can think that there might be.

Where it says, "have come" to share in Christ, this is the Greek Perfect Tense, so it's speaking of an action that once done, it remains done, it's result continues.

It's like the rung bell. You make a bell, and it's never been rung. Then you ring it, and it is a "rung" bell. It will never return to being an unrung bell.

So this is the same. If you've become a partaker of Christ, in the way this verse speaks, it means you have become something that you will not stop being. And the continuance of our faith shows this. Notice, it does not say, "If you continue in works to the end", rather, if we hold our original conviction.

Faith first and last!

Much love!

 

[Behold]

The kingdom of heaven and the kingdom of God are one and the same thing in scripture.

The Kingdom of God is "Righteousness, Peace, and Joy", in the Holy Spirit.... Romans 14:17
The Kingdom of God, is "within you".....Its a Spiritual Kingdom that Exist's as "Light", and the born again are "translated from Darkness into this Light".

Whereas the Kingdom of Heaven, is a literal physical situation.

 

[Ferris Bueller]

Good passages!

This second one tends to be misunderstood a lot, I find. It is so often though as showing a salvation which remains conditional, uncertain, and has caused a lot of grief in various ways! People who think that God is being fickle with them, that even though God says there is no more condemnation, well, they can think that there might be.

Where it says, "have come" to share in Christ, this is the Greek Perfect Tense, so it's speaking of an action that once done, it remains done, it's result continues.

It's like the rung bell. You make a bell, and it's never been rung. Then you ring it, and it is a "rung" bell. It will never return to being an unrung bell.

So this is the same. If you've become a partaker of Christ, in the way this verse speaks, it means you have become something that you will not stop being. And the continuance of our faith shows this. Notice, it does not say, "If you continue in works to the end", rather, if we hold our original conviction.

You're certainly entitled to an opinion about OSAS. But that was not the point of my post. The point is you must continue to believe to the very end to be saved.